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DrivenT

DT Commentary - The Future of Coaching / Where is it heading?

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http://www.chicagotribune.com/suburbs/post-tribune/sports/ct-ptb-mike-hutton-column-0407-20150406-story.html

Interesting article from way back in 2015 regarding coaching changes in northwest Indiana and how the coaching search, and the availability of qualified candidates, has changed dramatically.

It wasn't long ago that a majority of grizzled veterans pacing the sidelines was the norm.  Between 2005 and 2010, the state saw a huge outflow of experienced , long time coaches, including many Hall of Famers.  There just aren't too many Leroy Marshes or Russ Radtkes roaming the sidelines anymore.  The profession has turned dramatically, where the average age of a high school coach went from the late 40 to early 50s to the late 20s to early 30s, seemingly overnite.

The downside is young coaches are being pushed up through the system too quickly.  Many lack the experience and maturity needed  for success.  Quality of play suffers.  Coaching turnover is faster, as many leave the game due to long hours and low pay.  In the past, many coaches could supplement their teaching salary and coaching stipend with a multitude of other gigs, all provided through a trip to the publicly funded feeding trough.  Funding cuts have gutted those opportunities, giving younger coaches even more reason to walk away.

This is not likely a trend, but rather the new normal.  Better get used to it.

And for those ADs who are looking to make a change for the 2018 season, the pickens will likely be slim.  Better get a head start sooner than later.

 

 

 

 

Edited by DrivenT
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I contend there are some really good young coaches out there as well.   Just like there was some good and bad coaches in previous generations who were in the same age bracket.   

Agree with my pal from Bremen there, landscape of education has changed, could be reason why some folks get out earlier than expected.   

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I think there are some outstanding young coaches in the field now who have tremendous knowledge of football and have the ability to relate and motivate their players. I will give you a prime example. Danville was 2-8 in 2015 getting blown out by 35 points plus in some games scoring at most 20 plus points (with the exception of 1 game). The morale and spirit around the Warriors program was not to great.

Enter the young and refreshing K.C. Woods who has turned out to be a terrific hire by Danville. That next year 2016 he takes them to a 10-3 record with a Sectional Championship over Bishop Chatard and eventually losing in Regionals 37-20 to Lawrenceburg. This year he has the Warriors sitting at 10-0 with a game this Friday against county rival Tri-West. Coach Woods has brought life to a program that was on the downside. He is young refreshing and definitely displays some terrific football knowledge. 

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As an older coach, I will say that the off season demands are far greater than they were 15-20 years ago. I know 12 days in pads does not sound like a lot, but if you want to stay competitive, you still practice without pads. The 5 competition days are all day events. Add to it that there is no compensation for coaches during the Summer. Make no mistake though, I LOVE this game, but I am tired at this point in the season. I kick up my own workouts so I have the energy to give all I can for the kids here, but man am I tired.

I would add to that about 15 years ago, I decided there was no way I wanted to be a head coach. Give me my d line guys and let's go to work. I will add that I do see a trend in coaching. There are guys in it who know a system, but cannot coach outside of that. They are focused more on exposure and making connections than actually working to be a better coach.

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This trend also feeds the "bro culture" issue, which I brought out in a previous thread.

The player-coach relationship is much different today than it was 20 years ago.  Too many young coaches want to be buddies with their players.  Apparently they feel that this is the best week to extract optimal performance.  

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46 minutes ago, Irishman said:

As an older coach, I will say that the off season demands are far greater than they were 15-20 years ago. I know 12 days in pads does not sound like a lot, but if you want to stay competitive, you still practice without pads. The 5 competition days are all day events. Add to it that there is no compensation for coaches during the Summer. Make no mistake though, I LOVE this game, but I am tired at this point in the season. I kick up my own workouts so I have the energy to give all I can for the kids here, but man am I tired.

I would add to that about 15 years ago, I decided there was no way I wanted to be a head coach. Give me my d line guys and let's go to work. I will add that I do see a trend in coaching. There are guys in it who know a system, but cannot coach outside of that. They are focused more on exposure and making connections than actually working to be a better coach.

Agreed. The summer stuff is just getting ridiculous. I, for one, don't believe you need to use all of them, or many of them, to "keep up with the Joneses." Just my opinion, but I think the summer workouts are very overrated. I'm not saying they're not important and you can get away with it at >4a schools, but once you start implementing 12 days a summer full of practices, NOT INCLUDING the weight lifting, you're forcing kids to make a decision between football and other things. It's tough to get away with at the smaller schools who need all the kids they need.  

With that said, if you think football is bad, basketball is worse. 

8 minutes ago, DrivenT said:

This trend also feeds the "bro culture" issue, which I brought out in a previous thread.

The player-coach relationship is much different today than it was 20 years ago.  Too many young coaches want to be buddies with their players.  Apparently they feel that this is the best week to extract optimal performance.  

The problem is that kids have definitely changed and the 'bro' culture is the solution for these younger coaches. 

Edited by Canoe Fest Charlie

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We are starting to see where the inmates are taking over the asylum.  Note what is happening at Valparaiso High School.  I cant imagine this kind of mutiny taking place when most of us played the game.  It was unfathomable.  

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14 minutes ago, DrivenT said:

We are starting to see where the inmates are taking over the asylum.  Note what is happening at Valparaiso High School.  I cant imagine this kind of mutiny taking place when most of us played the game.  It was unfathomable.  

Along those lines, I will say the influence of recruiting sites and private training companies have contributed to this significantly. The training sites have even hired position coaches. Kids see who has worked out and some of the coaches had solid careers. From time to time I would hear "well my coach at ...... said I should do this"; when it does not even fit within the concept of what we do. Not that I am not open to new ideas; I am always looking for better ways to do things and to coach. Kids are listening to THOSE "coaches" more than the team coaches. And because the companies are making good money off of the kids, of course they are going to tell the parents their kids can play in college. When kids and parents hear that, they immediately think D1. One company even sells gear with the quote #D1. Some of these programs do a great job of building strength and speed, but kids are choosing those workouts rather than team workouts in the off season. I had a discussion with a fellow teacher whose son trains with one of these companies. They all have their travel 7 on 7 teams and go to tournaments in Georgia and Florida. The friend was saying because of limitations, they cannot get that kind of exposure with their high school team. While that may be true; the top athletes in the Southeastern US are not competing in these tourneys. When MAC/NAIA level talent is competing for a "national championship" at these events, it should be a clear sign. Kids from around here are NOT picking up offers based on these tourneys or the "exposure". The practices they have include no skill work. Bottom line is the kids' heads are filled with the idea that they are elite athletes on a national level, yet when no offers come, or low level partial offers come, it is the high school coach's fault.

 

Edit: I should clarify, this is from a NOrtheast Indiana perspective only. I am curious if other parts of the State are experiencing similar issues.

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6 minutes ago, Irishman said:

Along those lines, I will say the influence of recruiting sites and private training companies have contributed to this significantly. The training sites have even hired position coaches. Kids see who has worked out and some of the coaches had solid careers. From time to time I would hear "well my coach at ...... said I should do this"; when it does not even fit within the concept of what we do. Not that I am not open to new ideas; I am always looking for better ways to do things and to coach. Kids are listening to THOSE "coaches" more than the team coaches. And because the companies are making good money off of the kids, of course they are going to tell the parents their kids can play in college. When kids and parents hear that, they immediately think D1. One company even sells gear with the quote #D1. Some of these programs do a great job of building strength and speed, but kids are choosing those workouts rather than team workouts in the off season. I had a discussion with a fellow teacher whose son trains with one of these companies. They all have their travel 7 on 7 teams and go to tournaments in Georgia and Florida. The friend was saying because of limitations, they cannot get that kind of exposure with their high school team. While that may be true; the top athletes in the Southeastern US are not competing in these tourneys. When MAC/NAIA level talent is competing for a "national championship" at these events, it should be a clear sign. Kids from around here are NOT picking up offers based on these tourneys or the "exposure". The practices they have include no skill work. Bottom line is the kids' heads are filled with the idea that they are elite athletes on a national level, yet when no offers come, or low level partial offers come, it is the high school coach's fault.

 

Edit: I should clarify, this is from a NOrtheast Indiana perspective only. I am curious if other parts of the State are experiencing similar issues.

As I read this, I am wondering if we will start to see more and more places like IMG sprout up around the country, siphoning the best kids off from local high schools.  I could easily see an IMG style academy in the Chicago suburbs.  Imagine what impact that would have on the Chicago Catholic League.  Or IMG Indianapolis.  The uproar at Ben Davis, Carmel, Warren and Cathedral would be thunderous.  

6 minutes ago, Coach Nowlin said:

For every Pat Shanley, there are 5 Zach Prairies

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1 minute ago, DrivenT said:

As I read this, I am wondering if we will start to see more and more places like IMG sprout up around the country, siphoning the best kids off from local high schools.  I could easily see an IMG style academy in the Chicago suburbs.  Imagine what impact that would have on the Chicago Catholic League.  Or IMG Indianapolis.  The uproar at Ben Davis, Carmel, Warren and Cathedral would be thunderous.  

I know that one of these businesses in Fort Wayne completed an application with the State to open a charter school. No doubt that was the intention.

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Lousy OP in my opinion, however I think the discussion is bringing up some good dialogue. 

1. Football loses a LOT of good young coaches to burnout and time issues, particularly with young families. Is the time spent necessary or is the time spent just because the guy down the road is doing it?

2. Demands that ALL coaches put on high school athletes is stupid in my opinion. Two years ago the Student Advisory Council voted unanimously that they wanted no contact in the summer, much like most of us had back in the day. I have long maintained that you reach a point of diminishing returns working on a fall sport all winter and spring. When I was coaching Softball, I know a lot of schools had open gyms all fall. Are you really going to gain anything with HS kids in September that's going to help you in May?

3. How many athletes are your program losing due to demands of other sports? Or even the demands that you put on them? 

I feel like these are major concerns that need to be looked at moving forward for our sport.

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1 minute ago, Irishman said:

I know that one of these businesses in Fort Wayne completed an application with the State to open a charter school. No doubt that was the intention.

That would destroy the SAC, which is a very solid conference top to bottom.

1 minute ago, Impartial_Observer said:

Lousy OP in my opinion, however I think the discussion is bringing up some good dialogue. 

1. Football loses a LOT of good young coaches to burnout and time issues, particularly with young families. Is the time spent necessary or is the time spent just because the guy down the road is doing it?

2. Demands that ALL coaches put on high school athletes is stupid in my opinion. Two years ago the Student Advisory Council voted unanimously that they wanted no contact in the summer, much like most of us had back in the day. I have long maintained that you reach a point of diminishing returns working on a fall sport all winter and spring. When I was coaching Softball, I know a lot of schools had open gyms all fall. Are you really going to gain anything with HS kids in September that's going to help you in May?

3. How many athletes are your program losing due to demands of other sports? Or even the demands that you put on them? 

I feel like these are major concerns that need to be looked at moving forward for our sport.

This is what has killed the 3 sport athlete.  

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9 minutes ago, DrivenT said:

That would destroy the SAC, which is a very solid conference top to bottom.

While the top teams in the conference are some of the best in the State yearly, the bottom teams have struggled. That said, I do think those bottom programs would be hurt significantly. Even though the records are not good, there is still talent on the field for those teams; legitimate D1 talent too. Those are the kids that would go to such a school. As far as any impact on programs like Dwenger and Snider, they may lose more backup players than key starters. I don't see many from Homestead or Carroll leaving though. Academically, those two districts are among the best in the State, and parents would keep kids there just for that.

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18 minutes ago, DrivenT said:

 

For every Pat Shanley, there are 5 Zach Prairies

And I will argue for every Coach Hoffman/Dave Shelbourne there were 5 bad coaches as well from the 70s and 80s.    Which is my point.  Generation by generation you can have the same argument.   

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No doubt

But football was not under attack back then and under the microscope that is it today.  There was nothing but growth during that period.  Now we are seeing nothing but decline in every measurable facet.  Its indisputable.  So the scrutiny will be greater.  

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8 minutes ago, Coach Nowlin said:

And I will argue for every Coach Hoffman/Dave Shelbourne there were 5 bad coaches as well from the 70s and 80s.    Which is my point.  Generation by generation you can have the same argument.   

Thank you. Young coaches can be hard-nosed, can teach discipline, and can run highly respected programs. You don't have to be a certain age to do so. 

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7 minutes ago, CoachWeber said:

Thank you. Young coaches can be hard-nosed, can teach discipline, and can run highly respected programs. You don't have to be a certain age to do so. 

I guess I am considered a "young"ish coach (40)....i have been coaching since i was 21.

I was passed over for a job b/c I was considered too old school (no explination given).  I was always part of staffs that taught hardnosed football.  I am ALWAYS a firm but fair disciplinarian.  And have been part of successful football programs.

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1 hour ago, DrivenT said:

As I read this, I am wondering if we will start to see more and more places like IMG sprout up around the country, siphoning the best kids off from local high schools.  I could easily see an IMG style academy in the Chicago suburbs.  Imagine what impact that would have on the Chicago Catholic League. 

You obviously know nothing about the Catholic league. That thing is like the Mafia. If an IMG type place tried to move in Cardinal Cupich would make sure the went fishing on Lake Tahoe. 

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2 minutes ago, MarshallCounty said:

How soon until high schools wash there hands of athletics?

Not very soon....athletics are a huge part of many school's identities. A lot of money and community pride at work. Sure it has it's hassles but overall athletics are more positive for a community and school corporation than negative. 

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11 minutes ago, MarshallCounty said:

How soon until high schools wash there hands of athletics?

Not soon enough.  IMHO all extracurricular activities should be based on a club model, with no affiliation to a government school corporation.

 

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6 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

Not soon enough.  IMHO all extracurricular activities should be based on a club model, with no affiliation to a government school corporation.

 

As much as my political views want to support this....I also fear that this would turn athletics into a rich people's endeavor. The poor couldn't afford to play and would miss out on something that could change their lives. I know because I was one of those poor kids that needed the game.

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