6A #3 Merrillville @ 3A #1 Bishop Chatard next week

[hhpatriot04]

Congratulations, Chatard.

Don't know if this was the case in reality, but it was in the smack talk. Just never give the Trojans any locker room material. Either way win or lose, you're going to get smacked in the mouth on the field. 

And now they know. Run it back at Merrillville or halfway in Lafayette. Same outcome 9 of 10 times. 

3A should be very concerned heading into the tournament. 

[oldunclemark]

9 hours ago, Coach Nowlin said:

Per my rules of owning the Region Card, I must follow all region rules!!   Good Win Chatard.... per usual it seems.   

Got to agree. That's the same Merrillville team that dominated 2A No.1 Andrean....

What did Chatard get...500 yards....?    I know the Pirates were short a couple of players...but that defense had shut down everybody up here....

 

If Bishop Chatard is that good, how good is Cathedral?

[NLCTigerFan07]

26 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

If Bishop Chatard is that good, how good is Cathedral?

I said the same thing last night! Cathedral (and not taking anything away from Center Grove here) could win the state championship in any class in both Indiana and Ohio this year. Impressive seasons from the 2 Indianapolis Catholic rivals

[TheDoctor22]

Congrats Trojans! What a fun game to watch! It wasn't always pretty, but Chatard showed up ready to play. They played tough, physical football all four quarters, which I think was the difference in the game.

A lot of people quick to dismiss Merrillville after that game, but I'm not so sure. Merrillville was every bit as big and as athletic as advertised. They have some VERY good players on both sides of the ball. As others have mentioned, I think the travel definitely had an impact. Merrillville was also down a few starters. Lastly, Chatard is a pretty darn good football team. They played a competitive game with Cathedral (who is historically good by their standards), which no other Indiana team can say so far this year, including Merrillville's potential semi-state opponent Westfield. I wouldn't count Merrillville out just yet. If they get healthy and clean up some mistakes, they could be a very dangerous team in November. Keep your heads up pirates and good luck the rest of the year!

[BTF]

7 minutes ago, TheDoctor22 said:

Congrats Trojans! What a fun game to watch! It wasn't always pretty, but Chatard showed up ready to play. They played tough, physical football all four quarters, which I think was the difference in the game.

A lot of people quick to dismiss Merrillville after that game, but I'm not so sure. Merrillville was every bit as big and as athletic as advertised. They have some VERY good players on both sides of the ball. As others have mentioned, I think the travel definitely had an impact. Merrillville was also down a few starters. Lastly, Chatard is a pretty darn good football team. They played a competitive game with Cathedral (who is historically good by their standards), which no other Indiana team can say so far this year, including Merrillville's potential semi-state opponent Westfield. I wouldn't count Merrillville out just yet. If they get healthy and clean up some mistakes, they could be a very dangerous team in November. Keep your heads up pirates and good luck the rest of the year!

Great post. How do you think this years team stacks up with Chatard's all time best?

[FastpacedO]

47 minutes ago, TheDoctor22 said:

Congrats Trojans! What a fun game to watch! It wasn't always pretty, but Chatard showed up ready to play. They played tough, physical football all four quarters, which I think was the difference in the game.

A lot of people quick to dismiss Merrillville after that game, but I'm not so sure. Merrillville was every bit as big and as athletic as advertised. They have some VERY good players on both sides of the ball. As others have mentioned, I think the travel definitely had an impact. Merrillville was also down a few starters. Lastly, Chatard is a pretty darn good football team. They played a competitive game with Cathedral (who is historically good by their standards), which no other Indiana team can say so far this year, including Merrillville's potential semi-state opponent Westfield. I wouldn't count Merrillville out just yet. If they get healthy and clean up some mistakes, they could be a very dangerous team in November. Keep your heads up pirates and good luck the rest of the year!

I will say if travel had an impact, it is probably a good thing that they played this game. If Merrillville were to make it to the State Championship they would have to travel then to. Helps that they have done the travel now and can look back on what they can improve upon to not have travel impact them as much. 

[Lysander]

Ironically Chatard was more penalized than Merrillville last night but Chatard did win the turnover battle....which was critical.  

Merrillville was supremely talented (seemed abundantly obvious from the start) but I think Chatard’s fundamentals and discipline of play, constant physicality, swarming defense and, frankly, ability to adjust offset that, so, by game’s end, Chatard seemed to often be able to do what they wanted.  

Pretty typical recipe for a Chatard win....which more than a few times have been against more talented teams.  Chatard teams generally will just wear you down.  I think, playing a Chatard team for the first time is a bit of a shock to the system  for most schools.  As a fan I’m used to it but it just seems to throw a lot of teams off that first time.

I really did want to remark about a couple of things that stood out to me regarding Merrillville.  First, they truly are talented....admittedly, everyone acknowledges that.

But the other thing was just how Merrillville handled themselves. I’ve seen a LOT of talented teams play Chatard and get visibly frustrated, then get chippy (both with Chatard and within their own ranks) and then......just.......quit.

Merrillville did NONE of those things.  They never got visibly frustrated or chippy and they darn sure didn’t quit.  They played the whole game and played with class.  I honestly think this game should make them better.

Much like Doc22 stated above, I think people underestimate Merrillville at their own peril because of the result of this game.   

[TheDoctor22]

2 hours ago, BTF said:

Great post. How do you think this years team stacks up with Chatard's all time best?

I wouldn't say this team is among the all-time best...yet.  If they can run the gauntlet through a very tough 3A, then I might change my answer in November.  The talent level isn't close to some of the best Chatard teams in terms of raw athletic ability - there are no D1 players on this team.  I'm not sure there are any players even getting D2 looks, although I would hope/expect this to change by the end of the season.  I do think last year's Chatard team was one of the best in school history, and I don't think this year's team is there yet.

But I will say this year's team seems to get better every week.  The defense is very undersized, but they really fly to the ball.  As fast as Merrillville was, I thought Chatard's speed on defense really gave them fits.  Offensively, they don't have the big time play maker at RB that's been here historically, but this isn't the Chatard offense most teams are used to seeing.  I think they threw for over 300 yards last night.  The ability to be multi-dimensional has reduced the need to rely on a big time RB, and I think they are better offensively for it.

 

[Staxawax]

2 hours ago, FastpacedO said:

I will say if travel had an impact, it is probably a good thing that they played this game. If Merrillville were to make it to the State Championship they would have to travel then to. Helps that they have done the travel now and can look back on what they can improve upon to not have travel impact them as much. 

You don’t travel to state the same day. Big difference. 

[hhpatriot04]

3 minutes ago, TheDoctor22 said:

I wouldn't say this team is among the all-time best...yet.  If they can run the gauntlet through a very tough 3A, then I might change my answer in November.  The talent level isn't close to some of the best Chatard teams in terms of raw athletic ability - there are no D1 players on this team.  I'm not sure there are any players even getting D2 looks, although I would hope/expect this to change by the end of the season.  I do think last year's Chatard team was one of the best in school history, and I don't think this year's team is there yet.

But I will say this year's team seems to get better every week.  The defense is very undersized, but they really fly to the ball.  As fast as Merrillville was, I thought Chatard's speed on defense really gave them fits.  Offensively, they don't have the big time play maker at RB that's been here historically, but this isn't the Chatard offense most teams are used to seeing.  I think they threw for over 300 yards last night.  The ability to be multi-dimensional has reduced the need to rely on a big time RB, and I think they are better offensively for it.

 

Having played against the 2002 and 2003 Chatard teams and watched them in person until 2011 or so, when I hear "Chatard's best ever" my mind goes to the 2001-2007 stretch. Teams had multiple D1 players and played the state's best in Roncalli and typically a GCL team. Coach L ran a different offense than Coach D, so maybe those teams don't appear to be explosive, but if those teams are the measuring stick... it's far longer than 1 yard.

[Olympian06]

3 hours ago, TheDoctor22 said:

Congrats Trojans! What a fun game to watch! It wasn't always pretty, but Chatard showed up ready to play. They played tough, physical football all four quarters, which I think was the difference in the game.

A lot of people quick to dismiss Merrillville after that game, but I'm not so sure. Merrillville was every bit as big and as athletic as advertised. They have some VERY good players on both sides of the ball. As others have mentioned, I think the travel definitely had an impact. Merrillville was also down a few starters. Lastly, Chatard is a pretty darn good football team. They played a competitive game with Cathedral (who is historically good by their standards), which no other Indiana team can say so far this year, including Merrillville's potential semi-state opponent Westfield. I wouldn't count Merrillville out just yet. If they get healthy and clean up some mistakes, they could be a very dangerous team in November. Keep your heads up pirates and good luck the rest of the year!

I’m not sure I call the game with Cathedral “competitive”. It was 39-13 entering the 4th correct? Closer than other schools? Sure... 

Lastly, I am glad that Chatard got the W last night, but Chatard gifted M’Ville 2 TD’s... a 3rd and 16 and Chatard is flagged for 2 unsportsmanlike penalties that gives M’Ville 30 yards and they end up scoring. The strip/fumble return for a TD is another 1. M’Ville wasn’t the only team last night that played a sloppy game. 

[Olympian06]

2 hours ago, Lysander said:

Ironically Chatard was more penalized than Merrillville last night but Chatard did win the turnover battle....which was critical.  

Merrillville was supremely talented (seemed abundantly obvious from the start) but I think Chatard’s fundamentals and discipline of play, constant physicality, swarming defense and, frankly, ability to adjust offset that, so, by game’s end, Chatard seemed to often be able to do what they wanted.  

Pretty typical recipe for a Chatard win....which more than a few times have been against more talented teams.  Chatard teams generally will just wear you down.  I think, playing a Chatard team for the first time is a bit of a shock to the system  for most schools.  As a fan I’m used to it but it just seems to throw a lot of teams off that first time.

I really did want to remark about a couple of things that stood out to me regarding Merrillville.  First, they truly are talented....admittedly, everyone acknowledges that.

But the other thing was just how Merrillville handled themselves. I’ve seen a LOT of talented teams play Chatard and get visibly frustrated, then get chippy (both with Chatard and within their own ranks) and then......just.......quit.

Merrillville did NONE of those things.  They never got visibly frustrated or chippy and they darn sure didn’t quit.  They played the whole game and played with class.  I honestly think this game should make them better.

Much like Doc22 stated above, I think people underestimate Merrillville at their own peril because of the result of this game.   

Correct me if I’m wrong on my above post.. I only caught half of the Cathedral vs Chatard game.

[oldunclemark]

3 hours ago, Lysander said:

Ironically Chatard was more penalized than Merrillville last night but Chatard did win the turnover battle....which was critical.  

Merrillville was supremely talented (seemed abundantly obvious from the start) but I think Chatard’s fundamentals and discipline of play, constant physicality, swarming defense and, frankly, ability to adjust offset that, so, by game’s end, Chatard seemed to often be able to do what they wanted.  

Pretty typical recipe for a Chatard win....which more than a few times have been against more talented teams.  Chatard teams generally will just wear you down.  I think, playing a Chatard team for the first time is a bit of a shock to the system  for most schools.  As a fan I’m used to it but it just seems to throw a lot of teams off that first time.

I really did want to remark about a couple of things that stood out to me regarding Merrillville.  First, they truly are talented....admittedly, everyone acknowledges that.

But the other thing was just how Merrillville handled themselves. I’ve seen a LOT of talented teams play Chatard and get visibly frustrated, then get chippy (both with Chatard and within their own ranks) and then......just.......quit.

Merrillville did NONE of those things.  They never got visibly frustrated or chippy and they darn sure didn’t quit.  They played the whole game and played with class.  I honestly think this game should make them better.

Much like Doc22 stated above, I think people underestimate Merrillville at their own peril because of the result of this game.   

Okay but here's what it is when it comes to Merrillville.

(Lafayette) Jefferson (7-0) averages 50 points a game and will come to Merrillville unbeaten for 6A Sectional 1.  

How similar is Jefferson to Bishop Chatard?.    The offenses seem similar......The competition (Jeff and Chatard) obviously isnt.   I cant judge the O-lines

Can somebody match up Merrillville and Jeff because only one will even survive the sectional.

 

[Bears62]

2 minutes ago, oldunclemark said:

Okay but here's what it is when it comes to Merrillville.

(Lafayette) Jefferson (7-0) averages 50 points a game and will come to Merrillville unbeaten for 6A Sectional 1.  

How similar is Jefferson to Bishop Chatard?.    The offenses seem similar......The competition (Jeff and Chatard) obviously isnt.   I cant judge the O-lines

Can somebody match up Merrillville and Jeff because only one will even survive the sectional.

 

I will say this, Jeff would have kept it closer against Chatard than Merrillville did imo, but i still think Merrillville will beat Jeff. Merrillville killed themselves with mistakes, Jeff wouldn’t have made those. Jeff has 3 D-linemen committed to D1 schools and a great O-line and running game. Their passing game will be pretty nonexistent against high-caliber teams. Jeff runs no huddle, lot of inside and outside zone from the spread. They slowly break you down the longer the game goes, their RB is a track star and one of the 5 fastest kids in the state. Jeff could certainly beat Merrillville, but I have a hard time seeing it. Jeff has all those D1 lineman in the defense and still gave up over 400 yards rushing to Harrison which i can’t process.

[TheDoctor22]

1 hour ago, hhpatriot04 said:

Having played against the 2002 and 2003 Chatard teams and watched them in person until 2011 or so, when I hear "Chatard's best ever" my mind goes to the 2001-2007 stretch. Teams had multiple D1 players and played the state's best in Roncalli and typically a GCL team. Coach L ran a different offense than Coach D, so maybe those teams don't appear to be explosive, but if those teams are the measuring stick... it's far longer than 1 yard.

Definitely agree with you here. '02, '03, '04, '06 were probably the best/most talented.  Talent doesn't always mean the best teams though, as evidenced by your Patriots knocking off a loaded '04 Chatard team.

[TheDoctor22]

 

40 minutes ago, Olympian06 said:

Correct me if I’m wrong on my above post.. I only caught half of the Cathedral vs Chatard game.

No, you're right.  Competitive was the wrong word choice.  "Chatard didn't get mercy ruled and Cathedral kept the first team on the field the whole game" is a more accurate description, which might be as close as anyone gets to Cathedral this year, save Center Grove.  Dwenger and Valpo might have something to say about that though.

Point I'm trying to make though is if I'm Merrillville, it's not time to completely panic.  Obviously have some things to improve and clean up, but they have as much talent as anyone in the north IMO.  I'd rather learn that week 7 with time to fix some of those issue rather than not finding out until the sectional finals vs. Jeff.

49 minutes ago, Olympian06 said:

M’Ville wasn’t the only team last night that played a sloppy game. 

Correct on this as well.  I actually take this away as a positive for Chatard.  You didn't play your best game, and you still beat a quality 6A team.  If they can clean up some of those mistakes and continue to improve, they will be a very tough out in the playoffs.

[Lysander]

31 minutes ago, Olympian06 said:

Correct me if I’m wrong on my above post.. I only caught half of the Cathedral vs Chatard game.

Well, I’m probably not going think of the Cathedral game as especially  “competitive“.  It was, I think (Carmel may have been an exception), Cathedral’s only game against a team from Indiana so far not featuring a running clock....but that’s not exactly something aspirational.   But Chatard was as, or more, competitive in those games as was Carmel....certainly more so than Westfield it would appear.  Both of those teams commonly considered amongst the 5-6 best 6A teams.  

That said, and I’m not saying anything new, I think Cathedral way overmatches everyone in the state excepting, possibly, Center Grove.  They’re probably going to be every bit as good next year, btw.

As to “gifting” Merrillville 2 TDs.  In the case of the DOUBLE Unsportsmanlike......yep.....that was a gift.  I’m not entirely sure on the initial call (Which I’m assuming was seen as a taunt) but clearly remarks must have been made that definitely warranted the second Unsportsmanlike.  Bear in mind, I wish everyone played the game like Marvin Harrison but that’s not the game these days.

I’m not sure I’d consider the strip/fumble TD as a “gift”, though......at least a gift based on sloppy play.  The Chatard tailback was injured during the play and, apparently, gave up the ball.

That said, it WAS worth the price of admission to see a 6’4” 350 lb D lineman clutching the football truck 50 yards down the field swatting or running over tacklers like gnats.

 

[Dave007]

When Chatard wins Class 3A again this year - will you guys move up to 4A next year per the reclassification / success factor?  I think you guys certainly belong there and would prob win class 4A outright this year.

 

Great win Trojans!

[Olympian06]

1 hour ago, TheDoctor22 said:

 

No, you're right.  Competitive was the wrong word choice.  "Chatard didn't get mercy ruled and Cathedral kept the first team on the field the whole game" is a more accurate description, which might be as close as anyone gets to Cathedral this year, save Center Grove.  Dwenger and Valpo might have something to say about that though.

Point I'm trying to make though is if I'm Merrillville, it's not time to completely panic.  Obviously have some things to improve and clean up, but they have as much talent as anyone in the north IMO.  I'd rather learn that week 7 with time to fix some of those issue rather than not finding out until the sectional finals vs. Jeff.

Correct on this as well.  I actually take this away as a positive for Chatard.  You didn't play your best game, and you still beat a quality 6A team.  If they can clean up some of those mistakes and continue to improve, they will be a very tough out in the playoffs.

It’s 100% positive. Chatard is a very very good team this year. 

[BCstate]

2 hours ago, Dave007 said:

When Chatard wins Class 3A again this year - will you guys move up to 4A next year per the reclassification / success factor?  I think you guys certainly belong there and would prob win class 4A outright this year.

 

Great win Trojans!

Yes , pretty sure so. 

[Lysander]

12 hours ago, Dave007 said:

When Chatard wins Class 3A again this year - will you guys move up to 4A next year per the reclassification / success factor?  I think you guys certainly belong there and would prob win class 4A outright this year.

 

Great win Trojans!

Chatard needs to win both Sectional and Regional this year to move up to 4A (hardly a given with the distinctly loaded nature of Sectional 28).  They were Success Factored into 4A in 2013-14 but during that time you needed 4 points per period to stay “up”.....they were unable to do so at that time.

BTW, if they can win a Regional, they will join previously 3A Evansville Memorial who is locked into 4A for the next 2 years due to Memorial’s 4A State Championship last year.  Kudos to Memorial.

[FastpacedO]

19 hours ago, Staxawax said:

You don’t travel to state the same day. Big difference. 

Actually most of them do travel on the same day. Especially if it is 5A or 6A (later game).

[hhpatriot04]

7 minutes ago, FastpacedO said:

Actually most of them do travel on the same day. Especially if it is 5A or 6A (later game).

It can depend. Obviously in 6A most teams are coming from the Indy area and probably have routines -- it might not be a bad thing for even smaller Indy-area schools to stay in a hotel the night before to eliminate distractions.

Much depends on whether the team wants to practice at Lucas Oil and if they prefer to do so on Thursday or earlier in the week. I don't think there is a hard and fast rule for any program -- lots of moving parts.

[FastpacedO]

22 hours ago, hhpatriot04 said:

It can depend. Obviously in 6A most teams are coming from the Indy area and probably have routines -- it might not be a bad thing for even smaller Indy-area schools to stay in a hotel the night before to eliminate distractions.

Much depends on whether the team wants to practice at Lucas Oil and if they prefer to do so on Thursday or earlier in the week. I don't think there is a hard and fast rule for any program -- lots of moving parts.

I may be mistaken but I believe each team is allowed only 1 one hour practice in Lucas Oil during the week leading up to the State Championship game.

[Hoosier1102]

5 hours ago, FastpacedO said:

I may be mistaken but I believe each team is allowed only 1 one hour practice in Lucas Oil during the week leading up to the State Championship game.

This is correct I believe and can be a nightmare to schedule with travel included. Because of this many teams seek indoor facilities for practices the week of State as to adjust from a usually cold playoff run outdoors to a 80 degree LOS