cbc34 Posted December 11, 2019 Share Posted December 11, 2019 Conference championships don't matter. Not when the discussion on Saturday was centered on OSU/LSU losing but still making the playoff, just as a lower seed. That 13th data point doesn't matter when most of these teams are playing FCS teams during the season. So really ND is playing the same amount of FBS teams as anyone else. Until there is some sort of uniform scheduling policy (number of conference games, no FCS on the non-conference schedule, etc.) no one can complain about Notre Dame's independence. They play as good of a schedule as just about anyone in the country. Also, no one is strong-arming ND into a conference, especially by expanding the playoff and especially the NCAA. ND will tell the NCAA to kick rocks. And expanded playoff only makes it easier for ND. As long as it's a four-team playoff, there will never be a stipulation that you must win your conference to be in. No conference will vote for that because it eliminates the ability to get two teams in. Now if ND goes 11-1/12-0 a few times and gets left out, that would change a lot. Just don't see the committee doing that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sacked Posted December 11, 2019 Share Posted December 11, 2019 My question for Notre Dame fans is how long are they going to keep Brian Kelley around without winning a national championship? I can't think of any other coach for the Irish that has been their that long without winning one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DumfriesYMCA Posted December 11, 2019 Share Posted December 11, 2019 sagarins rankings and SOS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 11, 2019 Share Posted December 11, 2019 32 minutes ago, TrojanDad said: I believe Ohio State played 5, when they played Wisconsin for the 2nd time in the Big 10 Championship. (please know I am anything but a Buckeye fan....makes me sick to my stomach) We finally have something in common...can we build from this? 2 hours ago, Sacked said: My question for Notre Dame fans is how long are they going to keep Brian Kelley around without winning a national championship? I can't think of any other coach for the Irish that has been their that long without winning one. Yes, as they should. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 11, 2019 Share Posted December 11, 2019 Winning 10-11 games at a place like Notre Dame that is unwilling to cut as many corners as the elites of the sport is one hell of an accomplishment and should not be overlooked. They cannot even actively recruit many of the same players as the Clemson's, Alabama's and Georgia's of the world. Kelly has them as a top 10-15 power annually which is an upgrade over any of the previous coaches since Holtz. Be careful what you wish for... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobref Posted December 11, 2019 Author Share Posted December 11, 2019 3 hours ago, Temptation said: Winning 10-11 games at a place like Notre Dame that is unwilling to cut as many corners as the elites of the sport is one hell of an accomplishment and should not be overlooked. They cannot even actively recruit many of the same players as the Clemson's, Alabama's and Georgia's of the world. Kelly has them as a top 10-15 power annually which is an upgrade over any of the previous coaches since Holtz. Be careful what you wish for... I hear you, and don’t disagree. But as an independent, whose only goal every year has to be to get to the final four, ND has to ask two questions: Am I satisfied with beating everyone I should, but virtually never winning as an underdog? if the answer is “no,” how do I do better than that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 42 minutes ago, Bobref said: I hear you, and don’t disagree. But as an independent, whose only goal every year has to be to get to the final four, ND has to ask two questions: Am I satisfied with beating everyone I should, but virtually never winning as an underdog? if the answer is “no,” how do I do better than that? Cheat...like everyone else. You show me a clean program, I’ll show you a mediocre one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobref Posted December 12, 2019 Author Share Posted December 12, 2019 3 minutes ago, Temptation said: Cheat...like everyone else. You show me a clean program, I’ll show you a mediocre one. I assume that is tongue in cheek. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Bobref said: I assume that is tongue in cheek. Unfortunately, not anymore. It’s worse than its ever been. You can choose to produce doctors or all-American football players, rarely both. Edited December 12, 2019 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sacked Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 22 hours ago, Temptation said: Unfortunately, not anymore. It’s worse than its ever been. You can choose to produce doctors or all-American football players, rarely both. What proof are you basing this off of? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itiswhatitis Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 12 hours ago, Sacked said: What proof are you basing this off of? It's only an opinion (or conspiracy theory) because it's been reported in the media a couple of teams got caught. Therefor, EVERY school cheats, except Notre Dame, of course.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobref Posted December 13, 2019 Author Share Posted December 13, 2019 On 12/11/2019 at 6:18 PM, Temptation said: Cheat...like everyone else. You show me a clean program, I’ll show you a mediocre one. Notre Dame runs a clean program ... and I would hardly call them mediocre. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Bobref said: Notre Dame runs a clean program ... and I would hardly call them mediocre. Let’s settle on “average.” ONE top 25 win and The Camping World Bowl is my evidence. Yours? Edited December 13, 2019 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 10 minutes ago, Temptation said: Let’s settle on “average.” ONE top 25 win and The Camping World Bowl is my evidence. Yours? I smell an early round KO by @Bobref in this match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarshallCounty Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 Being independent is far more valuable than bowl games. Bowl games are glorified exhibitions that players are choosing to skip more and more. The only thing that matters is being in the playoff. If ND goes 12-0 they will be in the playoff. If they don't, they don't deserve to be there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 19 minutes ago, DannEllenwood said: I smell an early round KO by @Bobref in this match. Can't wait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarshallCounty Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 Just now, TrojanDad said: Some of the marquis players that are known to be high NFL draft pics. They seem to be the exception and not the rule. I would guess the vast, vast majority of players would prefer to play in an additional bowl game vs. sitting at home. As far as value of being independent vs. being in a conference.....I am not sure one way or the other. I would think more would be independent if it were truly financially better. Playing games in Ireland and Green Bay are products of being independent. They are are in California every year, the criss cross the nation and play in almost every region of the country every 2-3 years. You have pockets of ND fans everywhere, which contributes to an alumni base that stretches across the country. Those alumni in turn, donate money for many years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sacked Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 33 minutes ago, Temptation said: Let’s settle on “average.” ONE top 25 win and The Camping World Bowl is my evidence. Yours? I am in no way a Notre Dame fan but come on. They played 5 top 25 teams and beat three of them. Far from an average team. Just not the dominate force they once was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 4 minutes ago, Sacked said: I am in no way a Notre Dame fan but come on. They played 5 top 25 teams and beat three of them. Far from an average team. Just not the dominate force they once was. Top 25 WHEN they played... Better hope Navy wins tomorrow and stays ranked... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 39 minutes ago, DannEllenwood said: I smell an early round KO by @Bobref in this match. Is there a difference between “independent speed” and “conference speed?” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarshallCounty Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 5 minutes ago, TrojanDad said: I see your point....although the teams ND play in those venues are not independent. I think kids put some value on that, but not sure if more than picking up bling in a bowl game. I certainly agree there are ND fans everywhere....but I sure couldn't find them at Stanford just a couple of weeks ago....that small stadium was embarrassingly empty. I would think the Big 10 and SEC do pretty good for their member teams when it comes to generating income...there had to be a reasons teams worked to get in them and some have to travel great distances to play their games. I'm not saying ND would increase revenues by going to a conference....I am just saying there are pros and cons of being independent. I agree. I think every school has to find what works best for them. I think ND has a pretty good deal with the ACC. Is it perfect? No. However I think it is the best situation available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sacked Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 1 hour ago, Temptation said: Top 25 WHEN they played... Better hope Navy wins tomorrow and stays ranked... As it has been said on this forum for years, the only rankings that matter are the ones at the end of the year. The CFP rankings are done. Spots 5-25 will not change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 1 minute ago, Sacked said: As it has been said on this forum for years, the only rankings that matter are the ones at the end of the year. The CFP rankings are done. Spots 5-25 will not change. Yep, makes my point. USC and UVA were overrated when they played ND as the "end of the year" rankings show both outside of the top 25... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sacked Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 13 minutes ago, Temptation said: Yep, makes my point. USC and UVA were overrated when they played ND as the "end of the year" rankings show both outside of the top 25... Not sure where you are getting your rankings but the final CFP poll has USC- #22 Navy- #23 UVA- #24 That is three top 25 wins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2019 Share Posted December 13, 2019 33 minutes ago, Sacked said: Not sure where you are getting your rankings but the final CFP poll has USC- #22 Navy- #23 UVA- #24 That is three top 25 wins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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