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Using NCAA fields for high school games?


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In some of the discussions in the forum regarding neutral fields, the subject of using college fields has come up.  Is my memory failing me, or was there an edict a while back from the NCAA saying that their stadiums couldn't be used for high school?  I seem to remember something about not allowing these early season invitationals to be played at college stadiums any longer. 

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Cathedral has a history of playing at such stadiums for regular season and playoff games (Butler Bowl, Marian College, U of Indy) over the past few years and from what I know is why they don't more often is the cost to do so.  As long as the field configuration is the same I am not sure it matters.

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7 hours ago, gindie said:

In some of the discussions in the forum regarding neutral fields, the subject of using college fields has come up.  Is my memory failing me, or was there an edict a while back from the NCAA saying that their stadiums couldn't be used for high school?  I seem to remember something about not allowing these early season invitationals to be played at college stadiums any longer. 

I remember looking at something saying the goal posts are different 

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Marian University is not an NCAA institution,  I do not believe that Scecina has used UIndy for a few years now. If there was something in place by the NCAA that their fields could not be used for High School competition. And the goal post are different, by about 5 feet.

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19 minutes ago, FastpacedO said:

NFL and NCAA goalposts are 18 feet, 6 inches wide. High school goalposts are 23 feet, 4 inches wide

Hashmarks are different, too. 

It's 40' between the hashmarks on an NCAA field, 53.3' between the hashmarks on an NFHS one. Although HS hashmarks can usually be applied to a college field fairly easily, converting the goalposts is a more arduous task. 

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8 hours ago, gindie said:

In some of the discussions in the forum regarding neutral fields, the subject of using college fields has come up.  Is my memory failing me, or was there an edict a while back from the NCAA saying that their stadiums couldn't be used for high school?  I seem to remember something about not allowing these early season invitationals to be played at college stadiums any longer. 

The NCAA rule is that *independent third party* organizations cannot use college venues. For example, Ray Compton's group cannot rent Hinkle Fieldhouse or Assembly Hall for a game. What was happening was shoe companies and somewhat slimy folks in the basketball recruiting game were scheduling "shootouts" at college venues involving prime recruits to try to steer those recruits to that school. 

A school or a state association (such as the IHSAA) absolutely can rent out college venues. Several State Finals are held at them - volleyball & gymnastics at BSU, track at IU, softball at Purdue. GBB was at ISU for a few years. But third parties cannot. 

I believe the Tri-Eastern Conference rents out Ball State's stadium for a Saturday quadrupleheader every few years. A few years back, when Purdue had a Friday home game, it offered up Ross-Ade for the local high schools to play on Saturday. 

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2 hours ago, crimsonace1 said:

Hashmarks are different, too. 

It's 40' between the hashmarks on an NCAA field, 53.3' between the hashmarks on an NFHS one. Although HS hashmarks can usually be applied to a college field fairly easily, converting the goalposts is a more arduous task. 

When you play Ritter at Marian there are no HS hashmarks and the goalposts are not swapped out.  Its like ground rules being discussed for baseball stadiums/fields.

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8 minutes ago, coachkj said:

When you play Ritter at Marian there are no HS hashmarks and the goalposts are not swapped out.  Its like ground rules being discussed for baseball stadiums/fields.

I've heard of some officiating crews taking two steps outside the college hashmarks to mark the ball for high school. Do they do that or just play with the NCAA ones? 

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1 minute ago, crimsonace1 said:

I've heard of some officiating crews taking two steps outside the college hashmarks to mark the ball for high school. Do they do that or just play with the NCAA ones? 

We play with what we’ve got.

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5 minutes ago, crimsonace1 said:

I've heard of some officiating crews taking two steps outside the college hashmarks to mark the ball for high school. Do they do that or just play with the NCAA ones? 

 

3 minutes ago, Bobref said:

We play with what we’ve got.

What Bob said....

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3 hours ago, crimsonace1 said:

The NCAA rule is that *independent third party* organizations cannot use college venues. For example, Ray Compton's group cannot rent Hinkle Fieldhouse or Assembly Hall for a game. What was happening was shoe companies and somewhat slimy folks in the basketball recruiting game were scheduling "shootouts" at college venues involving prime recruits to try to steer those recruits to that school. 

That matches my memory.  In Cincinnati, they used to have a "Skyline Chili Kickoff Classic" at the University of Cincinnati Nippert Stadium that was run by Kirk Herbstreit at some point.  I remember seeing Warren Central, Carmel, and other states play in it at some points.  But, they hold those at high school fields now.

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27 minutes ago, gindie said:

That matches my memory.  In Cincinnati, they used to have a "Skyline Chili Kickoff Classic" at the University of Cincinnati Nippert Stadium that was run by Kirk Herbstreit at some point.  I remember seeing Warren Central, Carmel, and other states play in it at some points.  But, they hold those at high school fields now.

Cathedral played there as well; in 07 we beat LaSalle 7-6, but our kicked doinked 3 FG attempts off the uprights......would have been good on a HS field. 

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3 hours ago, crimsonace1 said:

Hashmarks are different, too. 

It's 40' between the hashmarks on an NCAA field, 53.3' between the hashmarks on an NFHS one. Although HS hashmarks can usually be applied to a college field fairly easily, converting the goalposts is a more arduous task. 

To clarify, the field width for HS is 53 and 1/3 yards. The distance between the hashes is 40 feet. And the distance from the hashes to the sidelines is 60 feet. 

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5 hours ago, WCGrad92 said:

Marian University is not an NCAA institution,  I do not believe that Scecina has used UIndy for a few years now. If there was something in place by the NCAA that their fields could not be used for High School competition. And the goal post are different, by about 5 feet.

NAIA uses NCAA rules in Football. 

 

2 hours ago, crimsonace1 said:

I've heard of some officiating crews taking two steps outside the college hashmarks to mark the ball for high school. Do they do that or just play with the NCAA ones? 

I have worked at Marian many times and have dealt with the hash mark issue. It’s not difficult to move the pylons behind the EZ to where the hashes should be. So given my experience with this issue, I called North Meridian, the answer is what Bob said, we play with what we have. I also address the hash mark issue with both coaches and both AD’s on Monday of game week. 
I have never worked at UIndy, but Cardinal Stadium in Louisville, RCA Dome, and LOS have had HS temporary hashes every time I’ve been there. 
 

One note, with turf being in the conversation lately, the old Cardinal Stadium at the fairgrounds was hands down the WORST surface I’ve ever been on…..OK, maybe second worse, you guys that played on D1 at Midwest know what I’m taking about. 

Edited by Impartial_Observer
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2 hours ago, Irishman said:

Cathedral played there as well; in 07 we beat LaSalle 7-6, but our kicked doinked 3 FG attempts off the uprights......would have been good on a HS field. 

Last season, Cathedral place kicker Ben Gomez missed one extra point.  It was at UIndy and it hit off the upright.  Gomez attempted 61 EP's last season.

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2 hours ago, Impartial_Observer said:

NAIA uses NCAA rules in Football. 

Playing rules yes. Recruiting and contact rules very different. I think NAIA may technically have some rules but I'm not sure how much they enforce them.

One of the college fields I've worked on has both HS and college hash marks because it's a community field used for both. Every time I've worked there I've put the ball on the HS hash for a college game at least once. The snapper very politely reminds me of my error.

Edited by JustRules
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17 hours ago, JustRules said:

Playing rules yes. Recruiting and contact rules very different. I think NAIA may technically have some rules but I'm not sure how much they enforce them.

One of the college fields I've worked on has both HS and college hash marks because it's a community field used for both. Every time I've worked there I've put the ball on the HS hash for a college game at least once. The snapper very politely reminds me of my error.

They don't call it the "National Association of Ineligible Athletes" for no reason :). 

In all seriousness, NAIA's recruiting rules are really lax compared to NCAA's, but the playing rules are the same. NAIA also doesn't have the restriction on third parties renting out their facilities for HS games, but methinks there are very few NAIA facilities where that would be an issue, as most NAIA basketball gymnasiums are the same size as/smaller than HS facilities in the area. 

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20 hours ago, Irishman said:

To clarify, the field width for HS is 53 and 1/3 yards. The distance between the hashes is 40 feet. And the distance from the hashes to the sidelines is 60 feet. 

I believe those are the NCAA dimensions. In HS, the hashmarks divide the field into thirds and are 53'4" apart. 

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2 hours ago, crimsonace1 said:

They don't call it the "National Association of Ineligible Athletes" for no reason :). 
 

As a former NAIA player and coach, as well as an NCAA D-II coach (Not to mention a father of an NAIA and NCAA D-III football players.) I have to respond....

NAIA has initial eligibility requirements for incoming freshmen. 

NCAA D-III does not. Get into the school you are eligible.

And no, NCAA schools don't necessarily have higher entrance requirements.

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13 hours ago, crimsonace1 said:

They don't call it the "National Association of Ineligible Athletes" for no reason :). 
 

Yea all those NAIA teammates of my daughter’s who are now doctors, nurses, accountants, teachers, and business professionals mostly just sit around and relive their glory days. 
There are currently two medical schools in the state of Indiana, the other one is an NAIA institution. 

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On 11/15/2022 at 3:16 PM, Irishman said:

To clarify, the field width for HS is 53 and 1/3 yards. The distance between the hashes is 40 feet. And the distance from the hashes to the sidelines is 60 feet. 

Here are all the dimensions for a high school field and an NCAA field. Compare and contrast.


 

2D9CCB1D-DCF6-4054-8F5A-F260FAEB20B3.png
 


      

 

43C8626F-EC39-4B5E-A963-4AB3BEDC4899.png

Edited by Bobref
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2 hours ago, Bobref said:

Here are all the dimensions for a high school field and an NCAA field. Compare and contrast.


 

2D9CCB1D-DCF6-4054-8F5A-F260FAEB20B3.png
 


      

 

43C8626F-EC39-4B5E-A963-4AB3BEDC4899.png

The first thing I notice is they’re facing different directions. That’ll never work.

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