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Muda69

The Media Wildly Mischaracterized That Video of Covington Catholic Students Confronting a Native American Veteran

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5 hours ago, Muda69 said:

Gentle?  I often find them cutting but insightful, and written in a prose that a mental midget like myself can only dream about.  It may be that elite Wabash education vs. my lowly Indiana State education................

 

 

Well, you may be right in blaming your education.  But before besmirching a fine institution like ISU, we should probably consider some alternative theories.... 😉

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1 minute ago, Wabash82 said:

Well, you may be right in blaming your education.  But before besmirching a fine institution like ISU, we should probably consider some alternative theories.... 😉

Such as?

 

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3 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

Such as?

 

Such as why you didn’t choose an alternative that was available at the time.

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16 minutes ago, gonzoron said:

FED318B4-66D1-41A1-A382-4E2DC6BEA2A7.jpeg

Such as why you didn’t choose an alternative that was available at the time.

Apples / Oranges.......

 

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17 minutes ago, gonzoron said:

 

Such as why you didn’t choose an alternative that was available at the time.

There wasn't.  ISU was the only school that accepted my application, and the only one I could afford.   

 

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3 hours ago, TrojanDad said:

I'm guessing Sandmann's attorney feels its not a waste of time.  He's got a pretty decent track record in this arena.  The Post left out a ton of details...and certainly help to paint an incomplete picture at best.  The young man because of the reporting that told only part of the story received death threats and harassment.  Several other organizations have been put on notice.  I guess time will tell.

I am sure his attorney doesn't. His MO, which has left him well compensated, usually involves leveraging the threat of continued bad publicity to get settlements, and I suspect he will have some success with that approach again here --  if not against the Post, at least with the smaller, less well-funded defendants he sues down the road. His representation of Richard Jewell is probably instructive in that regard: he reached nice but not huge settlements fairly quickly with most the media organizations he sued or threatened to sue; he lost the once defamation case (against the Atlanta newspaper) he actually took to trial.  

Defamation is not the same as shoddy reporting. I have not seen where the Post actually make any false assertions of fact about Sandman. 

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28 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

Such as?

 

Well, in Darwinian terms, there's nurture... and then there's nature.

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2 minutes ago, Wabash82 said:

Well, in Darwinian terms, there's nurture... and then there's nature.

I don't understand.

 

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6 minutes ago, Wabash82 said:

 I have not seen where the Post actually make any false assertions of fact about Sandman. 

https://reason.com/blog/2019/02/21/nick-sandmann-covington-lawsuit-libel

Quote

...

There is one statement that does look like a potential assertion of fact rather than opinion. From The Post:

"It was getting ugly, and I was thinking: 'I've got to find myself an exit out of this situation and finish my song at the Lincoln Memorial,' " Phillips recalled. "I started going that way, and that guy in the hat stood in my way, and we were at an impasse. He just blocked my way and wouldn't allow me to retreat."

This strikes me as potential grounds for a libel claim. It may indeed be considered a statement of fact rather than opinion, and one that was incorrect. The false assertion certainly portrays Sandmann in a negative light, and The Post made little effort to corroborate it before the author went ahead and subjected a previously unknown teenage boy to all the negative publicity that comes with being the subject of hit piece in a major media outlet. But this is far from open and shut, as the media's failures in the Covington case, while substantial, are more open to interpretation than Rolling Stone's failures in the Virginia story.

Of course, there's a broader philosophical problem with trying to resolve the Covington debacle via lawsuit, even if Sandmann may have a case (albeit an extremely narrow one): It raises serious free speech concerns, and it could have significant repercussions for the media.

....

 

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47 minutes ago, swordfish said:

Apples / Oranges.......

 

Nope, defamation and false claims by the media in both cases.

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46 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

There wasn't.  ISU was the only school that accepted my application, and the only one I could afford.   

 

There are many, many alternatives in choosing post-secondary education. There always have been.

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18 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

I'd say the Post's quote of Phillips involves a mixed statement of fact and opinion by Phillips, and I don't know how it can be shown to be "false", in light of the various videos. Phillips did walk up to Sandman, but Sandman (as he has acknowledged) didn't try to move or get out of his way. So Sandman did in that sense block Phillips. Phillips perceived it, apparently, as threatening; Sandman says he didn't mean for it to be threatening, he was instead trying to defuse things by not moving. Phillips may have been mistaken in his subjective opinion of Sandman's intent, but not in the objective statement that Sandman blocked him from moving forward. 

The "didn't allow me to retreat" appears to be a reference to the fact (as is shown on all the videos) that the kids sort of encircled the Native American group after they had walked up to Sandman. It doesn't look like they did it to be threatening, but rather just get a better view of what was happening, but they did still encircle them. 

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4 minutes ago, gonzoron said:

There are many, many alternatives in choosing post-secondary education. There always have been.

Like I've said before,  I guess I am just stupid.

 

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41 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

I don't understand.

 

Ah, Muda, you may have finally hit on a good signature for yourself! This seems to be a common refrain from you.

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1 minute ago, Wabash82 said:

Ah, Muda, you may have finally hit on a good signature for yourself! This seems to be a common refrain from you.

Like I've said before,  I guess I am just stupid.

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2 hours ago, gonzoron said:

FED318B4-66D1-41A1-A382-4E2DC6BEA2A7.jpeg

Such as why you didn’t choose an alternative that was available at the time.

wonder how many people with a 1270 SAT get admitted to Harvard?....

Wonder if his political views helped him out...just a little......

Now if he had more outspoken conservative views, would a 1270 be enough?

IU's school of Informatics, Computing, and Engineering (SICE) requires a minimum 1350 SAT for a direct admit.

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16 minutes ago, TrojanDad said:

wonder how many people with a 1270 SAT get admitted to Harvard?....

Do you know what they call the guy who graduated last in his class in medical school?

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2 minutes ago, TrojanDad said:

wonder how many people with a 1270 SAT get admitted to Harvard?....

Wonder if his political views helped him out...just a little......

Now if he had more outspoken conservative views, would a 1270 be enough?

IU's school of Informatics, Computing, and Engineering (SICE) requires a minimum 1350 SAT for a direct admit.

Don't know, but you get recruitment letters from Harvard if you live in Montana and Nevada and have SAT scores of 1310.  1270's not far off.  Heck, George Bush had around 1200 and got into Yale.

 

 

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18 hours ago, foxbat said:

Don't know, but you get recruitment letters from Harvard if you live in Montana and Nevada and have SAT scores of 1310.  1270's not far off.  Heck, George Bush had around 1200 and got into Yale.

 

 

I think you and Gonzo both know the average student does not get admitted to Harvard with a 1270 SAT.  5% of all applicants are accepted.  They estimate "some students may be accepted with a SAT as low as 1455.

https://www.collegesimply.com/colleges/massachusetts/harvard-university/admission/

If the young man had been a conservative, and was outspoken against gun control, would Harvard admitted him with a 1270 SAT?  

Harvard.JPG

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48 minutes ago, TrojanDad said:

I think you and Gonzo both know the average student does not get admitted to Harvard with a 1270 SAT.  5% of all applicants are accepted.  They estimate "some students may be accepted with a SAT as low as 1455.

https://www.collegesimply.com/colleges/massachusetts/harvard-university/admission/

If the young man had been a conservative, and was outspoken against gun control, would Harvard admitted him with a 1270 SAT?  

Harvard.JPG

Your question is, of course, hypothetical, since such a student would never want to go to a leftist, elitist, effete academy of pinheadedry such as Harvard. He'd apply to a solid conservative institution in the Midwest, like U of C, or  Hillsdale, or go to one of the wellspring academies for renowned libertarian thinkers, such as Indiana State. 

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46 minutes ago, TrojanDad said:

I think you and Gonzo both know the average student does not get admitted to Harvard with a 1270 SAT

Sorry, but I didn't know that. I don't really make it a habit to check SAT requirements of a school unless I am interested in sending one of my children there or I just want to find fault with someone who did get into that school. Nor am I in the habit of researching SAT scores of kids I see in the news. What possible relevance does this have to the comparison between Sandmann and Hogg? Was Sandmann rejected by Harvard? 

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36 minutes ago, TrojanDad said:

I think you and Gonzo both know the average student does not get admitted to Harvard with a 1270 SAT.  5% of all applicants are accepted.  They estimate "some students may be accepted with a SAT as low as 1455.

https://www.collegesimply.com/colleges/massachusetts/harvard-university/admission/

If the young man had been a conservative, and was outspoken against gun control, would Harvard admitted him with a 1270 SAT?  

 

Actually, they estimate that some may be admitted with an SAT score LOWER than 1455 based on your graphic.  Under 2% of them.

If you were talking about just any average admission doc, you'd probably be right, but we aren't talking about an average student, are we?  We're talking about a kid who has become an author, founded a non-profit, has been on TV lots of times, who has helped organize a movement ... whether you like the movement or not ... helped create a boycott movement that took out advertisers from an adversary's show, etc.  He became a national name and isn't done yet.  You may not like what he's doing, but the kid got in.  You have a conspiracy theory, why not prove it instead of just toss the mud out there and see if it sticks.  The kid's in the under 2% that get in.  The fact that Harvard sends mailers to folks in Montana and Nevada with 1310 means that they consider those scores.  May not admit a lot of them, but they have a policy that says target these kids.  Given that they are willing to "waste" their targeted application inquiries on kids with 1310 when 1455 is the supposed floor ... the reason is because they DO admit folks in that range.  And if they admit general folks from Montana with a 1310, then why wouldn't they consider and even admit a national profile kid with a similar score?

Yes, I know the narrative is to make him unworthy,  but frankly, that 2% is about diamonds in the rough.  Something that's seen as worth taking a chance on.  This kid took on Laura Ingraham and held his own.  He's taken on the NRA and held his own.  He's weathered a lots of folks attacking him and physically threatening him and hasn't backed down.  He had the awareness, during the shootings, to record the equivalent of last testaments so that if he and his fellow students didn't survive, they could at least leave their last messages.  He wrote a book.  He's founded a non-profit.  And he's still at it.  Tell me again why Harvard wouldn't want to have him?  If you've done admissions in a university setting, while there's lots that tied to the numbers, there are also windows for more holistic evaluation.  Admissions will see out diamonds in the rough and this kid fits that idea whether you like his politics or not.  Again, I don't see folks complaining about Bush's 1200 or so getting into Yale or Kushner's grades/scores not being in the Harvard ranges.  That's definitely a couple of conservatives there with lower-than-expected performance getting into Ivy League schools.

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Meh. I hear the University of California at Berkeley is where its at:  http://reason.com/blog/2019/02/22/uc-berkeley-student-punched-face-conserv

Quote

A stranger punched a University of California–Berkeley student in the face after becoming enraged at his posters, which said "Hate crime hoaxes hurt real victims" and "this is MAGA country."

The University of California Police Department is attempting to identify the attacker, and a spokesperson for the university said it would take action if he turns out to be a student.

"Let me state in no uncertain terms that this university strongly condemns violence and harassment of any sort, for any reason," Dan Moguluf, assistant vice chancellor for communications, tells Campus Reform. "That sort of behavior is reprehensible and intolerable. We have, in recent years, spent millions of dollars to ensure that students from across the ideological/political spectrum can safely and successfully promote and discuss their beliefs. Our commitment to freedom of expression and belief is unwavering."

The student, Hayden Williams, is a field representative for the Leadership Institute, and he was helping with recruitment for Turning Point USA. Both organizations promote conservatism on college campuses.

The altercation, which was captured on video, took place at a public square near Williams' recruitment table. The video clearly shows a young man in a black shirt punching Williams directly in the face. Williams' only crimes, it seems, were promoting a conservative cause and attempting to record his interactions with students on his phone.

The video shows another person attempting to knock Williams' phone out of his hands and accusing Williams of "fucking encouraging violence" just before the man in the black shirt attacks him. I gather that this person believed Williams' provocative signs—which allude to the allegedly fake Jussie Smollett hate incident—were not mere speech but actually a kind of assault on marginalized communities.

The idea that words are themselves violence is regrettably popular among student activists. If words are violence, then punching somebody who says something offensive isn't wrong; it's just self-defense. The idea's results are on display in the video:

 

 

 

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On 2/22/2019 at 12:07 PM, Wabash82 said:

Your question is, of course, hypothetical, since such a student would never want to go to a leftist, elitist, effete academy of pinheadedry such as Harvard. He'd apply to a solid conservative institution in the Midwest, like U of C, or  Hillsdale, or go to one of the wellspring academies for renowned libertarian thinkers, such as Indiana State. 

Now that you've answered the question for the hypothetical applicant using "humor", can you answer the question for Harvard with an honest opinion?

Had Hogg been outspoken in gun rights, would have Harvard accepted him with a 1270 SAT?  

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