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itiswhatitis

Mercy Rule Adpoted

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It's finally happened in Indiana.  The ISHAA has a new rule.  From now on, if a score is at least 35 - 0 at halftime, there will be a running clock in the second half. Hmmmmm, if I'm a coach, I'm going to only score 34 even if I have to miss an extra point on purpose.  LOL  Dumb rule.  There are still going to be 55 - 0 and 63 - 0 scores.  The explanation I heard was they want kinds to still feel good about competing.  Uh huh.

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38 minutes ago, itiswhatitis said:

It's finally happened in Indiana.  The ISHAA has a new rule.  From now on, if a score is at least 35 - 0 at halftime, there will be a running clock in the second half. Hmmmmm, if I'm a coach, I'm going to only score 34 even if I have to miss an extra point on purpose.  LOL  Dumb rule.  There are still going to be 55 - 0 and 63 - 0 scores.  The explanation I heard was they want kinds to still feel good about competing.  Uh huh.

Yes there will but they'll get there faster. If the coaches didn't want to have a running clock the second half of those games could still take 60-90 minutes. Now they'll take 30-45 minutes. It usually took a 45-0 halftime to have a running clock. Now if the game ends up 42-7 early in the 4th quarter the rest of the game will go quicker. This still gives the backups a chance at plays on a varsity field, but it will minimize the number of plays and thus injury exposure.

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Posted (edited)

Pop Warner has a 28 point mercy rule. Coaches would miss the conversions on purpose so they can keep playing another series. Often it would be achieved at the end of the 1st quarter and several times the patsy would concede at halftime.  The winning team cannot pass, run outside the box or advance a turnover either,

Edited by Tommy

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The real reason for this is so coaches don’t have to agree to essentially quit on their team.  Some coaches will refuse to allow it because they don’t want to give up on their guys. 

 

 

There are arguments that big schools dont want this because they have seniors who don’t see the field much so they want as much time as possible...but I’m a person who believes if your team is capable of getting to that big of a lead vs other big schools, you are also capable or rotating those guys in when the clock isn’t running. 

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Overall I understand why the rule is being put in place but two things bother me . . . 

1. No stopping a running clock if the score is brought back within 35 points. I'll call it right now that this will end many teams chances at having a chance to come back.

2. Only 35 points at Halftime. In my opinion that's not a big enough point differential. I understand that means a team will have to score 5 times without the other team scoring just to tie but I still think that's too quick.  

I hope the IHSAA revisits this in a year or two and makes some adjustments like they have with the Success Factor.

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28 minutes ago, CoachJackson said:

Overall I understand why the rule is being put in place but two things bother me . . . 

1. No stopping a running clock if the score is brought back within 35 points. I'll call it right now that this will end many teams chances at having a chance to come back.

2. Only 35 points at Halftime. In my opinion that's not a big enough point differential. I understand that means a team will have to score 5 times without the other team scoring just to tie but I still think that's too quick.  

I hope the IHSAA revisits this in a year or two and makes some adjustments like they have with the Success Factor.

I do not disagree with you, but here are a couple of things to think about:

1. This is just a starting point.  Every idea will have some tweeks along the way.

2. 35 point comebacks are rare.  So IMO a running clock depends on the situation. Playoffs v. Regular Season

3. Baseball, Softball and Soccer all have mercy rules, so this is a logical progression for a team sport.

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My perspective as a coach where numbers can be an issue is this is based on quarters more than lack of compete from one team or another. We have been in games where some of our JV guys get half a game in, leaving them with just two quarters for the JV game. If the clock is running, then it could, in some cases, save the quarters for those kids. I have coached JV many times over the years, and keeping track of quarters can become a pain; especially if a key player has to sit the 4th quarter. 

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This is long overdue, and totally consistent with the philosophy of “risk minimization “ that permeates the rules making process these days. Most of these games that I have seen are the result of physical mismatches, whether the result of a team having low numbers, lots of injuries, or a big school vs. small school matchup. This makes injuries more likely.  Take the decision out of the coaches’ hands, so he doesn’t have to justify the decision to throw in the towel to his players,  the fans or parents. 

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"Risk minimization" is a very key term.  It seems like injuries are even more common in blowouts.

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25 minutes ago, Coach_K said:

I do not disagree with you, but here are a couple of things to think about:

1. This is just a starting point.  Every idea will have some tweeks along the way.

2. 35 point comebacks are rare.  So IMO a running clock depends on the situation. Playoffs v. Regular Season

3. Baseball, Softball and Soccer all have mercy rules, so this is a logical progression for a team sport.

Totally agree it's a starting point. My issues aren't with the mercy rule in general just the way it's being implemented. 

I know 35 point comebacks are rare. My issue, which is a small one, is they are treating a 35 point deficit in the third quarter like it is equal to a 35 point deficit in the 4th quarter. I'd like to see the point differential higher for the 3rd quarter but that's more of a personal preference.

The part that I do not agree with at all is the continuation of the running clock whether or not the point deficit is still 35 points. If you come out at half time down 35-0 however small your chances to come back were your chances now are essentially over, especially if the other team gets the ball first. What incentive are we giving for teams to fight back if there is no chance the clock goes back to normal? Might as well do it like baseball and have a 35 point "run rule". I think this part of the rule is going to create second half scenarios that are absolute jokes. Your two possible scenarios are the losing team surrenders defeat and doesn't try or they make a comeback only to run out of time to do so. 

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2 minutes ago, CoachJackson said:

The part that I do not agree with at all is the continuation of the running clock whether or not the point deficit is still 35 points. If you come out at half time down 35-0 however small your chances to come back were your chances now are essentially over, especially if the other team gets the ball first. What incentive are we giving for teams to fight back if there is no chance the clock goes back to normal? 

Fair point. I guess I just think about the blowouts I have been a part of, in which the losing team did not stand a chance (and in some cases the head coach refused to have a running clock). However, your point is valid.  What incentive is there?  It is hard to get moody teenagers to play a clean game if they are getting their butts kicked.

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Not sure how you some of you think this is a dumb rule? It's a fantastic rule. The best part is the whole 6 quarter thing so teams can allow JV players to go in in the 3rd q. Great rule!!

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9 minutes ago, Coach_K said:

Fair point. I guess I just think about the blowouts I have been a part of, in which the losing team did not stand a chance (and in some cases the head coach refused to have a running clock). However, your point is valid.  What incentive is there?  It is hard to get moody teenagers to play a clean game if they are getting their butts kicked.

If you're down 35 at the half and have kids you can't control, you have more problems than just worrying about a mercy rule.

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2 minutes ago, JQWL said:

If you're down 35 at the half and have kids you can't control, you have more problems than just worrying about a mercy rule.

Never forget these are teenagers and teenagers do dumb things from time to time! haha

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Sure. I had a kid do something dumb last year and we were only down 18. Wish he had waited until we were down 35.

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22 minutes ago, JQWL said:

If you're down 35 at the half and have kids you can't control, you have more problems than just worrying about a mercy rule.

I see bewildering things every day.  

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I want to clarify something I said when I started this topic.  When I said I'd miss an extra point on purpose, I wasn't talking about being able to run up the score in the second half.  I was going with being able to play a full game (no running clock) so your backups and JV could get more snaps of playing time.  I've seen games when there was a running clock in the second half.  I've also seen coaches refuse to use a running clock even though they were down by 50+ and the other coach offered it to them.  I guess now it isn't a decision any more, it is a rule and will happen regardless.  So what does that coach that doesn't want to give up on his team say now?  How does he keep them motivated to play?  I have always admired the old Dugger teams.  Coach Gamble's teams ALWAYS played to the whistle and to the end of the game.  Even though they were down by 8 - 10 touchdowns, they'd never quit playing.  That is coaching your boys. 

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I believe the referees can still take control of the game and "influence" the clock.  Someone can correct me if I am wrong, but I believe that happened a few times for teams I was coaching.

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Where is the actual rule? , I find it hard to belive that normal timign doesn't resume if score gets under 35 although unlikely the comeback could occur.

Many states that have a mercy rule is like this one, but normal timing resumes at 34 point differential or less.  If it goes back over 35 points running clock resumes.

Great rule - can't believe I am saying that the IHSAA did something right.

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Since someone mentioned quarters playing a factor...at some point we have to get it changed where teams are not penalized for having their kids come in during a blowout. 

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, bucksfan said:

Many states that have a mercy rule is like this one, but normal timing resumes at 34 point differential or less.  If it goes back over 35 points running clock resumes.

 

It will not revert back. We were told at the state clinic this year that this was in the works, and pretty much a done deal at that point. The IHSAA has wanted this for some time now, and I'm glad something was able to be worked out. This is not a bad thing. I'm sure if you go back and look at all of the games that were 35+ at halftime in the past 20 years, the comeback percentage would probably be in the very low single digits. If at all.

Edited by CoachVeatch

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12 minutes ago, bucksfan said:

Where is the actual rule? , I find it hard to belive that normal timign doesn't resume if score gets under 35 although unlikely the comeback could occur.

Many states that have a mercy rule is like this one, but normal timing resumes at 34 point differential or less.  If it goes back over 35 points running clock resumes.

Great rule - can't believe I am saying that the IHSAA did something right.

http://www.ihsaa.org/Portals/0/ihsaa/documents/news media/2018-19/042919.BoardMeeting.pdf

"In its monthly gathering following the annual Board of Directors meeting this morning in Indianapolis, the IHSAA Executive Committee unanimously approved a new football mercy rule.  

The rule, which goes into effect this fall, was a joint effort with the Indiana Football Coaches Association to expedite the conclusion of football contests when a certain point differential is reached. With Monday’s vote, when the point differential reaches 35 points in the second half, the game clock will convert to a running clock with the exception of timeouts, scores, and/or injuries. Once implemented, the clock may not revert back to standard timing regardless of the score and coaches will not have the ability to override the implementation of the mercy rule. The 40 second play clock will remain in effect throughout the contest."

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6 minutes ago, DumfriesYMCA said:

Since someone mentioned quarters playing a factor...at some point we have to get it changed where teams are not penalized for having their kids come in during a blowout. 

Rule was changed to allow kids to play a total of 6 quarters as opposed to 5 in the past. Once halftime hits jv guys can sub in freely without penalty of missing time in the JV game. 

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