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DT

Hoosier Heritage Should Ask New Pal to Leave

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New Pal and it's on campus football factory have severely damaged the competitive balance in the Hoosier Heritage Conference

New Pal clearly does not share the same philosophy towards football as does the other 7 schools In the conference.  The results of the past several seasons are clear indication of this fact

If the Dragons will not leave on their own to pursue a better competitive fit, the HHC should ask them to do so, and in a hurry.   The current situation is unhealthy for both sides.  

 

Edited by DT
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3 hours ago, DT said:

New Pal and it's on campus football factory have severely damaged the competitive balance in the Hoosier Heritage Conference

New Pal clearly does not share the same philosophy towards football as does the other 7 schools In the conference.  The results of the past several seasons are clear indication of this fact

If the Dragons will not leave on their own to pursue a better competitive fit, the HHC should ask them to do so, and in a hurry.   The current situation is unhealthy for both sides.  

 

The issue with this is that New Pal is only dominant in football.  The other sports are quite even, though New Pal did make it to the Regional Championship in basketball against Ben Davis last year.

 

I do agree though that the possibility exists that New Pal, Greenfield and Mt Vernon could outgrow the conference as more and more people move into Hancock County.  Mt. Vernon will eventually be one of the largest schools in the state.

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If Columbus East hasn’t been kicked out of the HHC, don’t think New Pal is getting the boot. New Pal is only like a 49 game conference win streak... Columbus East is at 101 game conference win streak. Just don’t see a 7 year streak getting someone a boot. 

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Another incredibly uninformed, throw-a-dumb-idea-against-the-wall take from Driven Dakich. 

First off, there have been dominant teams in the HHC in the past - Delta & Mt. Vernon in the late 1990s/early 2000s, most notably. While some of the conference teams have been on down cycles, Pendleton Heights, Mt. Vernon and Delta are all trending toward being at that level of being teams who could make a deep run. 

The HHC sponsors 20 sports. There are dominant teams in a few of them. Should Yorktown & New Castle be kicked out because of their volleyball prowess? Delta has won 20+ tennis titles in the conference. Should they be kicked out, too? The bottom line is, the Hoosier Heritage Conference is a solid group of eight schools who are geographically compact and roughly the same size. One could argue the football team isn't even the most dominant team at New Palestine, given the softball team has won six state championships since 2004. 

Over time, as HoosierFB_JG noted, Mt. Vernon, New Palestine and Pendleton Heights could significantly outgrow the more rural schools in the conference and that might cause some realignment. Greenfield-Central will experience some growth, but probably not to the level of those three, who are closer to the growth explosion in Indy and Fishers/Noblesville. But that's not happening anytime soon. New Palestine is a member in good standing in the HHC, which has more sports than football, and has state championship-level teams in several of them (the HHC had *four* IHSAA championship teams last year - New Castle & Yorktown volleyball, New Palestine football & softball ... and Yorktown was the state runner-up to NP in softball). 

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Dan and I are both Region guys, so I appreciate the linkage

New Pal sits between the Mid State and the HHC.  Travel likely would be less in the MSC

MSC is a 5A-6A conference.   Based on long term growth projections and competitive profile, it's the better fit for NP

Schools have been asked to leave conferences before.  The Lafayette schools shown the door by the HCC, and The MIC booting the Terre Hautes

In my view, the HHC has a waning football culture.  That is in direct opposition to the approach and focus at NP.   Hence the suggestion to part company.  

 

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6 hours ago, DT said:

New Pal and it's on campus football factory have severely damaged the competitive balance in the Hoosier Heritage Conference

New Pal clearly does not share the same philosophy towards football as does the other 7 schools In the conference.  The results of the past several seasons are clear indication of this fact

If the Dragons will not leave on their own to pursue a better competitive fit, the HHC should ask them to do so, and in a hurry.   The current situation is unhealthy for both sides.  

 

And if they so NO! Then What? Linton was like that for many years in the SW7. Linton left SW7 never asked them to. Doesn't New Pal have Charlie? I believe he graduate soon. Lets see what happens to New Pal?

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Charlie is an excellent player but New Pal  has been very strong for the last seven years. What you fail to understand is their climb to a powerhouse position came at the time Kyle Ralph took control of the football program. Did you ever consider that coaching may have  been a major part in the success of the program. Are they to be penalized or forced to leave their conference because he may be a step above his counterparts. In addition, should the players be forced to leave because they 100% bought into the program dedicating endless hours of hard work in the weight room and during the off season when conditioning is critical to a successful program. 

Here is a novel idea. If you don't like the manner in which your competition is beating you on a yearly basis, then get better. Get into the weight room, hire a tremendous coach like New Pal did and see if your programs changes in a positive manner. 

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11 minutes ago, Ohiodragon said:

Charlie is an excellent player but New Pal  has been very strong for the last seven years. What you fail to understand is their climb to a powerhouse position came at the time Kyle Ralph took control of the football program. Did you ever consider that coaching may have  been a major part in the success of the program. Are they to be penalized or forced to leave their conference because he may be a step above his counterparts. In addition, should the players be forced to leave because they 100% bought into the program dedicating endless hours of hard work in the weight room and during the off season when conditioning is critical to a successful program. 

Here is a novel idea. If you don't like the manner in which your competition is beating you on a yearly basis, then get better. Get into the weight room, hire a tremendous coach like New Pal did and see if your programs changes in a positive manner. 

I understand very clearly what has happened at NP.  Coach Ralph deserves all the credit for creating a culture of hard work, dedication and excellence.  

My point is, the other schools in the conference are nowhere near that same level of commitment to football

NP admin does a disservice to its student athletes by rewarding their dedication with an overmatched and outclassed group of opponents every week.  

And how does the very best program in the conference suddenly wind up with an All American running back on its roster, courtesy of another conference school?

This is a very dangerous precedent.  Public football magnets can be just as disruptive to competitive balance as are private magnets

How many other kids on the NP roster have come in from other HHC schools?

As an analogy, NP is playing at a Power 5 level, while the rest of the league is MAC level at best, maybe lower

 

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34 minutes ago, Donnie Baker said:

What about the other sports?

A rising tide lifts all boats.   All new pal  sports will benefit from a shift to stronger competition. 

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54 minutes ago, DT said:

I understand very clearly what has happened at NP.  Coach Ralph deserves all the credit for creating a culture of hard work, dedication and excellence.  

My point is, the other schools in the conference are nowhere near that same level of commitment to football

Pendleton Heights and Mt. Vernon hired coaches from the MIC the last couple of years. To say they don't have that level of commitment to football is laughable. Delta has an incredible commitment to football. All of those programs are well-coached and have solid traditions and communities. 

New Palestine's players and coaches have created a special culture. But to hurl that level of invective against some solid, well-coached, well-run programs is really unfair. 

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1 hour ago, DT said:

How many other kids on the NP roster have come in from other HHC schools?

New Palestine has ONE starter on the roster who didn't attend New Palestine as a freshman, and that was because of a family move as the family business had more opportunities in the Indianapolis area, found a home in the New Palestine district. That was *very* well-documented in the Muncie paper. Family moves for job opportunities happen *all the time*. Like Mt. Vernon, Whiteland, Fishers, Brownsburg, Carmel, Center Grove, Avon, Plainfield, Zionsville ... New Palestine is in a *very* rapidly-growing area that borders Indianapolis and is experiencing growth. People are going to move into the district - many more for non-sports reasons than for sports. 

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Shades of Harrison Bergeron.

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41 minutes ago, crimsonace1 said:

Pendleton Heights and Mt. Vernon hired coaches from the MIC the last couple of years. To say they don't have that level of commitment to football is laughable. Delta has an incredible commitment to football. All of those programs are well-coached and have solid traditions and communities. 

New Palestine's players and coaches have created a special culture. But to hurl that level of invective against some solid, well-coached, well-run programs is really unfair. 

HOOSIER HERITAGE
ALL TIMES EASTERN
  CONFERENCE ALL GAMES
  W-L Pts OP W-L Pts OP Streak
New Palestine 7-0 399 51 9-  0 490 73 Won 23
Delta 5-2 304 93 7-  2 390 100 Lost 1
Mount Vernon 5-2 199 126 7-  2 288 163 Won 4
Yorktown 4-3 164 137 6-  3 215 151 Lost 1
Pendleton Heights 4-3 208 123 5-  4 264 152 Won 1
New Castle 2-5 158 290 3-  6 217 328 Won 1
Greenfield 1-6 122 328 1-  8 136 419 Lost 4
Shelbyville 0-7 8 414 0-  9 15 535 Lost 14

 

 

New Pal outscored its HHC opponents by an average of 57-7 per game.  

They were 5 touchdowns better than the conference runner up.

These numbers look familiar to those of the past several years.

Maybe the HHC should do what the Hoosier Hills did.  Reduce the conference schedule to 6 games so the bottom feeders wont have to play New Pal, like the Hoosier Hills bottom feeders avoid Columbus East.

But then, is that what NP really wants long term?  is that truly in their best interests?

 

 

 

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Apparently DT has never seen Mount Vernon's indoor turf field facility . And who the HC is....no commitment to football....you're made of spare parts aren't ya bud? 

Edited by CoachVeatch
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10 minutes ago, CoachVeatch said:

Apparently DT has never seen Mount Vernon's indoor turf field facility . And who the HC is....no commitment to football....you're made of spare parts aren't ya bud? 

MV could very well be the next New Pal   

What about GC, NC and Shelby?

They are to the Hoosier Heritage as JC and Madison are to the Hoosier Hills.  

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1 hour ago, foxbat said:

Shades of Harrison Bergeron.

I was going to say LCC and their departure from the Hoosier Heartland for the greener pastures of the Hoosier Conference.

 

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9 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

I was going to say LCC and their departure from the Hoosier Heartland for the greener pastures of the Hoosier Conference.

 

No pleasing you.  You complained when they were in the HHC and taking shots now that they are out. 

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6 hours ago, crimsonace1 said:

Another incredibly uninformed, throw-a-dumb-idea-against-the-wall take from Driven Dakich. 

First off, there have been dominant teams in the HHC in the past - Delta & Mt. Vernon in the late 1990s/early 2000s, most notably. While some of the conference teams have been on down cycles, Pendleton Heights, Mt. Vernon and Delta are all trending toward being at that level of being teams who could make a deep run. 

The HHC sponsors 20 sports. There are dominant teams in a few of them. Should Yorktown & New Castle be kicked out because of their volleyball prowess? Delta has won 20+ tennis titles in the conference. Should they be kicked out, too? The bottom line is, the Hoosier Heritage Conference is a solid group of eight schools who are geographically compact and roughly the same size. One could argue the football team isn't even the most dominant team at New Palestine, given the softball team has won six state championships since 2004. 

Over time, as HoosierFB_JG noted, Mt. Vernon, New Palestine and Pendleton Heights could significantly outgrow the more rural schools in the conference and that might cause some realignment. Greenfield-Central will experience some growth, but probably not to the level of those three, who are closer to the growth explosion in Indy and Fishers/Noblesville. But that's not happening anytime soon. New Palestine is a member in good standing in the HHC, which has more sports than football, and has state championship-level teams in several of them (the HHC had *four* IHSAA championship teams last year - New Castle & Yorktown volleyball, New Palestine football & softball ... and Yorktown was the state runner-up to NP in softball). 

I also think the HHC does it right.  Schools should not be penalized for greatness...or even badness!!!

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That being said, conferences don’t exist just for football.  South Newton, for instance, has a very good baseball program, and their golf team is pretty good, too.  As for basketball, I do know that Coach Sammons is a tremendous talent.

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26 minutes ago, foxbat said:

No pleasing you.  You complained when they were in the HHC and taking shots now that they are out. 

Image result for flip flop gif

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48 minutes ago, Impartial_Observer said:

Seriously you could have stopped right there.

Good luck on that one...

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2 hours ago, foxbat said:

No pleasing you.  You complained when they were in the HHC and taking shots now that they are out. 

Thank you for your support.

 

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22 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

Thank you for your support.

 

No problem.

 

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