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Muda69

Children who play football before age 12 show CTE-related symptoms much sooner

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https://www.cbsnews.com/news/cte-symptoms-youth-football-before-age-12/

Quote

A new study published in Annals of Neurology found kids who start playing tackle football before age 12 will, on average, develop cognitive and emotional symptoms associated with the degenerative brain disease CTE much earlier than those who start later. One California family whose son began playing football at 9 years old is blaming the sport for his early death.

"I loved my son. He was just a wonderful kid," an emotional Gregory Ransom told CBS News correspondent Jamie Yuccas. He is heartbroken about the loss of his 13-year-old son, James. Just over a year before his death, James suffered a brutal hit to the head while playing football as a lineman. After the game, his dad noticed blood around his ear.

"He was known in the neighborhood as a kid who'd fall down and just get right back up and go play and he didn't, he never cried. I talked to him about these things and he said, 'Well, I get my bell rung all the time playing football.' And it was shocking to me to hear that," Ransom said.

James' sister, Julia, said his personality began to change immediately after the hit.

"You could just look into his eyes and he just wasn't the same person. And just, you could see that inside he knew he was hurting and he was struggling so that was really hard to deal with as a sibling just seeing that happen and not knowing what to do," Julia said.

James suffered from short-term memory and vision loss and OCD. He attempted suicide just three months after the hit and was committed into a mental institution for a month. Nearly a year later, he took his own life.

...

A new study published in Annals of Neurology looked at the brains of 246 deceased amateur and professional football players. Two-hundred-eleven of them had the degenerative brain disease known as chronic traumatic encephalopathy, or CTE, which can be caused by repetitive hits to the head. The study showed kids who began playing tackle football before the age of 12 began showing cognitive and emotional symptoms associated with CTE an average of 13 years earlier than those who started after 12.

"It's concerning because it was such a change," said Dr. Ann McKee of Boston University, the study's lead researcher.

"Childrens' brains are rapidly developing between eight and 12 years old. They're laying down new networks, they're pruning the different connections. They're sort of enhancing their brain," McKee said.

The Ransom family did not get James' brain tested for CTE, but they hope to prevent his injuries from occurring in other children.

"I want parents, mothers and fathers, to know the science and to know what's happening to their sons' brains, because… if a mother knows what's happening inside that helmet, she's not going to let her son out on the football field," Ransom said.

The study also showed that for each year earlier kids begin playing football, their symptoms will progressively show up about two and a half years sooner.

Be safe. No tackle football before the age of 18.

 

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24 minutes ago, Coach Ellenwood said:

Or personal freedom of choice.

Yes, when the child become an adult.

 

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Ten years down the road, I believe high school football will have a very different look and feel.  The declining numbers will accelerate, forcing many smaller schools to eliminate the sport from the high school athletic menu.  

We may have a scenario where cities have "traveling" teams, much like they do in other low participation sports.  Instead of Fort Wayne and South Bend/Elkhart/Mishawaka  having 10 schools that play football, they might have two "super football magnet schools," which draw only the best athletes who remain committed to the game.

Club football will also rise at the high school level, replacing varsity, and possibly only flag - non contact at that.

We are now past the skepticism phase and CTE and other football related injuries are now fully accepted at face value.  This will have devastating consequences down the road.  The Ryan Shazier injury also adds more fuel to the fire.  

 

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Since no numbers were quoted in the sample, I expect it was a very small number.  Too small for a scientific conclusion.

Did any of those kids ride skate boards?  Head soccer balls?  Fall down stairs?   

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I found the abstract of the scientific study. I hope to read the full study tomorrow if I can access it.  The n = 246 and 211/246 had CTE. However it still has a self-selection bias that all these studies have.

An analogy: I go to a Lexus car lot, interview all the people there to buy a car. I then publish a study - 211/246 respondents said price did not matter when buying a car. The popular press picks up on my findings and run the headline, “Americans shouldn’t care about price when car-shopping” and they cite my study as proof.  Is that a valid conclusion? 

I hope to read the full study and analyze it. The point remains - these are 246 brains of individuals who donated their brains to science out of the hundreds of thousands who played football over that time frame.

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Guess that explains why my kids are knuckleheads.

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Posted (edited)

There was no control group in the study they discuss.  Meaning they did not test for CTE in people that did not play football.  

Edited by Coach Padgett71
different verbage
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6 hours ago, Lysander said:

Guess that explains why my kids are knuckleheads.

Does the fruit fall from the tree?? 

Racing season is getting into full swing! Get out and catch a race near you!

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4 minutes ago, Blue Racer said:

Does the fruit fall from the tree?? 

Racing season is getting into full swing! Get out and catch a race near you!

Grand Prix or left turns only?  :02_v:

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8 hours ago, oldtimeqb said:

I found the abstract of the scientific study. I hope to read the full study tomorrow if I can access it.  The n = 246 and 211/246 had CTE. However it still has a self-selection bias that all these studies have.

An analogy: I go to a Lexus car lot, interview all the people there to buy a car. I then publish a study - 211/246 respondents said price did not matter when buying a car. The popular press picks up on my findings and run the headline, “Americans shouldn’t care about price when car-shopping” and they cite my study as proof.  Is that a valid conclusion? 

I hope to read the full study and analyze it. The point remains - these are 246 brains of individuals who donated their brains to science out of the hundreds of thousands who played football over that time frame.

Very nicely demonstrated.  Statistics and studies to be valid must follow the true scientific method and methodology.  Cherry picking participants and information in the past invalidated studies, not so much today.  If you can show true results without "stacking the deck"and have true control groups in place, then I will be attentive to your findings even if I don't like what you are telling me.  If you bias your study, well, sorry, better things to do.  

Oldtimeqb, hate to ask, but if you do get to read, really like to hear what the full study says.  

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So I guess those 211 are "acceptable losses" when compared to totality of children playing tackle football.  Really just a statistical anomaly.

 

 

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Posted (edited)

Actuallly "monkey bars" and "tag" in elementary school gave me more concussions than I ever had playing football.  Maybe the best concussion I ever had was when Bobby Curry line-drived my forehead when I was pitching.  Took me a couple of days to remember my name.

Bobby was a mensch.  Black Belt State Trooper who killed an active shooter in self defense later...after Bobby was already wounded by the dude......might have put him down hand to hand...can't remember (Thanks Bobby....long term memory being somewhat faulty.....along with the tinnitus).

Great American.  Nailed me right in the forehead with that line drive.  Left an impression.

Straightened up my thinking ever since, though.

31 minutes ago, Blue Racer said:

Does the fruit fall from the tree?? 

Racing season is getting into full swing! Get out and catch a race near you!

Give me your schedule!!

Seriously thinking about going to the Truck Race at Eldora.  Bear in mind, I was there for the Second World 100 (the late Floyd Gilbert...sadly).  Also thinking about going to Bristol....these days I am making bucket lists.

Edited by Lysander

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18 minutes ago, Coach Ellenwood said:

Grand Prix or left turns only?  :02_v:

Left turns only.  Sometimes I will watch those commie events where they turn right. 

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2 minutes ago, Lysander said:

Left turns only.  Sometimes I will watch those commie events where they turn right. 

You would love the dirt track in Haubstadt Indiana!

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3 minutes ago, Lysander said:

Left turns only.  Sometimes I will watch those commie events where they turn right. 

Do you get dizzy?  :07_v:

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, Coach Ellenwood said:

Do you get dizzy?  :07_v:

I'm dizzy when I get out of bed.  

 

5 minutes ago, Titan32 said:

You would love the dirt track in Haubstadt Indiana!

One of the best short track dirt guys in the Midwest later owned that track.  But for my "monkey bars" addled brain I would remember his name.....he was a helluva racer, though.  

 

Edited by Lysander
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17 hours ago, Muda69 said:

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/cte-symptoms-youth-football-before-age-12/

Be safe. No tackle football before the age of 18.

 

Image result for donald trump fake news gif

15 hours ago, DrivenT said:

Ten years down the road, I believe high school football will have a very different look and feel.  The declining numbers will accelerate, forcing many smaller schools to eliminate the sport from the high school athletic menu.  

We may have a scenario where cities have "traveling" teams, much like they do in other low participation sports.  Instead of Fort Wayne and South Bend/Elkhart/Mishawaka  having 10 schools that play football, they might have two "super football magnet schools," which draw only the best athletes who remain committed to the game.

Club football will also rise at the high school level, replacing varsity, and possibly only flag - non contact at that.

We are now past the skepticism phase and CTE and other football related injuries are now fully accepted at face value.  This will have devastating consequences down the road.  The Ryan Shazier injury also adds more fuel to the fire.  

 

Image result for donald trump wrong gif

17 hours ago, Coach Ellenwood said:

Or personal freedom of choice.

Image result for ron swanson i'll consume all of this because i'm a free american

 

 
16 hours ago, Muda69 said:

Yes, when the child become an adult.

 

If we're worried about concussions lets get rid of the real issues first . . . https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/recruiting-insider/wp/2017/03/27/girls-soccer-has-highest-concussion-rate-of-high-school-sports-study-finds/?utm_term=.f456d885a03c

Girls’ soccer, basketball players have higher concussion rates than male counterparts

 
 
 
By Jacob Bogage March 27, 2017 Email the author

Female athletes, in particular soccer players, suffer concussions at a “significantly higher” rate than their male counterparts, according to a study released this month by the American Academy of Orthopaedic Surgeons.

In matched sports, girls were 12.1 percent more likely to sustain a concussion than boys, according to the report, which tracked concussions in a sport relative to total number of injuries from 2005 to 2015 using the High School Reporting Information Online injury surveillance system. In basketball, for example, concussions only accounted for 8.8 percent of boys’ injuries, but 25.6 percent of girls’ injuries.

“The neck muscles of girls just aren’t as developed as boys are,” said Wellington Hsu, one of the study’s authors and a professor of orthopedic surgery at Northwestern. “So if girls experience an impact, it makes sense they might be affected by it more than boys if they don’t have the muscles to cushion that impact.”

[Reducing the number of concussions in high school girls’ soccer is a daunting task]

Researchers from Northwestern University and Wake Forest University studied data from football, soccer, basketball, wrestling and baseball participation for boys; soccer, basketball, volleyball and softball for girls.

The results showed a striking gender-based difference in the incidents of concussion. Football, a sport most typically associated with brain injury but also has a high number of total injuries due to its being a collision sport, was fourth on the list of concussion as a percentage of total injuries, behind girls’ soccer, girls’ volleyball and girls’ basketball.

“We were surprised at how the incidence of concussions particularly in girls over the past five years has increased,” Hsu said. “And we found that sports that weren’t typically linked to concussion are actually quite risky.”

ConcussionAAOS-1.jpg&w=1484

 

The study’s authors attribute that increased risk to a lack of protective equipment available for female athletes and an increased emphasis on physical play. In soccer specifically, the authors cite a potential increase in headers, and wrote, “It remains unclear why boys soccer players do not appear to have the same risk as girls.”

[High schools are tracking concussions better, but the data is open for interpretation]

“We’ve seen a lot of data come out of women’s soccer that shows the women may very well be playing harder than the men,” said Geoff Manley, chief of neurosurgery at Zuckerberg San Francisco General Hospital and co-director of the Brain and Spinal Injury Center at the University of California-San Francisco.

“These are tremendous athletes with incredible skill who play really hard,” he said. “And there is no protection.”

 

So what were saying is that boys shouldn't tackle until they're 18, and girls shouldn't play sports at all. Or we can play sports the way Muda wants us to . . . 

Image result for bubble boy

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39 minutes ago, Coach Ellenwood said:

Grand Prix or left turns only?  :02_v:

Lysander is a redneck from Franklin County, it's dirt track man!

 

16 minutes ago, Lysander said:

Left turns only.  Sometimes I will watch those commie events where they turn right. 

C'mon man, Circuit de Catalunya is next Sunday, I'm sure you've been married long enough some culture has rubbed off from your wife!

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15 minutes ago, Lysander said:

I'm dizzy when I get out of bed.  

 

One of the best short track dirt guys in the Midwest later owned that track.  But for my "monkey bars" addled brain I would remember his name.....he was a helluva racer, though.  

 

Dusty Rhodes?  Is that it????????????:17_v:

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15 minutes ago, Lysander said:

 

One of the best short track dirt guys in the Midwest later owned that track.  But for my "monkey bars" addled brain I would remember his name.....he was a helluva racer, though.  

 

Tommy Helfrich...

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11 minutes ago, Gamecock Part Deux said:

Image result for donald trump fake news gif

Image result for donald trump wrong gif

Image result for ron swanson i'll consume all of this because i'm a free american

 

 

If we're worried about concussions lets get rid of the real issues first . . . https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/recruiting-insider/wp/2017/03/27/girls-soccer-has-highest-concussion-rate-of-high-school-sports-study-finds/?utm_term=.f456d885a03c

Girls’ soccer, basketball players have higher concussion rates than male counterparts

 
 
 
By Jacob Bogage March 27, 2017 Email the author

Female athletes, in particular soccer players, suffer concussions at a “significantly higher” rate than their male counterparts, according to a study released this month by the American Academy of Orthopaedic Surgeons.

In matched sports, girls were 12.1 percent more likely to sustain a concussion than boys, according to the report, which tracked concussions in a sport relative to total number of injuries from 2005 to 2015 using the High School Reporting Information Online injury surveillance system. In basketball, for example, concussions only accounted for 8.8 percent of boys’ injuries, but 25.6 percent of girls’ injuries.

“The neck muscles of girls just aren’t as developed as boys are,” said Wellington Hsu, one of the study’s authors and a professor of orthopedic surgery at Northwestern. “So if girls experience an impact, it makes sense they might be affected by it more than boys if they don’t have the muscles to cushion that impact.”

[Reducing the number of concussions in high school girls’ soccer is a daunting task]

Researchers from Northwestern University and Wake Forest University studied data from football, soccer, basketball, wrestling and baseball participation for boys; soccer, basketball, volleyball and softball for girls.

The results showed a striking gender-based difference in the incidents of concussion. Football, a sport most typically associated with brain injury but also has a high number of total injuries due to its being a collision sport, was fourth on the list of concussion as a percentage of total injuries, behind girls’ soccer, girls’ volleyball and girls’ basketball.

“We were surprised at how the incidence of concussions particularly in girls over the past five years has increased,” Hsu said. “And we found that sports that weren’t typically linked to concussion are actually quite risky.”

ConcussionAAOS-1.jpg&w=1484

 

The study’s authors attribute that increased risk to a lack of protective equipment available for female athletes and an increased emphasis on physical play. In soccer specifically, the authors cite a potential increase in headers, and wrote, “It remains unclear why boys soccer players do not appear to have the same risk as girls.”

[High schools are tracking concussions better, but the data is open for interpretation]

“We’ve seen a lot of data come out of women’s soccer that shows the women may very well be playing harder than the men,” said Geoff Manley, chief of neurosurgery at Zuckerberg San Francisco General Hospital and co-director of the Brain and Spinal Injury Center at the University of California-San Francisco.

“These are tremendous athletes with incredible skill who play really hard,” he said. “And there is no protection.”

 

So what were saying is that boys shouldn't tackle until they're 18, and girls shouldn't play sports at all. Or we can play sports the way Muda wants us to . . . 

Image result for bubble boy

manipulation.jpg

Nice try.  I believe there is a girl's basketball forum on the GID website.  Trying posting your report there.  

 

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5 minutes ago, Impartial_Observer said:

C'mon man, Circuit de Catalunya is next Sunday, I'm sure you've been married long enough some culture has rubbed off from your wife!

Sorry man.  Just not into that whole Cirque de "whatever" Frenchie types swinging from trapeze.  Took a pass in Vegas.  

 

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Posted (edited)

 @Muda69  moving the goal post picture.  PRICELESS!  That is your M.O.!

 

17 hours ago, Muda69 said:

Yes, when the child become an adult.

 

Thank you for your support.

Edited by Coach Ellenwood
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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, Titan20 said:

Tommy Helfrich...

YES!!!!  Helluva racer!!!

Thanks for remembering for me, btw.

9 minutes ago, Coach Ellenwood said:

Dusty Rhodes?  Is that it????????????:17_v:

"American Dream" bro'.  Nobody bled out like Dusty.

I am modeling my body in testament these days...and my forehead.

Sadly...probably my kidneys too.

Edited by Lysander

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