Old Man High Pants

23 hours ago, JQWL said:

The better question is why would anyone carry the "Contraction" torch for DT?

DT & HHF

20 minutes ago, CoachVeatch said:

From 2008 to 2019 Tri High school had 1 winning season including 4 (0-10) seasons. If they would have just given up and cut the program they never would have made the semi-state run they just made. And I can tell you that those kids during that decade would say that football enriched their high school experiences regardless of the record. But since Tri isn't in Indianapolis or the region they don't exist in (the artist formerly known as) DT's mind so they must contract. This whole contraction crap gets old. If the money spent on football was really hurting these systems, they would cut them. 

If the year were 2011 DT would say Gibson Southern should consider contraction.

16 hours ago, NLCTigerFan07 said:

Playing devil's advocate here - if that is how you feel about those schools - that one of the best high school coaches to ever roam the sidelines in Indiana could not win at any of the four schools mentioned... shouldn't they consider contraction and eliminating football?

As far as the programs are concerned maybe they should. My reason for bringing up Coach Moore is that HH's comment about "serious coaching" candidates rubbed me the wrong way. I know the young man who just resigned from Connersville, and I can assure you he is a "serious  coach". Just because he'd never been a head coach before and didn't have a bunch of success doesn't mean he was a serious coach. I'd like to think the majority of coaches are serious about what they do and many times they have a lot of things working against them. 

15 hours ago, Whiting89 said:

ECC central has quite a few D1 players over time including nfl player Kawaan Short. The talent is there is just a matter of reviving the program.

 

D1 players can come from any school, even more reason not to contract. And a few D1 players does not make an "all time, too big to fail" program. 

14 hours ago, HHF said:

He said nothing about winning a state title.  How about a winning season one every other decade?  Or a sectional or conf championship?  Or maybe even a 2 game winning streak.  

Connersville made it to their first ever sectional championship game this year off of a two win playoff streak. Guess you can strike them off the list then.

39 minutes ago, HHF said:

I was hoping you would ask . 

 

Jay County has hired a serious football coach in Grant Zgunda.  They appear to be in the process of rebuilding the program and I would like to see where Coach Zgunda can take the program.

East Chicago is one of the great dynasties of Indiana High School football, maybe the greatest ever.   It is historic in nature and cannot be allowed to fail.  The Cardinals played in the semistate in 2013.  The program is not dead.  It can be revived.

Connersville, like Rushville,  is the poster school for those who feel that football is to be endured until basketball season starts.  The school hits all the criteria to be considered for contraction.  They would do well by their student body to contract football and reallocate those valuable resources towards other more cost effective and positive endeavors.  

 

East Chicago Central has one sectional in the last 35 years according to John Harrell. They made one semistate almost a decade ago and haven't won any playoff championships since, sounds like a blind squirrel finding a nut. How does that make them one of the "greatest ever" and "too big to fail"? I'm from the opposite corner of the state and can tell you I'd be hard pressed to find 10 local football fans who can tell me anything about them. Sounds like you're a little biased for some reason on that one. 

As far as Connersville and Rushville your reasoning falls apart with keeping Jay County off your list. How do you know they don't have the right coaches for the job now? How does a team like that go about hiring a what you would call "serious football coach"? And no offense to the man, I've never met him, but I'm pretty sure Eric Moore couldn't win at any of the four schools mentioned. 

3 hours ago, HHF said:

Top reasons for Contraction :

1. Chronic lack of competitiveness

2. Chronic staff turnover

3. Low numbers

4. Poor administrative support

5. Poor community support

6. Lack of coordinated feeder system

7. Strong apathetic attitude towards football

8. Competitive consolidation

9. Merger consolidation

 

56	259	Connersville 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,	19.97	44.06	170	22.21	251	17.76	263
				36.12	225	16.31	265	18.99	261
58	276	Indianapolis Shortridge 1,2,3,4,5,6,8,	12.10	23.50	284	10.62	279	12.10	275
59	280	Indianapolis Attucks 1,2,3,4,5,6,7, 8,	11.45	25.42	276	8.86	282	11.77	276
				38.18	208	2.53	293	0.96	296
61	303	South Bend Clay 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,	-2.95	39.14	202	-3.02	302	-4.09	305

Overall 2021 Sagarin Rating hilited in bold

* It is recommended that Shortridge and Attucks drop football as a means to further strengthen the Tech program by consolidating IPS football players to one central public school.  This was the vision of Dr White

* Football does not fit the specialized curriculum offered at SB Clay and should be dropped, which will also potentially strengthen the other 3 remaining city public school programs.  

Your reason for adding Connersville but taking out Jay County and East Chicago Central is?

3 hours ago, Lysander said:

Connersville used to be a major employer for folks from Franklin County with Philco-Ford, D&M, etc. operating huge facilities there - relative to the size of Connersville.  In fact, all of the surrounding counties used to benefit from that.  All of that is gone.  These days, Connersville is in terrible condition relative to the rest of the state by most any measurable.

Brookville has never had much in the way of manufacturing jobs there excepting Fry(?) Roofing.  Other than small businesses and farming, historically most other jobs were out of county - particularly Cincinnati/Ohio and Batesville (and previously in Connersville).

With that it remains a quite poor but quaint little area and hasn’t suffered some of the worst rust belt ravages and dislocations so easily observed in neighboring Connersville or Rushville but it is (and has been) relatively static.  Perhaps, anecdotally, it’s never had a reputation as the most welcoming to outsiders - which would even include people from same county towns like Metamora and Laurel (admittedly, that may be a feature of many rural communities).

Honestly them dropping, if they do, I think will help them in the long run. They never had a chance to compete in 4A after the late 90s and haven't done much in 3A. If they were to drop to 2A I think it would give them more of a chance to be relevant in the playoffs again.

Maybe at some point that can be the same for Connersville and Rushville. This year when Connersville played East Central they dressed 34 kids. Hard to compete at the 4A level when your team is that small.

On 12/4/2021 at 11:26 AM, DanteEstonia said:

I'm not trying to be rude, but what's there to do for work in Franklin County?

Not much at all. The few people I do know who live in Brookville work in Cincinnati, about an hour drive away. Not really a place that's suffered from an economic setback, just zero growth in years.

Brookville is a nice little town but it hasn't grown at all since Franklin County became a school in the late 80s. Biggest grocery store in town is the IGA, have to drive 20 to 30 minutes to get to a Kroger in either Batesville, Harrison, Oxford or Connersville.

The biggest thing that brings people in is the lake but that's just for a weekend here or there. 

13 hours ago, Lysander said:

I thought the entirety of Franklin County was already consolidated as of the mid-80s.  Just what other existing districts could Laurel and/or Mt. Carmel opt for?  In the case of Laurel, the closest existing school District (I believe) is Connersville - which is in Fayette County.

Yeah sorry should have clarified better. The talk was the existing Franklin County school district would be split up and consolidated into other schools. Laurel would become a part of Fayette County (Connersville), Mt Carmel Union County, there was even talk of Brookville consolidating into Sunman Dearborn (East Central). Right now it's all just hearsay but my dad always told me there's the slightest bit of truth in everything you hear so who knows?

15 hours ago, HoopsCoach said:

You’re right about Franklin County and their enrollment trend.  They have lost roughly 200 students at the high school level over the last 10 years.  They went from around 950 students in 2010 to 750 in 2020.  It has fallen around 20-40 students per year during that time so they could be headed towards 2A three or four alignment cycles from now.  Certainly could be sooner if their enrollment drop is greater at the younger levels right now.

SD would probably be in a 3A sectional with county rival Lawrenceburg.

This next cycle I would think the entire 3A EIAC will be in the same sectional. You have Rushville, Greensburg, Batesville, Franklin County, Lawrenceburg and South Dearborn. Add in a team or two from either Indianapolis of Louisville area depending on which way the IHSAA sends them.

7 minutes ago, HoopsCoach said:

Franklin County (732) had more students than South Dearborn (723) in 2020-21.  Both would have been in the top 20 largest 3A schools and still about 200 more than the largest 2A.

Believe Franklin County's big issue area is below the high school level. Enrollment has been declining for years there, they consolidated their middle schools four or five years ago. The layoffs happened at the elementary level. While they still are a few hundred away from 2A it's not impossible for it to happen soon.

https://wrbiradio.com/2021/05/17/five-teacher-contracts-canceled-by-franklin-county-school-board/?epik=1638301537990

Could be wrong. That's just what I'm hearing.

South Dearborn could possibly be leveling out. The Dearborn County Country Club shut down from COVID and there has been talk of them building a subdivision on the land. Though I don't think South Dearborn would want to get back to 4A, they'll have a good chance of winning their first ever sectional by being in 3A.

2 hours ago, Lysander said:

What’s happening at Franklin County….or do I even want to know?

A few work friends of mine graduated from there had told me a lot of the Millennial generation left and didn't come back. They live in Cincinnati, Harrison & Lawrenceburg now and have no desire to move back. 

Unfortunately they had to let go multiple certified and uncertified positions at the end of last year because of lack of student funding.

Multiple rumors about the future of the district now which include Franklin County staying in tact and falling to 2A, outlying areas like Laurel and Mt. Carmel being consolidated into other districts, or all of Franklin County being consolidated.

18 minutes ago, oldtimeqb said:

All this talk of moving up.  I will be Mr. Negative.  Who is moving down?  I would assume rural schools, or those communities on an island without much surrounding growth?

Over the last few classifications we have seen Owen Valley and Martinsville drop in the southern half of the state.  I think Crawford County was 3A but has dropped to 2A as well.  Will the EIAC "big school" division be mostly 3A schools now? 

Without much knowledge of individual communities, just speculation, but maybe South Dearborn, Madison, Pike Central, Brownstown and Sullivan drop?   

South Dearborn will for sure be dropping down to 3A, leaves only two 4A schools in the conference (East Central & Connersville), with some expected shake ups on who is "Big School" and "Little School".

Biggest question with the EIAC is how far Franklin County will drop. If not in 2022-23 they may very well be 2A by 2024-25.