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How did Central and North Supplant Reitz and Castle?


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Reitz and  Castle were the dominant big school programs for decades in the SIAC.  Evansville city schools North and Central appear to now be at the top of the SIAC heap

This didnt happen overnite, although in some ways , for those of us in north and central Indiana, it sure seems to have occurred quite quickly.

Whats the inside story?  

What factors contirubuted to this shift in power?

Evolving coaching staffs?

Economic changes within the city?

Deemphasis of football?

Changing demographics?

 

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Castle is usually middle of the pack or have been the last several years. Nobody in siac looks at Castle as a top tier program. Probably biggest underachieving team year in and year out. 
 

Central has been near or at the top the past 4 or 5 years. 
 

North has been awful since 2012 and is due for a couple good seasons. I wouldn’t say they’ve replaced anyone based off of being 500 last year and off to a good start in a down siac conference this year. 
 

Reitz had a couple bad years lately which can be expected after dominating for years. 

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Both Central and North established youth leagues in the past 5-10 years.  The population on the north side of Evansville has grown significantly and the "new" North High School was built.  I think you are starting to see fruits of their labor paying off.  I think Reitz is in a bit of a down spell, and their numbers were down a bit last year.  Not sure about this year.  

Too early to say MD has "gone south".  They just lost a really good senior class and this year's team is a bit of a rebuild and they are experiencing some growing pains on offense with a soph QB, RB and some new OL.  The defense has played well through 4 games.

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Transfers have certainty benefited Central the last 4 years.  Schutte snd Clayton were in Reitz feeder till high school then they  leave for Central. Madison is best player in town and left Bosse for Central this season.  

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15 minutes ago, Wildcat1992 said:

Both Central and North established youth leagues in the past 5-10 years.  The population on the north side of Evansville has grown significantly and the "new" North High School was built.  I think you are starting to see fruits of their labor paying off.  I think Reitz is in a bit of a down spell, and their numbers were down a bit last year.  Not sure about this year.  

Too early to say MD has "gone south".  They just lost a really good senior class and this year's team is a bit of a rebuild and they are experiencing some growing pains on offense with a soph QB, RB and some new OL.  The defense has played well through 4 games.

I would say this is pretty accurate. Unless I'm mistaken, last year's North seniors were the first graduating class to complete the youth league from start to finish. 

Central also benefited from North moving. North was a more diverse school. The inner-city kids that once attended North, no longer want to make that 45 minute bus ride. Instead they just go to Central. 

As far as others struggling, I'm unsure. Maybe some others can shed more light on those programs. 

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1 hour ago, southend said:

We would be remiss not to add a third ,MD, to the list of Big Dogs, that went south. 

I don't believe I agree with that assessment. 2014 state runner-up, 15 lost to state champ Monrovia at regional, 16 lost to Monrovia again at regional, 17 lost to state champ Southridge in sectional, 18 lost to Southridge again, 19 lost in regional to Triton Central. They have won one State title in football, they are really good year in and year out in 2A. Don't expect this year to be any different! 

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32 minutes ago, Cappy said:

I don't believe I agree with that assessment. 2014 state runner-up, 15 lost to state champ Monrovia at regional, 16 lost to Monrovia again at regional, 17 lost to state champ Southridge in sectional, 18 lost to Southridge again, 19 lost in regional to Triton Central. They have won one State title in football, they are really good year in and year out in 2A. Don't expect this year to be any different! 

This year's group of sophomores were undefeated at 8th and 9th graders.  The JV team is 3-1 this year.  Beat Central in OT, lost to Castle by 6, beat VL 34-0 and beat Memorial 37-0.

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All great points with youth leagues, new North location etc.  I would add that all the expansion in Evansville is on the North side and it is growing like crazy....pushing farther and farther north.  I think North has a young talented and energetic coaching staff as well.  The revolving coaching door at Central hasn't seemed to matter much.  I feel like what North is building (at least for now) looks more sustainable than Central to me.  I also agree on Castle under achieving based on it's enrollment and type of community from which to draw from.

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2 hours ago, vicvinegar said:

I would say this is pretty accurate. Unless I'm mistaken, last year's North seniors were the first graduating class to complete the youth league from start to finish. 

Central also benefited from North moving. North was a more diverse school. The inner-city kids that once attended North, no longer want to make that 45 minute bus ride. Instead they just go to Central. 

As far as others struggling, I'm unsure. Maybe some others can shed more light on those programs. 

Makes sense. Looking at this boundary map, the school is pretty far north of the portion of their district that extends into the city of Evansville. Do students in the EVSC get to pick their HS? How easy is it for a kid in North's district to attend Central, Reitz, etc.?

 

Capture.PNG

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Let's put things in perspective...when Coach John Lidy was head coach at Castle, the only times they won the SIAC title were in the following years:

  • 1975 - SIAC "B" League Champions (great team, but they didn't play the city schools)
  • 1982
  • 1983
  • 1984 - Co-SIAC Champions (did not play Mater Dei that year and MD was the other Co-SIAC Champion
  • 2002 - 18 seasons later

Since then, Castle won the title in 2011 and 2012. Since 1973 Lidy's first year as HC and until now through 2 more HCs, it's been the ebbs and flows of high school football. Every program goes through them.

Go Knights!

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Central has definitely benefited from transfers in recent years. Reitz, Bosse, Harrison, and probably more have lost notable players to Central. Reitz used to be the school that would get the transfers from all those schools. Where that change came from, I won't/can't really say for sure. May have to do with coaching preferences, friends, or chasing more success. However, with the growth of the North side, North has also started benefiting from transfers, even down at the lower levels. North also has a young, energetic coaching staff like someone mentioned, which definitely helps. Reitz has a really good freshmen class and a new coaching staff, so I am sure they will be back near the top within the next few years after a culture has been re-established. North will be good these next few years, then may hit a brief rebuild, but they definitely have talent down in the lower levels. I have not heard much about the lower levels of MD, Central, Memorial, or Castle. Jasper is typically always good at all levels and Lewis is great at instilling culture from the bottom up. Other question, how does VL, Bosse, and Harrison get to the point of being competitive in a tough week-to-week conference. It will be interesting to see how the year finishes out, but I am more interested to see how the next few years will be when (hopefully) everything is back to normal and these programs all get an actual off-season+summer.

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3 hours ago, Paradise1960 said:

Let's put things in perspective...when Coach John Lidy was head coach at Castle, the only times they won the SIAC title were in the following years:

  • 1975 - SIAC "B" League Champions (great team, but they didn't play the city schools)
  • 1982
  • 1983
  • 1984 - Co-SIAC Champions (did not play Mater Dei that year and MD was the other Co-SIAC Champion
  • 2002 - 18 seasons later

Since then, Castle won the title in 2011 and 2012. Since 1973 Lidy's first year as HC and until now through 2 more HCs, it's been the ebbs and flows of high school football. Every program goes through them.

Go Knights!

There you go, bringing facts and data up again!  😁

I have been out of town a while, but never would have guessed MD had more SIAC titles than Castle.

I think the two 5A titles Lidy won influenced the perception of Castle (maybe rightfully so, not meant to be a knock at all).

 

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58 minutes ago, fenderbender said:

There you go, bringing facts and data up again!  😁

I have been out of town a while, but never would have guessed MD had more SIAC titles than Castle.

I think the two 5A titles Lidy won influenced the perception of Castle (maybe rightfully so, not meant to be a knock at all).

 

Technically 3A and 5A, I believe in 82 3A was the biggest class and 4A was introduced in 83.

4 hours ago, Paradise1960 said:

Let's put things in perspective...when Coach John Lidy was head coach at Castle, the only times they won the SIAC title were in the following years:

  • 1975 - SIAC "B" League Champions (great team, but they didn't play the city schools)
  • 1982
  • 1983
  • 1984 - Co-SIAC Champions (did not play Mater Dei that year and MD was the other Co-SIAC Champion
  • 2002 - 18 seasons later

Since then, Castle won the title in 2011 and 2012. Since 1973 Lidy's first year as HC and until now through 2 more HCs, it's been the ebbs and flows of high school football. Every program goes through them.

Go Knights!

Completely shocked me they didn't win SIAC in 94, don't remember Bosse winning it. Bosse lost in sectional, Castle wins state, and MD (who finished 3rd in SIAC) was state runner-up.

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15 minutes ago, Cappy said:

Since then, Castle won the title in 2011 and 2012. Since 1973 Lidy's first year as HC and until now through 2 more HCs, it's been the ebbs and flows of high school football. Every program goes through them.

What  schools other than Castle  routinely have Middle School, Freshmen and JV programs go at or near undefeated, then go .500 as a varsity program?  All the other schools must really hit on all cylinders their varsity years . . . Might suggest it’s a bit deeper than be and flow.

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11 minutes ago, Stickfish said:

What  schools other than Castle  routinely have Middle School, Freshmen and JV programs go at or near undefeated, then go .500 as a varsity program?  All the other schools must really hit on all cylinders their varsity years . . . Might suggest it’s a bit deeper than be and flow.

Doesn't Castle have two middle school programs?

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14 minutes ago, Alduflux said:

Doesn't Castle have two middle school programs?

They have 2 middle schools (North & South).  Not sure if they still have 7th & 8th grade teams at both or not though.  They did from 2009-2015 when I was involved for Memorial at that level and often had 40+ on each squad.  

 

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49 minutes ago, Cappy said:

Completely shocked me they didn't win SIAC in 94, don't remember Bosse winning it. Bosse lost in sectional, Castle wins state, and MD (who finished 3rd in SIAC) was state runner-up.

Me too! That Castle team in '94 was big and tough. They completely wore us (Portage) down in the 2nd half of the '94 State Title game. I believe they only led by 6 going into the 4th quarter and ended up winning 30-12. The O-Line was massive and they could just run behind them at will with the little RB or Lidy (built like a mack truck) on QB keepers. I went back and looked at their results. I would have assumed they lost to North (State Runner Up following year with Deke Cooper), but they beat North. Both losses (Central and Bosse) were early in the season. Was Levron Williams already carrying the ball for Bosse in '94? He and Randle El were a lethal combination at IU. 

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2 hours ago, Boilernation said:

Me too! That Castle team in '94 was big and tough. They completely wore us (Portage) down in the 2nd half of the '94 State Title game. I believe they only led by 6 going into the 4th quarter and ended up winning 30-12. The O-Line was massive and they could just run behind them at will with the little RB or Lidy (built like a mack truck) on QB keepers. I went back and looked at their results. I would have assumed they lost to North (State Runner Up following year with Deke Cooper), but they beat North. Both losses (Central and Bosse) were early in the season. Was Levron Williams already carrying the ball for Bosse in '94? He and Randle El were a lethal combination at IU. 

I think that was before Levron. I believe Mac Jacobs was the running back then...he was a bad dude too. I want to say levron started at running back on varsity in 95 but I could be wrong. I agree with the randle el comment though. I was at IU when they were there and they were as exiting as it gets. They actually brought some fans in the stands.

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2 hours ago, Stickfish said:

What  schools other than Castle  routinely have Middle School, Freshmen and JV programs go at or near undefeated, then go .500 as a varsity program?  All the other schools must really hit on all cylinders their varsity years . . . Might suggest it’s a bit deeper than be and flow.

That is not really what happens to Castle. Over the last 26 years they have had 15 seasons with at least 8 wins. 20 winning records, one season of a .500 record and 5 less that .500

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