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Muda69

Those darn Jesuits are at it again: Archdiocese of Indianapolis cut ties with Brebeuf

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https://www.indystar.com/story/news/education/2019/06/21/archdiocese-indianapolis-brebeuf-jesuit-catholic-what-it-means/1522790001/

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The Archdiocese of Indianapolis has officially cut ties with Brebeuf Jesuit Preparatory School after the school refused to fire a gay teacher.

The decree from Archbishop Charles Thompson went into effect Friday, adding a new wrinkle to a growing debate over LGBTQ staff and their role in local Catholic education.

It's an unprecedented step for the archdiocese to take and is reverberating around the Catholic community. Here's what it means for the school.

Not a lot, actually, in day-to-day operations.

Brebeuf doesn't receive any financial support from the archdiocese and isn't using any of its ministers in the school right now.

Principal Greg VanSlambrook said it's a sad decision, but students and their families won't see much of a difference.

Brebeuf will no longer be listed in the official Catholic directory, and school officials won't be invited to meetings of other Catholic school administrators.

Is it still a Catholic school?

Yes, kind of. The archbishop's decree says that Brebeuf can't call itself Catholic and it won't be recognized as a Catholic institution. But Brebeuf is an independent Catholic school, sponsored by the USA Midwest Province of the Society of Jesus, or the Midwest Jesuits. An order of Catholic priests, the Jesuits will continue to sponsor the school and send their members to minister at Brebeuf.

Brian G. Paulson, provincial for the Midwest Jesuits, said that a representative of the archdiocese has verbally assured Brebeuf that it will continue to allow Jesuit priests to serve in leadership at the school and they can still hold Mass on campus.

VanSlambrook said the archdiocese's decision will not change the mission or teachings at the school. 

.....

One wonders how this will affect future enrollment at the preparatory school?  Current support from parents, students, and alumni appears to be steadfast.

 

 

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7 hours ago, Muda69 said:

https://www.indystar.com/story/news/education/2019/06/21/archdiocese-indianapolis-brebeuf-jesuit-catholic-what-it-means/1522790001/

One wonders how this will affect future enrollment at the preparatory school?  Current support from parents, students, and alumni appears to be steadfast.

 

 

If this were a place like Cathedral, no doubt there would be a negative impact. But with Brebeuf being what Brebeuf is and really, always has been, it will feel no impact at all. The letter from not only the leadership of Brebeuf , but the leadership of the Jesuit community in the Midwest, make a very strong case for why the school chose this path. I have no doubt the decision of the Archbishop will be overturned at some point in the appeal process. 

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5 hours ago, Irishman said:

If this were a place like Cathedral, no doubt there would be a negative impact. But with Brebeuf being what Brebeuf is and really, always has been, it will feel no impact at all. The letter from not only the leadership of Brebeuf , but the leadership of the Jesuit community in the Midwest, make a very strong case for why the school chose this path. I have no doubt the decision of the Archbishop will be overturned at some point in the appeal process. 

I'm not sure it would be as much of an issue with Cathedral as Cathedral is not officially backed or even directly associated with the Diocese outside of a general assumption that it's a Catholic institution.  While at one point it was tied to the Brothers of Holy Cross and has recently been re-affiliated, they tend to be considered an independent Catholic school.  

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1 hour ago, foxbat said:

I'm not sure it would be as much of an issue with Cathedral as Cathedral is not officially backed or even directly associated with the Diocese outside of a general assumption that it's a Catholic institution.  While at one point it was tied to the Brothers of Holy Cross and has recently been re-affiliated, they tend to be considered an independent Catholic school.  

True...I was speaking more to the population of Cathedral being more “traditional”, and more likely to take issue with the school if it were to make a similar decision. 

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So is Brefeuf now the logical choice for liberal Catholic families to send their children?

 

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5 hours ago, Muda69 said:

So is Brefeuf now the logical choice for liberal Catholic families to send their children?

 

It has been for many years now. They also have a healthy Jewish population. 

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42 minutes ago, Irishman said:

It has been for many years now. They also have a healthy Jewish population. 

Why would Jewish families send their kids to a Catholic school?

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23 minutes ago, DanteEstonia said:

Why would Jewish families send their kids to a Catholic school?

It’s all about the education.

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1 hour ago, DanteEstonia said:

Why would Jewish families send their kids to a Catholic school?

They have choices. Just like all the other families.

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Cathedral received $1.14 Million in tax dollars this past school year. Roncalli received $1.75 Million. Should schools that discriminate continue to receive tax dollars? I did some checking as well. I looked at the Catholic schools in the Archdiocese. I am sure I missed a few, but the schools I did count, add up to over $30.5 Million in tax dollars. These schools and more are all subordinate to the Archbishop, and since Cathedral has chosen that route as well, I included them. 

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One other thought on this witch hunt; The strict interpretation of this mindset is that he also has to exclude non Catholics from working in these schools as well. After all, living the Catholic faith includes the obligation of attending Mass every Sunday and receiving Holy Communion.

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2 hours ago, Irishman said:

FTA:

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Cathedral High School has fired a teacher in a same-sex marriage after Archbishop Charles Thompson told the school they would forfeit their Christian identity if they didn't.

Their Christian identity?  Really?  So only Catholics are Christians?

 

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7 hours ago, Irishman said:

I stand corrected @Irishman.

6 hours ago, Irishman said:

Cathedral received $1.14 Million in tax dollars this past school year. Roncalli received $1.75 Million. Should schools that discriminate continue to receive tax dollars? I did some checking as well. I looked at the Catholic schools in the Archdiocese. I am sure I missed a few, but the schools I did count, add up to over $30.5 Million in tax dollars. These schools and more are all subordinate to the Archbishop, and since Cathedral has chosen that route as well, I included them. 

Was there an indication of archdiocesan financial support or was this mainly focusing on voucher money?  Many of the schools receive both, which would bring a particularly interesting and reciprocal situation where a school could be pressured by the archdiocese, but affiliated parishes could also be pressured from the collection plate by congregants from schools that look more like Brebeuf.  The less low-level affiliation a school has, for example a Catholic school that isn't specifically tied to parishes, the less reciprocity there would seem to be in the pressure level.  I'm curious as to whether it might be more one-way or whether there is a two-way likelihood as these issues are pressed more.

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5 hours ago, foxbat said:

I stand corrected @Irishman.

Was there an indication of archdiocesan financial support or was this mainly focusing on voucher money?  Many of the schools receive both, which would bring a particularly interesting and reciprocal situation where a school could be pressured by the archdiocese, but affiliated parishes could also be pressured from the collection plate by congregants from schools that look more like Brebeuf.  The less low-level affiliation a school has, for example a Catholic school that isn't specifically tied to parishes, the less reciprocity there would seem to be in the pressure level.  I'm curious as to whether it might be more one-way or whether there is a two-way likelihood as these issues are pressed more.

This was all voucher money from just this last school year. 

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2 hours ago, Muda69 said:

Thank you.   An attempt at fake news by the reporter, possibly.

 

Sometimes people just make mistakes. 

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1 minute ago, Impartial_Observer said:

Sometimes people just make mistakes. 

What?  In this day and age?

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This whole thing is such a cluster.

The Archbishop's decision to make this particular issue a deal-breaker for Catholic schools strikes me as very cynically calculated.  Just as a matter of statistical probability, the likelihood that there are or will be any significant number of teachers in archdiocesen schools who are in same sex marriages would be small relative to the likely number of teachers in the schools who have had multiple different-sex marriages without obtaining annulments, or who are engaging in pre-marital sex and/or "living in sin" with a different sex partner/significant other. 

The fact that he has chosen to focus on this particular, fairly rare example of "immoral conduct" instead of the (presumably) much more common ones mentioned above suggests to me he didn't have the balls to challenge "immoral" behavior among teachers of the sort that he knows many, many students' parents and alums of Catholic schools also have engaged in or are now engaging in. He went after a fringe group to minimize (he hoped) the backlash.  

The Archbishop's calculation appears to be correct for the most part, since for reasons noted in the Board's letter, Cathedral's situation was akin to Roncalli's in terms of the strong leverage the archdiocese holds over it. That made this  pretty much a, "Is this a hill I am willing to die defending?" decision for the Board of Directors. 

Not exactly a "Profiles in Courage" moment on either side. But the reaction among Cathedral alums I am seeing online -- "I won't send my kids there; they won't get anymore money from me!" -- ignores the plain fact that Cathedral (like Roncalli) didn't have the luxury to say no, like Brebeuf did, and still stay open and essentially continue to operate as it has up to now, without archdiocesan support.  

If they truly want to put their money where their mouths are, Cathedral's wealthy alums, instead of threatening to withdraw their financial support,  should step up and offer to fund the cost to buy the school the flexibility it needs to pursue a third option: surviving for a year or two simply as a non-denominational "private school" until they can gain sponsorship from a Catholic order independent of the archdiocese, ala the situation with Brebeuf. 

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21 hours ago, Bobref said:

It’s all about the education.

My family left a Methodist church back when I was in 5th grade because the minister sent his kids to the local Catholic school.

I, as a Protestant, would not want my children to be exposed to Rome’s teachings, even if the school was “better”.

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3 hours ago, DanteEstonia said:

My family left a Methodist church back when I was in 5th grade because the minister sent his kids to the local Catholic school.

I, as a Protestant, would not want my children to be exposed to Rome’s teachings, even if the school was “better”.

Quite clearly, many do not feel the same way.

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