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Muda69

Children who play football before age 12 show CTE-related symptoms much sooner

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2 minutes ago, Blue Racer said:

Make friends and influence people??  

 

Seems like a Dale Carnegie disciple.

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Be Best

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1 hour ago, Muda69 said:

Not really.  My spouse and I have made the decision not to allow our under age 18 children to play tackle football, due to the risks described in this forum thread, and I encourage other parents to do the same.  There are other outlets that can teach many of the same "lessons"  supposedly learned from playing tackle football, without the risk of significant medical problems decades down the road.  

How many children currently under the age of 18 are you the parent of,  Gamecock?

 

Let me try asking you a question again how you assess risk, and please don't head down the path that I encourage our children to drink and drive.....

1) Do you allow your children to drive or ride in cars with other people.  (no booze involved)  If so, why would you allow this?  Wouldn't you agree that the probability and severity of an incident is far greater occurring to someone operating a 2000lb mass at varying speeds than a child sustaining a concussion playing football?  

2) You have long been an advocate of legalizing what is currently illegal drugs.  (not for minors...please don't head down that path)  Wouldn't data tell us there are more harmful effects of drug use than children playing football?  (I'm operating under the premise of legalizing drugs would make it easier for a minor to have access to drugs...much like alcohol today or weed in certain states)

So back to my original question....how are you getting comfortable with 2 much more significant risks to children, but having so much difficulty with a child playing football?  Not saying you are wrong...just trying to learn how you process risk.

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I tried to warn you @Muda69 we come at you fast and hard like spider monkeys. Head on a swivel man. Head. On. A. Swivel. 

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56 minutes ago, Coach Ellenwood said:

I tried to warn you @Muda69 we come at you fast and hard like spider monkeys. Head on a swivel man. Head. On. A. Swivel. 

Image result for spider monkey talladega nights gif

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3 hours ago, Coach Ellenwood said:

I tried to warn you @Muda69 we come at you fast and hard like spider monkeys. Head on a swivel man. Head. On. A. Swivel. 

Image result for rope a dope gif

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15 hours ago, Trojan Dad said:

Let me try asking you a question again how you assess risk, and please don't head down the path that I encourage our children to drink and drive.....

1) Do you allow your children to drive or ride in cars with other people.  (no booze involved)  If so, why would you allow this?  Wouldn't you agree that the probability and severity of an incident is far greater occurring to someone operating a 2000lb mass at varying speeds than a child sustaining a concussion playing football?  

2) You have long been an advocate of legalizing what is currently illegal drugs.  (not for minors...please don't head down that path)  Wouldn't data tell us there are more harmful effects of drug use than children playing football?  (I'm operating under the premise of legalizing drugs would make it easier for a minor to have access to drugs...much like alcohol today or weed in certain states)

So back to my original question....how are you getting comfortable with 2 much more significant risks to children, but having so much difficulty with a child playing football?  Not saying you are wrong...just trying to learn how you process risk.

1.  This attempt to compare riding or driving in cars to playing tackle football puzzles me.  One does not drive or ride in a car with the intent of inflicting physical violence on another individual (unless that car is entered in something like a demolition derby, I guess).  But one of the primary goals of tackle football is inflicting physical violence on another individual, most often in the form of tackling them.  Apples versus oranges.

2. Once again, and you just don't seem to get it,  I do not advocate children under the age of 18 consuming currently illegal drugs.  Or even if those drugs become legalized.

 

10 hours ago, Coach Ellenwood said:

I tried to warn you @Muda69 we come at you fast and hard like spider monkeys. Head on a swivel man. Head. On. A. Swivel. 

No big deal.  I've been dog piled numerous times over the years on this forum,  but unlike most of you I don't have that big of an ego to bruise.   Comes with the territory when you have unpopular or controversial opinions.

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2 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

1.  This attempt to compare riding or driving in cars to playing tackle football puzzles me.  One does not drive or ride in a car with the intent of inflicting physical violence on another individual (unless that car is entered in something like a demolition derby, I guess).  But one of the primary goals of tackle football is inflicting physical violence on another individual, most often in the form of tackling them.  Apples versus oranges.

2. Once again, and you just don't seem to get it,  I do not advocate children under the age of 18 consuming currently illegal drugs.  Or even if those drugs become legalized.

 

No big deal.  I've been dog piled numerous times over the years on this forum,  but unlike most of you I don't have that big of an ego to bruise.   Comes with the territory when you have unpopular or controversial opinions.

wrong statements trying to pass them off as facts.

FTFY.  :02_v:

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The assumption that the intent to "inflict physical violence" is ridiculous. Is it a physical game? yes, but the intent is to win games, get better at it, work hard, and work with, rely on, and trust your teammates, along with the other life lessons previously mentioned.

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16 hours ago, Gamecock Part Deux said:

Wouldn't a true libertarian not care what others did with their kids???

I don't care.  I don't go down the level of believing that individuals who let their children play tackle football are committing child abuse.  I just believe it is a stupid, callous, and short-side decision.  

As long as government doesn't put me on the hook to help pay for the bad decision you made for your child, go for it.   Doesn't mean that I shouldn't try and educate others to the dangers of such a decision.

 

Just now, Irishman said:

The assumption that the intent to "inflict physical violence" is ridiculous. Is it a physical game? yes, but the intent is to win games, get better at it, work hard, and work with, rely on, and trust your teammates, along with the other life lessons previously mentioned.

Please explain how tackling is not an act of violence. Because it is done in the context of a game doesn't make it any less violent;  that violent act is just now condoned/accepted by the majority of American society.

 

3 minutes ago, Coach Ellenwood said:

wrong statements trying to pass them off as facts.

FTFY.  :02_v:

Citations please.

 

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3 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

Please explain how tackling is not an act of violence. Because it is done in the context of a game doesn't make it any less violent;  that violent act is just now condoned/accepted by the majority of American society.

 

Tackling is merely one aspect of the game. Throwing and catching are not "violent acts". Running the ball is not a "violent act". Is it a Quarterback's job/intent to "inflict violence"? A receiver's? While an occasional tackle is rough, most are not. The "intent" in tackling, is to keep the ball from being moved down the field.

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1 minute ago, Irishman said:

Tackling is merely one aspect of the game. Throwing and catching are not "violent acts". Running the ball is not a "violent act". Is it a Quarterback's job/intent to "inflict violence"? A receiver's? While an occasional tackle is rough, most are not. The "intent" in tackling, is to keep the ball from being moved down the field.

As is tackling not the aspect of the game where the vast majority of concussions, and the subsequent CTE which can occur, are inflicted?  

Define the word 'tackle: https://www.google.com/search?q=define+tackle&oq=define+tackle

Quote
AMERICAN FOOTBALLRUGBY
stop the forward progress of (the ball carrier) by seizing them and knocking them to the ground.

 

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24 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

I don't care.  I don't go down the level of believing that individuals who let their children play tackle football are committing child abuse.  I just believe it is a stupid, callous, and short-side decision.  

As long as government doesn't put me on the hook to help pay for the bad decision you made for your child, go for it.   Doesn't mean that I shouldn't try and educate others to the dangers of such a decision.

 

Please explain how tackling is not an act of violence. Because it is done in the context of a game doesn't make it any less violent;  that violent act is just now condoned/accepted by the majority of American society.

 

Citations please.

 

Thank you for your support.

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By all means, let's look to google to define one aspect of the game. Please explain then, how it is possible to seize someone AND knock them to the ground? Seizing someone means getting a hold of them, correct? so, how is trying to grab someone "inflicting violence"? Does not seem to match the "intent". :14_v:

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22 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

I don't care.  I don't go down the level of believing that individuals who let their children play tackle football are committing child abuse.  I just believe it is a stupid, callous, and short-side decision.  

As long as government doesn't put me on the hook to help pay for the bad decision you made for your child, go for it.   Doesn't mean that I shouldn't try and educate others to the dangers of such a decision.

If you don't care then why are you on a football forum calling for the end of football? If football is a stupid, callous and short sided decision then why do you even associate yourself with the game in any way shape or form? And how is the government putting you on the hook for children playing football? Please explain . . . .

16 hours ago, Trojan Dad said:

Let me try asking you a question again how you assess risk, and please don't head down the path that I encourage our children to drink and drive.....

1) Do you allow your children to drive or ride in cars with other people.  (no booze involved)  If so, why would you allow this?  Wouldn't you agree that the probability and severity of an incident is far greater occurring to someone operating a 2000lb mass at varying speeds than a child sustaining a concussion playing football?  

2) You have long been an advocate of legalizing what is currently illegal drugs.  (not for minors...please don't head down that path)  Wouldn't data tell us there are more harmful effects of drug use than children playing football?  (I'm operating under the premise of legalizing drugs would make it easier for a minor to have access to drugs...much like alcohol today or weed in certain states)

So back to my original question....how are you getting comfortable with 2 much more significant risks to children, but having so much difficulty with a child playing football?  Not saying you are wrong...just trying to learn how you process risk.

And why don't you answer the man's question without a red herring response? You're quick to call out individuals like me because I don't have any kids, so why is there no legit response to Trojan Dad, who obviously does have kids. Is it because you possibly allowed your kids to partake in a stupid, callous, short sided decision of riding in a car being driven by another minor that wasn't under the influence of any mind altering substances?

2 minutes ago, Irishman said:

By all means, let's look to google to define one aspect of the game. Please explain then, how it is possible to seize someone AND knock them to the ground? Seizing someone means getting a hold of them, correct? so, how is trying to grab someone "inflicting violence"? Does not seem to match the "intent". :14_v:

I guess a charge in basketball is a violent act too, so is sliding into home plate in baseball. Get rid of all these violent sports.

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2 minutes ago, Irishman said:

By all means, let's look to google to define one aspect of the game. Please explain then, how it is possible to seize someone AND knock them to the ground? Seizing someone means getting a hold of them, correct? so, how is trying to grab someone "inflicting violence"? Does not seem to match the "intent". :14_v:

Yes, by all means.  Because as I said tackling is where the vast majority of concussions, and the subsequent risk of CTE, occur.  Are you disputing this? 

As for the rest of your "questions":

giphy.gif 

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5 minutes ago, Gamecock Part Deux said:

I guess a charge in basketball is a violent act too, so is sliding into home plate in baseball. Get rid of all these violent sports.

Add heading a soccer ball, a "tackle" in soccer as well is a "violent act". Many moves in wrestling....check that; wrestling is a violent act as well, so we can't do that either. While we are at it, let's stop all martial arts hockey as well. They are too violent for young people. Come to think of it, skateboards, bikes, motocross bikes, can all be pretty violent as well. Let's just do nothing for the first 18 years of our lives for fear of being hurt.

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3 minutes ago, Gamecock Part Deux said:

If you don't care then why are you on a football forum calling for the end of football?

Please cite where I have called for the end of football.  I have only advocated that individuals not participate in the sport until at least the age of 18 years old.

 

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Just now, Muda69 said:

Please cite where I have called for the end of football.  I have only advocated that individuals not participate in the sport until at least the age of 18 years old.

Oh I'm sorry. You've advocated ending "high school football" on a "high school football forum". 

5 minutes ago, Gamecock Part Deux said:

 And how is the government putting you on the hook for children playing football? Please explain . . . .

And why don't you answer the man's question without a red herring response? You're quick to call out individuals like me because I don't have any kids, so why is there no legit response to Trojan Dad, who obviously does have kids. Is it because you possibly allowed your kids to partake in a stupid, callous, short sided decision of riding in a car being driven by another minor that wasn't under the influence of any mind altering substances?

Image result for waiting gif

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20 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

As is tackling not the aspect of the game where the vast majority of concussions, and the subsequent CTE which can occur, are inflicted?  

 

citations please

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2 minutes ago, Blue Racer said:

citations please

https://www.drdavidgeier.com/concussions-impacts-nfl-football/

https://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/07/16/the-risk-of-high-school-football-tackles/

 

5 minutes ago, Gamecock Part Deux said:

Oh I'm sorry. You've advocated ending "high school football" on a "high school football forum". 

 

manipulation.jpg

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

 

15 minutes ago, Gamecock Part Deux said:

And how is the government putting you on the hook for children playing football? Please explain . . . .

And why don't you answer the man's question without a red herring response? You're quick to call out individuals like me because I don't have any kids, so why is there no legit response to Trojan Dad, who obviously does have kids. Is it because you possibly allowed your kids to partake in a stupid, callous, short sided decision of riding in a car being driven by another minor that wasn't under the influence of any mind altering substances?

Image result for waiting gif

 

Edited by Gamecock Part Deux

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I like your beanie.

Quote

And how is the government putting you on the hook for children playing football? Please explain . . . .

Easily.  Studies have shown the horrific effects of CTE often do not show up until decades after the child has played tackle football.  Therefore there is a chance that as an adult the medical care an individual may need to help combat those effects are paid via medicare/medicaid. Both taxpayer funded government entitlements.

 

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1 minute ago, Muda69 said:

I like your beanie.

Easily.  Studies have shown the horrific effects of CTE often do not show up until decades after the child has played tackle football.  Therefore there is a chance that as an adult the medical care an individual may need to help combat those effects are paid via medicare/medicaid. Both taxpayer funded government entitlements.

And what percentage of medicare/medicaid goes to CTE compared to lung cancer, cirrhosis, diabetes resulting from smoking, drinking, and obesity? Guarantee you those are bigger issues. Only if there were something that we could do for the kids that would help to promote a healthy lifestyle . . . like high school sports. But since most sports have an aspect of violence and they're publicly funded you'll want to get rid of those. 

30 minutes ago, Gamecock Part Deux said:

And why don't you answer the man's question without a red herring response? You're quick to call out individuals like me because I don't have any kids, so why is there no legit response to Trojan Dad, who obviously does have kids. Is it because you possibly allowed your kids to partake in a stupid, callous, short sided decision of riding in a car being driven by another minor that wasn't under the influence of any mind altering substances?

Image result for waiting gif

I wonder how much money goes to medicare/medicaid for injuries suffered from car accidents?

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