Time for the "Rubber to Hit the Road"....

[Yuccaguy]

Its' a DAMNED shame that in a league 70% (+/-) African-American. in 2022 there is only ONE Head Coach that reflects any ability for those who would even choose to think about their future within the NFL beyond that of an "assistant" continue to use the guise of the Rooney Rule to circumvent and continue the old-boys network as a way to further their idiotic hiring practices....

Eric Bieniemy should have been hired 3 years ago as a HC in the NFL!  The Jaguars "may" hire Byron Leftwich as their HC....again "MAY".  

That's IT!  

The NFL has done a better job with their officials (selection/promotion) in giving/providing a diverse representation to the those of us on that end of the spectrum;  Than anything the ''OWNERS" have ever done in trying to find and promote those within a minority community to lead their franchises.  

SAME OLE, SAME OLE....  Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.  Recycled, and not updated! 

But with the same 'suit".  🤬

[Irishman]

A lot of people seem to be laughing this off, but to me it seems he has some solid evidence. It’s obvious that owners do not take the Rooney rule seriously, but it’s also obvious the people in charge of the league do not take it seriously either.

[southend]

But the subjectivity ,of making the hires ,is so individualized for each team that it’s almost too intricate to put blame on discrimination. Okay I’m not Naive enough to know it might play a part, in some teams over several years ,but proving and trying to enforce is almost too complicated. But winning requires putting the best people available,at all the positions on the team, and this includes coaches.

[Whiting89]

Here is the problem most black coaches are former players so they get their coaching start later in their career so once they are seasoned they are passed over because of age, another form of discrimination. These other coaches such as mcvay shannahan Staley etc start right out if college and or are hired because of nepotism. I don’t know what the answer is 

[Whiting89]

The bigger problem is the 100k to lose games nothing more important then the integrity of the game 

[Irishman]

10 hours ago, Whiting89 said:

The bigger problem is the 100k to lose games nothing more important then the integrity of the game 

Looks like that problem just got bigger
https://thespun.com/nfl/afc-north/cleveland-browns/hue-jackson-claims-browns-paid-him-money-to-lose-games 

[Yuccaguy]

This situation cannot, nor should be confined to just the lawsuit filed by Brian Flores.   

There are NUMEROUS individuals who have been "bushwacked" by the pretense of an actual interview/opportunity that was brought by the "Rooney Rule".  

As for Hue Jackson, he seems to be in compliance and the embodiment of TANKING for draft picks, supplemented by $$ to lose.  He says that "Why would you give a contract extension to  HC that was 1-31 over 2 years if it wasn't clear that you wanted to lose and did NOTHING to improve the quality of the team?"...

The owners within the league are the problem.   Yet, again their employ (Goodell) is the front-man who has to answer for all of this.  As usual, the NFL will dodge/pivot and ultimately not answer for anything. 

It's quite clear that they blackballed Kaepernick out of the league, and got away with it.  But with 70% of the league consisting of AA players, this is not a situation that they cannot address.

It would be a great opportunity for those players to boycott a week, and see what the effects would be.

A number of these men have looked at their futures beyond the playing field, and see no opportunity for advancement.

The time came years ago for the NFL to diversify.  Yet in 2022, the same ole, same ole continues and is the norm.  

[Bobref]

From a strictly legal standpoint, there are some real problems with bringing this case as a class action. Just filing it as a class action is not enough. Before it can go forward, the judge has to certify it as appropriate for class treatment under all the very complex procedural requirements that are quite different than “normal” civil litigation. To be certified, the judge has to find that the class is defined in a way that “common questions of law and fact predominate” in the claim of each putative class member.

The second issue I see is proof. In large employment race discrimination class actions, statistical proof is often key. Because there are large numbers of employees and large numbers of employment-related decisions, statistical analysis can be brought to bear to show a systematic bias, despite the fact that employment decisions are done on an individualized basis. NFL coaching decisions are not nearly so numerous, which would leave any statistical analysis open to serious attack on any purported conclusions. That leaves the proof to rely on individualized scenarios, with a lot of “he said, she said” type situations. The fact that such decisions are so individualized not only presents proof problems, but argues against class certification.

Also, I wonder where the EEOC is in all this. Civil claims by an employee or applicant for employment based on Title VII of the 1964 Civil Rights Act, which protects against racial discrimination in the workplace, must normally be first presented to the EEOC, which investigates and can take action against the employer itself. Once the EEOC investigation is over, they issue the employee a “right to sue” letter, which you normally have to get before you can file a case in court. Haven’t heard any mention of it here.

On the other side side of the coin, it’s highly unlikely the NFL allows this to go anywhere for very long. They run from any sort of publicity that might turn off the money printing machine they are operating. They’ll settle this with some sort of an agreement that is a stronger version of the Rooney Rule. The owners will sign some sort of pledge. Maybe the League will even create a position specifically to monitor compliance. Flores may get some money. His lawyers certainly will.

I’m very interested to hear what the NFLPA has to say about this. Crickets, so far.

[DE]

Do not intend to detract from the topic, but why was Flores fired in Miami?

[Esso Ayche]

1 minute ago, DE said:

Do not intend to detract from the topic, but why was Flores fired in Miami?

I believe the answer to that question is the impetus to the lawsuit.  He seemed to be on the right track to me, particularly when viewing the hand he was dealt.

[DE]

34 minutes ago, Esso Ayche said:

I believe the answer to that question is the impetus to the lawsuit.  He seemed to be on the right track to me, particularly when viewing the hand he was dealt.

I too thought he was doing a nice job.

[Irishman]

He was doing a good job. The Dolphins caught a lot of heat for firing him. Someone made a comparison….Flores was in Miami for a short time, David Culley gets fired by the Texans in just his first year…a year without his QB, and the year they lost JJWatt, along with a bunch of other crap going on in the front office and with the owner, while Bill O’Brien was able to hang on as coach and GM for a longer period of time. 
 

Thanks Bob for explaining the class action aspect of this. Sounds like what he will need is to prove that other minority coaches were interviewed after an owner or president made a decision on who to hire. If he had just stuck with suing the Giants organization, his case may be easy to prove. 
 

It also sounds like Gooddell is letting the owners do whatever they want, but the reality is they are his bosses. There are some things that could be done immediately. The Giants flaunted the Rooney rule in the league’s face if the texts are accurate. They should lose not only draft picks, but take a hot against their salary cap. You take a few mill off a team’s cap for something like this, teams will do what is needed real quick. 

[DE]

3 minutes ago, Irishman said:

He was doing a good job. The Dolphins caught a lot of heat for firing him. Someone made a comparison….Flores was in Miami for a short time, David Culley gets fired by the Texans in just his first year…a year without his QB, and the year they lost JJWatt, along with a bunch of other crap going on in the front office and with the owner, while Bill O’Brien was able to hang on as coach and GM for a longer period of time. 
 

Thanks Bob for explaining the class action aspect of this. Sounds like what he will need is to prove that other minority coaches were interviewed after an owner or president made a decision on who to hire. If he had just stuck with suing the Giants organization, his case may be easy to prove. 
 

It also sounds like Gooddell is letting the owners do whatever they want, but the reality is they are his bosses. There are some things that could be done immediately. The Giants flaunted the Rooney rule in the league’s face if the texts are accurate. They should lose not only draft picks, but take a hot against their salary cap. You take a few mill off a team’s cap for something like this, teams will do what is needed real quick. 

Wonder if Steve Wilks feels the same way?

[DE]

If people would just watch The Office, specifically the “Search Committee” (season 7 episode 26) episode, this could all have been averted. 
 

*Kelly’s interview*

Edited February 3, 2022 by DE

[temptation]

8 minutes ago, DE said:

Merit > Melanin

Edited February 3, 2022 by temptation

[BTF]

The average NFL franchise has a valuation of 2.86 billion dollars. The owners have the right to hire whoever they want. I guarantee they are hiring, in their estimation, the most qualified person to lead their team to the Super Bowl. 

[Bobref]

2 hours ago, BTF said:

 The owners have the right to hire whoever they want. I guarantee they are hiring, in their estimation, the most qualified person to lead their team to the Super Bowl. 

Actually, they don’t. Like anyone else, their employment practices are constrained by law. And some recent evidence, if believed, would tend to suggest that the ability to lead a team to the Super Bowl is not the only factor that goes into some coaching decisions.

[temptation]

3 minutes ago, Bobref said:

Actually, they don’t. Like anyone else, their employment practices are constrained by law. And some recent evidence, if believed, would tend to suggest that the ability to lead a team to the Super Bowl is not the only factor that goes into some coaching decisions.

So prove it.  What “recent evidence” points solely to race?

[Bobref]

2 minutes ago, temptation said:

So prove it.  What “recent evidence” points solely to race?

I don’t have a dog in this fight. But I was referring to the statements of both Flores and Hue Jackson that their owners/management incentivized other things besides winning games. If winning is not your top priority, then you’re not really concerned about whether your coach is good enough to get you to the Super Bowl.

[temptation]

Just now, Bobref said:

I don’t have a dog in this fight. But I was referring to the statements of both Flores and Hue Jackson that their owners/management incentivized other things besides winning games. If winning is not your top priority, then you’re not really concerned about whether your coach is good enough to get you to the Super Bowl.

Gotcha.  Agree.  Not what the OP was inferring though.

[Bobref]

1 minute ago, temptation said:

Gotcha.  Agree.  Not what the OP was inferring though.

Yes, but his inference was unwarranted.

More significantly, I take exception to something everyone else is glossing over: the idea that winning every game should be the highest priority for a team, i.e., anything else is “tanking.” I can conceive of several scenarios where other things might legitimately be higher priorities.

[Bobref]

On 2/1/2022 at 3:58 PM, Yuccaguy said:

Meet the new boss, same as the old boss. 

The Jaguars double down, hiring an old, white retread (Doug Peterson) in the current climate. More than a little surprising with Byron Leftwich still in the mix.

[temptation]

1 hour ago, Bobref said:

The Jaguars double down, hiring an old, white retread (Doug Peterson) in the current climate. More than a little surprising with Byron Leftwich still in the mix.

Skin color is irrelevant.  Please just stop.  The “climate” is irrelevant.  You said yourself the goal is to win a championship.

You conveniently left our FORMER SUPER BOWL WINNING COACH Doug Pederson in your description of his attributes.

Kind of an important fact, but you knew that already.  Race is not as important of a factor as you, and others want it to be.

[temptation]

1 hour ago, Bobref said:

The Jaguars double down, hiring an old, white retread (Doug Peterson) in the current climate. More than a little surprising with Byron Leftwich still in the mix.

Then of course there is this little nugget…but don’t let facts get in the way of a good fairy tale.

“Leftwich, who played quarterback for the Jaguars, reportedly did not want to take the job if general manager Trent Baalke was still working for the franchise because he wanted to potentially work with Cardinals vice president of pro personnel Adrian Wilson. The duo worked together in Arizona when Bruce Arians was the head coach there.”

[DE]

26 minutes ago, temptation said:

Skin color is irrelevant.  Please just stop.  The “climate” is irrelevant.  You said yourself the goal is to win a championship.

You conveniently left our FORMER SUPER BOWL WINNING COACH Doug Pederson in your description of his attributes.

Kind of an important fact, but you knew that already.  Race is not as important of a factor as you, and others want it to be.

Thank you.  Very well said.

19 minutes ago, temptation said:

Then of course there is this little nugget…but don’t let facts get in the way of a good fairy tale.

“Leftwich, who played quarterback for the Jaguars, reportedly did not want to take the job if general manager Trent Baalke was still working for the franchise because he wanted to potentially work with Cardinals vice president of pro personnel Adrian Wilson. The duo worked together in Arizona when Bruce Arians was the head coach there.”

Is that statement by BL racist, since TB is white and AW is black?