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Temp’s Top 25 (8/20/22)


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3 minutes ago, MonkeyButt said:

I think there are several that could. CG isn't as good as they were last year, and WC has to prove they can produce offensively which has been a challenge for the program since 2018. Ben Davis went against a really good Brownsburg team. Carmel I think is comparative to any of them losing to a really good Trinity team. CG struggled to get in the end zone until the 2nd half, which has been WCs MO for the last several years; very little offensive production so the defense is on the field too long and too much so wearing them down is inevitable.

And we are talking about power rankings, not class rankings, so Merrillville could go above them, New Pall, Decatur Central, I'd even say LC and LN until WC can beat one of them, which they have struggled with both teams in the past two years. So yeah I'd say that there are several teams deserving of being above WC. Do I think they still have the potential to make a run? Yes, but they have to get the offense going and give the defense a rest. 

Agree with many of your points but CG is still #1 in both polls (media and coaches) if I am not mistaken.  A team that goes on the road and loses to that team by single digits can’t be that far behind then in any type of objective ranking system.

2-3 plays turn out differently and Warren wins that game.

Save for Carmel and BD, I think Warren would still be clear favorites over every other 6A team you mentioned and all of the 5A schools you listed.

I think it’s Cathedral and then everyone else honestly.  Could eventually see 4-5 schools vying for that #2 ranking by season’s end…though CG will also get better each week.

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On 8/23/2022 at 4:08 PM, Bobref said:

 

That game remains one of the most vivid memories of my career, and the best overall performance I ever saw by a high school team.

This goes back to what Elder Coach Ramsey stated about Warren Central coming to town and overpowering his defending state champs and calling Chris Graham "unblockable." Then Elder roared on to another state title, smashing St. Edward's in Canton. 

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1 hour ago, ragdoll said:

calling Chris Graham "unblockable."

One of my most enduring memories of that 2003 championship game is Warren kicking off (they did it a lot), and Brick Graham running down as the “wedge buster.” When he hit that wedge, it sounded like a bomb going off.

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20 hours ago, temptation said:

Agree with many of your points but CG is still #1 in both polls (media and coaches) if I am not mistaken.  A team that goes on the road and loses to that team by single digits can’t be that far behind then in any type of objective ranking system.

2-3 plays turn out differently and Warren wins that game.

Save for Carmel and BD, I think Warren would still be clear favorites over every other 6A team you mentioned and all of the 5A schools you listed.

I think it’s Cathedral and then everyone else honestly.  Could eventually see 4-5 schools vying for that #2 ranking by season’s end…though CG will also get better each week.

Was Ben Davis healthy at the scrimmage? I thought a young Westfield looked better than Carmel and Ben Davis. None of the teams had that great 6A Indy size across the board. Run games kept in check and Cover 1 and 0 allowed all the DBs to show they were solid not getting beat by straight go routes. 

Chatard is the best team I've seen in person this far. Small sample and early but let's see. 

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20 hours ago, temptation said:

Agree with many of your points but CG is still #1 in both polls (media and coaches) if I am not mistaken.  A team that goes on the road and loses to that team by single digits can’t be that far behind then in any type of objective ranking system.

2-3 plays turn out differently and Warren wins that game.

Save for Carmel and BD, I think Warren would still be clear favorites over every other 6A team you mentioned and all of the 5A schools you listed.

I think it’s Cathedral and then everyone else honestly.  Could eventually see 4-5 schools vying for that #2 ranking by season’s end…though CG will also get better each week.

I think Cathedral loses to Brownsburg tomorrow night. I don't think it will be a blowout, but I don't see anyone going undefeated this year and as the year progresses we will see some upsets out of the likes of like LN and LC too. They get better as the year progresses. So I see a tight MIC conference going against a tight Hoosier Crossroads Conference with Cathedral fitting right in the middle. I think it is all up in the air to be honest. Cathedral wasn't really tested against La Jeff. My son played their 2023 class as a freshman and we were up 41 points in the first half. So I wouldn't really say they were a show of Cathedral's ability. However, tomorrow night I think we will see them actually tested. I hope for a good game. Regardless the next state champ is coming out of Indy. Sorry southern and northern teams. No state title for y'all again this year. Maybe in... well honestly I don't see it any time soon.

 

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57 minutes ago, hhpatriot04 said:

Was Ben Davis healthy at the scrimmage? I thought a young Westfield looked better than Carmel and Ben Davis. None of the teams had that great 6A Indy size across the board. Run games kept in check and Cover 1 and 0 allowed all the DBs to show they were solid not getting beat by straight go routes. 

Chatard is the best team I've seen in person this far. Small sample and early but let's see. 

Not sure.  Likely they were not based on being unhealthy in week 1.  We will see.  But if Westfield is better than Carmel and BD, just hand the 4A title to New Pal now.

20 minutes ago, MonkeyButt said:

I think Cathedral loses to Brownsburg tomorrow night. I don't think it will be a blowout, but I don't see anyone going undefeated this year and as the year progresses we will see some upsets out of the likes of like LN and LC too. They get better as the year progresses. So I see a tight MIC conference going against a tight Hoosier Crossroads Conference with Cathedral fitting right in the middle. I think it is all up in the air to be honest. Cathedral wasn't really tested against La Jeff. My son played their 2023 class as a freshman and we were up 41 points in the first half. So I wouldn't really say they were a show of Cathedral's ability. However, tomorrow night I think we will see them actually tested. I hope for a good game. Regardless the next state champ is coming out of Indy. Sorry southern and northern teams. No state title for y'all again this year. Maybe in... well honestly I don't see it any time soon.

 

Damn.  Bold.  The second poster I have seen with this take.

I just can't believe in Brownsburg yet.  They strike me as a one step forward/two steps back program.  Their blowout loss to BD after beating Carmel last year in the tournament broke me.

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On 8/20/2022 at 8:16 AM, temptation said:

Gonna try to make this a weekly deal.  Not sure if I’ve overlooked a GID poll but if so, I apologize.  Critique away!

  1. Cathedral
  2. Center Grove
  3. Brownsburg
  4. Warren Central
  5. Carmel
  6. Ben Davis
  7. New Palestine
  8. Hamilton Southeastern
  9. Westfield
  10. Fishers
  11. Decatur Central
  12. Merrillville 
  13. Mooresville
  14. Lawrence North
  15. Roncalli
  16. Lawrence Central
  17. Bishop Chatard
  18. Penn
  19. Fort Wayne Snider
  20. East Central
  21. Andrean
  22. Zionsville
  23. Fort Wayne Dwenger
  24. Franklin Central
  25. Carroll (Fort Wayne)

Andrean is too low even with out the QB we are top 15 in state. 
 

merrillville should be top 7

penn is to low! 
fw snider to low

and DC is too high. Should be around 20

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42 minutes ago, Andrean4life said:

Andrean is too low even with out the QB we are top 15 in state. 
 

merrillville should be top 7

penn is to low! 
fw snider to low

and DC is too high. Should be around 20

Yeah, you don't like seeing DC above Merrillville. Andrean took a huge loss by losing their starting QB to a year ending injury against Merrillville. They could be in for another thumping this week against Crown Point. I would expect Andrean to possibly bounce back and maybe be Top 25 by the time the Playoffs start, but they're not there right now with a backup QB and O-Line issues.

 

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4 hours ago, MonkeyButt said:

I think Cathedral loses to Brownsburg tomorrow night. I don't think it will be a blowout, but I don't see anyone going undefeated this year and as the year progresses we will see some upsets out of the likes of like LN and LC too. They get better as the year progresses. So I see a tight MIC conference going against a tight Hoosier Crossroads Conference with Cathedral fitting right in the middle. I think it is all up in the air to be honest. Cathedral wasn't really tested against La Jeff. My son played their 2023 class as a freshman and we were up 41 points in the first half. So I wouldn't really say they were a show of Cathedral's ability. However, tomorrow night I think we will see them actually tested. I hope for a good game. Regardless the next state champ is coming out of Indy. Sorry southern and northern teams. No state title for y'all again this year. Maybe in... well honestly I don't see it any time soon.

 

I think Cathedral could lose tomorrow, but I wouldn’t bet on it until the tournament, in the event it happens. Cathedral’s skill position players are far superior to anyone else in the state. Obviously I’m biased, but you can make a legitimate argument that O’Neil, Tibbs, Wooten at QB/WR/TE are the best at their positions over anyone in the state. CHS breaking in an entire new OL is obviously a concern early, but they have too many weapons at every other position on that side of the ball.

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52 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

I think Cathedral could lose tomorrow, but I wouldn’t bet on it until the tournament, in the event it happens. Cathedral’s skill position players are far superior to anyone else in the state. Obviously I’m biased, but you can make a legitimate argument that O’Neil, Tibbs, Wooten at QB/WR/TE are the best at their positions over anyone in the state. CHS breaking in an entire new OL is obviously a concern early, but they have too many weapons at every other position on that side of the ball.

I absolutely agree that those three are some of the best in the state at their positions, but they haven't been tested yet. Brownsburg's defense is pretty stout with some of the best at their positions there as well. I think the real question will be how Cathedral's defense does against the Brownsburg offense. Brownsburg did not score the entire second half against Ben Davis, but again that is Ben Davis for you. They don't quit and Coach Simmon's is great at making half time adjustments.

I think the two are pretty well balanced. I think BHS edges CHS, but I see these two as making statements in the playoffs later on. It is one of my favorite games this week.

 

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1 minute ago, Footballking16 said:

How many other teams in the state have a D1 QB, WR, and TE on their roster? Tibbs (Purdue) and O’Neil (several high major offers) are both P5 players and Wooten has recently committed to Western Michigan.

Cathedral probably has the best skill guys in the state, you lost me at "far superior."

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10 minutes ago, BTF said:

Cathedral probably has the best skill guys in the state, you lost me at "far superior."

It’s an opinion obviously. But I’d be hard pressed to know another team in the state that has anywhere close to the collection of wealth and talent in the skill position department as Cathedral? You have anything to offer?

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Just now, Footballking16 said:

It’s an opinion obviously. But I’d be hard pressed to know another team in the state that has the collection of wealth and talent in the skill position department as Cathedral? You have anything to offer?

Cathedral is probably a good place to start. But I haven't researched all 317 teams to say that they are "far" superior. 

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8 minutes ago, BTF said:

Cathedral is probably a good place to start. But I haven't researched all 317 teams to say that they are "far" superior. 

You don’t need a full set of fingers on one hand to count the number of teams in the state that have two D1 commits at the skill positions, let alone 3. It’s not a knock on anyone else, you’re just not going to find another team this year with that many weapons at multiple positions.

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6 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

You don’t need a full set of fingers on one hand to count the number of teams in the state that have two D1 commits at the skill positions, let alone 3. It’s not a knock on anyone else, you’re just not going to find another team this year with that many weapons at multiple positions.

Got it. Good luck to your Irish this year, they appear to have a special team. 

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42 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

How many other teams in the state have a D1 QB, WR, and TE on their roster? Tibbs (Purdue) and O’Neil (several high major offers) are both P5 players and Wooten has recently committed to Western Michigan.

Those three are impressive. I know others that are just as good with D1 offers, but I'd be more impress if they had OL with D1 offers. Skill players are nothing without their OL. I know Danny and I know he'd say the same thing. So a team can have all the skill players they want, but without a line that can keep the defensive pressure to a minimum skill players won't be able to get the ball to do anything. Heck there are three D1 players on New Pals team, and I say they are some of the best in the state too, but two of those players are OL. 

I'd also argue that just because a kid has a D1 school or multiple ones following them, means the TEAM is going to be far superior. There are 22 guys on the field that have to do their jobs every play. There are some D1 players on Brownsburg too, and on defense. I just won't hang Cathedrals success on those three. I am happy for them and they are good, but far superior? That may be a stretch. 

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2 minutes ago, MonkeyButt said:

Those three are impressive. I know others that are just as good with D1 offers, but I'd be more impress if they had OL with D1 offers. Skill players are nothing without their OL. I know Danny and I know he'd say the same thing. So a team can have all the skill players they want, but without a line that can keep the defensive pressure to a minimum skill players won't be able to get the ball to do anything. Heck there are three D1 players on New Pals team, and I say they are some of the best in the state too, but two of those players are OL. 

I'd also argue that just because a kid has a D1 school or multiple ones following them, means the TEAM is going to be far superior. There are 22 guys on the field that have to do their jobs every play. There are some D1 players on Brownsburg too, and on defense. I just won't hang Cathedrals success on those three. I am happy for them and they are good, but far superior? That may be a stretch. 

Cathedral’s offensive line is inexperienced to date, as would be the case anytime you have to replace 5 senior starters from the year prior, but they certainly aren’t without talent. I’ll assure you that. 

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1 minute ago, Footballking16 said:

Cathedral’s offensive line is inexperienced to date, as would be the case anytime you have to replace 5 senior starters from the year prior, but they certainly aren’t without talent. I’ll assure you that. 

Look I am not saying they are not talented. Cathedral typically reloads, not rebuilds. But the OL is the reason for skill players success 90% of the time. And that is usually what makes the difference in big games. La Jeff is no where near the caliber of teams that Cathedral will face in some of their games this year and definitely not in the playoffs. But I know Cathedral is well coached and will be prepared for anyone. 

How many are on Varsity roster btw? 

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1 minute ago, MonkeyButt said:

Look I am not saying they are not talented. Cathedral typically reloads, not rebuilds. But the OL is the reason for skill players success 90% of the time. And that is usually what makes the difference in big games. La Jeff is no where near the caliber of teams that Cathedral will face in some of their games this year and definitely not in the playoffs. But I know Cathedral is well coached and will be prepared for anyone. 

How many are on Varsity roster btw? 

Cathedral was up 3 scores before Lafayette Jeff could blink last week. No doubt Brownsburg is a major step up in competition, but it’s not like Cathedral doesn’t present a major challenge for Brownsburg in their own right. Brownsburg was pretty fortunate to squeak out a win against a short handed Ben Davis team who hasn’t exactly set the world on fire these last couple years and even with an inexperienced offensive line, Cathedral is still likely a decided favorite.

I’ve given my score prediction on the CHS-Brownsburg game thread (21-13) and while I do think it’ll be a close game throughout, it wouldn’t surprise me in the least to see Cathedral win by a couple scores. 

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23 minutes ago, MonkeyButt said:

Skill players are nothing without their OL.

Heck there are three D1 players on New Pals team, and I say they are some of the best in the state too, but two of those players are OL. 

I am happy for them and they are good, but far superior? That may be a stretch.

Sad that an offensive lineman will never win the Heisman. 

Two D1 linemen from a school of 1400 students? That's impressive. 

I think FBKing might be willing to admit that he overstated the "far superior" bit. 

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3 minutes ago, BTF said:

I think FBKing might be willing to admit that he overstated the "far superior" bit.

I’ve asked you now three times to offer up a team that has anywhere near the collection of wealth and talent in the skill position department? You’ve yet to offer anything.

Either put up or shut up. Again, I said it’s an opinion. But I stand by it.

 

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2 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

Either put up or shut up. Again, I said it’s an opinion. But I stand by it.

What if there were a team that sported a D1 WR, a D3 WR, a D3 RB, and a D3 QB? Would you say that three D1's are far superior to that scenario? I mean, "far" superior is quite a statement. 

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1 hour ago, Footballking16 said:

It’s an opinion obviously. But I’d be hard pressed to know another team in the state that has anywhere close to the collection of wealth and talent in the skill position department as Cathedral? You have anything to offer?

Merrillville is loaded. 

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