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Coach Nowlin

6th Quarter APPROVED: Mercy Rule or No Mercy Rule

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I reached out to IFCA to get clarification 

100% IHSAA approved the quarter rule to 6 quarters per week, with or without having the Mercy Rule invoked in a game 

HUGE for small schools still running 3 teams like Rensselaer 

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With the 6 quarter rule (which I like) why the need for a mercy rule? The argument was always that scores got out of hand because coaches could not use their JV/Freshmen players on Friday nights in the third quarter so that they had enough quarters left for the JV/Freshmen games on Saturday and/or Monday - the 6 quarter rule takes care of this if coaches run up the score on teams on a Friday night that is on the head coach and a lack of ethics. I do not like the mercy rule and never will and I have been on both sides of the scoreboard. Just my thoughts 

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I believe this was a quid pro quo move by the IFCA and IHSAA (I could be wrong, just my optics on the situation). State wanted mercy rule, coaches wanted six quarters. Came to an agreement. Quality work by both sides. 

6 quarters will indeed be huge in development of better football players, i.e. more in game reps, etc. Sometimes teams have a few tweeners that could help on Friday nights, but still need work in J.V. This alleviates having to choose or worry about it. 

Better football is the result, if done correctly. 

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I coach in Michigan now and I really miss the Indiana JV model.   Here, our JV's play after the Freshman on Thursday night.  The same opponent we are going to play on Friday.  Not only does it lock JV football into being for 10th graders who play zero varsity, but it also takes away the emphasis of skill development and getting kids on the field at the JV level.  Usually both varsity staffs are in attendance trying to see how the other team might align in the Friday game.   Also has really made it tough for smaller schools to field 3 levels.  Even if you can have 25 kids out for football as Sophomores,   you can see where if the Varsity "takes" 4 of them, and a few get hurt through the course of the year, your quickly left with 15-19 kids to try to play a JV football game.  Kids are forced to play out of position.   Meanwhile a percentage of juniors spends a lot of that year not playing much at all accept during mop-up time.   Its just soooooo stupid.  

Great Job on this Indiana!!!1

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17 minutes ago, Wedgebuster said:

I coach in Michigan now and I really miss the Indiana JV model.   Here, our JV's play after the Freshman on Thursday night.  The same opponent we are going to play on Friday.  Not only does it lock JV football into being for 10th graders who play zero varsity, but it also takes away the emphasis of skill development and getting kids on the field at the JV level.  Usually both varsity staffs are in attendance trying to see how the other team might align in the Friday game.   Also has really made it tough for smaller schools to field 3 levels.  Even if you can have 25 kids out for football as Sophomores,   you can see where if the Varsity "takes" 4 of them, and a few get hurt through the course of the year, your quickly left with 15-19 kids to try to play a JV football game.  Kids are forced to play out of position.   Meanwhile a percentage of juniors spends a lot of that year not playing much at all accept during mop-up time.   Its just soooooo stupid.  

Great Job on this Indiana!!!1

Are you required to play JV games on Thursdays?  Some schools in here play JV Saturday and some on Monday so I'm just curious.

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RUnning clock also moved to 35 points ahead in second half,  no coaches conferment , just goes right to running clock???

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The way I read the six quarter rule as it was stated in the proposal was that it was for varsity/JV not JV/Frosh.  The rule states you can play up to six quarters a week, but no more than two of which can be varsity, and a total of four for Frosh/JV.  Not sure how much that will be adhered to, but, at least the way I read it, it is not just six quarters total.  This is from the IHSAA agenda:

image.png.ccd611b0ed553d236fed472489890353.png

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Almost all of our Frosh/JV games are on Saturday mornings.  Opposite locations.  

We love it....easier for most parents to make.  Less long evenings for kids during week.  Our entire program (coaches and players) is at practice MTWR.  Even easier if you agree to just wear Varsity jerseys again Saturday morning (unless you had a mud bath Friday night).

Different strokes for different folks, but we are very happy with it.

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1 hour ago, WCGrad92 said:

RUnning clock also moved to 35 points ahead in second half,  no coaches conferment , just goes right to running clock???

Correct:  It is a mandate not a suggestion 

45 minutes ago, tkoontz said:

The way I read the six quarter rule as it was stated in the proposal was that it was for varsity/JV not JV/Frosh.  The rule states you can play up to six quarters a week, but no more than two of which can be varsity, and a total of four for Frosh/JV.  Not sure how much that will be adhered to, but, at least the way I read it, it is not just six quarters total.  This is from the IHSAA agenda:

image.png.ccd611b0ed553d236fed472489890353.png

JV/Frosh treated the same way :  Sub Varsity Quarters

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My question on the rule is this.  Can a freshman play 2 quarters on a Monday night JV game then 4 quarters of their freshmen game? 

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Good Question:   Used to be 4 freshman quarters and 1 JV quarter:    or any combo of 5 quarters.    

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This will also help out cutting down on those blowout scores.  In the past with the 5 quarters, in some games Linton would have to wait until the fourth quarter to play a lot of their JV.  Now with 6 quarters, they can play the entire second half and still play 4 quarters in a JV game.   That's going to be a big deal for some of the smaller schools or teams with a limited roster.

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7 hours ago, NPFB said:

My question on the rule is this.  Can a freshman play 2 quarters on a Monday night JV game then 4 quarters of their freshmen game? 

The way I read the rule, "no player can participate in more than four sub-varsity quarters per week" seems pretty clear that a player CANNOT play 2 frosh quarters and four JV quarters.  This limits teams MORE than the old rule if the numbers are low at the frosh/JV level.  We have had times where we will bring up a few freshman for some JV depth when our numbers were down at the JV level. We would let the freshman play a quarter or two on JV and then play their other three on the freshman team.  Sounds like teams will no longer be able to do this.  The six quarters helps the varsity teams in blowouts, but the way I read it, the new rule hurts teams with low participation numbers at the lower levels. 

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This is from the current IHSAA bylaws. 

image.png.a6dddc2d507001e1e5781a7ff2cf7b92.png

In the past it was NOT any combination of 5 quarters (although I think that is how most teams implemented it).  If a player played in three varsity quarters they were limited to one JV quarter (four quarters for the week total not 5).  If they only played in two varsity quarters they could play in three more JV or Frosh.  

I believe this idea is still true in the new six quarter rule.  Once a player plays in three varsity quarters they only can play in one more quarter (JV or Frosh) for the week.  If they play in only two varsity quarters they can play four more sub-varsity quarters (JV or Frosh). 

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I have questions about the math as well. I too assume that 4 quarters on a Friday night would eliminate any time at the lower levels. I have not seen anything, but I am assuming that special teams plays do not count toward the quarter numbers. 

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My question is... what is the penalty if a school plays a kid more than 6 quarters in a week?  Forfeit the Varsity game that week?  What if they lost it?  Then what? 

I've seen this a bunch over the past 6 years with the old 5 quarter rule, and I'm not aware there was ever any penalty.  Especially since the team that was doing it was the team that lost Friday night. 

Thoughts? 

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47 minutes ago, Coach-Ref_Kiser said:

My question is... what is the penalty if a school plays a kid more than 6 quarters in a week?  Forfeit the Varsity game that week?  What if they lost it?  Then what? 

I've seen this a bunch over the past 6 years with the old 5 quarter rule, and I'm not aware there was ever any penalty.  Especially since the team that was doing it was the team that lost Friday night. 

Thoughts? 

I'm not sure the actual rule, but yes, you are correct. The commonplace has been, if you won in varsity and violated the rule in JV, then you forfeit the varsity game. It is also true (in my experience) that a lot of teams when they lose in varsity, they just go ahead and play kids that played multiple varsity quarters. I'm guessing the reasoning for doing something like this varies widely (although most the time I believe it's seen as a busch league move). Maybe they have been violating some not well known rule and skirting the punishment. 

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14 hours ago, itiswhatitis said:

This will also help out cutting down on those blowout scores.  In the past with the 5 quarters, in some games Linton would have to wait until the fourth quarter to play a lot of their JV.  Now with 6 quarters, they can play the entire second half and still play 4 quarters in a JV game.   That's going to be a big deal for some of the smaller schools or teams with a limited roster.

Definitely what I was thinking too.... So many times in the past, and a handful last year.. I'd hear the opposing fans get bent when the starters would still be out in the middle of the 3rd ...even though there would be subs at positions, as well as players in different positions... we would always wait til that 3rd quarter ended to bring in the JV.  So I think now we will see more of the JV gets get time with the varsity on the field in those situations.  I know the coaches want to get the varsity work in game situations...especially early in the season... and honestly.. we've not been in those blowout situations in the first 5 weeks these last 2 years....   I like the change to 6 a lot.  But I also think that once the young kids get on the field..if we are up by 35 and it's a running clock... they'll only get a couple possessions to do anything LOL.. that clock moves fast!   I still think that if the opponent keeps his starters out there and we throw in the young kids... they should do the same..   but some don't. 

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violation occured during the sub varsity game, how could that cost the forfeiture of the Varsity contest ?   That makes NO sense.   the game where the player played more than the allotted number of quarters would be the game that if called out on by the other team or self reported would be the game that would be deemed a forfeit for the infraction made by the team.  

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11 minutes ago, Coach Nowlin said:

violation occured during the sub varsity game, how could that cost the forfeiture of the Varsity contest ?   That makes NO sense.   the game where the player played more than the allotted number of quarters would be the game that if called out on by the other team or self reported would be the game that would be deemed a forfeit for the infraction made by the team.  

Coach-

Can you refresh my memory, when does the "week" start?

Is it Monday-Sunday?

Or something like, Friday-Thursday?

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55 minutes ago, DannEllenwood said:

Coach-

Can you refresh my memory, when does the "week" start?

Is it Monday-Sunday?

Or something like, Friday-Thursday?

Friday through Thursday

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3 hours ago, Coach Nowlin said:

violation occured during the sub varsity game, how could that cost the forfeiture of the Varsity contest ?   That makes NO sense.   the game where the player played more than the allotted number of quarters would be the game that if called out on by the other team or self reported would be the game that would be deemed a forfeit for the infraction made by the team.  

Illegal participation for the week? Idk, just something I've heard coaches at school talk about. Maybe it's totally wrong, probably just fake news. 

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