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Who would you kick out of conference?


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1 hour ago, Old Man High Pants said:

Both were talked about a few years back, not sure how serious those talks were. Lately Madison has come into the discussion among the ADs again. And Milan! Which to me would be even dumber than bringing in Connersville and Rushville. 

If you added JC & Madison without dropping Connersville and Rushville, those 4 schools would be competitive with each other. South Dearborn already plays both schools. They could be competitive with FC and, Greensburg and Batesville at times as well. No one in the EIAC is really competitive with EC or Lawrenceburg right now. 

Milan and Madison make sense from a location standpoint as well as the fact they are both independent, so it could make scheduling easier for both. Milan, though a very solid 1a program, is still a small school for that conference. Then again, they already play 4 EIAC teams plus Madison. 

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4 hours ago, Old Man High Pants said:

Both were talked about a few years back, not sure how serious those talks were. Lately Madison has come into the discussion among the ADs again. And Milan! Which to me would be even dumber than bringing in Connersville and Rushville. 

Madison applied to join the Mid-Southern Conference last February after Clarksville announced it was leaving. The conference’s principals voted to table the application and stick with eight for the 2021-2022 school year.

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8 minutes ago, Frozen Tundra said:

Madison applied to join the Mid-Southern Conference last February after Clarksville announced it was leaving. The conference’s principals voted to table the application and stick with eight for the 2021-2022 school year.

Madison AD is a hoot.  I tried to interview his coach and he acted like they were The University of Michigan and already had enough press coverage for their program.

LOL

The Mighty Cubs are 11-59 over the past 7 seasons.

Hmmmmmm

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On 1/19/2022 at 1:53 PM, BDGiant93 said:

I'd vote out any team that doesn't want to be in my conference but that is just using your conference as a fall back in case something else doesn't work out...like getting into another conference. 

I’d vote out any team that fails to provide a safe environment for players, students and fans. 

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11 hours ago, Old Man High Pants said:

While I think East Central would be better suited as an independent I don't think they ever will be. I've always gotten the feeling that East Central likes their position and won't do too much to compromise that. 

East Central would fit in the Southwest Ohio Conference with their rival and neighbor Harrison.  It’s currently a 6 school conference - Harrison, Ross, Talawanda, Edgewood, Northwest, and Mount Healthy.  All have around 850-1200 students, and their longest trip would be 50 minutes to Edgewood.  As a 7 team conference, they would still have 3 open weeks for non-conference games with Lawrenceburg, Roncalli, and Moeller.

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42 minutes ago, HoopsCoach said:

East Central would fit in the Southwest Ohio Conference with their rival and neighbor Harrison.  It’s currently a 6 school conference - Harrison, Ross, Talawanda, Edgewood, Northwest, and Mount Healthy.  All have around 850-1200 students, and their longest trip would be 50 minutes to Edgewood.  As a 7 team conference, they would still have 3 open weeks for non-conference games with Lawrenceburg, Roncalli, and Moeller.

Has EC looked into playing Colerain?

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14 hours ago, boilerfan87 said:

If you added JC & Madison without dropping Connersville and Rushville, those 4 schools would be competitive with each other. South Dearborn already plays both schools. They could be competitive with FC and, Greensburg and Batesville at times as well. No one in the EIAC is really competitive with EC or Lawrenceburg right now. 

Milan and Madison make sense from a location standpoint as well as the fact they are both independent, so it could make scheduling easier for both. Milan, though a very solid 1a program, is still a small school for that conference. Then again, they already play 4 EIAC teams plus Madison. 

If a team wants to play them out of conference that's one thing. Being forced to play a team year after year knowing you're going to win isn't going to do much for your program. Take East Central out of the equation, adding Jennings County and Madison now gives a team like Lawrenceburg two more games that won't do anything for them in the playoffs.

11 hours ago, Frozen Tundra said:

Madison applied to join the Mid-Southern Conference last February after Clarksville announced it was leaving. The conference’s principals voted to table the application and stick with eight for the 2021-2022 school year.

I think the Mid Southern would be a good fit for them. They're a small 4A school and may be 3A here soon which would fit well with that conference.

6 hours ago, HoopsCoach said:

East Central would fit in the Southwest Ohio Conference with their rival and neighbor Harrison.  It’s currently a 6 school conference - Harrison, Ross, Talawanda, Edgewood, Northwest, and Mount Healthy.  All have around 850-1200 students, and their longest trip would be 50 minutes to Edgewood.  As a 7 team conference, they would still have 3 open weeks for non-conference games with Lawrenceburg, Roncalli, and Moeller.

I couldn't agree more. I've always thought joining an Ohio Conference would be great for East Central. They have played Edgewood before as well. I think it would be great for the program but like I said I don't really see that happening. Though the Southwest Conference has been having some potential shake ups talked about lately so who knows?

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5 hours ago, HHF said:

Has EC looked into playing Colerain?

They've played them in JV in the past. Colerain is a tough team to schedule. They play in a conference with more teams than regular season games. Their 2-3 out of conference games they have per year are always against GCL teams. 

East Central does a good job of scheduling Ohio schools in their out of conference. Currently play Harrison and Moeller. In the past have played LaSalle, Edgewood, and Columbus De Sales.

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2 hours ago, Old Man High Pants said:

I think the Mid Southern would be a good fit for them. They're a small 4A school and may be 3A here soon which would fit well with that conference.

@HoopsCoach released the new enrollment numbers in another thread and Madison’s enrollment dropped by over 100. They are now firmly in 3A.

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2 hours ago, Old Man High Pants said:

1 - If a team wants to play them out of conference that's one thing. Being forced to play a team year after year knowing you're going to win isn't going to do much for your program. Take East Central out of the equation, adding Jennings County and Madison now gives a team like Lawrenceburg two more games that won't do anything for them in the playoffs.

2 - I think the Mid Southern would be a good fit for them. They're a small 4A school and may be 3A here soon which would fit well with that conference.

 

1 - I agree, but if the EIAC expanded to enough teams, they wouldn't necessarily have to play all teams in the EIAC. With the big school/small school split, they could stick to playing the teams they have to play in their division and playing whoever outside of that. Realistically, it's all hypothetical anyway because I don't see it happening. 

 

2 - I also agree, but that is disappointing to hear what Frozen said about denial, at least for the time being. I do get it. Before Clarksville's exit, they only had 1 out of conference game and that was tough to schedule. Or at least the schedules were very locked in. Perhaps conference members enjoy the flexibility of 2 out of conference games. 

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2 hours ago, Old Man High Pants said:

If a team wants to play them out of conference that's one thing. Being forced to play a team year after year knowing you're going to win isn't going to do much for your program. Take East Central out of the equation, adding Jennings County and Madison now gives a team like Lawrenceburg two more games that won't do anything for them in the playoffs.

Lawrenceburg wouldn't be required to play those schools, East central doesn't currently play all the conference teams, only the ones in the 4A "division".

The difference between Lburg and EC is that EC is the odd man out population wise in the EIAC, Lburg fits with the rest of the EIAC size wise. 

 

The entire conference structure will likely have to be revamped with most of the schools falling to the 3A class

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3 hours ago, boilerfan87 said:

1 - I agree, but if the EIAC expanded to enough teams, they wouldn't necessarily have to play all teams in the EIAC. With the big school/small school split, they could stick to playing the teams they have to play in their division and playing whoever outside of that. Realistically, it's all hypothetical anyway because I don't see it happening. 

I personally hate the Big School / Small School format. To me it makes the small school conference champion look like a runner up. But that's just me. 

3 hours ago, Frozen Tundra said:

@HoopsCoach released the new enrollment numbers in another thread and Madison’s enrollment dropped by over 100. They are now firmly in 3A.

Sounds like a great fit to me. That conference is much more on Madison's level when it comes to football. Have no idea in other sports. 

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3 hours ago, GoodKn19ht said:

Lawrenceburg wouldn't be required to play those schools, East central doesn't currently play all the conference teams, only the ones in the 4A "division".

The difference between Lburg and EC is that EC is the odd man out population wise in the EIAC, Lburg fits with the rest of the EIAC size wise. 

The entire conference structure will likely have to be revamped with most of the schools falling to the 3A class

This goes back to the Big School / Small School. To me a conference should be a conference. The only reason I can see for splitting up into divisions would be to have a North/South or East/West divide to cut down on travel time and open up more opportunities for out of conference games. 

Lets just call it what it is. This entire format was created so that schools could avoid playing East Central. Ironically Lawrenceburg was the one in the driver seat for this when it was initiated, which is why they didn't play for four years. There's been a lot of change in the football program, athletic department and frankly the town since this thing started rolling over a decade ago.

To the original question though of who should be in or out. Rushville and Connersville don't beat anyone but each other. Jennings County & Madison would probably be the same. I think the EIAC was better when teams couldn't avoid East Central, there was a standard to measure up to. 

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25 minutes ago, Old Man High Pants said:

This goes back to the Big School / Small School. To me a conference should be a conference. The only reason I can see for splitting up into divisions would be to have a North/South or East/West divide to cut down on travel time and open up more opportunities for out of conference games. 

Oh no that makes total sense, and I agree, I was simply saying if they want to continue this format, it would need to be revamped heavily. Based on those new enrollment numbers, only one team in the conference will be in the 4A division. EC

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30 minutes ago, Old Man High Pants said:

This goes back to the Big School / Small School. To me a conference should be a conference. The only reason I can see for splitting up into divisions would be to have a North/South or East/West divide to cut down on travel time and open up more opportunities for out of conference games. 

Lets just call it what it is. This entire format was created so that schools could avoid playing East Central. Ironically Lawrenceburg was the one in the driver seat for this when it was initiated, which is why they didn't play for four years. There's been a lot of change in the football program, athletic department and frankly the town since this thing started rolling over a decade ago.

To the original question though of who should be in or out. Rushville and Connersville don't beat anyone but each other. Jennings County & Madison would probably be the same. I think the EIAC was better when teams couldn't avoid East Central, there was a standard to measure up to. 

East Central has become the Penn of Eastern Indiana football.  They sleepwalk thru their conference schedule and then get upended in the post season.  Columbus East was the same until they finally broke thru.  All of these conference dominators have options.  Penn had the DAC, but passed due to time change issues.  East is clsose enough to Indy to apply to a few conferences for membership, but wants to be seen as a "southern" school so they stay put.  EC could align with Ohio or pull a Carmel and go independent.  Everybody has options and everybody makes choices.  

There are many schools who have controlled their own destinies and made moves in their own best competitive interests.  Mishawaka to the NLC, Hanover Central to the NCC, New Castle to the HHC, Franklin Central to the HCC, Perry Meridian to the MSC, the entire HNAC.  Kudos to those with the vision and the guts to make bold moves and enhance the experience for their student athletes.

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1 hour ago, GoodKn19ht said:

Oh no that makes total sense, and I agree, I was simply saying if they want to continue this format, it would need to be revamped heavily. Based on those new enrollment numbers, only one team in the conference will be in the 4A division. EC

I believe the rules state that it's the four largest in one and the four smallest in the other. They started it 4A/3A because that's how it was at the time. Next season only East Central and Connersville will be 4A.

The interesting part will be to see if Greensburg goes to the large conference, which by the numbers posted on another thread they're at the 4th largest enrollment, how that will work out. Both teams came to a mutual agreement to not play and it's honestly better for both teams. 

In my opinion should get rid of divisions and just say if a team decides they don't want to play another then that's it. Make it a lot easier.

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2 hours ago, HHF said:

East Central has become the Penn of Eastern Indiana football.  They sleepwalk thru their conference schedule and then get upended in the post season.  Columbus East was the same until they finally broke thru.  All of these conference dominators have options.  Penn had the DAC, but passed due to time change issues.  East is clsose enough to Indy to apply to a few conferences for membership, but wants to be seen as a "southern" school so they stay put.  EC could align with Ohio or pull a Carmel and go independent.  Everybody has options and everybody makes choices.  

There are many schools who have controlled their own destinies and made moves in their own best competitive interests.  Mishawaka to the NLC, Hanover Central to the NCC, New Castle to the HHC, Franklin Central to the HCC, Perry Meridian to the MSC, the entire HNAC.  Kudos to those with the vision and the guts to make bold moves and enhance the experience for their student athletes.

Columbus East doesn’t care about whether a conference is southern enough. They applied for membership to the Mid-State Conference a few years ago, along with Bloomington North, but Perry Meridian was chosen instead because of geography. 

Conference Indiana tried to get Columbus East to join around that same time but there were allegedly some “logistics issues” as to why East turned them down. The rumor I’d heard was that East wasn’t fond of traveling to the Terre Haute schools.

So if the Mid-State Conference doesn’t want you and you don’t want Conference Indiana, you really have no other choice than to stay in the Hoosier Hills Conference. It’s the only one in the area with schools of a similar size. The others are too far away.

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On 1/19/2022 at 7:40 AM, superjay said:

Sagamore Conference!  A conference is made up of more than football.  But taking only football into account.  I think that Southmont would be better off in the Wabash River Conference and Frankfort in the Hoosier East.  

The WRC already has one school that couldn’t beat teams it’s own size they don’t need 2. 

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54 minutes ago, dazed and confused said:

i've been thinking for a couple years that West Lafayette could be better prepared for post season by leaving the the Hoosier.... NCC ?

Without a doubt.  WL is also one of the few schools in the state that could also play as an independent.  They are without question the strongest public 3A program in the state.  If Tech goes to The MIC, that will open a spot in The NCC.  

 

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6 minutes ago, HHF said:

Without a doubt.  WL is also one of the few schools in the state that could also play as an independent.  They are without question the strongest public 3A program in the state.  If Tech goes to The MIC, that will open a spot in The NCC.  

 

Tech to the MIC still strikes me as Rutgers to the Big Ten...they'd add nothing from a competitive standpoint.

Basketball is their golden goose (right now) and they aren't even in position to win the NCC.

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9 minutes ago, temptation said:

Tech to the MIC still strikes me as Rutgers to the Big Ten...they'd add nothing from a competitive standpoint.

Basketball is their golden goose (right now) and they aren't even in position to win the NCC.

I think this is still a possibility due more to political reasons than competitive ones.

I think IPS and top level politically connected people in Indy would like to see Tech in The MIC.  It would certainly go a long way in legitimizing IPS sports to the general public, and likely spur participation and even potentially increase enrollment.  The loss of CG and CAR makes The MIC less a football conference and more a basketball one, which is Tech's strength.  

If The MIC does intend to flex back out to 8 schools, I expect Tech to be one of the additions.  I think Franklin Central is the next best fit, just hard to see them bolt from The HCC.  

Best case scenario:

Tech and FC to The MIC

CG to The HCC

WL to The NCC

Carmel already off to the races as an independent

 

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