Jump to content

Season Format - Change It or Leave It?


Recommended Posts

Thought I’d chime in with a relatively new topic. I got bored yesterday so I decided to look up the schedules of high school football teams in other states and compare them to Indiana. I had to go back to 2019 because COVID has made things hectic the last couple years schedule-wise. 

I put together the table below to give an easy visual representation of the differences between Indiana and its border states, as well as four of the biggest football states in the country.

What are your thoughts? Is the format best here in Indiana or does one of the other states do it better? With the school year starting earlier these days than ever before, should the season start earlier? Should a tenth regular season game be added to the schedule? Should each team be required a bye week during the regular season? Let me know what you think.

D395453E-9C85-4A0F-96D1-A47068F2F53D.jpeg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Leave it.  If you start a week earlier, you are stealing a week of summer, that is already short.  If you go a week longer, you lose the state games on Thanksgiving weekend, and also would require pushing the basketball season back another week. It is just my opinion, I could be swayed.

  • Like 4
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Every school in the state is guaranteed 10 games (which is how it was prior to the all-in playoff). A team that gets to Lucas Oil plays 14 (6A/5A) or 15 (1A-4A) games. 

The format is just fine. We can't add onto the end of the season because it has to end Thanksgiving weekend to make the State Finals work without pulling kids out of class (as well as the Big Ten championship game is the following week so LOS is not available). Any addition would be at the front end and the season already starts pretty early. 

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Julio said:

I say go a week later like Michigan, Ohio, and Illinois and get rid of the scrimmage.  We already scrimmage in the summer.  Can still have State on Thanksgiving weekend.

Pretty sure starting a week later would cause the State Championship games to NOT fall on Thanksgiving weekend, unless my math is off. If we go a week later (and eliminate the scrimmage), that would be a first game of the season on 8/26 this year instead of 8/19.

8/26 - Week 1
9/2 - Week 2
9/9 - Week 3
9/16 - Week 4
9/23 - Week 5
9/30 - Week 6
10/7 - Week 7
10/14 - Week 8
10/21 - Week 9
10/28 - Sectional Quarterfinals
11/4 - Sectional Semifinals
11/11 - Sectional Championships
11/18 - Regional Championships
11/25 - Semi-State Championships (THANKSGIVING)
12/2 - State Championships
 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Julio said:

I say go a week later like Michigan, Ohio, and Illinois and get rid of the scrimmage.  We already scrimmage in the summer.  Can still have State on Thanksgiving weekend.

Yeah I always thought they should get rid of the public scrimmage and just play a game instead. Not sure if that throws off the summer schedule though. I never played so I couldn’t tell you if it’s feasible or not.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Leave it as is. I believe Ohio actually starts the same week now but ends 1 week after. I actually prefer that as a Stateliner & family on both sides. Especially if the local programs make it to Thanksgiving weekend & beyond on both sides. If that ever happens, I'd hope the IN schools play Friday, and the OH schools play Saturday night after The Game which Michigan kicks the Bucknuts butts!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Given the ability to play championship games in LOS on that Thanksgiving weekend, I would say leave it.  Yes, it only applies directly to 12 teams in the state, but I think it also provides, with the holiday, more opportunity for more fans to be able to take part in the games ... especially on that Friday.

Of interest on that grid provided, is that the Texas stats exist with over half the schools in the state never seeing the post season due to the playoff scheme and sheer number of teams in the state.  Is Indiana the only all-in tourney on that grid?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, foxbat said:

Given the ability to play championship games in LOS on that Thanksgiving weekend, I would say leave it.  Yes, it only applies directly to 12 teams in the state, but I think it also provides, with the holiday, more opportunity for more fans to be able to take part in the games ... especially on that Friday.

Of interest on that grid provided, is that the Texas stats exist with over half the schools in the state never seeing the post season due to the playoff scheme and sheer number of teams in the state.  Is Indiana the only all-in tourney on that grid?

Indiana and Missouri are the only states in the country that have an all-in format.

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 minutes ago, Gipper said:

I've said it before: if all of these others states jumped off of a bridge, would you, too?

I’m by no means advocating a change. I just think it’s a good thing to evaluate our system and compare it with others. Do we do it better? Can we make it better? When I look at how late football runs in some states (i.e. Texas), I’m stunned because I don’t see how that’s possible from a winter sports aspect. Maybe it somehow does work there. It wouldn’t work here though.

Personally, I like Indiana how it is. If I had to make a change, the only thing I’d change is getting rid of the scrimmage week and making it a tenth regular season game. However, that’s just my perspective as an outsider. I wasn’t able to play high school football so I don’t know if it’s even feasible.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Frozen Tundra said:

I’m by no means advocating a change. I just think it’s a good thing to evaluate our system and compare it with others. Do we do it better? Can we make it better? When I look at how late football runs in some states (i.e. Texas), I’m stunned because I don’t see how that’s possible from a winter sports aspect. Maybe it somehow does work there. It wouldn’t work here though.

Personally, I like Indiana how it is. If I had to make a change, the only thing I’d change is getting rid of the scrimmage week and making it a tenth regular season game. However, that’s just my perspective as an outsider. I wasn’t able to play high school football so I don’t know if it’s even feasible.

I understand, and it was a bit of a joke.  But on paper  it does look like a good thing, but with the finals being on 12/2, I see many basketball coaches not being all that enthused.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Get rid of the all-in.
 

Add a tenth regular season game, create a formula that effectively cuts the field in half after the 10th regular season game, send 16 teams north and 16 south and seed them accordingly in a single elimination bracket that allows for a championship game to still be played at LOS Stadium Thanksgiving Weekend. 

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Frozen Tundra said:

I’m by no means advocating a change. I just think it’s a good thing to evaluate our system and compare it with others. Do we do it better? Can we make it better? When I look at how late football runs in some states (i.e. Texas), I’m stunned because I don’t see how that’s possible from a winter sports aspect. Maybe it somehow does work there. It wouldn’t work here though.

Personally, I like Indiana how it is. If I had to make a change, the only thing I’d change is getting rid of the scrimmage week and making it a tenth regular season game. However, that’s just my perspective as an outsider. I wasn’t able to play high school football so I don’t know if it’s even feasible.

The winter sports scene here isn't nearly what it is up there.  From what I have seen there is a round ball contingent in the larger metro areas, and even in some of the big schools where I live (Waco area), but their popularity overall does not hold a candle to football and baseball, the #1 & #2 boys HS sports in TX.  At my kids school, basketball was viewed by most as a tool for maintaining conditioning between football & baseball/track, which IIRC start practicing in Feb.  Heck, there's not a school in this area that even offers wrestling!  Also, if I'm not mistaken there is an overlap in seasons.  My youngest graduated in 2018 so I'm starting to forget some of these details.

My perspective comes from small/medium sized school experiences.  @foxbat might be able to provide a better read on the large school winter sports scene, having lived in the Houston area IIRC.

Edited by Bonecrusher
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd like to see them replace the official scrimmage with a 10th regular season game. With what you are allowed during the summer, the scrimmage isn't all that valuable.

Keep the all-in format. Just seed the tournament somehow. Not sure why people have an issue with the all-in format necessarily. Every other sport in the state has it, so why wouldn't football?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, Bonecrusher said:

The winter sports scene here isn't nearly what it is up there.  From what I have seen there is a round ball contingent in the larger metro areas, and even in some of the big schools where I live (Waco area), but their popularity overall does not hold a candle to football and baseball, the #1 & #2 boys HS sports in TX.  At my kids school, basketball was viewed by most as a tool for maintaining conditioning between football & baseball/track, which IIRC start practicing in Feb.  Heck, there's not a school in this area that even offers wrestling!  Also, if I'm not mistaken there is an overlap in seasons.  My youngest graduated in 2018 so I'm starting to forget some of these details.

My perspective comes from small/medium sized school experiences.  @foxbat might be able to provide a better read on the large school winter sports scene, having lived in the Houston area IIRC.

Your perspective is similar to mine from the bigger schools and bigger cities in Texas.  There are some schools where basketball gets much more of a look, but I'd agree that football/baseball drive much of the energy with football easily being #1 ... and it's not even a close second.  It's been a while since I was in the Texas environment where I had any skin in the mix, but it's funny that what you said about basketball, being used to maintain conditioning ... and sometimes just something to do ... between football and baseball seasons is exactly the way many of my football teammates and I remember viewing it when I played many, many, many years ago.  Matter of fact, I recall some of the guys that played football and basketball in junior high viewed basketball as a way to get out of the winter lifting regiments for football.  :classic_smile:  Granted, there were definitely kids that were basketball-only kids, but plenty of the 2-sporters/3-sporters saw basketball as the creme filling in the cookie.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, JQWL said:

I'd like to see them replace the official scrimmage with a 10th regular season game. With what you are allowed during the summer, the scrimmage isn't all that valuable.

Keep the all-in format. Just seed the tournament somehow. Not sure why people have an issue with the all-in format necessarily. Every other sport in the state has it, so why wouldn't football?

My only question is whether or not the official start of practice would need to be moved a week earlier since the first game would be a week sooner. If so, is that feasible? Would summer camps also need to start a week sooner?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Bonecrusher @foxbat

I really appreciate your perspectives. It’s quite eye-opening to read your posts. As a lifelong Hoosier and one that prefers basketball over other sports, it’s surprising to me that basketball is seen there as a tertiary sport. I know I’m just a product of my environment but I was always under the impression that football and basketball were looked at as the two biggest sports across this country. With as many pro baseball players as Texas churns out, I guess it does make sense that baseball is held in higher regard there than basketball.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Frozen Tundra said:

My only question is whether or not the official start of practice would need to be moved a week earlier since the first game would be a week sooner. If so, is that feasible? Would summer camps also need to start a week sooner?

I don't think we need to change anything. If we are prepared to play an official scrimmage, we should be prepared to play a game. From a coaching standpoint, we had everything installed prior to Friday. The only thing lacking was the game planning for our opponent.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

58 minutes ago, Frozen Tundra said:

@Bonecrusher @foxbat

I really appreciate your perspectives. It’s quite eye-opening to read your posts. As a lifelong Hoosier and one that prefers basketball over other sports, it’s surprising to me that basketball is seen there as a tertiary sport. I know I’m just a product of my environment but I was always under the impression that football and basketball were looked at as the two biggest sports across this country. With as many pro baseball players as Texas churns out, I guess it does make sense that baseball is held in higher regard there than basketball.

It was surprising to me,  as well, when we moved from IN to TX 16 years ago. Couldn't comprehend the low regard for basketball at first, but it is what it is.

I would imagine it's the same in most of the deep south, with maybe Florida being an exception, regarding round ball. Seems like they appreciate it a little more over there (FL).

Edited by Bonecrusher
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 8/16/2022 at 1:51 PM, JQWL said:

I'd like to see them replace the official scrimmage with a 10th regular season game. With what you are allowed during the summer, the scrimmage isn't all that valuable.

Keep the all-in format. Just seed the tournament somehow. Not sure why people have an issue with the all-in format necessarily. Every other sport in the state has it, so why wouldn't football?

The thing with the scrimmage is it falls on the 11th day of practice. Players need a minimum of 10 days of practice to play, so if you have *any* injuries that cause a kid to miss, he's missing the first game (you can compete in the scrimmage with 5 practices, and IIRC, the scrimmage *does* count as a practice day) ... I know the summer is largely open now, but two "install weeks" before having to gameplan makes a lot of sense. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 8/16/2022 at 3:00 PM, Bonecrusher said:

It was surprising to me,  as well, when we moved from IN to TX 16 years ago. Couldn't comprehend the low regard for basketball at first, but it is what it is.

I would imagine it's the same in most of the deep south, with maybe Florida being an exception, regarding round ball. Seems like they appreciate it a little more over there (FL).

When I coached girls hoops, we took our team to Anderson University for a one-day shootout, and one of the teams we played was from Florida (coached by a former New Castle coach who was bringing his team north for some competition). They were a school of 3,000 students and had gone something like 16-5 the year before, but were at about the level of an average 2A/small 3A team here. Their coach told us the coaching is about a decade behind where we are in Florida and basketball just isn't a big deal (soccer is a winter sport there and they lose a lot of girls to that sport). 

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, crimsonace1 said:

When I coached girls hoops, we took our team to Anderson University for a one-day shootout, and one of the teams we played was from Florida (coached by a former New Castle coach who was bringing his team north for some competition). They were a school of 3,000 students and had gone something like 16-5 the year before, but were at about the level of an average 2A/small 3A team here. Their coach told us the coaching is about a decade behind where we are in Florida and basketball just isn't a big deal (soccer is a winter sport there and they lose a lot of girls to that sport). 

Florida behind Indiana in football? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 minutes ago, hhpatriot04 said:

Florida behind Indiana in football? 

In girls basketball. They lose a lot of players to soccer in winter.

1 hour ago, crimsonace1 said:

When I coached girls hoops, we took our team to Anderson University for a one-day shootout, and one of the teams we played was from Florida (coached by a former New Castle coach who was bringing his team north for some competition). They were a school of 3,000 students and had gone something like 16-5 the year before, but were at about the level of an average 2A/small 3A team here. Their coach told us the coaching is about a decade behind where we are in Florida and basketball just isn't a big deal (soccer is a winter sport there and they lose a lot of girls to that sport). 

I stand corrected re. FL round ball. Def looks like a regional thing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...