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Selecting Mr. Football


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15 hours ago, tango said:

I would agree the MIC is a great conference and easily the best in Indiana, but the best player on the best MIC team isn't automatically the best player in the state.  Both are great players, but Bell wasn't "hands down" better than Kizer and finishing second in the voting wasn't a "crime".   

 

I respect your opinion but I would have to disagree. I have seen both play in person with my own eyes, I respect him as a player I think he is really Talented but in my opinion and I can't state that enough, I don't think he plays that well if in the MIC but I am sure to get some backlash on that topic 

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Until such time as the whole Mr. Football “thing” really gives serious and legitimate consideration to lineman it’s, as often as not, a glorified skilled position player popularity contest.  

Personally, I think Bell is probably a better talent BUT Notre Dame didn’t....they chose Kiser.  My guess is that they know a helluva better than I do.  Until Purdue (whom I love) is spoken in the same breath as Notre Dame (whom I.....well....don’t love....I was going to make some snide comment about loving them like I love venereal disease but I won’t do that) then I think Notre Dame’s opinion trumps mine.

That said, I’ve just never cared one way or the other about Mr. Football.  

Amazes me all the heartburn it causes folks.

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1 hour ago, TrojanDad said:

Could that be because WC had 2 potential candidates on the same team with Bell and Romeir Elliott?  

Every Class got 10 votes for a total of 60.  12 votes went to other players and 1 coach did not vote.

Did we ever hear who got the other 12?  I would assume Lindauer got some, especially from that 3A/4A mix, but that is just a hunch.

If we want to mention voting advantages, 32 teams in 6A have 10 votes, while 64 teams in 1A get 10 (same for classes 2-4A).  The largest class already has over-representation in voting. 

It does bother me that Mr. Football played 58/60 HS games against 1A and 2A competition.  I would have enjoyed watching him play bigger schools, but it's nothing to hold against him. To echo Lysander, I don't much sleep over the Mr. Football "Thing."

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46 minutes ago, Lysander said:

Thought it would best reflect my "welcoming" personality....

Both of you guys have great new avatars!!...I feel as if I was a bit to "traditionalistic" in the selection of mine now.  Does it reflect my true "homer" bias??

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36 minutes ago, Titan32 said:

Both of you guys have great new avatars!!...I feel as if I was a bit to "traditionalistic" in the selection of mine now.  Does it reflect my true "homer" bias??

Be a “homer” as long as you can - you still have kids on the field.  

I’m envious.

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On 3/19/2019 at 9:11 AM, SuperQuickArtesians said:

David Bell was the best player in the State hands down!! Now Kizer going to Notre Dame is no accident the kid could ball and if had been any other player outside the MIC Kizer would have got my vote. The MIC top to bottom is the best conference in the State some even view it as one of the best in the Midwest. for that kid not to win Mr. Football was a crime. I am glad they are proposing a change in the voting process, in my opinion, you can blame the 1A and 2A coaches who voted it was clearly a bias towards the small school athlete.

Right, because the MIC is the best conference, there is NO WAY ANY athletes at the other 400 or so schools could have the best player. I'm embarrassed for you.

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On 3/18/2019 at 9:09 PM, JeffO2 said:

@CGFan2017   Nothing against him personally and I don't want to start any rumors. He only has stats for 13 games in the  on maxpreps. Didn't play week#4 against Lawrence Central:    http://www.maxpreps.com/athlete/david-bell/1eIQZzeKEeW-8KA2nzwbTA/gendersport/football-stats.htm  Click on the Varsity 18-19 link and look at the game by game.

I tried to find a newspaper article about the game, but didn't find any.

He was ejected during the NC game was what I was saying. I didnt see anything in newspapers when I searched either. Had to look through Twitter

 

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16 hours ago, TrojanDad said:

Stax, I believe his challenge was if you put an individual that plays in 1A, would they perform identically and amass the same type of stats playing in the MIC? Is it a level playing field to compare individual performance?  I wonder the same. You know firsthand being a 6A Indiana football fan that players rarely go both ways for entire games all season. This is due to roster depth, player fatigue and player injury. 

I was kind of wondering why you started this thread. This decision is well in the rear view mirror. If you start a thread, then get triggered because someone offers a thought in which you don’t align, well????

Great quote from the movie Saving Sarah Marshall....”it’s like the Soprano’s....IT’S OVER!”

You must know this Artesian personally to know what he "meant". I did not read it that way.  Threads tend to shift from the original statement and morph into something else. If I get "triggered" (probably an inappropriate term in this PC era) because of a thought I object, I'm not allowed to give opposing opinion?

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7 hours ago, Trojanmp52 said:

His passing numbers wound have not been even close to that high and would have not played defensive or play defensive and not qb

I would have to disagree. His pass numbers probably would have been just as high or higher. Jack Kellams threw for 31 less yards, then Kiser, his senior year (2016).

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14 hours ago, CGFan2017 said:

I would have to disagree. His pass numbers probably would have been just as high or higher. Jack Kellams threw for 31 less yards, then Kiser, his senior year (2016).

That is true but cg also has Russ that year and he is a big reason Jack numbers where that high a lot of YAC yards 

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On 3/20/2019 at 2:49 PM, oldtimeqb said:

Every Class got 10 votes for a total of 60.  12 votes went to other players and 1 coach did not vote.

Did we ever hear who got the other 12?  I would assume Lindauer got some, especially from that 3A/4A mix, but that is just a hunch.

I was unable to find anything with exact amounts, but both Michael Lindauer of Evansville Memorial (3A) and Bronson Yoder of NorthWood (4A) were named among the top 4 finalist for Mr. Football and received votes. That is why you see some votes missing among the 3A, 4A and 5A totals posted above from what Kiser and Bell received in those respective classes. Lindauer and Yoder played a majority of their games against those size teams in areas where Kiser and Bell were probably never seen, especially those in the southwest corner of the state.

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On 3/25/2019 at 12:36 PM, NLCTigerFan07 said:

I was unable to find anything with exact amounts, but both Michael Lindauer of Evansville Memorial (3A) and Bronson Yoder of NorthWood (4A) were named among the top 4 finalist for Mr. Football and received votes. That is why you see some votes missing among the 3A, 4A and 5A totals posted above from what Kiser and Bell received in those respective classes. Lindauer and Yoder played a majority of their games against those size teams in areas where Kiser and Bell were probably never seen, especially those in the southwest corner of the state.

Couldn't find the totals either, but here is how the Kiser/Bell breakdown went:

How Mr. Football is selected

Sixty high school coaches vote for Mr. Football and the Mr. Football position award winners at the annual Indiana Football Coaches Association all-state meeting. There is one vote for each sectional and two at-large votes in each class. That comes out to 60 total votes — 10 for each class. Here is a breakdown of how each class voted between Kiser and Bell:

Class A – Kiser 10, Bell 0

Class 2A – Kiser 9, Bell 1

Class 3A – Bell 4, Kiser 1

Class 4A – Kiser 3, Bell 3

Class 5A – Kiser 3, Bell 3

Class 6A – Bell 6, Kiser 4

 

And here is the story on how it will change next year:

The voting process for IndyStar Indiana Mr. Football will change starting next season.

The Indiana Football Coaches Association voted at its board meeting Friday to allow all members – coaches and assistant coaches – to have a Mr. Football vote. Previously, an IFCA ratings board of 60 -- 10 coaches in each of the six classes --voted for Mr. Football.

Jason Simmons, the Ben Davis coach and assistant executive director for the IFCA, said the ratings board will select the Mr. Football finalists, which will be the top two for each of the Mr. Football position awards. Coaches will then have two or three days to vote electronically for Mr. Football.

“We will leave the all-state meeting and send a ballot out that night or the next morning and then allow 48 or 72 hours to vote,” Simmons said.

The previous voting process had been in place for about 15 years. Simmons said the decision to allow all coaches to vote is to make the process as transparent as possible

“There is probably no perfect system, but I feel like we have been as progressive as any coaches association in the state,” Simmons said. “If there is a need for a change, we are going to attack it and adjust what we do. We felt like there was a need to change the voting system for Mr. Football.”

The process became a topic of discussion in December when Pioneer’s Jack Kiser, a two-time state champion and Notre Dame recruit, was voted Mr. Football over Warren Central’s David Bell. Kiser had 30 votes to outdistance runner-up Bell of Warren Central’s 17 votes. Kiser was voted Mr. Football on 19 of the 20 ballots from Class A and 2A coaches.

 

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On 3/23/2019 at 2:49 PM, Trojanmp52 said:

His passing numbers wound have not been even close to that high and would have not played defensive or play defensive and not qb

Maybe not, but his rushing yardage and the over-all improvement to the offense would make up the difference (Assuming they would utilize a running QB.). CG just hasn't been getting the production out of the QB position. I don't know if it's the scheme, coach, or players. 

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On 3/27/2019 at 11:41 AM, Staxawax said:

Couldn't find the totals either, but here is how the Kiser/Bell breakdown went:

How Mr. Football is selected

Sixty high school coaches vote for Mr. Football and the Mr. Football position award winners at the annual Indiana Football Coaches Association all-state meeting. There is one vote for each sectional and two at-large votes in each class. That comes out to 60 total votes — 10 for each class. Here is a breakdown of how each class voted between Kiser and Bell:

Class A – Kiser 10, Bell 0

Class 2A – Kiser 9, Bell 1

Class 3A – Bell 4, Kiser 1

Class 4A – Kiser 3, Bell 3

Class 5A – Kiser 3, Bell 3

Class 6A – Bell 6, Kiser 4

 

And here is the story on how it will change next year:

The voting process for IndyStar Indiana Mr. Football will change starting next season.

The Indiana Football Coaches Association voted at its board meeting Friday to allow all members – coaches and assistant coaches – to have a Mr. Football vote. Previously, an IFCA ratings board of 60 -- 10 coaches in each of the six classes --voted for Mr. Football.

Jason Simmons, the Ben Davis coach and assistant executive director for the IFCA, said the ratings board will select the Mr. Football finalists, which will be the top two for each of the Mr. Football position awards. Coaches will then have two or three days to vote electronically for Mr. Football.

“We will leave the all-state meeting and send a ballot out that night or the next morning and then allow 48 or 72 hours to vote,” Simmons said.

The previous voting process had been in place for about 15 years. Simmons said the decision to allow all coaches to vote is to make the process as transparent as possible

“There is probably no perfect system, but I feel like we have been as progressive as any coaches association in the state,” Simmons said. “If there is a need for a change, we are going to attack it and adjust what we do. We felt like there was a need to change the voting system for Mr. Football.”

The process became a topic of discussion in December when Pioneer’s Jack Kiser, a two-time state champion and Notre Dame recruit, was voted Mr. Football over Warren Central’s David Bell. Kiser had 30 votes to outdistance runner-up Bell of Warren Central’s 17 votes. Kiser was voted Mr. Football on 19 of the 20 ballots from Class A and 2A coaches.

 

If a 1A or 2A player wins next year they can always add managers, trainers, Cheer Coach and Cheerleaders to potential voters. And don't forget about adding parents, siblings (half or step), and possibly grandparents (must be alive to qualify). 🤔😂

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On 3/27/2019 at 12:41 PM, Staxawax said:

The Indiana Football Coaches Association voted at its board meeting Friday to allow all members – coaches and assistant coaches – to have a Mr. Football vote. Previously, an IFCA ratings board of 60 -- 10 coaches in each of the six classes --voted for Mr. Football.

That certainly favors (Most) 5A & 6A schools. I would think they have 50% to 100% more coaches and assistants than 1, 2, 3 and probably 4A. I would think each head coach of each school getting a vote would be best??

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20 hours ago, psaboy said:

That certainly favors (Most) 5A & 6A schools. I would think they have 50% to 100% more coaches and assistants than 1, 2, 3 and probably 4A. I would think each head coach of each school getting a vote would be best??

But you have to remember that  5a  and 6a have less teams so I say it would favor the Lower class

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3 hours ago, Trojanmp52 said:

But you have to remember that  5a  and 6a have less teams so I say it would favor the Lower class

OK, then the 1A thru 4A head coach vote is then worth 1/2 a point. That will settle that. 

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