Temp's 4A Bracket Analysis

[fenderbender]

4 hours ago, WestfieldRocks said:

Roncalli's blowout of Shortridge was supposed to be a Shortridge home game. However, it was moved to Roncalli. Not sure the reason. Supposedly the same will happen next week when they play Attucks.

Yes, requested by the IPS schools.  
 

My wife used to teach at CA and one section of the concrete beaches was not safe.  Looked like they were going to fall down.   Though one would think they could play at Tech.   Pretty nice facilities from what I heard.  

[MonkeyButt]

18 hours ago, Sports Freak20 said:

But New Pal is probably the best team in the state, right Monkey Butt??  They should run through 4A right???

Yes absolutely the best team in the state! 

[MonkeyButt]

10 hours ago, temptation said:

Let me start by saying I think Mount Vernon is one of the most improved teams in the state and if I heard correctly last night starts a 15 year old at QB.

That being said, @MonkeyButt likes to use the transitive property in his argument that New Pal could be the #1 team in Indiana regardless of class.

Well, that can work both ways.

New Pal was trailing in the 3rd quarter and defeated a Mount Vernon team by 11 points.  Mount Vernon also lost to the HCC’s 7th place team (Noblesville) by 8.

HSE and Brownsburg beat Noblesville by a combined score of 83-42 this season.

Let’s pump the brakes a bit.

Both things can still be true: New Pal is the best team in the state and they had a tough game against Mt. Vernon. And yes the transitive property can apply. I don't deny that it goes both ways.

 

[MonkeyButt]

8 hours ago, dmizers3 said:

Yes they might be.  Not understanding this reply at all.  They beat a good team on the road by double digits in a game that wasn't that close. Nevermind the fact it was a rivalry game.  If not for a very questionable call that took a TD away from New Pal at the end of the 1st half and New Pal electing not to score late that game could have easily been 25 point + margin.

Those are facts that irrelevant to Temptation because the best team in the state apparently can't have a close or tough game with someone, especially a second game against their biggest rivalry in the playoffs and on the road. So I guess there are no "best" teams in the state if what Temptation or SportsFreak is saying is true. smh

[temptation]

6 minutes ago, MonkeyButt said:

Those are facts that irrelevant to Temptation because the best team in the state apparently can't have a close or tough game with someone, especially a second game against their biggest rivalry in the playoffs and on the road. So I guess there are no "best" teams in the state if what Temptation or SportsFreak is saying is true. smh

Knew you’d take the bait.  Your late night damage control spoke volumes.

Mount Vernon is a fringe top 75 team in the state…rivalry game or not “the unquestioned best team in the state” should roll through them with relative ease.

Every team ranked in front of New Pal has taken care of/put away clearly inferior competition without missing a beat.

New Pal was down in the third quarter…to a team with a 15 year old QB whose parents picked him up after the game because he’s not old enough to drive.

Facts are facts.

Edited October 22, 2022 by temptation

[Staxawax]

5 hours ago, fenderbender said:

Yes, requested by the IPS schools.  
 

My wife used to teach at CA and one section of the concrete beaches was not safe.  

Concrete beaches are never safe!

[MonkeyButt]

3 hours ago, temptation said:

Knew you’d take the bait.  Your late night damage control spoke volumes.

Mount Vernon is a fringe top 75 team in the state…rivalry game or not “the unquestioned best team in the state” should roll through them with relative ease.

Every team ranked in front of New Pal has taken care of/put away clearly inferior competition without missing a beat.

New Pal was down in the third quarter…to a team with a 15 year old QB whose parents picked him up after the game because he’s not old enough to drive.

Facts are facts.

I love how you pull quotes out of your butt as if someone actually said them and then "quote" them as if the fake quote helps your argument. If you can't argue with real quotes or things that people actually said (in case you don't know what a quote it because apparently you don't) then why argue at all? Misinformation much? Oh sorry disinformation. LOL And try acting like you know sports and that the best team can be challenged or lose on any given "Friday" instead of still projecting how offended you were when someone disagreed with a team's ranking in your poll. So is your number one team in your rankings just going through roll through the competition with ease according to your logic? You are actually arguing what now or just doing your "let me put him down with my witty comment" rebuttal? I am sure you win arguments a lot with that. 

[temptation]

4 hours ago, MonkeyButt said:

I love how you pull quotes out of your butt as if someone actually said them and then "quote" them as if the fake quote helps your argument. If you can't argue with real quotes or things that people actually said (in case you don't know what a quote it because apparently you don't) then why argue at all? Misinformation much? Oh sorry disinformation. LOL And try acting like you know sports and that the best team can be challenged or lose on any given "Friday" instead of still projecting how offended you were when someone disagreed with a team's ranking in your poll. So is your number one team in your rankings just going through roll through the competition with ease according to your logic? You are actually arguing what now or just doing your "let me put him down with my witty comment" rebuttal? I am sure you win arguments a lot with that. 

“Yes absolutely the best team in the state!”

EIGHT HOURS ago.  
Scroll up.

[MonkeyButt]

4 hours ago, temptation said:

“Yes absolutely the best team in the state!”

EIGHT HOURS ago.  
Scroll up.

Let's compare your quotes shall we: "the UNQUESTIONED best team in the state" vs " Yes absolutely the best team in the state". I am not here, unlike you apparently, unwilling to be questioned about my opinions on teams. I do believe they are the best team in the state as do many other people that aren't New Pal fans. It is not unquestioned, however, because at the end of the day it is who is on top AND because the State Champs don't have a playoff between each it will always be questioned and debatable, for years to come even. 

Look I am not here to have another pissing contest (things getting personal in other words) with you and you can continue to bring old arguments or whatever. You know football better than you are showing in your poor nit picking of my supposed comments that the best team (and let's settle for 4A right now simply because NP is ranked #1) can and will come across tough matches especially in certain situations. I NEVER said New Pal will blow through the 4A tournament. I have even posted to the opposite that they will have a tough road to LOS. Argue with me all you want that New Pal isn't the best team. Fine. And if they lose then clearly they aren't. But neither of us can prove the point that New Pal is or isn't the best team of all the classes even after Thanksgiving Day weekend is finished. At the end of the day we only have our opinions and people will disagree with them. 

[temptation]

16 minutes ago, MonkeyButt said:

Let's compare your quotes shall we: "the UNQUESTIONED best team in the state" vs " Yes absolutely the best team in the state". I am not here, unlike you apparently, unwilling to be questioned about my opinions on teams. I do believe they are the best team in the state as do many other people that aren't New Pal fans. It is not unquestioned, however, because at the end of the day it is who is on top AND because the State Champs don't have a playoff between each it will always be questioned and debatable, for years to come even. 

Look I am not here to have another pissing contest (things getting personal in other words) with you and you can continue to bring old arguments or whatever. You know football better than you are showing in your poor nit picking of my supposed comments that the best team (and let's settle for 4A right now simply because NP is ranked #1) can and will come across tough matches especially in certain situations. I NEVER said New Pal will blow through the 4A tournament. I have even posted to the opposite that they will have a tough road to LOS. Argue with me all you want that New Pal isn't the best team. Fine. And if they lose then clearly they aren't. But neither of us can prove the point that New Pal is or isn't the best team of all the classes even after Thanksgiving Day weekend is finished. At the end of the day we only have our opinions and people will disagree with them. 

There is zero difference between those quotes.  All semantics.

I’ve stated all along they deserve to be in the conversation and you are the one creating a pissing contest and splitting hairs.

Then you double down AFTER they let a mediocre Mount Vernon team hang around and state it as an ABSOLUTE.

You must live in a world where words don’t matter and you can just constantly change the meaning of them despite them being front and center for all to see.

The difference in us is the obvious bias. You have skin/blood in the game.  I don’t.  I have not seen one other poster who is not a New Pal fan (as you claim) that thinks they are the best team in the state.

The “blow through the tournament” comment was not made by me so don’t drag me into that one.  I’m actually on record (in this very thread) as stating there may be some challengers to New Pal which was unheard of 8 weeks ago.

Man, you are making it easy to be a Roncalli fan.  Don’t be the Merrillville of central Indiana please.

[MonkeyButt]

16 minutes ago, temptation said:

There is zero difference between those quotes.  All semantics.

I’ve stated all along they deserve to be in the conversation and you are the one creating a pissing contest and splitting hairs.

Then you double down AFTER they let a mediocre Mount Vernon team hang around and state it as an ABSOLUTE.

You must live in a world where words don’t matter and you can just constantly change the meaning of them despite them being front and center for all to see.

The difference in us is the obvious bias. You have skin/blood in the game.  I don’t.  I have not seen one other poster who is not a New Pal fan (as you claim) that thinks they are the best team in the state.

The “blow through the tournament” comment was not made by me so don’t drag me into that one.  I’m actually on record (in this very thread) as stating there may be some challengers to New Pal which was unheard of 8 weeks ago.

Man, you are making it easy to be a Roncalli fan.  Don’t be the Merrillville of central Indiana please.

Yeah it's called hyperbole. smh Look it up and you might actually understand my statement instead of injecting your opinion about me into it. Sheesh 

[MonkeyButt]

18 minutes ago, temptation said:

You must live in a world where words don’t matter and you can just constantly change the meaning of them despite them being front and center for all to see.

The difference in us is the obvious bias. You have skin/blood in the game.  I don’t.  I have not seen one other poster who is not a New Pal fan (as you claim) that thinks they are the best team in the state.

The “blow through the tournament” comment was not made by me so don’t drag me into that one.  I’m actually on record (in this very thread) as stating there may be some challengers to New Pal which was unheard of 8 weeks ago.

28 minutes ago, temptation said:

 

 

LOL This is fun. Talking with some who doesn't understand simply linguistic terms and when a fan does believe their team is the best team. Of course I can't be sold out for New Pal who is and has been ranked #1. most of the year. Since you love to stalk me on here and twist my comments because your feelings are hurt let me be clear again. I will double down because I believe they are. It is called an opinion. I also said that they have to get through to LOS to prove that. Why is that so difficult for you? 

I am not not your bubble (THANK YOU GOD) to know who you pay attention to (other than me) where you are not seeing comments where people have stated they believe New Pal, and Roncalli I might add, are the two best teams in the state. But it isn't my responsibility to hold your hand and find those comments. 

I could care less if you are a New Pal fan or not. I could also care less if you are turned off by my fandom of New Pal. I am not here to win you to my side. 
 

 

14 hours ago, temptation said:

should roll through them with relative ease.

I will admit I did quote your wrong. There's your quote. I guess I should ask for clarification since you could have been hyperbolic in your statement. But looking at the context of the rest of that post I'd say I was not wrong in the point you were trying to say I was making. So let me ask about this statement. Where did I every say they should "roll through them with ease"?

 

[MonkeyButt]

30 minutes ago, temptation said:

Man, you are making it easy to be a Roncalli fan.  Don’t be the Merrillville of central Indiana please.

So I guess what you think of me and my claim is that no one can argue that New Pal is not the best team, that New Pal will roll through the competition with ease, that New Pal has no weaknesses, and that if New Pal is challenged at any point the disqualifies them as the best team in the state. Yeah I am sure you can assume that from one statement where I say that I believe New Pal is absolutely the best team in the state of all the classes.

Let me also say this which is consistent with other posts I have made:
- NP will be challenged every week bc of the target on their back being #1

- NP is the most balanced team I have ever seen in HS football, but that doesn't mean they don't have weaknesses bc they do

- NP is their biggest opponent, but there are several teams that could take them down that I believe are some of the best teams in the state too (Please argue with me that there can only be one best team in the state bc of semantics)

- NP is only the best team in the state as an opinion, however, they can at the very least make it a fact they are the best team in 4A by winning at LOS

- Yes I believe that it is possible for NP to lose, but then again anything is possible

- Did you not admit you believed Mt Vernon was the most improved team in 4A? Yet turn right around and discount their achievement of being the most improved bc you wanted to make NP not seem as good bc Mt Vernon has a freshman QB? I guess a there is no such thing as a freshman QB being better than an upperclassman QB? Is that your argument? Good luck with that one. Luke Ertel is one of the better QBs in 4A and will prove to be one of the best QBs in the state sooner than his senior year. He improved tremendously from week 4 and showed how good he can be by playing in his first playoff game being one of the main reasons why MV hung in there so well

- I believe that the best team, in my opinion, can also be challenged in a tough game by one of the most improved teams in 4A (your statement not mine) at their field. I also believe it could have happened even out our field. I believe both of those can exist and be true. 

Sheesh Temptation it I hope you don't make everyone else you have to spell it out bc you take all of their posts literally. And here you go pushing me to write long posts again.

 

[Rodney]

8 minutes ago, MonkeyButt said:

So I guess what you think of me and my claim is that no one can argue that New Pal is not the best team, that New Pal will roll through the competition with ease, that New Pal has no weaknesses, and that if New Pal is challenged at any point the disqualifies them as the best team in the state. Yeah I am sure you can assume that from one statement where I say that I believe New Pal is absolutely the best team in the state of all the classes.

Let me also say this which is consistent with other posts I have made:
- NP will be challenged every week bc of the target on their back being #1

- NP is the most balanced team I have ever seen in HS football, but that doesn't mean they don't have weaknesses bc they do

- NP is their biggest opponent, but there are several teams that could take them down that I believe are some of the best teams in the state too (Please argue with me that there can only be one best team in the state bc of semantics)

- NP is only the best team in the state as an opinion, however, they can at the very least make it a fact they are the best team in 4A by winning at LOS

- Yes I believe that it is possible for NP to lose, but then again anything is possible

- Did you not admit you believed Mt Vernon was the most improved team in 4A? Yet turn right around and discount their achievement of being the most improved bc you wanted to make NP not seem as good bc Mt Vernon has a freshman QB? I guess a there is no such thing as a freshman QB being better than an upperclassman QB? Is that your argument? Good luck with that one. Luke Ertel is one of the better QBs in 4A and will prove to be one of the best QBs in the state sooner than his senior year. He improved tremendously from week 4 and showed how good he can be by playing in his first playoff game being one of the main reasons why MV hung in there so well

- I believe that the best team, in my opinion, can also be challenged in a tough game by one of the most improved teams in 4A (your statement not mine) at their field. I also believe it could have happened even out our field. I believe both of those can exist and be true. 

Sheesh Temptation it I hope you don't make everyone else you have to spell it out bc you take all of their posts literally. And here you go pushing me to write long posts again.

 

did you just triple post? thats not a good look

next thing you know you're going to be quoting and responding to yourself

[BTF]

Perspective from Northeast Indiana: No dog in the fight. 

 

Why New Pal is the best team in the state:

They beat Westfield by 14 points, whereas the #1 team in the state only beat the Rocks by only 5

They've obliterated every other team on their schedule. 

 

Why New Pal isn't the best team in the state:

While the 14 point over Westfield is impressive, let's face it, the Rocks aren't as good as the team they had last year. 

Sagarin has New Pal as the 7th best team in the state. The highest ranked opponent outside of Westfield (14) is Mount Vernon, who is ranked 39th. 

New Pal's strength of schedule is less than impressive. 

 

What would make them the best team in the state:

If the Dragons beat Roncalli by 14+, then blow through East Central and Northwood by 21+, then I'll be ready to partake in the conversation as to why New Pal is the best team in the state. And that could happen. But in the present, I've got to give the nod to a team like Cathedral, Brownsburg, HSE, or Center Grove based on the brutality of the schedules they play week in and week out. 

 

Here is the unfortunate reality. When debating the #1 team in the state, the advantage is always going to be given to the team who wins state in the largest division (6A) and whoever Sagarin says is the best. The 5A champ and 4A champ will always have an uphill climb in convincing others that their team is the best. 

[temptation]

2 hours ago, MonkeyButt said:

Yeah it's called hyperbole. smh Look it up and you might actually understand my statement instead of injecting your opinion about me into it. Sheesh 

Because hyperbole and sarcasm is so easy to detect on the internet, right?

[Donnie Baker]

You guys need to go find Batman. I gotta go 

[MonkeyButt]

3 hours ago, BTF said:

Perspective from Northeast Indiana: No dog in the fight. 

 

Why New Pal is the best team in the state:

They beat Westfield by 14 points, whereas the #1 team in the state only beat the Rocks by only 5

They've obliterated every other team on their schedule. 

 

Why New Pal isn't the best team in the state:

While the 14 point over Westfield is impressive, let's face it, the Rocks aren't as good as the team they had last year. 

Sagarin has New Pal as the 7th best team in the state. The highest ranked opponent outside of Westfield (14) is Mount Vernon, who is ranked 39th. 

New Pal's strength of schedule is less than impressive. 

 

What would make them the best team in the state:

If the Dragons beat Roncalli by 14+, then blow through East Central and Northwood by 21+, then I'll be ready to partake in the conversation as to why New Pal is the best team in the state. And that could happen. But in the present, I've got to give the nod to a team like Cathedral, Brownsburg, HSE, or Center Grove based on the brutality of the schedules they play week in and week out. 

 

Here is the unfortunate reality. When debating the #1 team in the state, the advantage is always going to be given to the team who wins state in the largest division (6A) and whoever Sagarin says is the best. The 5A champ and 4A champ will always have an uphill climb in convincing others that their team is the best. 

I completely agree with everything you are saying. Even the very last point. Way to sum it up BTF.

1 hour ago, temptation said:

Because hyperbole and sarcasm is so easy to detect on the internet, right?

Fair point.

[SBFootballFan6]

Word out of the North a front runner is gonna be down 4 possibly 6 starters, possibly for the whole length of their run. Not much of a rumor, since the 4 names can be found on the inkfreenews.com

Really opens things up in the North, and could end up making a magical run come to an end before it needed to. 

[CaptainHook]

While I might regret wallowing out in this thread...

 

Mt. Vernon is a very good football team, and I would challenge anyone that says differently.  When you have two guys like they do in Bridenthal and Burhenn, it makes them very hard to defend.  They have great schemes on defense.  Their freshman QB has come a long way this season.  And playing your cross-county rival and defending state champ two times at their place is difficult.  I would have taken an ugly one point win and been ecstatic.  Knew all week that was gonna be a tough one.

I have no idea how good Roncalli, East Central, and Northwood are.  I do not think NP will roll through 4A.  But that alone doesn't mean the winner of 4A couldn't compete in the higher classes.  I do think 4A is tougher than 5A this year. We will never know.  Hell, I still think the 2018 and 2019 NP teams would have won any class those two years.  Who cares what we think?

It does make the message boards fun though.

 

[SBFootballFan6]

12 hours ago, SBFootballFan6 said:

Word out of the North a front runner is gonna be down 4 possibly 6 starters, possibly for the whole length of their run. Not much of a rumor, since the 4 names can be found on the inkfreenews.com

Really opens things up in the North, and could end up making a magical run come to an end before it needed to. 

More word is getting out, looking like 10 total starters are possibly out. It is in the news if you look close enough, will see if it tries to be covered up. Feel real bad for the ones who did the right thing. This should really open the door for a different North champion.

[Muda69]

Go Kokomo Wildkats.

 

[TigerFan20]

1 hour ago, SBFootballFan6 said:

More word is getting out, looking like 10 total starters are possibly out. It is in the news if you look close enough, will see if it tries to be covered up. Feel real bad for the ones who did the right thing. This should really open the door for a different North champion.

Got a link for this?

[SBFootballFan6]

12 minutes ago, TigerFan20 said:

Got a link for this?

You can find some bookings on inkfreenews.com

I'm waiting for others to post more, and only adults can be booked, underclassman would be held waiting for parent pick up.

[FastpacedO]

2 hours ago, CaptainHook said:

While I might regret wallowing out in this thread...

 

Mt. Vernon is a very good football team, and I would challenge anyone that says differently.  When you have two guys like they do in Bridenthal and Burhenn, it makes them very hard to defend.  They have great schemes on defense.  Their freshman QB has come a long way this season.  And playing your cross-county rival and defending state champ two times at their place is difficult.  I would have taken an ugly one point win and been ecstatic.  Knew all week that was gonna be a tough one.

I have no idea how good Roncalli, East Central, and Northwood are.  I do not think NP will roll through 4A.  But that alone doesn't mean the winner of 4A couldn't compete in the higher classes.  I do think 4A is tougher than 5A this year. We will never know.  Hell, I still think the 2018 and 2019 NP teams would have won any class those two years.  Who cares what we think?

It does make the message boards fun though.

 

Agreed so many variables anymore. 5A is like no man's land. It is either really good with teams like New Pal and Cathedral. Or when there is a shift it pilfers the good teams (New Pal to 4A and Cathedral to 6A etc). I think this year 4A is really tough, 6A has more parody, and 5A is watered down (my personal opinion).

Edited October 24, 2022 by FastpacedO