How did New Pal Slip So Quickly?

[crimsonace1]

8 minutes ago, DT said:

I find this very hard to believe.  You really think that the vast majority of readers on this forum believe that suddenly the states all time leading rusher just showed up out of nowhere?  Cmon.  get real my man.  This was a highly thought out, targeted and calculated move.  It did indeed destroy the equilibrium in the conference.  The IHSAA should have considered denying the transfer request due to reasons of upsetting competitive balance in the conference.  CS could have statyed at DElta and achieved many of the same results.  Not all, but many, certainly most of the individual accolades. 

The family business was moved to the Indianapolis area to take advantage of better business opportunities. The family bought a home in New Palestine. The father is from Hancock County. It might have also provided a better educational opportunity for their three sons who were in school. You cannot simply say "sorry, can't go, you have to stay in Muncie 70 miles away from your family." 

Schools in large, growing suburban communities attract new families. Property values in New Palestine are through the roof right now because there are a lot more people trying to move here than there are houses available. Neighborhoods cannot be built fast enough to meet the demand. Families who are looking to move are going to seek out good school districts for their children. If my kids were football players, I'd want them to go to an academically successful school (which New Palestine is) and know they're going to be coached by the best coaches available (which New Palestine has). There are lots of reasons a family will choose to do so. My son is a soccer player. We decided to move to New Palestine before he enrolled in kindergarten because of the community and the quality of the schools (and the fact that I work here). The fact that the school had a pretty strong athletic program didn't factor as much into our decision, but it certainly didn't hurt. For you to claim you know all about a family's reason for moving - *ESPECIALLY* when it has been reported pretty widely in the press (especially in Muncie) from people who actually have talked to them - is a bit concerning. 

[CaptainHook]

9 minutes ago, DT said:

I get that.  BUt dont try to tell us that CS just fell out of the transfer apple tree and landed in the NP backfield.  Thats preposterous.  This was a calculated family move.  Im aware that these moves happen fairly regularly.  But this move absolutely decimated the competitive balance in the conference.   Do you really think it was good and healthy for the HHC to watch one of its schools physically destroy  all the others over a two year period?

I dont think so.

 

Nobody said they didn’t choose to move here. He was not recruited to do so. Period. So stop making that accusation. 
 

The Dragons were dominating the HHC long before Charlie got there. And that motivated some schools to go out and hire some real coaches. 

[Guest DT]

I dont believe I ever mentioned the word "recruiting" in my posts on this topic.  

[itiswhatitis]

(Humongous amount of sarcasm)  Yes I am shocked and appalled that New Pal lost to the #1 ranked and undefeated team in 4A (Mount Vernon).   And New Pal is only 4 and 1 this year???  They should just shut down their program!  I can't believe they are still playing football after THAT loss!!!  

[CaptainHook]

23 minutes ago, DT said:

I dont believe I ever mentioned the word "recruiting" in my posts on this topic.  

🙄 c’mon man...

[hhpatriot04]

:Flush: making every issue he can in HS football about him. Why is he a afforded this platform? This isn't his first rodeo. Contraction threads have lost traction, so now this is the content he wants to "contribute" to this forum? This thread is such a disgrace compared to the Linton-Rensselear thread that highlights everything right with high school football, the purpose of this forum.

[Guest DT]

11 minutes ago, hhpatriot04 said:

:Flush: making every issue he can in HS football about him. Why is a afforded this platform? This isn't his first rodeo. Contraction threads have lost traction, so now this is the content he wants to "contribute" to this forum? This thread is such a disgrace compared to the Linton-Rensselear thread that highlights everything right with high school football, the purpose of this forum.

Is it right that a school is allowed to accumulate talent to a level where it so completely dominates its competition that the games are rendered useless and unwatchable?

The IHSAA has responsibility to works towards the maintainence of competitive balance.  These issues happen in basketball all the time.  This is really the first time where a single student athlete had such a huge impact within the conference that it destabilized the entire league for two years.  Yes, you can make the argument that it forced other schools to go out and get better, but many are still struggling.  

All the way back to the spring of 2004 when I joined this site, my primary focus has been the maintenance of competitive balance.  That can be achieved thru the use of many tools and mechanisms :

* Class structure

* Conference alignment

* OOC scheduling strategies

* Multipliers

* Success Factors

* Failure Factors

* Contraction

* Minimum roster requirements

* Transfer management

 

 

 

Edited October 2, 2020 by DT

[hhpatriot04]

I wish the Dragons good luck tonight. Whose on the slate?

[CaptainHook]

1 minute ago, DT said:

Is it right that a school is allowed to accumulate talent to a level where it so completely dominates its competition that the games are rendered useless and unwatchable?

The IHSAA has responsibility to works towards the maintainence of competitive balance.  These issues happen in basketball all the time.  This is really the first time where a single student athlete had such a huge impact within the conference that it destabilized the entire league for two years.  yes, you can make the argument that it forced other schools to go out and get better, but many are still struggling.  

All the way back to the spring of 2004 when I joined this site, my primary focus has been the maintenance of compoetitive balance.  That can be achieved thru the use of many tools and mechanisms :

* Class structure

* Conference alignment

* OOC scheduling strategies

* Multipliers

* Success Factors

* Failure Factors

* Contraction

* Minimum roster requirements

* Transfer management

 

 

 

I wish the old forum was available. I remember the day I broke the news that Spegal had transferred to NP. It was generally met with a lot of “Who?” and a lot of collective yawns. 
 

What I do not remember on that day, is DT stating that the power in the HHC and 5A had been drastically shifted and this should not be allowed by the IHSAA. You did not say the IHSAA should not allow a family to move and enroll their children in the school district they now lived in. You did not say that the Dragons would win their next 28 games and two state championships, thus his transfer should be blocked. Why? Most likely because you’d never heard of Charlie Spegal before.  But certainly because NOBODY could have predicted it.

In a forum where you make a lot of ridiculous statements, expecting the IHSAA to predict the future takes the cake.

Maybe this afternoon you can claim you invented the question mark?

[CaptainHook]

11 minutes ago, hhpatriot04 said:

I wish the Dragons good luck tonight. Whose on the slate?

Shelbyville Golden Bears. Hopefully we can score enough points that DT doesn’t feel like we run up the score, but enough so he doesn’t feel like the program is in shambles.

[Guest DT]

3 minutes ago, CaptainHook said:

I wish the old forum was available. I remember the day I broke the news that Spegal had transferred to NP. It was generally met with a lot of “Who?” and a lot of collective yawns. 
 

What I do not remember on that day, is DT stating that the power in the HHC and 5A had been drastically shifted and this should not be allowed by the IHSAA. You did not say the IHSAA should not allow a family to move and enroll their children in the school district they now lived in. You did not say that the Dragons would win their next 28 games and two state championships, thus his transfer should be blocked. Why? Most likely because you’d never heard of Charlie Spegal before.  But certainly because NOBODY could have predicted it.

In a forum where you make a lot of ridiculous statements, expecting the IHSAA to predict the future takes the cake.

Maybe this afternoon you can claim you invented the question mark?

Spegals transfer to NP was widely reported in the media and reported on extensively in the buildup to the 2018 and 2019 seasons.

I recall clearly at the time having many of the same observations I have now.  Something about this move just didnt seem right.  What if this particular student athlete sets a precedent where all the top level athletes begin congregating at a small select number of schools.  KInd of like in the NBA where players collude in free agency and select destinations where they can collectively go and achieve their goals.

Im seeing many high level college recruits using social media to do this very thing.  a 4 or 5 star player signs with Mega State University, and he starts texting and tweeting all the other high level kids he met at camps along the way.  The strong get stronger, the weak get weaker.  This cant be allowed if the IHSAA expects to stand by its creed to support the concept of competitive balance.

[gonzoron]

2 minutes ago, DT said:

Spegals transfer to NP was widely reported in the media and reported on extensively in the buildup to the 2018 and 2019 seasons.

It was reported on in Muncie. That's not a very "wide" area. And I can only find one link to a Muncie Star Press article, maybe you can find others that will back up your claim?

https://www.thestarpress.com/story/sports/high-school/2018/04/05/delta-star-running-back-charlie-spegal-transfers-new-palestine/486430002/

[Muda69]

13 minutes ago, DT said:

Spegals transfer to NP was widely reported in the media and reported on extensively in the buildup to the 2018 and 2019 seasons.

I recall clearly at the time having many of the same observations I have now.  Something about this move just didnt seem right.  What if this particular student athlete sets a precedent where all the top level athletes begin congregating at a small select number of schools.  KInd of like in the NBA where players collude in free agency and select destinations where they can collectively go and achieve their goals.

Im seeing many high level college recruits using social media to do this very thing.  a 4 or 5 star player signs with Mega State University, and he starts texting and tweeting all the other high level kids he met at camps along the way.  The strong get stronger, the weak get weaker.  This cant be allowed if the IHSAA expects to stand by its creed to support the concept of competitive balance.

https://www.thestarpress.com/story/sports/high-school/2018/04/05/delta-star-running-back-charlie-spegal-transfers-new-palestine/486430002/

And your stance on this transfers mirrors what was said almost a year ago:

 

7 minutes ago, CaptainHook said:

COACH NOWLIN EDITED THIS OUT SO TO NOT OFFEND MUDA69: THIS IS ME TELLING YOU I EDITTED YOUR POST SO YOU DO NOT GET HURT

Language please.  Such foulness is not allowed on this GID forum.

 

[itiswhatitis]

4 minutes ago, DT said:

Is it right that a school is allowed to accumulate talent to a level where it so completely dominates its competition that the games are rendered useless and unwatchable?

The IHSAA has responsibility to works towards the maintainence of competitive balance.  These issues happen in basketball all the time.  This is really the first time where a single student athlete had such a huge impact within the conference that it destabilized the entire league for two years.  yes, you can make the argument that it forced other schools to go out and get better, but many are still struggling.  

All the way back to the spring of 2004 when I joined this site, my primary focus has been the maintenance of compoetitive balance.  That can be achieved thru the use of many tools and mechanisms :

* Class structure

* Conference alignment

* OOC scheduling strategies

* Multipliers

* Success Factors

* Failure Factors

* Contraction

* Minimum roster requirements

* Transfer management

 

 

 

And of course you have definitive proof of what you accuse them of.  What, cheating???  That is about the dumbest comment I have EVER read on this forum in my many years of being a member.  And in the day of open enrollment, it makes it ever dumber!  Who says the games were unwatchable?  You say it to fit some DT  agenda and for NO other reason.  I watched another program beat up on teams for years.  You KNEW every year it was going to be a blowout with most teams on their schedule.  However, NO ONE accused them of accumulating talent so they could beat up the other teams.   It was just the case of one program being that much better than the others in a particular area.   It's called having a program.  Something it appears you are not familiar with.  Oh yeah, you support that powerhouse, Highland.  No wonder.  You should be trying to "fix" your own program instead of throwing rocks at others, especially ones that are successful.  They are successful so they MUST be cheating is your way of explaining it.  I guess you are one of those people in society that wants every kid to get a trophy even if they don't do anything.  You want everything "equal".  Life doesn't work that way and especially in sports and competition.  You are going to find someone who is always bigger, always faster, always stronger, and more talented.  Hey, maybe we should limit football players to no one over 200 pounds.  Maybe that would help you in your "quest" to get everything equal.  Good luck with that.

[CaptainHook]

1 minute ago, Muda69 said:

https://www.thestarpress.com/story/sports/high-school/2018/04/05/delta-star-running-back-charlie-spegal-transfers-new-palestine/486430002/

And your stance on this transfers mirrors what was said almost a year ago:

 

Wait, so they should have not allowed it after a November game in 2019?  Hilariously stupid. Fire up the time machine!

[olinecoach]

3 minutes ago, DT said:

Spegals transfer to NP was widely reported in the media and reported on extensively in the buildup to the 2018 and 2019 seasons.

I recall clearly at the time having many of the same observations I have now.  Something about this move just didnt seem right.  What if this particular student athlete sets a precedent where all the top level athletes begin congregating at a small select number of schools.  KInd of like in the NBA where players collude in free agency and select destinations where they can collectively go and achieve their goals.

Im seeing many high level college recruits using social media to do this very thing.  a 4 or 5 star player signs with Mega State University, and he starts texting and tweeting all the other high level kids he met at camps along the way.  The strong get stronger, the weak get weaker.  This cant be allowed if the IHSAA expects to stand by its creed to support the concept of competitive balance.

When an athlete and their family buy a house in a new district, there is nothing that the IHSAA can do to block a transfer in that case. Whether or not that is the only home they own or whether or not they choose to stay in the area post high school is irrelevant. The fact of the matter is that Charlie was a great player at Delta and a great player at New Pal. Couple that with the fact that New Pal had already built something special with the other players they had on the roster and it made for an incredible two year run. Whatever the motivation for the move (family in Hancock county, closer/more business opportunities, etc..) is a non-factor in a transfer.

[gonzoron]

2 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

https://www.thestarpress.com/story/sports/high-school/2018/04/05/delta-star-running-back-charlie-spegal-transfers-new-palestine/486430002/

And your stance on this transfers mirrors what was said almost a year ago:

 

Which was 19 months after the transfer was announced.

Edited October 2, 2020 by gonzoron

[Muda69]

Just now, CaptainHook said:

Wait, so they should have not allowed it after a November game in 2019?  Hilariously stupid. Fire up the time machine!

Reading comprehension is not your friend, is it?

 

1 minute ago, gonzoron said:

Which was 19 months after the transfer was announced.

[CaptainHook]

1 minute ago, Muda69 said:

Reading comprehension is not your friend, is it?

 

Gonna have to expand on that. You post a quote from DT saying the transfer should not have been allowed almost two full seasons after it was allowed. That makes sense to you?

[Muda69]

Just now, CaptainHook said:

Gonna have to expand on that. You post a quote from DT saying the transfer should not have been allowed almost two full seasons after it was allowed. That makes sense to you?

That's not the point I was trying to make.

 

[Guest DT]

2 hours ago, CaptainHook said:

I call absolute fiddle sticks You never said anything of the sort. Should MV quarterback have be forced to stay at Greenfield and run the wishbone? Or is his move ok? 

Is the MV transfer going to go down in history as one of the all time greats in Indiana High School Football?

Never once have I said that NP recruited CS.  Frankly, I put the blame for this entire situation on Bobby Cox and the IHSAA.  They were asleep at the wheel.  

They should have disallowed the transfer on the grounds that it would disrupt the competitive balance within the conference, within the class and within the entire state, which it did. It doesnt take a rocket science to combine the New Pal of 2018 plus the addition of the states likely new all time rushing and scoring champion to figure out what the end result will be.

 

[gonzoron]

3 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

That's not the point I was trying to make.

 

What was your point? That @DTwaited over a year and a half to comment on a transfer he disapproved of? And now a year later, after the student has graduated from High School, he still thinks the IHSAA should not allow it? Got it.

[hhpatriot04]

Stay away from forum violations, it's gameday. The thread will be closed and posters warned/suspended if it continues to need constant moderation oversight.

[CaptainHook]

1 minute ago, DT said:

Is the MV transfer going to go down in history as one of the all time greats in Indiana High School Football?

Never once have I said that NP recruited CS.  Frankly, I put the blame for this entire situation on Bobby Cox and the IHSAA.  They were asleep at the wheel.  

They have should have disallowed the transfer on the grounds that it would disrupt the competitive balance within the conference, within the class and within the entire state, which it did. It doesnt take a rocket science to combine the New Pal of 2018 plus the addition of the states likely new all time rushing and scoring champion to figure out what the end result will be.

 

just laughable. You are a 🤡. Have a great day.

1 minute ago, hhpatriot04 said:

Stay away from forum violations, it's gameday. The thread will be closed and posters warned/suspended if it continues to need constant moderation oversight.

my bad

[Guest DT]

2 minutes ago, hhpatriot04 said:

Stay away from forum violations, it's gameday. The thread will be closed and posters warned/suspended if it continues to need constant moderation oversight.

Who are you talking to?