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Indiana Low Teacher Wages forces Coach to Resign

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My issues with the licensing changes are:

1. It was dirty politics, plain and simple, that got this passed. Most legislators had no idea this was inserted into the bill. It was buried fairly deep (page 17 of a 40 page bill). 

2. There is no practical application to be gained from the change for a large majority of teachers. And for those that would benefit from....it is highly likely they have been doing these kinds of things for PD any way. 

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49 minutes ago, Irishman said:

My issues with the licensing changes are:

1. It was dirty politics, plain and simple, that got this passed. Most legislators had no idea this was inserted into the bill. It was buried fairly deep (page 17 of a 40 page bill). 

2. There is no practical application to be gained from the change for a large majority of teachers. And for those that would benefit from....it is highly likely they have been doing these kinds of things for PD any way. 

Agree on both counts

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As long as one party controls the state of Indiana things will continue to go the way they are going:  Get In Line!!!  Indiana does not have a checks-and-balance system, as the same with some other states.  This is not a slap at Republicans or Democrats but how things seam to work.  When one party controls everything for several years this is what happens.  Just my opinion.

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2 hours ago, US31 said:

To me, this means your local school district AND the DOE should be working together to provide you with multiple hours of PD training each year that fit this role...in other words, part of your faculty training across the district should accomplish this without need for you to do it on your own.  If 3-5 of your PD hours each year were directed towards these topics, anyone on the PGP renewal plan would easily fulfill this requirement.

I'm not necessarily a fan of this plan, but I don't think its a "sky is falling" type of problem if your local district gears your PD towards meeting this need.  The result is that more and more of your professional meeting time is going to be eaten away by these types of requirements (these community partner hours, ALICE training, suicide prevention, etc) and less of your meeting time will be available to you to actual work on curriculum, planning, etc.

my 2cents....likely worth as much or less :classic_biggrin:

But... it was on Facebook!  Correct me if I'm wrong.  But the Total (90) hours for renewal did not change, just the content coverage of some of them?   

The bill doesn't require an externship, which has seemed to get all the publicity.  It was stated as an option, along with the professional development options you highlighted.  And 15 hours of PD, does that amount to 3 per year?  I think they are 5-year renewals?

If given the choice between a continuing education seminar titled "Creating Effective Rubrics", "Learner Outcomes for the 21st Century", or "Job Skills needed for a Global Workforce" - I would choose the last one every time.  I think all 3 would be important, but adding the 3rd doesn't take away from 1 and 2.

I think it's fair to criticize the manner in which the bill was written and passed.  It's also fair to discuss whether work readiness/career preparation is the job of a public HS.  Should they instead be focused on a broader understanding of the world and educating future citizens in civic engagement?  Those are all good questions.  

That's my take as an outsider, but someone who does have to get continuing education hours for a professional license.  That's less than your 2 cents!

Edited by oldtimeqb
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17 minutes ago, oldtimeqb said:

But... it was on Facebook!  Correct me if I'm wrong.  But the Total (90) hours for renewal did not change, just the content coverage of some of them?   

The bill doesn't require an externship, which has seemed to get all the publicity.  It was stated as an option, along with the professional development options you highlighted.  And 15 hours of PD, does that amount to 3 per year?  I think they are 5-year renewals?

If given the choice between a continuing education seminar titled "Creating Effective Rubrics", "Learner Outcomes for the 21st Century", or "Job Skills needed for a Global Workforce" - I would choose the last one every time.  I think all 3 would be important, but adding the 3rd doesn't take away from 1 and 2.

I think it's fair to criticize the manner in which the bill was written and passed.  It's also fair to discuss whether work readiness/career preparation is the job of a public HS.  Should they instead be focused on a broader understanding of the world and educating future citizens in civic engagement?  Those are all good questions.  

That's my take as an outsider, but someone who does have to get continuing education hours for a professional license.  That's less than your 2 cents!  

I almost always renew with 2 college courses within one of my license areas.  Each class is worth 45 points.  I don't have that option now, I believe.  I almost always have one or two jobs outside of school, but that is my business.  I did have a coach at IPS tell me that maybe I needed to let go of one of those extra jobs.  That was a crock of cheese.

Edited by Robert

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35 minutes ago, Robert said:

I almost always renew with 2 college courses within one of my license areas.  Each class is worth 45 points.  I don't have that option now, I believe.  I almost always have one or two jobs outside of school, but that is my business.  I did have a coach at IPS tell me that maybe I needed to let go of one of those extra jobs.  That was a crock of cheese.

https://www.doe.in.gov/licensing/application-instructions-step-step#add1

 

perhaps I can still do it through the link above. 

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1 hour ago, oldtimeqb said:

But... it was on Facebook!  Correct me if I'm wrong.  But the Total (90) hours for renewal did not change, just the content coverage of some of them?   

The bill doesn't require an externship, which has seemed to get all the publicity.  It was stated as an option, along with the professional development options you highlighted.  And 15 hours of PD, does that amount to 3 per year?  I think they are 5-year renewals?

If given the choice between a continuing education seminar titled "Creating Effective Rubrics", "Learner Outcomes for the 21st Century", or "Job Skills needed for a Global Workforce" - I would choose the last one every time.  I think all 3 would be important, but adding the 3rd doesn't take away from 1 and 2.

I think it's fair to criticize the manner in which the bill was written and passed.  It's also fair to discuss whether work readiness/career preparation is the job of a public HS.  Should they instead be focused on a broader understanding of the world and educating future citizens in civic engagement?  Those are all good questions.  

That's my take as an outsider, but someone who does have to get continuing education hours for a professional license.  That's less than your 2 cents!

Correct....still 90 hours/points.  In a perfect world, I don't think it should be a big problem to get those hours/points...

  1. IF your corporation incorporates into the structure of your current PD meetings.  If your district PD person is asleep at the wheel on this you'd be forced to figure out something on your own...which apparently could be Beer Camp!! https://www.indystar.com/story/news/education/2019/05/15/indiana-teachers-license-renewal-new-rules-catch-teachers-off-guard/1193573001/
  2. IF it really does mean what I think it means (that it can be accomplished with your normal district PD)
  3. IF these hours don't minimize the PD time you need to actually prepare to teach (curriculum dev, planning, etc)

For those of us who have been teaching for a long time....we know those are potentially big IF's.😉

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2 hours ago, Robert said:

I almost always renew with 2 college courses within one of my license areas.  Each class is worth 45 points.  I don't have that option now, I believe.  I almost always have one or two jobs outside of school, but that is my business.  I did have a coach at IPS tell me that maybe I needed to let go of one of those extra jobs.  That was a crock of cheese.

Yes, you still do have the option of taking classes to renew, to avoid this new mandate. But that seems to be an expensive way to avoid it. 🤷🏼‍♂️

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2 hours ago, oldtimeqb said:

But... it was on Facebook!  Correct me if I'm wrong.  But the Total (90) hours for renewal did not change, just the content coverage of some of them?   

The bill doesn't require an externship, which has seemed to get all the publicity.  It was stated as an option, along with the professional development options you highlighted.  And 15 hours of PD, does that amount to 3 per year?  I think they are 5-year renewals?

You are correct, however the law does require some connection with a community/business leader and professional development. 

I also agree there is some pd that does nothing for me, and is boring. If I can minimize the amount of time on my own I am doing it, then fine. There may even be some relativity to me and what I teach. But for most teachers, that is not the case. Most teachers already do something similar because they have to work a job or two outside of teaching. But I am not sure what a business leader can tell a Kindergarten or other elementary teacher what exactly he is looking for out of the students in that class as far as necessary skills go. 

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14 minutes ago, Irishman said:

Yes, you still do have the option of taking classes to renew, to avoid this new mandate. But that seems to be an expensive way to avoid it. 🤷🏼‍♂️

Spread out over 5 years, it isn't so bad.  I just choose something that interests me and is in one of my areas.  I'm weird.  🙂

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As some others have mentioned, our district is just going to find a way to incorporate these into the PD that we already offer in house on our PD days. It is silly and unfortunate, but I imagine many districts will do the same. 

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What about an unintended consequence:  Teachers go to these externships and find a better opportunity to make more outside of education and more teachers leave the field....

 

Food for thought.............

Edited by SoIndRef
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43 minutes ago, SoIndRef said:

What about an unintended consequence:  Teachers go to these externships and find a better opportunity to make more outside of education and more teachers leave the field....

 

Food for thought.............

To me, that is part of the plan. The ultimate goal is to make it so teaching is not a career; that most will stay for somewhere around 3-5 years, at most. The thinking is that the high turnover rate will weaken the membership numbers in ISTA. what is sad is what price they have decided to pay to reach that goal. 

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Sad that no one sees the negative effects of constant teacher turnover.   I taught at my first school for many years, I knew the kids, the brothers, the sisters, parents, coached kids in multiple sports and at multiple levels.  The relationships you develop cannot be understated.  I could get kids to do things they didn't want to do, just because I asked them to, sometimes just with a look.  

Fast forward, I'm at my 2nd teaching job (in Michigan) and I've only been here a couple of years.   I like the kids and they like me, but its not the same.  Takes years and years to become part of a community or school system that is the community in a lot of rural areas.   Deeply bothers me that those relationships are being robbed from Indiana's youth. 

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I've been involved with education for 15 plus years as an educator.  The stretch from spring break until the end of year always seems to bring anxiety, stress, worry, and change.  This year from my own perspective seems to be magnified.  Admin changes, teachers leaving, gossip is rampant.  More and more friends to be saying enough is enough and walking away.

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