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jakone

EACS schools to get field turf

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Muda69 said:

Thank you for clarifying.

Also, as a supposed member of the media how is that content which you create for this media outlet vetted for accuracy?  Do you have an editor?  Just trying to get insight from a supposed media insider on how the truth is determined.

If I have already clarified and been thanked for doing so, I am not sure  why you repeated the question.

Edited by Night Hawk

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19 hours ago, Night Hawk said:

If I have already clarified and been thanked for doing so, I am not sure  why you repeated the question.

So the GID is the only "media outlet" which you produce content for?

 

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Muda, still waiting for your response to

this....

At what percentage is the crossover point from extravance to reasonable. When 25% of schools posses turf fields? 50%?

There was a time I’m sure some viewed air conditioning and indoor plumbing as extravagances.  Eventually convenience and function often win out.  

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21 hours ago, Coach_G said:

Muda, still waiting for your response to

this....

At what percentage is the crossover point from extravance to reasonable. When 25% of schools posses turf fields? 50%?

There was a time I’m sure some viewed air conditioning and indoor plumbing as extravagances.  Eventually convenience and function often win out.  

There is no crossover point.   

And comparing AC and indoor plumbing to field turf is apples vs. oranges.   Is field turf needed in order to provide a safe, sanitary, and secure environment for trying to teach children reading, writing, and arithmetic?

 

 

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2 hours ago, Muda69 said:

There is no crossover point.   

And comparing AC and indoor plumbing to field turf is apples vs. oranges.   Is field turf needed in order to provide a safe, sanitary, and secure environment for trying to teach children reading, writing, and arithmetic?

 

 

I am a natural grass guy and not a fan of field turf, but does AC provide a safe, sanitary, and secure environment for trying to teach children reading, writing, and arithmetic?  I don't think it does.

How about the schools that are on their 2nd round of turf fields?  Wonder how much they saved?

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5 minutes ago, Coach Ellenwood said:

I am a natural grass guy and not a fan of field turf, but does AC provide a safe, sanitary, and secure environment for trying to teach children reading, writing, and arithmetic?  

 I would submit that with many government schools now having earlier and earlier start times (early to mid August) or using "balanced schedules" that AC is more and more relevant. 

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Posted (edited)

Looks like I graduated 32 years too early lol.  Of course the kind of "turf" they (NFL/NCAA) used back when I was playing h.s. ball was a step down from grass.

I thought New Haven already had turf.  I'm surprised the other three are getting it, just due to financial reasons.  Is it a necessity? IMO, no it is not.  Is it nice to have? IMO yes definitely.  Like Irishman, I've heard that besides the initial investment, there is a huge maintenance cost savings, but that could be a regional thing seeing as how we have to water the he!! out of our grass fields to get them to look just acceptable.  I doubt the same problem exists in Indiana.  Also, what is the life expectancy of turf?  I've heard anywhere from 10-15 years.

I say if the money's there, go for it.  If the community's behind it is a big factor as well.  If you have to slide it through or do an end run to get it, probably not such a good idea. 

Don't know what percentage of schools up there have it, but down here if you're 4A or bigger and don't have turf you're considered behind the 8-ball.  As I write this, that mind set will soon spill over into the 3A schools as probably close to half of them have it, and I'd bet 25% of 2A programs have turf as well.  My son loved to play on turf, and was always hoping we'd have a few of those teams in our district.  We also got turf fields in playoff games (all neutral sites ha ha).

To comment further on what Coach G said, I agree that what was once a luxury many times becomes standard.  When I was at Heritage in early-mid 80's, one whole side of the school (classrooms that had windows) did not have A/C.  I remember sitting in class the first few weeks of school, and maybe also the last week or two, with the bottom half of the windows opened up having to wipe beads of sweat off my forehead.

Edited by Bonecrusher

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, Muda69 said:

There is no crossover point.   

And comparing AC and indoor plumbing to field turf is apples vs. oranges.   Is field turf needed in order to provide a safe, sanitary, and secure environment for trying to teach children reading, writing, and arithmetic?

 

 

I would love statistical proof that indoor plumbing increases reading scores.  

 

Using this logic I assume you are against schools possessing pools, auditoriums, Weight rooms, and student common spaces. 

Edited by Coach_G
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14 hours ago, Coach_G said:

I would love statistical proof that indoor plumbing increases reading scores.  

 

Using this logic I assume you are against schools possessing pools, auditoriums, Weight rooms, and student common spaces. 

And I would love statistical proof that field turf increases reading scores.

And yes, yes, yes, and please better define the term "common spaces".

 

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2 hours ago, Muda69 said:

And I would love statistical proof that field turf increases reading scores.

And yes, yes, yes, and please better define the term "common spaces".

 

I never made the claim that turf does.  The burden is on you.  I didn't even say it wasn't an extravagance.  I simply asked you to tell me when an extravagance becomes the norm/acceptable based on function, similar to the examples I gave.   For a large part of american educational history students walked to school.  In recent decades the majority of students ride busses.  Something in the 20's or 30's would've been viewed as an extravagance.  Eventually function won out.  Today districts have entire departments focused on transportation a major line item for a district.  Something unheard of for 150 years of american education.  I simply again will ask at what point does function win out.  While turf fields are not cheap, they do offer districts a lot in return.  While they may have qualified as an extravagance in 2000, in 2018, I'm not sure you can make that argument anymore. 

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2 hours ago, Coach_G said:

 I simply again will ask at what point does function win out.  While turf fields are not cheap, they do offer districts a lot in return.  While they may have qualified as an extravagance in 2000, in 2018, I'm not sure you can make that argument anymore. 

When that function is used to primarily benefit an extracurricular activity instead of honest to goodness classroom instruction, then it is an extravagance which should be eliminated or not purchased in the first place.  Do students and faculty need modern restrooms in order to eliminate human waste in a hygienic matter so that they can concentrate on learning and teaching? I would say yes.    

 

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19 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

When that function is used to primarily benefit an extracurricular activity instead of honest to goodness classroom instruction, then it is an extravagance which should be eliminated or not purchased in the first place.  Do students and faculty need modern restrooms in order to eliminate human waste in a hygienic matter so that they can concentrate on learning and teaching? I would say yes.    

 

The fact that you completely separate extracurricular activities from the whole school experience is strange. Extracurriculars are not completely separated from the learning and development experience.

You can argue all you want whether field turf is a good investment or not, but I do not agree with your assmemt of extracurricular activities whatsoever.

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4 minutes ago, FormerColtsFan said:

The fact that you completely separate extracurricular activities from the whole school experience is strange. Extracurriculars are not completely separated from the learning and development experience.

But they should be, hence the term 'extracurricular'.    

Government school is "reading, writing, arithmetic",  not "football, basketball, baseball".

 

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2 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

But they should be, hence the term 'extracurricular'.    

Government school is "reading, writing, arithmetic",  not "football, basketball, baseball".

 

I sure hope it’s not literally restricted to those three items, particularly at the secondary education level.

You, community/State/nation/etc, will increasingly not be competitive in today’s world if you simply stick to the good old fashioned “3 R’s”.

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7 minutes ago, FormerColtsFan said:

I sure hope it’s not literally restricted to those three items, particularly at the secondary education level.

You, community/State/nation/etc, will increasingly not be competitive in today’s world if you simply stick to the good old fashioned “3 R’s”.

No, that was not literally restricted to those three items.

 

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19 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

No, that was not literally restricted to those three items.

 

Make up your mind, you literally just said government school is reading, writing and arithmetic.  

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1 hour ago, Muda69 said:

When that function is used to primarily benefit an extracurricular activity instead of honest to goodness classroom instruction, then it is an extravagance which should be eliminated or not purchased in the first place.  Do students and faculty need modern restrooms in order to eliminate human waste in a hygienic matter so that they can concentrate on learning and teaching? I would say yes.    

 

Fair enough, then one can suppose using this logic if a school corp uses the field for more purposes then just supporting EXC then it crosses the threshold into value.  

However, my bussing comparison was ignored in your response, is this not a similar luxury connecting to function?

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17 hours ago, Coach_G said:

Fair enough, then one can suppose using this logic if a school corp uses the field for more purposes then just supporting EXC then it crosses the threshold into value.  

However, my bussing comparison was ignored in your response, is this not a similar luxury connecting to function?

What other non-extracurricular purposes would a turf field be used for?  What classroom related studies/activities would require or be enhanced by a turf field?

And yes, IMHO bussing is a luxury.  One that various school corporations have struggled with the  costs of for years.

 

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As stated before, whoever oversees band competitions, requires turf to be installed to host competitions. The amount of use that Physical Education classes get out of it goes up tremendously. Add to it the number of community events and youth activities that will be able to use the fields. You ignored the fact that it will actually be a savings to the district over the life of the turf and that by doing all of them at once, will provide even more of a savings to the district, as one of the fields is basically free.

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58 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

What other non-extracurricular purposes would a turf field be used for?  What classroom related studies/activities would require or be enhanced by a turf field?

And yes, IMHO bussing is a luxury.  One that various school corporations have struggled with the  costs of for years.

 

So what we have here are two different conversations going on.   We have 1) you opinion on what is appropriate funding philosophically.  I'm not going to argue your point there, and you've made it clear for years, so let's move on from that.  We also have 2) a debate over whether a "luxury" at some point crosses over into functional value.   Do you really not see any functional value for a school district in a turf field.  I understand you might have more check marks in the negative collum, but you don't have any in the positive category?  Because I'm calling shananigens on that.  

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5 minutes ago, Coach_G said:

 Do you really not see any functional value for a school district in a turf field. 

No, much as I don't see any functional value in government school extracurricular activities.

 

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1 hour ago, Muda69 said:

What other non-extracurricular purposes would a turf field be used for?  What classroom related studies/activities would require or be enhanced by a turf field?

And yes, IMHO bussing is a luxury.  One that various school corporations have struggled with the  costs of for years.

 

I could see biology, other sciences, nursing doing research/clinical type studies comparing contrasting type thing.  Just off the top of my head.

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3 minutes ago, Coach Ellenwood said:

I could see biology, other sciences, nursing doing research/clinical type studies comparing contrasting type thing.  Just off the top of my head.

And you would need a 120 yard by 53.3 yard area in order to do this?  Sounds dubious.

 

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6 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

And you would need a 120 yard by 53.3 yard area in order to do this?  Sounds dubious.

 

No.  You asked a question.  I answered said question.

You mustve forgotten, I am NOT a proponent of turf fields.  I am a natural grass guy.

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