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MIC & HCC realignment


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7 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

Carmel's proposed 2022 6A tour schedule:

@ Penn

Lafayette Jeff

@ Columbus North

Merrilville

@ Carroll (Fort Wayne)

Southport

@ Franklin Central

Chesterton

@ Warsaw

 

Franklin Central would have to be earlier in the season due to conference scheduling.

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17 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

Carmel's proposed 2022 6A tour schedule:

@ Penn

Lafayette Jeff

@ Columbus North

Merrilville

@ Carroll (Fort Wayne)

Southport

@ Franklin Central

Chesterton

@ Warsaw

 

Can't do much better than that outside of the MIC and HCC. Looks good.

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1 hour ago, temptation said:

Those matchups are last resorts…true nothing to gain/everything to lose propositions for Carmel.

 

Just saying those four teams would accept the challenge. Always a challenge when the team you are playing is double your enrollment. At least Carmel knows those teams will hit them in the mouth. I agree with "nothing to gain, everything to lose." No one wants to lose to a smaller school. But any matchup that  causes you to put your best foot forward to win the game, is a good matchup. I doubt Carmel looks at it the way you do. 

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20 minutes ago, BDGiant93 said:

Franklin Central would have to be earlier in the season due to conference scheduling.

As would Merrillville and Chesterton. As they would be in conference (DAC) play. 

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31 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

Carmel's proposed 2022 6A tour schedule:

@ Penn

Lafayette Jeff

@ Columbus North

Merrilville

@ Carroll (Fort Wayne)

Southport

@ Franklin Central

Chesterton

@ Warsaw

 

So 9-0 with an average margin of victory of 20+ points per game?

Got it.

9 minutes ago, BTF said:

Just saying those four teams would accept the challenge. Always a challenge when the team you are playing is double your enrollment. At least Carmel knows those teams will hit them in the mouth. I agree with "nothing to gain, everything to lose." No one wants to lose to a smaller school. But any matchup that  causes you to put your best foot forward to win the game, is a good matchup. I doubt Carmel looks at it the way you do. 

1.  What evidence do you have that those teams would “hit Carmel in the mouth?”

2.  What makes you think Carmel would have to “put its best foot forward” to win any of those contests?

They may end up getting one or more of those teams on the schedule but they will be way down the priority list if all else fails.

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24 minutes ago, temptation said:

So 9-0 with an average margin of victory of 20+ points per game?

Got it.

1.  What evidence do you have that those teams would “hit Carmel in the mouth?”

2.  What makes you think Carmel would have to “put its best foot forward” to win any of those contests?

They may end up getting one or more of those teams on the schedule but they will be way down the priority list if all else fails.

It makes me no bit of difference if Carmel schedules them or not. I just said they would accept the challenge. Sounds like you are in the mood for an argument. 

1. Snider hits them in the mouth every time. Homestead and Carroll continue to get better. Carmel would be the favorites, but let's not play pretend that teams in Fort Wayne are a bunch of chumps. 

2. They do every time they play a Fort Wayne school. They know they can't fall asleep against schools up here in the Fort. If they do, they are done. They play Homestead with the same intensity they play Snider (a series that speaks for itself). Probably why they beat the Spartans by 3 or 4 touchdowns when they play. I guarantee they are doing that by "not putting their best foot forward." 

You're taking a step backward here Temp. Very unlike you. I tell other posters that you know your football. But maybe you don't know the Carmel program as well as you think you do. I mean for crying out loud, in another thread you compared them to a school half their size!!!!

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1 hour ago, Muda69 said:

Carmel's proposed 2022 6A tour schedule:

@ Penn

Lafayette Jeff

@ Columbus North

Merrilville

@ Carroll (Fort Wayne)

Southport

@ Franklin Central

Chesterton

@ Warsaw

 

What makes you think Carmel & CG won't play each other?

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4 minutes ago, Grover said:

What makes you think Carmel & CG won't play each other?

I don't know, just that maybe the Greyhounds would want a 1 year break from playing former and current MIC opponents.

By all means, please provide you 2022 dream schedule for both the now independent Trojans and Greyhounds.

 

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56 minutes ago, BTF said:

It makes me no bit of difference if Carmel schedules them or not. I just said they would accept the challenge. Sounds like you are in the mood for an argument. 

1. Snider hits them in the mouth every time. Homestead and Carroll continue to get better. Carmel would be the favorites, but let's not play pretend that teams in Fort Wayne are a bunch of chumps. 

2. They do every time they play a Fort Wayne school. They know they can't fall asleep against schools up here in the Fort. If they do, they are done. They play Homestead with the same intensity they play Snider (a series that speaks for itself). Probably why they beat the Spartans by 3 or 4 touchdowns when they play. I guarantee they are doing that by "not putting their best foot forward." 

You're taking a step backward here Temp. Very unlike you. I tell other posters that you know your football. But maybe you don't know the Carmel program as well as you think you do. I mean for crying out loud, in another thread you compared them to a school half their size!!!!

You should know me by now.  I am always in the mood for an argument.  

1.  Snider is a shell of its former self and isn’t even the best team in Allen County annually anymore.

2.  No one outside of the SAC considers Homestead a threat in 6A nor should they until the Spartans beat (hell compete with) anyone noteworthy outside of their area.

Carmel is so far above those programs it’s not even funny.

I know it is often a fruitless effort to compare programs who cycle players in and out every year and attempt to make blanket statements but we all do it.  

Snider could prove me wrong (and the way they turned it on late in 2021 got me halfway back on board) but right now I see them as a 5A contender and not much more.  
 

Even with the stability of a coaching staff, we can make assumptions about the way teams are going to be made up and the way that they are going to play and Homestead has failed miserably on every occasion it has had to prove itself, losing by 30+ ppg to the two Hamilton County teams they’ve lined up across from in the tournament recently.

I do see parallels between the last few Homestead teams and the CG teams of the early 2000s though, so I’ll never say never.

In conclusion, both of those programs would have a lot to gain by scheduling Carmel, but would not be much other than a homecoming opponent for the Hounds.

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4 hours ago, Grover said:

What makes you think Carmel & CG won't play each other?

I think they certainly would, along with Cathedral. I tend to agree with temp as mudas proposed schedule would be competitive if Carmel sent their JV on the field. Louisville Trinity, Westfield (the Rocks REALLY want this one) HSE or Fishers, Snider and one of the Catholic League powers out of Cincy.

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9 hours ago, Staxawax said:

I think they certainly would, along with Cathedral. I tend to agree with temp as mudas proposed schedule would be competitive if Carmel sent their JV on the field. Louisville Trinity, Westfield (the Rocks REALLY want this one) HSE or Fishers, Snider and one of the Catholic League powers out of Cincy.

The schedule Muda proposed looks good if for some reason teams from the MIC and HCC didn't want to schedule them. 

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7 minutes ago, BTF said:

The schedule Muda proposed looks good if for some reason teams from the MIC and HCC didn't want to schedule them. 

If that schedule comes to fruition, add Carmel to the list of non-Indy teams that needs to beef up its schedule to play with the 6A powers.

Maybe TWO of those contests would be competitive after halftime.

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18 minutes ago, temptation said:

If that schedule comes to fruition, add Carmel to the list of non-Indy teams that needs to beef up its schedule to play with the 6A powers.

Maybe TWO of those contests would be competitive after halftime.

Agree. Most those schools don't have the resources to compete with a school 2-3 times their enrollment. 

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14 hours ago, temptation said:

Carmel is so far above those programs it’s not even funny.

Above? In terms of what? Enrollment only....... the way I see it. If Homestead had 5000 kids the results would be different. 

A great program would win state 2/3 of the time with that kind of student population. 

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2 minutes ago, BTF said:

Above? In terms of what? Enrollment only....... the way I see it. If Homestead had 5000 kids the results would be different. 

A great program would win state 2/3 of the time with that kind of student population. 

Competitiveness on a state wide level.  

Look, Carmel is an easy punching bag and target on here and their lack of success in the tournaments since they have gone south is well documented over the past two seasons and makes it easy to pile on.

What is not debatable, however is the fact that no northern Indiana program is even close to their level or will make them sweat.  I need to see more from Homestead, Snider, Merrillville and others.

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14 hours ago, temptation said:

Snider could prove me wrong (and the way they turned it on late in 2021 got me halfway back on board) but right now I see them as a 5A contender and not much more.  

Fair assessment. Snider had a good team in 2021. Not compared to great teams of Snider's past, but still pretty good. After handling Dwenger in the regular season, they were probably looking ahead to Zionsville a little bit. They love knocking heads with Indy. 

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2 minutes ago, temptation said:

What is not debatable, however is the fact that no northern Indiana program is even close to their level

Nor should they be. It's not a fair fight.

4 minutes ago, temptation said:

no northern Indiana program will make them sweat.

Snider makes them sweat every time. If you think Carmel's coaching staff thinks they can walk into a Snider game with their team half asleep, you might consider talking to one of them. 

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56 minutes ago, temptation said:

Competitiveness on a state wide level.  

Look, Carmel is an easy punching bag and target on here and their lack of success in the tournaments since they have gone south is well documented over the past two seasons and makes it easy to pile on.

What is not debatable, however is the fact that no northern Indiana program is even close to their level or will make them sweat.  I need to see more from Homestead, Snider, Merrillville and others.

When Carmel has gone north recently, and made it to state, haven’t they also won state?

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1 hour ago, BTF said:

Nor should they be. It's not a fair fight.

Snider makes them sweat every time. If you think Carmel's coaching staff thinks they can walk into a Snider game with their team half asleep, you might consider talking to one of them. 

You’re once again assuming Snider returns to being Snider…those games were not recent enough for me use then as data/talking points.

51 minutes ago, DE said:

When Carmel has gone north recently, and made it to state, haven’t they also won state?

2-3 since the inception of 6A unless my math is mistaken.

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18 hours ago, Muda69 said:

Carmel's proposed 2022 6A tour schedule:

@ Penn

Lafayette Jeff

@ Columbus North

Merrilville

@ Carroll (Fort Wayne)

Southport

@ Franklin Central

Chesterton

@ Warsaw

 

Some of those matchups are possible, but many of those schools have conference games from weeks 3-9.  That will make it tough for Carmel and Center Grove to fill their schedule with some of them.  I think CG, Carmel, and the MIC schools may have to continue to play in the regular season out of necessity.  
 

Here is a potential schedule for both schools based upon non-conference availability for the opponents.  I don’t know the political stance of each MIC school towards Carmel and CG, so the schools who are willing to play them are just a guess.  Maybe Ben Davis would be willing to play, but I get the impression they led the movement to vote the suburban schools out.

CG

1 Warren Central

2 Merrillville

3 Cincinnati St. Xavier

4 Columbus North

5 Lawrence North

6 Carmel

7 Bloomington South

8 East Central

9 Cathedral

 

Carmel

1 Homestead

2 Westfield

3 Cincinnati Elder

4 Cathedral

5 North Central

6 Center Grove

7 Chatard

8 Warren Central

9 Louisville Trinity

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49 minutes ago, DE said:

When Carmel has gone north recently, and made it to state, haven’t they also won state?

They were north in 2020/2021

2019     Won state

2018     State Runner-up

2017     Third best team in the north. Never made it Lucas

2016     Won state 

2015     Didn't make it, lost to Penn. Wouldn't have made it past regional if Snider didn't get bumped down.

2014     Escaped Penn by one point before losing to Ben Davis at Lucas

 

 

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6 minutes ago, BTF said:

They were north in 2020/2021

2019     Won state

2018     State Runner-up

2017     Third best team in the north. Never made it Lucas

2016     Won state 

2015     Didn't make it, lost to Penn. Wouldn't have made it past regional if Snider didn't get bumped down.

2014     Escaped Penn by one point before losing to Ben Davis at Lucas

 

 

Man, your hatred of Carmel is palpable.

(I will give you credit on your Snider/Homestead basketball prediction however.)

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10 minutes ago, temptation said:

You’re once again assuming Snider returns to being Snider…those games were not recent enough for me use then as data/talking points.

Fair evaluation of the Panthers performance over the past four years. But not a morsel of evidence that Carmel could beat them without breaking a sweat during any time period over the last four decades. 

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