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MIC & HCC realignment


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There are plenty of HCC schools that would be happy to add Carmel as a non-conference game.  Thats a totally different issue than why they weren't allowed into the conference.

"If" Carmel stays independent...I predict you could see them playing 4-5 HCC schools a year in football.

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1 minute ago, US31 said:

There are plenty of HCC schools that would be happy to add Carmel as a non-conference game.  Thats a totally different issue than why they weren't allowed into the conference.

"If" Carmel stays independent...I predict you could see them playing 4-5 HCC schools a year in football.

That would be impossible unless the HCC changes their schedule.  Currently, HCC only allows for week 1 and 2 as non conference.

Carmel could technically allow for HSE and Westfield (just an example) in the first two weeks then Cathedral in week 3.  That leaves six openings and I’m sorry to say but there aren’t but 2-3 other programs in Indiana that bring the type of competition Carmel needs to see to get them tournament ready.

Personally, I haven’t been a fan of this since day one because of football scheduling.

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2 minutes ago, HoosierFB_JG said:

That would be impossible unless the HCC changes their schedule.  Currently, HCC only allows for week 1 and 2 as non conference.

Carmel could technically allow for HSE and Westfield (just an example) in the first two weeks then Cathedral in week 3.  That leaves six openings and I’m sorry to say but there aren’t but 2-3 other programs in Indiana that bring the type of competition Carmel needs to see to get them tournament ready.

Personally, I haven’t been a fan of this since day one because of football scheduling.

I overlooked how the addition of FC changed things.  It used to be there was another floating non-conf game.  Those pesky Flashes🤪

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3 minutes ago, US31 said:

I overlooked how the addition of FC changed things.  It used to be there was another floating non-conf game.  Those pesky Flashes🤪

I find it to be extremely ironic that both CG and Carmel were hoping to bring in programs that brought more gate revenue, yet they’ll now more than likely fill their schedule with Detroit Renaissance, East St. Louis, etc.

 Bravo!  Bravo!

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16 minutes ago, HoosierFB_JG said:

I find it to be extremely ironic that both CG and Carmel were hoping to bring in programs that brought more gate revenue, yet they’ll now more than likely fill their schedule with Detroit Renaissance, East St. Louis, etc.

 Bravo!  Bravo!

Both schools will have the last laugh winning the 6A title as an independent instead of the HCC. How much gate revenue are HCC members potentially missing out on not including the two most prolific and visible athletic profiles in the state? 

Pretty wild that the three best football programs in the state now have no conference affiliation. Wonder if this will spark a new trend going forward?

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1 hour ago, BDGiant93 said:

Carmel is going independent.

 

Would like to see Harrison add them as a non-con opponent.  

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12 minutes ago, foxbat said:

Would like to see Harrison add them as a non-con opponent.  

I can’t see Carmel wanting to play teams they'll have a running clock on annually.  No offense to Harrison, but we’re talking an annual elite program here.  Carmel only aligns with so many programs before they simply blast the others.

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45 minutes ago, Grover said:

Just stating facts.  No need for childish name calling.

They aren’t facts.  You act as if CG has won 10 state titles in a row.  They haven’t.  In fact, I don’t believe they would be in the top 2 in next years MIC.  
 

I do find it funny though in CG’s new world, they’ll more than likely make less money than what the MIC schools provided.

 

 Greed will only hurt the kids in the long run, but I’m sure a rivalry with Detroit MLK will benefit the Trojans.

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Just now, HoosierFB_JG said:

They aren’t facts.  You act as if CG has won 10 state titles in a row.  They haven’t.  In fact, I don’t believe they would be in the top 2 in next years MIC.  
 

I do find it funny though in CG’s new world, they’ll more than likely make less money than what the MIC schools provided.

 

 Greed will only hurt the kids in the long run, but I’m sure a rivalry with Detroit MLK will benefit the Trojans.

Really bizarre takes on your part.  And more than a little odd that you are finding pleasure in a schedule disruption for a bunch of teenagers.  Not sure where the greed part works into your imagination either.  Try leaving your envy out of it and stick to the facts.  Happy to discuss those but not interested in your emotions.

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5 minutes ago, Grover said:

Really bizarre takes on your part.  And more than a little odd that you are finding pleasure in a schedule disruption for a bunch of teenagers.  Not sure where the greed part works into your imagination either.  Try leaving your envy out of it and stick to the facts.  Happy to discuss those but not interested in your emotions.

I’m not taking ANY PLEASURE as I was a Carmel dad up until this past year when my son graduated.  
 

Where are you getting envy?

I simply stated that your comment about not being beaten isn’t fact, it’s only true about a 2-year run.  Prior to that, Center Grove went 8-6 with a 1-4 start, 9-4 with a 2-3 start and 6-6.  That is fact.  I can’t state that it is fact that CG or Carmel won’t win in 2022, but both Warren and Ben Davis return a plethora of talent and in my opinion, it will be a major challenge for Center Grove and Carmel to defeat both WC and BD.  That’s how it’s worked with the MIC’s top 4 for nearly 20 years.  Don’t act as if CG and Carmel have ran the show, because that’s not true.

 

The sad truth is, that currently, CG and Carmel are left without a conference and, in football, that is a killer.  Both teams can play 2 HCC non conference games (dependent upon contracts), Cathedral, the Copper Kettle game, then only hope that 5 other teams will schedule them.  IMO, there aren’t but maybe 2-3 other teams in all of Indiana that will be competitive with both teams regularly.  This means you’re left with out of state opponents, and all I’m saying is a simple FACT.  CG and Carmel will not benefit from the tens of fans that the other schools bring, nor will a game with an out of state team.  I just asked my son who is now at Valparaiso, who he would rather play each year, Warren Central or East St. Louis and his answer, Warren.

 Carmel and CG’s best option now would be to lure teams from the HCC and maybe North Central to form a new conference.

Its also important to note that this only affects football in my opinion, but in your largest revenue generating sport, these two schools dropped the ball.  Nothing was gained.  Kids were affected today, and there’s no envy.  It infuriates me.  I’m mad that there wasn’t a better plan.  The two schools simply were like an employee who talked to other employees about quitting, then instead of being able to quit, they were fired without another job lined up.  

I have no affiliation now, so I’m not afraid to say, both schools hurt their students today.

26 minutes ago, Grover said:

Really bizarre takes on your part.  And more than a little odd that you are finding pleasure in a schedule disruption for a bunch of teenagers.  Not sure where the greed part works into your imagination either.  Try leaving your envy out of it and stick to the facts.  Happy to discuss those but not interested in your emotions.

Funny was not the appropriate word.  Ironic is more appropriate.

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1 hour ago, HoosierFB_JG said:

I simply stated that your comment about not being beaten isn’t fact, it’s only true about a 2-year run.  Prior to that, Center Grove went 8-6 with a 1-4 start, 9-4 with a 2-3 start and 6-6.  That is fact.  I can’t state that it is fact that CG or Carmel won’t win in 2022, but both Warren and Ben Davis return a plethora of talent and in my opinion, it will be a major challenge for Center Grove and Carmel to defeat both WC and BD.  That’s how it’s worked with the MIC’s top 4 for nearly 20 years.  Don’t act as if CG and Carmel have ran the show, because that’s not true.

You are reading things into my comments that simply aren't there.  But if you want to discuss recent history CG has won the south 5 of the last 7 years including 3 state titles.

Only Carmel could take exception to a comment complimentary of Carmel.  🤣

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1 hour ago, HoosierFB_JG said:

I’m not taking ANY PLEASURE as I was a Carmel dad up until this past year when my son graduated.  
 

Where are you getting envy?

I simply stated that your comment about not being beaten isn’t fact, it’s only true about a 2-year run.  Prior to that, Center Grove went 8-6 with a 1-4 start, 9-4 with a 2-3 start and 6-6.  That is fact.  I can’t state that it is fact that CG or Carmel won’t win in 2022, but both Warren and Ben Davis return a plethora of talent and in my opinion, it will be a major challenge for Center Grove and Carmel to defeat both WC and BD.  That’s how it’s worked with the MIC’s top 4 for nearly 20 years.  Don’t act as if CG and Carmel have ran the show, because that’s not true.

 

The sad truth is, that currently, CG and Carmel are left without a conference and, in football, that is a killer.  Both teams can play 2 HCC non conference games (dependent upon contracts), Cathedral, the Copper Kettle game, then only hope that 5 other teams will schedule them.  IMO, there aren’t but maybe 2-3 other teams in all of Indiana that will be competitive with both teams regularly.  This means you’re left with out of state opponents, and all I’m saying is a simple FACT.  CG and Carmel will not benefit from the tens of fans that the other schools bring, nor will a game with an out of state team.  I just asked my son who is now at Valparaiso, who he would rather play each year, Warren Central or East St. Louis and his answer, Warren.

 Carmel and CG’s best option now would be to lure teams from the HCC and maybe North Central to form a new conference.

Its also important to note that this only affects football in my opinion, but in your largest revenue generating sport, these two schools dropped the ball.  Nothing was gained.  Kids were affected today, and there’s no envy.  It infuriates me.  I’m mad that there wasn’t a better plan.  The two schools simply were like an employee who talked to other employees about quitting, then instead of being able to quit, they were fired without another job lined up.  

I have no affiliation now, so I’m not afraid to say, both schools hurt their students today.

Funny was not the appropriate word.  Ironic is more appropriate.

I think you’re dramatically overstating things. Carmel/CG are only guaranteed 4-5 home regular season games a year anyway. Could host Cathedral and Chatard every year and not only would it be an upgrade in competition, but they travel better than almost every current MIC team. Same with Roncalli. Carmel and Center Grove playing home and aways against schools like Louisville Trinity or Cincinnati St. Xavier is good for the state. Guarantee you either of those schools brings more fans the 100 or so miles to Indy than Pike or North Central does.

Edited by Footballking16
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1 hour ago, HoosierFB_JG said:

I’m not taking ANY PLEASURE as I was a Carmel dad up until this past year when my son graduated.  
 

Where are you getting envy?

I simply stated that your comment about not being beaten isn’t fact, it’s only true about a 2-year run.  Prior to that, Center Grove went 8-6 with a 1-4 start, 9-4 with a 2-3 start and 6-6.  That is fact.  I can’t state that it is fact that CG or Carmel won’t win in 2022, but both Warren and Ben Davis return a plethora of talent and in my opinion, it will be a major challenge for Center Grove and Carmel to defeat both WC and BD.  That’s how it’s worked with the MIC’s top 4 for nearly 20 years.  Don’t act as if CG and Carmel have ran the show, because that’s not true.

 

The sad truth is, that currently, CG and Carmel are left without a conference and, in football, that is a killer.  Both teams can play 2 HCC non conference games (dependent upon contracts), Cathedral, the Copper Kettle game, then only hope that 5 other teams will schedule them.  IMO, there aren’t but maybe 2-3 other teams in all of Indiana that will be competitive with both teams regularly.  This means you’re left with out of state opponents, and all I’m saying is a simple FACT.  CG and Carmel will not benefit from the tens of fans that the other schools bring, nor will a game with an out of state team.  I just asked my son who is now at Valparaiso, who he would rather play each year, Warren Central or East St. Louis and his answer, Warren.

 Carmel and CG’s best option now would be to lure teams from the HCC and maybe North Central to form a new conference.

Its also important to note that this only affects football in my opinion, but in your largest revenue generating sport, these two schools dropped the ball.  Nothing was gained.  Kids were affected today, and there’s no envy.  It infuriates me.  I’m mad that there wasn’t a better plan.  The two schools simply were like an employee who talked to other employees about quitting, then instead of being able to quit, they were fired without another job lined up.  

I have no affiliation now, so I’m not afraid to say, both schools hurt their students today.

Funny was not the appropriate word.  Ironic is more appropriate.

Frankly, I think independence is a good fit for Carmel, not so good for CG.  Carmel will have its own broadcast network and it will act like a hybrid IMG/Mid Size college football operation.  They will have no problem building a schedule of in state and out of state schools based on their history of reciprocal travel.  I can remember when Carmel came to my school, Highland, way up in the Region with Mark Herrmann and Bart Burrell in 1976 and beat my Trojans in a very close game.  Carmel vs Cathedral/Chatard/Roncalli/Brebeuf are all intriguing matchups.  The SAC opening up means Homestead, Snider and Carroll now are top notch schools to play.  The Duneland will jump all over the opportunity to play Carmel.  Crown Point under Craig Buzea have probably already reached out.  Id love to see Carmel schedule St Edwards out of Cleveland, the #1 program in Ohio.  Carmel will thrive, and independence was the best outcome for the school.

Center Grove is in trouble.  They dont have the statewide relationships that Carmel enjoys, and they dont fit well into any conference other than The MIC or The HCC.  There is not room for two big independents, plus Cathedral on the schedule in Indianapolis.  

CGs best short term solution might be Conference Indiana, where they can be guaranteed 6 games against 5A/6A competition. 

Unfortunately, despite all their success, Center Grove comes out of this as the biggest loser.  Its a shame, but there are consequences when loyalty bounds are crossed

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34 minutes ago, HHF said:

CGs best short term solution might be Conference Indiana, where they can be guaranteed 6 games against 5A/6A competition.

Center Grove would be better off scrimmaging themselves six times a season before joining Conference Indiana. Roncalli, Franklin Central, and Whiteland are solid south side schools that make sense from a scheduling standpoint.

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Two of those three have previously begged out of playing CG.  Whiteland would be wise to schedule CG given their impending move to 6A but I won't hold my breath.

Edited by Grover
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8 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

Center Grove would be better off scrimmaging themselves six times a season before joining Conference Indiana. Roncalli, Franklin Central, and Whiteland are solid south side schools that make sense from a scheduling standpoint.

Agree.  Thats 3 games.  Have 6 others to fill.  Not sure FC would want to schedule CG ahead of that HCC schedule.  Whiteland already tried that and cancelled the series after getting drilled for several years.  Teams are not going to be running to help CG.  Its going to be a challenge for them to build a decent schedule.  

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4 minutes ago, HHF said:

Agree.  Thats 3 games.  Have 6 others to fill.  Not sure FC would want to schedule CG ahead of that HCC schedule.  Whiteland already tried that and cancelled the series after getting drilled for several years.  Teams are not going to be running to help CG.  Its going to be a challenge for them to build a decent schedule.  

Cathedral to my knowledge is still under contract and I assume Carmel and Center Grove anticipate their rivalry continuing. Decatur has been the Trojans second week opponent the last few so there’s six right there. Center Grove is arguably the hottest commodity in the Midwest right now, zero reason to think they’d struggle adding a couple out of state opponents.

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4 hours ago, HoosierFB_JG said:

Arrogant much?

 

 

Says a Carmel parent/supporter, lol?

He has a right to be.  His favorite program is riding high on two consecutive state titles and the state’s current longest winning streak.

3 hours ago, HoosierFB_JG said:

They aren’t facts.  You act as if CG has won 10 state titles in a row.  They haven’t.  In fact, I don’t believe they would be in the top 2 in next years MIC.  
 

I do find it funny though in CG’s new world, they’ll more than likely make less money than what the MIC schools provided.

 

 Greed will only hurt the kids in the long run, but I’m sure a rivalry with Detroit MLK will benefit the Trojans.

Just stop.  You are embarrassing yourself.

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