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MIC & HCC realignment


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13 minutes ago, foxbat said:

This is how the 10-team Hoosier Conference works.  Two 5-team divisions.  You play four games against the others in your division, two against teams from the other division in a rotating fashion over the seasons, and then a crossover game in Week 9 ... 1st East vs. 1st West, 2nd East vs. 2nd West, etc.  Two games left over to schedule at will against traditional rivals or anyone else.

HCC West

Westfield

Zionsville

Bburg

Avon

CG

 

HCC East

HSE

Fishers

Carmel

Noblesville 

Franklin Central

 

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1 hour ago, HHF said:

CG is being publicly accused of being a disloyal member of its conference. That's an ugly accusation, but unfortunately true.   Its a black mark that stains the shine that has emanated from everything that they have accomplished in building that program.  

BTW - I appreciate the tens of thousands of page views you have contributed to my total over the years.  Ive always known you were one of my biggest readers.

You are really reaching....schools leave conferences all the time.  All the time.   CG's decision to move has zero impact on their past and present accomplishments.  The decision to leave was based on factors that go well beyond football.

Was in a black mark on the MIC when they pushed out the Terre Haute schools to make room for local Indy schools??  At that time, the MIC did what was best for them, and now 2 schools are doing the same.  Nothing more or less.

 

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3 minutes ago, Bash Riprock said:

You are really reaching....schools leave conferences all the time.  All the time.   CG's decision to move has zero impact on their past and present accomplishments.  The decision to leave was based on factors that go well beyond football.

Was in a black mark on the MIC when they pushed out the Terre Haute schools to make room for local Indy schools??  At that time, the MIC did what was best for them, and now 2 schools are doing the same.  Nothing more or less.

 

Respectfully disagree with your opinion.  This move makes CG look selfish and arrogant, and comes directly on top of the recent incident at the state finals, which shed a very poor light on the school.  

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Just now, HHF said:

Respectfully disagree with your opinion.  This move makes CG look selfish and arrogant, and comes directly on top of the recent incident at the state finals, which shed a very poor light on the school.  

You know nothing about the incident, other than from the local media.  You have no idea how that incident has been managed by the school and the athletic program.  That incident has nothing to do with the decision that had been in the works for a long, long time.  

Selfish and arrogant...because they have to think about gate revenues to feed their program and providing better competition for a number of sports besides football.  Ridiculous.  

You ignored my question? Was the MIC selfish and arrogant when they pushed out the Terre Haute schools to make room for 2 local Indy township high schools??  

You are now doing nothing more than being a sh*t stirrer....and that's pretty darn low.  

At the end of the day, schools have to do what is best for them and their students.  Period.

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1 minute ago, Bash Riprock said:

You are really reaching....schools leave conferences all the time.  All the time.   CG's decision to move has zero impact on their past and present accomplishments.  The decision to leave was based on factors that go well beyond football.

Was in a black mark on the MIC when they pushed out the Terre Haute schools to make room for local Indy schools??  At that time, the MIC did what was best for them, and now 2 schools are doing the same.  Nothing more or less.

 

Agreed but by kicking out CG and Carmel (despite the fact they were headed out the door - apparently regardless whether they had a firm HCC deal) the MIC gets all the bad PR in this. 

I am still amazed that anyone with even a tinge of PR savvy allowed such a letter to be drafted, let alone released.  It’s as if petty children were running these remaining MIC schools.

To me the real question is who really wants to join the MIC at this point….and why?  What do they have to offer?  It must be pretty bad if CG and Carmel were leaving regardless and didn’t even have a firm deal.  

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4 minutes ago, Lysander said:

Agreed but by kicking out CG and Carmel (despite the fact they were headed out the door - apparently regardless whether they had a firm HCC deal) the MIC gets all the bad PR in this. 

I am still amazed that anyone with even a tinge of PR savvy allowed such a letter to be drafted, let alone released.  It’s as if petty children were running these remaining MIC schools.

To me the real question is who really wants to join the MIC at this point….and why?  What do they have to offer?  It must be pretty bad if CG and Carmel were leaving regardless and didn’t even have a firm deal.  

6 years ago I would have laughed at myself BUT Avon makes all the sense in the world. I think across the board in all sports they would end up being in the top half of the MIC . Travel is no issue , and they can keep their rivalry in tact with Brownsburg. I think  Avon, Ben Davis , WC, LN , and LC  would all stand a chance at a title next fall in football not many conferences can say they have a legitimate 5 team race . 

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1 minute ago, EasyEJay said:

6 years ago I would have laughed at myself BUT Avon makes all the sense in the world. I think across the board in all sports they would end up being in the top half of the MIC . Travel is no issue , and they can keep their rivalry in tact with Brownsburg. I think  Avon, Ben Davis , WC, LN , and LC  would all stand a chance at a title next fall in football not many conferences can say they have a legitimate 5 team race . 

I thought Avon was a suburban donut school.  Is that changing?

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14 minutes ago, Lysander said:

I am still amazed that anyone with even a tinge of PR savvy allowed such a letter to be drafted, let alone released. 

In the press release the remaining 6 claim Carmel and CG are "culturally re-aligning" but isn't that exactly what they did with this move? Not saying the move was wrong or anything, just find it ironic that they did exactly what they accused the other 2 of doing. We live in strange times.

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3 minutes ago, HHF said:

I thought Avon was a suburban donut school.  Is that changing?

Yes and no . I can tell you since passing a referendum in 2018 every decision made by the school is financial in nature. On a Wednesday in September your boys tennis team would travel to Pike or BD instead of Noblesville or Fishers. 

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10 minutes ago, CoachVeatch said:

In the press release the remaining 6 claim Carmel and CG are "culturally re-aligning" but isn't that exactly what they did with this move? Not saying the move was wrong or anything, just find it ironic that they did exactly what they accused the other 2 of doing. We live in strange times.

The MIC press release used those words, pointing toward the words used by the media.  I have yet to find a source that ties those words being used by Carmel and CG.  Bottom line, the MIC member schools were scorned and that is the language they used.  Not the 2 schools.

Does improving school economics and raising competition and opportunities for student athletes not mean anything?

Carmel and CG dominated sports such as tennis, golf, cross country, softball,  soccer, swimming, baseball, etc.  Then the post season would come, and sometimes results weren't as good.  (exception Carmel girls swimming)  These schools realize playing tougher competition in the conference improves team performance overall.  

I've sat in the football stands over the years on a friday night and sometime could count visiting MIC fans on 2 hands.  Worse Saturday morning.  And football, like it or not, is a revenue sports that pays a lot of bills for the athletic department.  

Edited by Bash Riprock
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4 minutes ago, EasyEJay said:

Yes and no . I can tell you since passing a referendum in 2018 every decision made by the school is financial in nature. On a Wednesday in September your boys tennis team would travel to Pike or BD instead of Noblesville or Fishers. 

But Pike and BD can barely field a boys tennis team.  Thats the problem with The MIC.  

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Possible fallout from this…….in other conferences where a couple teams at the top seem to dominate in terms of ALL sports, may decide to go independent as well. I think the possibility of Carmel just being independent is a very real one. It allows greater flexibility in scheduling……think beyond just football though folks. 

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3 minutes ago, Bash Riprock said:

The MIC press release used those words, point toward the words used by the media.  I have yet to find a source that ties those words being used by Carmel and CG.  Bottom line, the MIC member schools were scorned and that is the language they used.  Not the 2 schools.

Does improving school economics and raising competition and opportunities for student athletes not mean anything?

Carmel and CG dominated sports such as tennis, golf, cross country, softball,  soccer, swimming, baseball, etc.  Then the post season would come, and sometimes results weren't as good.  (exception Carmel girls swimming)  These schools realize playing tougher competition in the conference improves team performance overall.  

I've sat in the football stands over the years on a friday night and sometime could count visiting MIC fans on 2 hands.  Worse Saturday morning.  And football, like it or not, is a revenue sports that pays a lot of bills for the athletic department.  

Nobody is arguing the positives that CA and CG will realize in terms of better competition and improved gate revenue.  This is all about style and process.  The MIC did not like these two schools openly negotiating for a new home right out in the wide open.  I fully understand how the six would be put off by this.  They handle it properly and professionally by reiterating their core mission and explaining their future growth plans.  The CG-CA release was basically a CYA notice to the public and the media as a means to protect their reputations.

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So shifting the conversation a bit, is this more like taking a tag off of a new garment or pulling at a thread on a well-worn sweater?  In the former, it impacts, at most a couple of conferences.  In the latter, it provides a potential domino effect.

 

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Just now, HHF said:

But Pike and BD can barely field a boys tennis team.  Thats the problem with The MIC.  

You save even more money for a cancellation which leads to making tennis a club sport outside of school which is better (mindset of most Superintendents in the state) 🤣 JK. In all seriousness Pros and Cons for sure. 

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1 minute ago, Irishman said:

I would add that a move on this level is something that was needed, something to stir the pot. I am excited to see how all this plays out. 

Its huge, and I agree with you on Carmel.  Independence would suit them well.  They've allowed the school to get too big.  It may ultimately be their only option if the HCC gets cold feet on the Hounds.  

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I know this phrase “culturally realigned” is a loaded one BUT for schools who have fairly serious numbers of kids in sports outside of football, basketball and baseball (and I’m not sure about baseball in the MIC) there is a problem scheduling the remaining MIC schools for sports.  

I realize, for example, that lacrosse and rugby aren’t even IHSAA sports but Chatard and Cathedral have a LOT of kids playing these sports…many of them football players, btw.  Let alone the IHSAA sports like golf, tennis, etc.  I realize NC likely has all of these (and is competitive) but what about the remaining MIC schools?

Even then, simply “having” the sport doesn’t mean it’s competitive.  If you are a great tennis player you likely want competitive matches most of the year for your own self-improvement if nothing else.  Years ago, I had kids that played football and lacrosse.  One was an All-State player in both but his first love was lacrosse.  Despite my love for football, I would not have wanted him to play in the new MIC because of its lack of lacrosse…at least competitive lacrosse.  

BTW, I can see something like this being a problem for a school like Avon to join.

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2 minutes ago, Lysander said:

I know this phrase “culturally realigned” is a loaded one BUT for schools who have fairly serious numbers of kids in sports outside of football, basketball and baseball (and I’m not sure about baseball in the MIC) there is a problem scheduling the remaining MIC schools for sports.  

I realize, for example, that lacrosse and rugby aren’t even IHSAA sports but Chatard and Cathedral have a LOT of kids playing these sports…many of them football players, btw.  Let alone the IHSAA sports like golf, tennis, etc.  I realize NC likely has all of these (and is competitive) but what about the remaining MIC schools?

Even then, simply “having” the sport doesn’t mean it’s competitive.  If you are a great tennis player you likely want competitive matches most of the year for your own self-improvement if nothing else.  Years ago, I had kids that played football and lacrosse.  One was an All-State player in both but his first love was lacrosse.  Despite my love for football, I would not have wanted him to play in the new MIC because of its lack of lacrosse…at least competitive lacrosse.  

BTW, I can see something like this being a problem for a school like Avon to join.

Just to play Devils Advocate your saying a 16 year old Tennis Player at Avon and his parents would rather him be the 8th best Men's single player competing in the HCC than a Conference Champion in the MIC? 

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