Irishman Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 3 minutes ago, Muda69 said: Let's say a high school safety prevents a go-ahead touchdown by their opponent as time expired in the 4th quarter, but does it using a non-approved tackling method that puts him and/or his opponent at the risk of incurring a real concussion. Would he be berated by his coaches after the play, or carried off the field on the shoulders of his teammates? There is an inherent risk in playing the game, just as there is in any sport.....you know the answer to that question. Just like most of us know you do not want people playing tackle football until the age of 18. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muda69 Posted January 21, 2022 Author Share Posted January 21, 2022 1 minute ago, Irishman said: There is an inherent risk in playing the game, just as there is in any sport.....you know the answer to that question. Just like most of us know you do not want people playing tackle football until the age of 18. How would you handle the above scenario as a coach, Irishman? 3 minutes ago, Irishman said: Just like most of us know you do not want people playing tackle football until the age of 18. A sensible position if you really care about the health and safety of children. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irishman Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 5 minutes ago, Muda69 said: A sensible position if you really care about the health and safety of children. Not engaging in the question......but it is good to know that out of the 1,000 plus members here (based on the fact that you are the only one who believes it) that you are the ONLY one on this entire forum that truly cares about the health and safety of children. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gonzoron Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 8 minutes ago, Irishman said: There is an inherent risk in playing the game, just as there is in any sport.....you know the answer to that question. Just like most of us know you do not want people playing tackle football until the age of 18. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muda69 Posted January 21, 2022 Author Share Posted January 21, 2022 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Irishman said: Not engaging in the question......but it is good to know that out of the 1,000 plus members here (based on the fact that you are the only one who believes it) that you are the ONLY one on this entire forum that truly cares about the health and safety of children. I guess so. Thanks for the kudos. Interesting that you refuse to answer how as a football coach you would respond to a simple scenario. Telling. Edited January 21, 2022 by Muda69 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grover Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 There's nothing telling about it. You are just looking for an argument. And in your hypothetical situation you celebrate the win and point out the preferred tackling method in film. 6 hours ago, Irishman said: There is an inherent risk in playing the game, just as there is in any sport.....you know the answer to that question. Just like most of us know you do not want people playing tackle football until the age of 18. Had my parents believed something that absurd I would have never played football. I've never begrudged a parent's paranoia about football. There are other sports/activities for their kids. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementbias Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 Having coached youth football, the problems come from not using any proper fundamentals when tackling. It comes when kids do not wrap when tackling. They try to big hit or "hit stick" by just throwing themselves at a runner. They aren't coordinated and thus their head gets put in a bad spot. When they use the old school proper technique I have yet to see it personally. The Seahawks tackling I'd maybe use as a secondary technique as I see some flaws. It still has hitting with the shoulder near the head & neck area. Big thing is that kids & adults do not watch the belly button and stay on the back hip when pursuing. That's a major problem as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxbat Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 1 hour ago, Basementbias said: Having coached youth football, the problems come from not using any proper fundamentals when tackling. It comes when kids do not wrap when tackling. They try to big hit or "hit stick" by just throwing themselves at a runner. They aren't coordinated and thus their head gets put in a bad spot. When they use the old school proper technique I have yet to see it personally. The Seahawks tackling I'd maybe use as a secondary technique as I see some flaws. It still has hitting with the shoulder near the head & neck area. Big thing is that kids & adults do not watch the belly button and stay on the back hip when pursuing. That's a major problem as well. One of my youth coaches back in the day was a bit cruder in the technique. He always told us to watch the guy's balls because he wasn't going anywhere without them. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bash Riprock Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 3 hours ago, foxbat said: One of my youth coaches back in the day was a bit cruder in the technique. He always told us to watch the guy's balls because he wasn't going anywhere without them. At least until the guy is married.....😉 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muda69 Posted January 23, 2022 Author Share Posted January 23, 2022 On 1/21/2022 at 8:35 PM, Grover said: There's nothing telling about it. You are just looking for an argument. And in your hypothetical situation you celebrate the win and point out the preferred tackling method in film. No, I'm looking for information about how coaches view the game of high school tackle football. So the win is the most important thing. Got it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gonzoron Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 16 minutes ago, Muda69 said: No, I'm looking for information about how coaches view the game of high school tackle football. Why are you looking for that information in a thread about youth football and rugby? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grover Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 2 hours ago, Muda69 said: So the win is the most important thing. Got it. That is a dumb conclusion to draw but I'll consider the source. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muda69 Posted January 23, 2022 Author Share Posted January 23, 2022 8 hours ago, Grover said: That is a dumb conclusion to draw but I'll consider the source. No, Chief. That is your conclusion. When all you have left is insults well, your part in the discussion is effectively over. Go away and let the adults talk. 10 hours ago, gonzoron said: Why are you looking for that information in a thread about youth football and rugby? Because this is a high school football forum. Oh, getting dogpiled by the likes of Grover and Gonzo, reminds me of the good old days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gonzoron Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 54 minutes ago, Muda69 said: No, Chief. That is your conclusion. When all you have left is insults well, your part in the discussion is effectively over. Go away and let the adults talk. Because this is a high school football forum. Oh, getting dogpiled by the likes of Grover and Gonzo, reminds me of the good old days. 2 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FastpacedO Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 On 1/22/2022 at 11:45 PM, Muda69 said: No, I'm looking for information about how coaches view the game of high school tackle football. So the win is the most important thing. Got it. I will take into consideration you may have no experience with it. They did it some back in the day although it usually took longer. In HS football after they play a game on Friday night, Saturday morning they usually do film study, It has come a long way from old reel to reel and VHS film study. With the digital age they have HUDL (and other programs similar to it). In that the coaches point out players out of position, poor techniques (blocking, route running, throwing), and yes they even point out poor tackling techniques for future learning. They might even replay a play 6-8 times pointing out several mistakes on that one play. Not one player in youth, HS, College, or Professional has been perfect 100% of the time. They all make mistakes and the coaches job is to correct them. Sometimes those mistakes can and do cause an injury. Is it a risk yes, driving a car is a greater risk than most people think about too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muda69 Posted January 26, 2022 Author Share Posted January 26, 2022 53 minutes ago, FastpacedO said: I will take into consideration you may have no experience with it. They did it some back in the day although it usually took longer. In HS football after they play a game on Friday night, Saturday morning they usually do film study, It has come a long way from old reel to reel and VHS film study. With the digital age they have HUDL (and other programs similar to it). In that the coaches point out players out of position, poor techniques (blocking, route running, throwing), and yes they even point out poor tackling techniques for future learning. They might even replay a play 6-8 times pointing out several mistakes on that one play. But is there ever punitive action doled out by high school coaches for incorrect tackling techniques? Unless the the player who got tackled is injured (most likely a concussion) or the tackler is flagged by the officials for some reason I would bet not. Maybe just a feeble comment during a film session. After all in my above scenario the player made the play that won the game, right? 1 hour ago, FastpacedO said: Not one player in youth, HS, College, or Professional has been perfect 100% of the time. They all make mistakes and the coaches job is to correct them. Sometimes those mistakes can and do cause an injury. Is it a risk yes, driving a car is a greater risk than most people think about too. And are these children made 100% clear of the risk involved? Not just risks during a practice or game, but risks to their future? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grover Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 Wait…you mean we should also be teaching safety?? My God man! That is brilliant! Never thought about it. Thanks for enlightening us!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muda69 Posted January 26, 2022 Author Share Posted January 26, 2022 1 hour ago, Grover said: Wait…you mean we should also be teaching safety?? My God man! That is brilliant! Never thought about it. Thanks for enlightening us!! Your sarcasm and arrogance is noted. Not yet on the level of the famed Roncalli Horde, but you Center Grove jamokes can keep trying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goose Liver Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 On 1/23/2022 at 10:23 AM, gonzoron said: If you look at that picture closely that is an Amtrak derailment I worked. Safety briefing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bash Riprock Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 1 hour ago, Muda69 said: Your sarcasm and arrogance is noted. Not yet on the level of the famed Roncalli Horde, but you Center Grove jamokes can keep trying. Nice sterotype.....how is retorting with your own insult behavior that is any different or any more acceptable? Seriously, what are you arguing? You start a thread comparing football to rugby indicating the latter is safer. I provided you clear data from the NIH that indicates that is not accurate. You have other people that have shown you that much of youth football and above does teach safer tackling techniques. It would seem that you don't have a ton of data and you are using one example to make your case, when you really don't know a ton of about that particular case. You are speculating at best. I understand you wish to go down with your ship....but I am not sure you need to. What is it that you are really arguing? I think we agree the world in general and sports included are not risk free. And I believe you are a guy that tends to espouse personal freedom including free will. What do you want from this discussion other than it would seem is to simply argue? You've said in the past that football should be banned until the age of 18 in the name of safety. That is pretty extreme and is polar opposite of personal freedom. How would have doing so helped with the particular case of the NFL player injury that you use as an example? Given the injury data for rugby, including concussions, would that sport need to be banned as well? Where are you going with this discussion? You just really come across in this case as data lacking, argumentative, and inconsistent with your past political positions of personal accountability and freedom. At least that is my take. I respect your positions all in all on GID....but I am struggling in this case to understand where you are going. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grover Posted January 27, 2022 Share Posted January 27, 2022 6 hours ago, Muda69 said: Your sarcasm and arrogance is noted. Not yet on the level of the famed Roncalli Horde, but you Center Grove jamokes can keep trying. A sarcastic response was far nicer than the first 10 responses I could have given. I just don't have a high tolerance for a bitter old man who sits back and second-guesses everything done by those who are actually doing. It's even worse when you have preconceived notions that facts don't have a chance of altering. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muda69 Posted January 27, 2022 Author Share Posted January 27, 2022 14 minutes ago, Grover said: A sarcastic response was far nicer than the first 10 responses I could have given. I just don't have a high tolerance for a bitter old man who sits back and second-guesses everything done by those who are actually doing. It's even worse when you have preconceived notions that facts don't have a chance of altering. There you go Mr. Grover. Getting closer! I asked simple questions in this thread. I find it puzzling why they can't be answered simply and directly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muda69 Posted January 27, 2022 Author Share Posted January 27, 2022 5 hours ago, Bash Riprock said: And I believe you are a guy that tends to espouse personal freedom including free will. What do you want from this discussion other than it would seem is to simply argue? You've said in the past that football should be banned until the age of 18 in the name of safety. It should. And I believe many, many youth today are not playing tackle football completely of their own free will but are doing so under duress and pressure from parents, other family members, educational professionals, and peers. And they are putting their bodies and minds at risk. Risks that don't become apparent until maybe decades down the line. There are medical professionals and former professional football players out there who won't let their under-18 children take that risk, and champion other parents do the same, because they have either seen the results of taking that risk are currently living with those results. And it is not pretty. But hey, Friday Night Lights! What can beat it? Right? The rest of your response? tl;dr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grover Posted January 27, 2022 Share Posted January 27, 2022 11 minutes ago, Muda69 said: There you go Mr. Grover. Getting closer! I asked simple questions in this thread. I find it puzzling why they can't be answered simply and directly. They were. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muda69 Posted January 27, 2022 Author Share Posted January 27, 2022 13 hours ago, Grover said: They were. No, they were not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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