BTF Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 8 hours ago, Boilernation said: 6-10 is is reality for a lot of NFL coaches who go into the season with no real talent at QB1. Not really sure it's that big of a blemish on the guy. Besides, the NFL has no bearing on being the GOAT in College. Resources? A lot of the Blue Bloods he's beaen over the years also have resources. Especially in the SEC. Feels like you're really reaching. The guy first won with with the strength of his defenses at LSU/Bama and then adjusted with the evolution of the game to build championship caliber offenses. He's the epitome of being a CEO as HC. I wouldn't say I'm reaching at all. I'm just saying there's other coaches out there that could do what he's done with seven top ranked recruiting classes in a row. "Recruiting is coaching," bla bla bla. There's speculation on how Alabama recruits end up at Alabama. In the end, I agree that he's a very good coach. There's nothing more to debate here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grover Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 Saban had one good year at MSU. Bottom line is he's as good as his players. Down south he gets better players. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bash Riprock Posted January 2 Author Share Posted January 2 13 hours ago, Boilernation said: Lofty expectations? Are you familiar with why that season was awful? Saban wanted the Dolphins to trade for Drew Brees when it was clear the Chargers didn't want him. The Dolphins execs didn't want Brees and instead gave Saban an injured Daune Culpepper who never recovered and went on the IR a few weeks into the season. Saban is on record as saying he knew once the decision was made to take Culpepper over Brees (despite his wishes) he was going back to college. Excellent reminder.... People forget there is a massive difference in the college vs pro game. Not many have started in college and transition to a HOF NFL coaching career...exceptions such as Vermeil, but not a ton. Bottom line, no coach is going to be successful in the NFL without a quality QB...especially in today's NFL. The latter is why the news about the LA Chargers now in play for Harbaugh is so interesting. They have the QB...and that is the key first piece. Additionally, they may be open to giving Jimmy Boy more front office power without a GM in place. This one will be interesting to watch. He just may be headed back to Cali...SoCal this time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bash Riprock Posted January 2 Author Share Posted January 2 14 hours ago, BTF said: I don't think Harbaugh is innocent, but I also don't believe Saban is squeaky clean. I still think he's the John Wooden of college football. Disclaimer: No dog in this fight. Your speculation about Saban's integrity as a coach could be correct. But what we know for fact is this...Saban has never been suspended during a season for rules violations, let alone 2 different suspensions for different rules violations during same season. Another fact...I am no Bama or SEC fan by any stretch..... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bash Riprock Posted January 2 Author Share Posted January 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boilernation Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 12 hours ago, Grover said: Saban had one good year at MSU. Bottom line is he's as good as his players. Down south he gets better players. His tenure at Michigan State ended like 23 years ago and it started with him inheriting a complete mess of a program that had sanctions put on them. Who would you put in your personal Top 3 list and did they have any lean years at any point in their career? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boilernation Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 5 hours ago, Bash Riprock said: He's gone. What else is there to prove at Michigan? He goes out currently owning Ohio State, Big Ten, and possibly College Football. He's not going to go through a reset at Michigan when he wants that Super Bowl trophy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bash Riprock Posted January 3 Author Share Posted January 3 15 hours ago, Boilernation said: He's gone. What else is there to prove at Michigan? He goes out currently owning Ohio State, Big Ten, and possibly College Football. He's not going to go through a reset at Michigan when he wants that Super Bowl trophy. This article claims the Chargers are gaining steam in getting Harbaugh as their next head coach. I can see this because of their home, stadium and most importantly, they have a QB. Would be good to get him in the pros and out of the college game, given the need to follow rules. https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10103414-jim-harbaugh-rumors-chargers-have-gained-steam-as-fit-amid-michigan-hcs-nfl-links Finebaum confident he is leaving Michigan. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
temptation Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 Am I allowed to return yet @Bobref? I’ve made it over 36 hours fergodsakes… My victory lap turned into 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobref Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 55 minutes ago, temptation said: Am I allowed to return yet @Bobref? I’ve made it over 36 hours fergodsakes… My victory lap turned into 3. Not until after the championship game. 😂🤣😆 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
temptation Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 43 minutes ago, Bobref said: Not until after the championship game. 😂🤣😆 Oh come on…gimme a pitch count at least. I have SO much to say. Any update on @Bash Riprock’s Harbaugh fetish? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grover Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 LOL "Michigan quarterback J.J. McCarthy fanned the flames of the program's sign-sealing scandal and its rivalry with Ohio State on Wednesday by suggesting the No. 1 Wolverines were only trying to keep pace with the Buckeyes by engaging in a scheme that was ultimately deemed to violate the Big Ten's Sportsmanship Policy. As part of an explanation into the messages given to the team by coach Jim Harbaugh, McCarthy alluded to the "unfortunate" sign-stealing scandal, adding that around "80%" of the teams in college football steal signs. "It's just a thing about football. It's been around for years," McCarthy said during Wednesday's CFP teleconference. "We actually had to adapt because in 2020 or 2019 when Ohio State was stealing our signs, which is legal and they were doing it, we had to get up to the level that they were at, and we had to make it an even playing field." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballking16 Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 On 1/1/2024 at 10:18 PM, Boilernation said: 6-10 is is reality for a lot of NFL coaches who go into the season with no real talent at QB1. Not really sure it's that big of a blemish on the guy. Besides, the NFL has no bearing on being the GOAT in College. Resources? A lot of the Blue Bloods he's beaen over the years also have resources. Especially in the SEC. Feels like you're really reaching. The guy first won with with the strength of his defenses at LSU/Bama and then adjusted with the evolution of the game to build championship caliber offenses. He's the epitome of being a CEO as HC. Seconded. Ask Belichick about that reality. Most coaches are only as good as their players. Frank Vogel went 54-110 in two years in Orlando, was fired, hired by the Lakers and won a championship the next year. Monty Williams went from winning 60 games a year in Phoenix to coaching the Pistons and went two entire months without recording a win. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
temptation Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 10 minutes ago, Footballking16 said: Seconded. Ask Belichick about that reality. Most coaches are only as good as their players. Frank Vogel went 54-110 in two years in Orlando, was fired, hired by the Lakers and won a championship the next year. Monty Williams went from winning 60 games a year in Phoenix to coaching the Pistons and went two entire months without recording a win. There are a couple of exceptions to this rule (guys that have succeeded at both levels) but I just can’t put my finger on who they are… One of them even lost QB1 and still went to the Super Bowl…and that QB1 was never the same after the coach departed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballking16 Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 3 minutes ago, temptation said: There are a couple of exceptions to this rule (guys that have succeeded at both levels) but I just can’t put my finger on who they are… One of them even lost QB1 and still went to the Super Bowl…and that QB1 was never the same after the coach departed. Harbaugh and Carroll are certainly the exceptions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTF Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 1 hour ago, Footballking16 said: Harbaugh and Carroll are certainly the exceptions. We all know how Carroll succeeded at the one level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grover Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 1 hour ago, Footballking16 said: Harbaugh and Carroll are certainly the exceptions. I can never forgive Carroll for throwing the ball on the 1 yard line and handing the Patriots another Super Bowl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
temptation Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 49 minutes ago, Grover said: I've been accused of a lot of things but never being an OSU fan. Try to think a little rather than taking sophomoric cheap shots. Oh, I think PLENTY. I THINK your one-sided presentation of the very article in which you quoted McCarthy shows your true colors and that you have an axe to grind. Here’s the full article that you went all CNN/MSNBC to cherry pick. https://theathletic.com/408558/2018/07/02/the-game-within-a-game-secrets-of-a-college-football-signal-stealer/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grover Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 4 hours ago, temptation said: Oh, I think PLENTY. I THINK your one-sided presentation of the very article in which you quoted McCarthy shows your true colors and that you have an axe to grind. Here’s the full article that you went all CNN/MSNBC to cherry pick. https://theathletic.com/408558/2018/07/02/the-game-within-a-game-secrets-of-a-college-football-signal-stealer/ Dang. You’re obviously upset that Harbaugh is leaving and you aren’t thinking clearly. Your team is in the championship game. You shouldn’t be so bitter. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
temptation Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 8 minutes ago, Grover said: Dang. You’re obviously upset that Harbaugh is leaving and you aren’t thinking clearly. Your team is in the championship game. You shouldn’t be so bitter. LOL, not bitter at all. If maize and blue confetti drops in Houston next Monday night, I’ll recommend YOU as the next HC in Ann Arbor. And that’s “if he leaves”…you must have insight that those close to Jim don’t. Or you are just listening to the same talking heads that have been wrong every damn step of the way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muda69 Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Mr. Doyel from the Indianapolis Star weighs in on Mr. Harbaugh: https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/columnists/gregg-doyel/2024/01/04/jim-harbaugh-cheated-twice-to-help-michigan-reach-national-title-game/72019343007/ Quote Michigan’s Jim Harbaugh isn’t the destruction of college football. He's the messenger. The sport had been disfigured beyond recognition before Harbaugh’s heel turn, a downward spiral accelerated by the approach of one tsunami and then another – NIL and the transfer portal – and the NCAA’s response of diving behind the nearest potted plant. But someday we’ll look back and ask: When was college football kind of … over? Could be late Monday night – Jan. 8 in the year of our Lord 2024 – if Michigan is crowned as national champion. Jim Harbaugh hasn’t been merely accused of cheating (twice). He has been caught. Twice. The first instance was during the COVID-19 dead recruiting period, when he kept recruiting many of the players who will play Monday against Washington in the College Football Playoff title game. In the years that followed Michigan was illegally stealing signs, a scandal uncovered this season as the Wolverines were building momentum toward the grand finale. Understand this: We could be days away from Jim Harbaugh hoisting a national championship trophy to cap a season in which he was suspended twice for cheating – the first three games of the regular season, and the last three – because of two different scandals that helped the 2023 Michigan Wolverines achieve greatness. When that time comes, if that times comes, college football will be thrown into the blazing furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, to borrow from a book Harbaugh likes to thump. That’s from the New Testament, Matthew 13:42. Perhaps it is right and good that Jim Harbaugh be remembered as one of the horsemen of this apocalypse. Because if Michigan wins the national championship in a season it was popped twice for cheating – violations that helped this very team – college football will become like something from the Book of Ecclesiastes. Meaningless. Transfer portal, NIL cause Georgia 63, FSU 3 The system has been breaking down for years, well before Jim Harbaugh decided only fools play by the rules. The combination of NIL and the transfer portal hasn’t brought free agency to college football – it has brought chaos. Tell me, in what professional sport is everybody a potential free agent after every season? No, not after every season – during every season. That’s what we have now in college football, with everyone free to enter the transfer portal, typically after their final regular-season game in November. Seeing how 86 of the 128 teams at the highest level of Division I still have a bowl game to play, most of the 1,000-plus players in the portal are leaving with a game still to play. Close to 20 schools played bowl games this year without their starting quarterback, who was already in the transfer portal.NIL is the accelerant of this dumpster fire, because schools are offering transfers more than the promise of a fresh start or starting job. Schools are now offering money, as much as seven figures for the best players. Is this what we wanted? Jim Harbinger I mean Harbaugh is the messenger, but the tipping point for this broken system – the moment it crumbled right before our eyes – was Dec. 30 when No. 6 Georgia beat No. 3 Florida State 63-3 in the Orange Bowl. That was the kicker to a story the NCAA had been writing for years. NCAA officials serve at the pleasure of schools but advise university presidents how to proceed, and their advice was to dig in and deny players fair compensation or freedom – until the dam broke in the form of NIL and transfer portal. And on Dec. 30, the Seminoles were washed away. Less than a month earlier Florida State had been 13-0 and hoping for a spot in the College Football Playoff, but the Seminoles were denied that chance because the season-ending injury to quarterback Jordan Travis had demonstrably changed who they were. Then came the disfigurement. Without Travis, without anything meaningful to play for – just the FedEx Ecclesiastes Bowl – 14 FSU players entered the transfer portal and nine others opted out to protect their status for the 2024 NFL Draft. Including Travis, 24 of the Seminoles' best players didn’t play against Georgia. Victorious coach Kirby Smart was disgusted, and not with anyone at FSU. He was disgusted with the system that made such a result possible. “People need to see what happened tonight, and they need to fix this,” Smart told reporters after the game. “It's really unfortunate for those kids on that sideline that had to play in that game.” Jim Harbaugh, Moses? Nah, he's guilty as sin One way or another this season will end with Harbaugh at its rotten core, one last spectacle of his creation. The cheating he did during the COVID shutdown wasn’t the worst we’ve ever seen, more like something from the Kelvin Sampson playbook circa Oklahoma 2006 or IU 2007, when Sampson and his staff made hundreds of recruiting phone calls during a period such calls weren’t allowed. That was Harbaugh during the COVID shutdown. We’ll never know how many players on Michigan’s current roster were contacted illegally by Harbaugh, or how many were subliminally swayed to Michigan by the special attention. If the number is greater than zero – and it has to be – it’s too many. The cheating since then has been more egregious, with Harbaugh’s analytics assistant, Connor Stalions, arranging for himself and others to scout opposing teams in person and use video cameras to steal their sideline signals. Harbaugh says he didn’t direct Stalions to do that, or even know about it, but he lost the benefit of the doubt during the COVID shutdown. And we’ve seen tape – “Sweet Jesus there’s always a tape,” as Scott Glenn’s Washington Post reporter says in the 1996 movie “Courage Under Fire” – of Stalions standing next to Harbaugh during games, studying the opposing sideline and telling him … something. What was he saying? And why was Harbaugh listening to a low-level staffer, right then and there, as he called plays? Look, no need to prosecute Harbaugh again. The case is over and beyond a reasonable doubt he has been found guilty. It’s not a matter of knowing he’s guilty, but accepting the results. Harbaugh survives because he’s a demagogue in khaki pants, making outrageous statements while his followers close their eyes, lift their hands and shout, “Preach!” He’s the guy who couldn’t decide in early 2022 between quarterbacks J.J. McNamara and Cade McNamara, and used theology to explain. “No person – that’s Biblical – no person knows what the future holds,” he told reporters before a September 2022 game against Hawaii. “Some people have asked, 'How'd you come to that decision? Was it based on some kind of NFL model?' No. It's really Biblical. Solomon was known to be a pretty wise person." Last week Harbaugh chose another analogy – and more theology – to credit his coaching staff, which had won six games while he was suspended. “Like Moses,” he said, “I’m going to die leaning on my staff – and no one’s got a better staff to lean on.” After Michigan beat Alabama in the Rose Bowl to advance to Monday’s title game, Harbaugh considered his 2023 team’s journey – having its coach suspended for three games, twice, for obtaining an unfair advantage – and said the following with his typical blank stare. “It's almost been an unfair advantage, all the things that the team has gone through,” Harbaugh said without self-awareness, irony or decency as the monster he has created – and the sport he has sullied – slinks toward a conclusion that feels inevitable, and worse. Meaningless, meaningless, utterly meaningless. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobref Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 34 minutes ago, Muda69 said: Mr. Doyel from the Indianapolis Star weighs in on Mr. Harbaugh Cue @temptation in 3…2…1… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
temptation Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Bobref said: Cue @temptation in 3…2…1… Doyel is CNN/MSNBC/and Fox rolled into one. He wishes HE had someone he could “cheat” on. Sensationalist journalism. “Thousands will die if there are fans at the Indianapolis 500 and if college football is played.” NO ONE has held him accountable. “Journalism” is full of hacks in the modern era. Edited January 4 by temptation 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muda69 Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 6 minutes ago, temptation said: Doyel is CNN/MSNBC/and Fox rolled into one. He wishes HE had someone he could “cheat” on. Sensationalist journalism. “Thousands will die if there are fans at the Indianapolis 500 and if college football is played.” NO ONE has held him accountable. “Journalism” is full of hacks in the modern era. Mr. Doyel's current position at the Indy Star is a sport columnist. He's paid to write his opinions. IMHO a columnist is different than a "Sensationalist journalist". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
temptation Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Muda69 said: Mr. Doyel's current position at the Indy Star is a sport columnist. He's paid to write his opinions. IMHO a columnist is different than a "Sensationalist journalist". Ok, well his opinions suck and have for quite sometime. When you have a platform, you also have a responsibility to have educated opinions…instead he digs his heels in and takes the most controversial stance possible while actually alienating himself and his employer from common sense. This “antagonist view” gains clicks which is a high priority in modern day journalism. Maybe I was too kind with my Fox/CNN/MSNBC take…the National Enquirer is more appropriate. Edited January 4 by temptation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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