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trojanmp52

what 3 rules would you like to see change next year

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15 minutes ago, crimsonace1 said:

From an official stats perspective:

*-Live-ball penalties behind the LOS - all yardage is assessed as penalty yards (so a holding penalty 3 yards behind the LOS is recorded as a 13-yard penalty) and it's basically a "no play" statistically - everything that happens is voided. 
*-Live-ball penalties beyond the LOS - all yardage to the point of the flag is counted, then the penalty yardage is assessed. on the case you mentioned above, you are correct. +23 rushing yardage, -10 penalty yardage. The play is scored as if it were a normal play to the point of the flag - so a rusher gets a carry/passer-receiver get a completion-reception and yardage to the flag.  At one time, only the yardage would be recorded but the carry/completion/reception would not be, but that has changed in the last 15 or so years. 

As far as I know, there is no official stats manual for NFHS, but I use the NCAA statisticians manual as a guide. 

That may be a part of the issue from a stats perspective then because in NCAA the penalty is enforce from the previous spot if the foul happens behind the LOS and/or the run ends behind the LOS (i.e. a sack). It would probably make more sense for you to do the -3 yard run even if it's a pass play. I don't know if that would cause you to treat it like a sack though on passing plays.

I know this was up for consideration at this year's rules committee, but I have no idea if it passed. I guess we'll all find out in 2-3 weeks. I'm a huge proponent of it, so I hope it does eventually pass. The enforcement is a lot more complex this way and the NFHS rules committee tries to avoid complexity if at all possible.

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21 hours ago, BisonUmpire said:

That may be a part of the issue from a stats perspective then because in NCAA the penalty is enforce from the previous spot if the foul happens behind the LOS and/or the run ends behind the LOS (i.e. a sack). It would probably make more sense for you to do the -3 yard run even if it's a pass play. I don't know if that would cause you to treat it like a sack though on passing plays.

I know this was up for consideration at this year's rules committee, but I have no idea if it passed. I guess we'll all find out in 2-3 weeks. I'm a huge proponent of it, so I hope it does eventually pass. The enforcement is a lot more complex this way and the NFHS rules committee tries to avoid complexity if at all possible.

I don't think that makes any sense to make a pass a 3 yard run on a player when it's a pass. That sounds ridiculous. It's a foul make it a 13 yard penalty and move on. Why would you manufacture negative yards. It's a 13 yard penalty why try and make things more complicated then they need to be

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1 hour ago, Huge football fan said:

I don't think that makes any sense to make a pass a 3 yard run on a player when it's a pass. That sounds ridiculous. It's a foul make it a 13 yard penalty and move on. Why would you manufacture negative yards. It's a 13 yard penalty why try and make things more complicated then they need to be

Because the hold is essentially preventing a sack. The penalty is not enforced 13 yards from the previous spot. It's enforced from the spot of the foul. So neither is fully logical, but we can correctly track the actual penalty yardage this way. Maybe the -3 isn't a run loss but it's captured some other way. If the runner loses 5 yards and there is a hold at -3 you would enforce from the end of the run and record a run of -5 and penalty of 10 yards. If the runner loses 1 yard and there is a hold at -3 you would enforce from the spot of the foul and record a run of -3 and penalty of 10 yards. It would be consistent to do something similar on a pass play. Or we could greatly simplify this for the stats guys and enforce all these penalties from the previous spot. :)

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12 minutes ago, BisonUmpire said:

Because the hold is essentially preventing a sack. The penalty is not enforced 13 yards from the previous spot. It's enforced from the spot of the foul. So neither is fully logical, but we can correctly track the actual penalty yardage this way. Maybe the -3 isn't a run loss but it's captured some other way. If the runner loses 5 yards and there is a hold at -3 you would enforce from the end of the run and record a run of -5 and penalty of 10 yards. If the runner loses 1 yard and there is a hold at -3 you would enforce from the spot of the foul and record a run of -3 and penalty of 10 yards. It would be consistent to do something similar on a pass play. Or we could greatly simplify this for the stats guys and enforce all these penalties from the previous spot. :)

No. Right from your first statement totally wrong. Also what if the hold is 7 yards behind the line and the qv is 2 and throws it? Just trying to make things more difficult then they need to be

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Don't know about anyone else but in off season film study we never had an OL downfield more than 2 yards on our RPO's. It's one of the things that concerns me most about running them. 

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1 hour ago, Old Viking said:

Don't know about anyone else but in off season film study we never had an OL downfield more than 2 yards on our RPO's. It's one of the things that concerns me most about running them. 

I bet the other team said you had them down field 100 times. I'm still waiting for the guy that was complaint to show all these hudl plays where the lineman are down field and the call was missed

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