Indiansreloaded

3 minutes ago, Bobref said:

If there was physical contact — and it sounds like there was — the proper call is a dead ball personal foul for unnecessary roughness, not unsportsmanlike conduct. But a player can still be ejected if the conduct is deemed “flagrant,” or if it crosses the line and satisfies the criteria for “fighting.” And the fact that the game was terminated at that point does not preclude disqualification, since the officials retain jurisdiction for that purpose even after the game was terminated.

There were multiple flags thrown.  The penalties were never made official or signaled.  If I had to guess, there were unsportsmanlike, unnecessary roughness, and other penalties on multiple players.  I would also guess that there were some ejections that were going to happen had the game continued.  Either way, the officials had control and did the right thing by ending the game so there wouldn't be any further issues.  

2 minutes ago, Bobref said:

Was #62 disqualified last Friday? 

He was the player that made the late hit that caused the incident and the game to be called.  He was not officially ejected because the game was called.  Would he been ejected had the game continued?  Not sure if he would as it was his first penalty which probably would have been unsportsmanlike conduct.  Not sure what the officials would have done or what their final report determined.  

1 hour ago, XStar said:

Out of everyone, Eastside was the team I was most confident could hang with Luers (assuming they returned most of their key players from last season).  They had beaten them 2 years ago and hung with them for 4 quarters last year.  It could be just me, but I thought the regional game would've been easier for Luers, particularly if it had been Eastbrook.  Eastbrook has shown time and again over the years they are terrible defending the pass and Adamson has shown an unwillingness to change his approach.  I think Luers would've passed up and down the field on Eastbrook all game long.  Fortunately for Eastbrook, I think they have a much better chance against Eastside who plays a style easy for Eastbrook to defend.  In fact, I think Eastbrook is a big favorite in that matchup because Eastside won't be able to maintain the level of play they showed last week.  

Eastbrook plays in a run heavy conference.  Mississinewa and Oak Hill are usually the two teams with an equal balance of run and pass.  This year these two were heavy run offenses.  Over the years, Eastbrook has had a history of not being able to defend the pass, however they have improved.  I think that since they in a run heavy conference they focus more on defending the run.  Just like their offense has been very little passing for years, and since 2016 they have thrown the ball more.  Adamson adjusts his offense based on what the capability of his QB is.  His defense is much of the same way.  If they have a passing QB, then they defend the pass well.  If they have an option QB then they don't defend the pass as well.  

2 minutes ago, Yuccaguy said:

Absolutely Correct.   Now let's again divert from THAT, and focus on the game at Northridge HS. 

The Raiders are a formidable opponent on a "hot streak", at home, and focused on LOS!  

If we continue to bring up an incident on 11/5/21,  This posting may also be closed.   

Represent your school, oblivious to the actions previous....  And good luck to all involved!!!  

Mississinewa is also on a hot streak as they have won 9 straight.  Northridge has the strength of schedule in their favor.  Mississinewa has several players that have been to regionals where Northridge has none.  I don't think it is going to be a blow out game but a close game.  Then factor in that there is predictions of the white stuff flying this weekend so it could be a cold game.

10 minutes ago, Yuccaguy said:

I was there.... TOTALLY different in EVERY WAY.  Had absolutely nothing to do with the visiting team, had more to do with the dynamics of the closing of Elmhurst HS and as to how it pertained to FW Wayne Athletics.  

I am not going to assign blame in this situation, as I truly believe that the powers that be (Game officials in conjunction with the IHSAA) will sort this out and meter out any and all further sanctions. 

But I would suspect that Ole Miss faithful, need to understand that the outcome may ALSO fall upon the actions of players/coaches/administrators at Mississinewa when this all sorted out.  

I agree there will be something done by the higher ups of the IHSAA.  It will come down to the reports that are turned in.  My guess is the IHSAA was on the phone on Saturday with officials, administrations, and possibly coach's trying to sort things out so preparation can take place for the next round with the players that won't be eligible.

10 minutes ago, BACKSIDEBELLY said:

I wasn’t saying they would or wouldn’t, I just said they might.  This is the kind of incident that the IHSAA could use to make a statement to every other school.

I agree, however in an article in a Fort Wayne news outlet reference was made to another incident in 2010 about Wayne involved in something similar that placed the football program on probation.  I am sure the IHSAA will do something to both schools but again it comes down to the reports and video.  

41 minutes ago, BACKSIDEBELLY said:

I wonder if there will even be a game.  Mississinewa could be told by the ihsaa that they can’t compete because of last week’s display.

Doubt that the entire team will be suspended.  There will be one player that will be suspended and maybe a coach.  They may be put on probation by the IHSAA.  It all depends on what the officials put on their report as to what led up to the fight.  The officials can not review film, however they can after the game like this notify teams of players that would have been ejected had the came continued.  Now the IHSAA can review film and make further suspensions.  The last thing the IHSAA wants to do is to remove a team from the tournament.  Fort Wayne Wayne was clearly beat by Mississinewa long before the fight broke out.  In fact Mississinewa was driving and in 2-3 more plays more than likely would have scored again.  

1 hour ago, NRRaider2001 said:

Appreciate the insight, my ex mother in law is buried at Marion National Cemetery and we went through Gas City/ ate at Cracker Barrel usually when we came from 69 to visit.  Usually Sirloin Stockade if we came down through Marion.

 

Sirloin Stockade is closed but there is a Texas Roadhouse in Marion now along with Popeye's and McCalisters.  Then there is Ivanhoe's in Upland, Obi's BBQ in downtown Marion, Pappy's in Gas City (BBQ), and a few Mexican places to enjoy.

Mississinewa lost their starting QB the first game of the season when he tore his ACL.   Mississinewa has 2 track State Finalists sprinters on the team, one is a RB and another a WR.  Mississinewa throws the ball when needed but when 2 RB's average a first down with each touch there isn't much need to throw the ball.  Both RB's average over 100 yards a game.  

12 minutes ago, Bobref said:

A disqualified player may remain on the sidelines. However, if a coach is ejected he must leave the facility and have no contact with the team for the remainder of the contest.

How to handle potentially inflammatory exchanges between teams is something that is so situation-specific, you can’t really develop a hard and fast protocol for dealing with them. The Referee has wide discretion to adapt an approach to fit the circumstances.  I think it is a bad idea for the officials to address a team in the locker room on that subject. They should deal strictly with the head coach.

I’ll relate one anecdote that provides an example of a way to deal with it. I was the Referee on a college game involving two teams with a well known history of not liking one another. By the middle of the 1st quarter there had been several incidents of pushing and shoving, and 4 dead ball personal fouls. I sent both teams to their benches and called the head coaches to the middle of the field. They both began explaining how the other team was the instigator, and I cut them off, saying “ I didn’t bring you out here to hear what you had to say. I brought you out here so you could hear what I have to say. Any pushing or shoving is now going to be penalized as a personal foul — no leeway. And any dead ball personal foul or unsportsmanlike act is going to be an ejection. Now, without further comment, go back to your sidelines and communicate that to your players. End of discussion.”

One approach that I’ve seen used in the case of skirmishes where nonplayers enter the field, or where there is a significant pregame incident, is to assess an unsportsmanlike conduct penalty on every player and coach on both teams. This means that any subsequent unsportsmanlike act results in mandatory disqualification of the offender.

As to racial remarks, the IHSAA has a zero tolerance policy. If an official hears it, immediate disqualification is warranted.

I only asked about the officials going to the locker room thinking that it might get players attention but at the same time I agree that it wouldn't be a good idea.  Calling both coach's to mid-field like you did I think would get the attention of both teams that the actions won't be tolerated.  If I was a coach and I was called to mid-field for a conversation like this, I would be embarrassed and relay that to my team to not embarrass me again like that because if they did, then the next practice they wouldn't like.  Doing the unsportsmanlike on both teams and coach's seems like a logical thing to do as they would be offsetting penalties and would get some attention.  

Kids will be kids and say things that they shouldn't say.  Over the years I have heard racial slurs from players on and off the field/court.  In this incident I feel that either the officials weren't hearing the racial slurs, as we know things are said in piles on the ground that can't be heard, or the officials heard them but chose to ignore them.  But then again, perhaps the ejected players had used the slurs causing their ejection.  

Are the officials reports on things like this made public?  It would be interesting to see what the officials side of what happened.  If they are not public, I can understand why because it could cause future problems in life for those involved and/or threats to officials by those that were named.

14 hours ago, NRRaider2001 said:

 

For those making the trip from Gas City, you'll want to show up plenty early and visit Das Dutchmen Essenhaus (Indianas Largest Restaurant).

Been to Essenhaus a few times but unfortunately due to the start time of the game combined with the drive many Mississinewa fans will be arriving just before game time.  It is almost a 2 hour drive for the Mississinewa fans.  Mississinewa will more than likely being missing a player or two due to the brawl that took place to end the Sectional game.  It was an unfortunate incident that both teams have players that were in the wrong.  

Mississinewa has size and speed.  The top 2 running backs average a first down every time they touch the ball.  Some will say "That's because they play mostly 2A schools because of their conference."  But they have had this average or better in the post season.   Mississinewa has the 10 highest scoring team in the State and 3rd highest in 4A.  They have 7th best defense in 4A.  They are 2nd in margin of victory in 4A.  They score a lot and often.  

Northridge has a stronger schedule than Mississinewa which will have them prepared.  Mississinewa has won 3 Sectionals over 5 years so many of the players have been to Regionals before. So the experience goes to Mississinewa.  It will be a good game and will be competitive.  I don't think it will be blow out win by either team.  It is interesting that neither team is ranked in the top 15 of either poll, and is the only 4A game that neither team is ranked.  

2 hours ago, Bobref said:

The officials are precluded from using video. But the IHSAA certainly isn’t. And I would expect that Asst. Commissioner Faulkens is already reviewing video. 

When players are ejected are they supposed to stay in the locker room until the conclusion of the game?  There are reports that the ejected players from Wayne were along the fence in front of the stands and then jumped over the fence when everything took place.  Also if an official is hearing racial slurs being said on the field, would it be in the best interest of everybody for the officials to stop the game and call both head coach's to midfield or at least go to each head coach to address the racial slurs and then give each coach an opportunity to talk with their team to knock it off?  If it was going on in the first half, would be alright for the officials to enter each teams locker room to tell each team that if they heard it at all in the second half that the player using it would be immediately ejected as this talk is their warning?  

I personally think that the Mississinewa player should be punished and held responsible so that he can learn from his actions.  But I think there there could have been some early intervention that may have been able to prevented this from taking place.  Sadly, both programs and schools in general have now received a bad reputation across the state because of the actions of a few players/students.  

7 minutes ago, XStar said:

I hope Mississinewa's coach takes the appropriate measures to address the issues on his team, regardless of what circumstances led to them.  Player discipline has been lacking in the CIC this season.  

Pictures that were posted by one of the schools photographers, the school administration was on the sidelines helping to separate the teams.  Mississinenwa administration will take action against the player(s) involved. The current coach, I'm not sure what action he will take but being a former college assistant coach and in his second season at Mississinewa, he should use this incident to set a precedent for discipline for the entire team.  In my opinion the player is done for the season.  He would have to attend practice but not be allowed to participate because he would be running laps the entire time around the baseball field or track.  Then on Friday night, he is allowed to go to the game but he has to stay either with coach's in the press box or with a school administrator and NOT be allowed to wear the jersey.  Suspension should carry over to next season as well.  Other thing is the player is ineligible to a team Captain in any sport the remainder of high school.

Correction.  Northridge is in Middleberry and has turf.  Northwood in Nappannee has the crooked goal post.  

Let's go CIC and get 2 Regional titles.  

5 minutes ago, Gibbs said:

  Is we opened sectional play with a home game against Eastern. This will be the 3rd road game in a row,  how does that work in the tournament

This is from the IHSAA website:

Determining Home Team
Classes 2A, 4A, 6A
Sectional final game non-host, if applicable, or lower sectional # (i.e., Sect. 1 is lower than Sect. 2).
Classes A, 3A & 5A
Sectional final game non-host, if applicable, or higher sectional # (i.e., Sect. 2 is higher than Sect. 1).

Eastside and Eastbrook were both on the road for the sectional final and since Eastside is in a lower sectional number, they are the home team.

Mississinewa and Northridge both hosted the sectional final but because Northridge is in the lower sectional number they are the home team.  

Now, I say we both pray for lots of rain to make Eastside and Northridge's fields unplayable since they both have natural grass.  If they are unplayable then the games could be moved to Eastbrook and Mississinewa since they have turf.  Northridge has a crooked goalpost on one end of the field.  Been like that for a few years.

7 minutes ago, Boilernation said:

#62 from Miss shouldn’t play another down of football this year. I would like to see the IHSAA thoroughly investigate this weekend with the officials to see if Wayne fan/players  comments regarding the use of racial slurs is accurate. Multiple supporters of Wayne are claiming they asked the officials to put a stop to it.  If the officials validate the claims, no damn reason Miss should be allowed to play next week. No Place for that garbage in the game!

There are twitter post from Wayne players/fans/students that contain racial slurs.  Fans from both sides have said that racial slurs were flying, but the only ones that know are the officials and players.  I agree, if the officials heard it and did nothing then they need to be dealt with by the IHSAA.  The IHSAA will be in contact with both schools on Monday if they haven't been already.  Wayne had 2 players ejected and had 5 unsportsmanlike penalties before this all happened.  One of the unsportsmanlike was after a touchdown by Mississinewa and a Wayne player shoved the player that scored after he crossed the goal line, whistle was blown, and touchdown was signaled.  The player was not ejected for it but was penalized.  I think both of the ejected players had been called for unsportsmanlike penalties twice before being ejected, so they had their warning.   If the Mississinewa player had been doing this type of thing all season, then the coach should have taken action long before this game by suspending him for a game or two during the season.  If the coach was aware of what was being said towards him on the field then he should have pulled him for a few series or a quarter to help keep something from like this happening.  The head coach's of both teams are just as liable for this as the players involved.  

1 hour ago, Whiting89 said:

Look at the Facebook comments from that WANE page exclusive video of him and his cheap shots. These weren’t football plays, he knew what he was doing. Then you mix in the racial slurs supposedly said from the comments this team should be out the tournament.

I agree if he has been doing this all season, then the coach should have done something long before now about it.  In the Wane comments, there are twitter posts made by Wayne players/students/fans that include racial slurs and references to the players dad.  If the twitter post was made by a player from Wayne then Wayne needs to take action.  From other social media posts there are references that Wayne players were also making on field comments towards Mississinewa.  In my opinion if the officials heard the comments they should have went to both coaches and addressed it and gave them time to address their teams to knock it off and play football.  It is an embarrassment to both schools.  The reminded me of the Pacers and Pistons brawl.  Luckily coaches, administration, and officials were able to separate those involved before it got really ugly.

I have watched the video several times and it does look like he intentionally did a late hit that leveled the player.  Then one of Wayne players came to defend his teammate and #62 pushed him away and the player came back to be pushed away again while he was headed towards the player he leveled.  Then a few more Wayne players attacked him from the backside.  Mississinewa players went to get their teammate but quickly left the pile and returned to their sideline while the Mississinewa coaches ran across the field along with administration.  Mississinewa coaches escorted #62 to the sidelines and away from everything.  Then one of Wayne's players started chasing one of the Mississinewa coach's around the field only to be stopped by another of Mississinewa coach's.  Wayne's coach's were trying to get their players off of the field as their sideline had cleared.  Mississinewa's sideline stayed put.  

Both teams have players in the wrong and some may never play football again in high school and some will be back next year.  If they do return next year, then he coach's need to work on discipline of the players during the summer to prevent something like this again.  

2 minutes ago, BACKSIDEBELLY said:

Not on calpreps

John Harrel's has Eastside by 1.  Either way it is going to be a good game and a State Final atmosphere.  Does Eastside have turf or natural grass?  

From what I see Eastside is favored by 1 point.  Eastside beat Luers who beat every Ft Wayne school this year but Snider.  This game is going to come down to execution, penalties, and ball control.  I don't think it will be a high scoring affair like Eastbrook is used to.  The winner of this game has a good chance of being the 2A State Champion.  I hope Eastbrook can pull out the win.  I also hope that Mississinewa can pull out the win this week so both can represent the CIC.  Wouldn't be something if both are lucky enough to be playing Thanksgiving weekend in Indy.  If this would happen, I hope fans from Eastbrook show up for Mississinewa's game and fans from Mississinewa show up for Eastbrook's game.  Let's Go CIC!!!

26 minutes ago, BTF said:

 

Somewhere I missed where you said "the Mississinewa player was in the wrong." Both coaching staffs have some work to do after this game. Something tells me that both teams were guilty, and neither were the victim. 

I had said "Mississinewa player took a blindside cheap shot" which was meant as he was in the wrong.  Yes both coach's have some attitude and temper control that need to be addressed.  There are many accusations that have been stated on social media as to what fueled this brawl but only the players, officials, and maybe coach's know what fueled it as they were on the field and could hear what was said.  The fans are too far away to hear what is said on the field.  

10 minutes ago, MHSTigerFan said:

I feel for the officials in games that get so overheated.  Tough balance - because I’m sure they don’t want to look like they have an itchy trigger finger.  Officials hate the idea of affecting the outcome of a game…especially a tournament game.

But I’m with you on the early intervention.  Maybe the IHSAA should give them an intermediate tool between a verbal warning and disqualification…like a 1 quarter or time-based suspension.  Give them some time to cool off and the distinct feeling of consequences.

I agree.  Maybe if the officials would give the coach's the players numbers that are doing things that could lead to an ejection, then the coach's could pull the player and sit them for a series or quarter to get them to calm down.  At the same time, if a coach notices a player doing something that could cause an ejection, then the coach should take action.  

2 minutes ago, BTF said:

In making a public statement like this, you should probably tell the entire story. Did you not see the cheap shot delivered by said "Mississinewa player" upon the Wayne player? If I saw a teammate of mine get leveled from behind like that, I would have acted the same. In no way shape or form do I condone what ensued. Nor do I condone five unsportsmanlike penalties and two ejections. Haydock will have to address those issues with his program. But let's not come on here and pretend that Mississinewa's #82 was any kind of a victim. Anyone can look at the video by visiting wane.com.

As I said, the Mississinewa player was in the wrong and took a blindside cheap shot.  Yes, Wayne's players were going to protect their teammate, but once the 2 or 3 got the Mississinewa player down the entire Wayne team got involved.  Yes there were a few Mississinewa players that went into the middle, but like Wayne, they were going to protect their teammate.  There have been accusations made by both sides of words exchanged the entire game and included references to a deceased parent and racial slurs.  In my opinion, if the officials heard these type of exchanges going on, then they should have stop the game clock and pulled both coach's together to address the issue.   Then tell each coach to address it to their teams immediately.  If it was going on in the first half, the officials should have addressed it then with the coach's and teams.  

39 minutes ago, Impartial_Observer said:

I had a friend text me the initial sequence with the shove in the back that started the melee. Then saw the video of the “fight”. It just saddens me to see such events. I have no idea of history of the two teams, mood of the game, etc. This whole thing just seems a microcosm of society today. Sports are suppose to be a diversion, something enjoyable to entertain us, part of the educational process for the participants. These kind of events just puts a black eye on everything. 

The IHSAA has a history of dealing with these sorts of things pretty harshly and I’m sure they will be in the office bright and early this morning dealing with this situation. I just think it’s time we as a society stand up and say “this type of behavior is unacceptable under any circumstances”.  I am in no way attempting to place blame on anyone in particular, I’m sure there’s plenty of blame to go around. 

These two teams have not played each other in football.  I think they played against each other last year in basketball, but the players involved don't play basketball.  They only played basketball because both had opponents cancel due to COVID and it was a last minute thing.  So there really isn't a history between the two schools.  

2 minutes ago, Yuccaguy said:

Got ya....  Now take a breath, and let the IHSAA brass do their job and sort out the 'punishment' needed to try and rectify the situation.  

 

I am sure the IHSAA will be reviewing everything and then coming down with rulings, suspensions, or more after this incident.  

4 minutes ago, Yuccaguy said:

The bolded portion is NOT correct.  If you are ejected, pursuant to NFHS rules, you are OUT for the next contest at ALL levels for the week.  So if you are a Varsity player...see ya in 2 weeks.  

As for anything else related to damage, etc...  I am sure that the Ole Miss administration will/shall report that to the IHSAA/FWCS for any further renumeration, and or administrative actions.  

Sad to see that once again, WHS is the initiator of actions that will/may impact its athletic program in such a negative light.  Even with the actions of a Mississinewa player (62) perhaps being the instigator of the primary action..... He will be dealt with!  

I thought it was suspended for a week if a player or coach was ejected but then also heard that it was 4 quarters.  So the Wayne players that were suspended would they be suspended for a game in the next sport they play since their season is over?  Or does it carry over until the next Football season?  Also can an ejected player be on the sidelines the next week that is their suspension game?

And yes, the Mississinewa player will be dealt with by the administration and coaching staff.  

There is video of the incident.  Wayne had 5 unsportsmanlike penalties and 2 players ejected long before the brawl took place.  WaneTv out of Fort Wayne has the video on their website.  Yes, a Mississinewa player took a blindside cheap shot but then was attacked by 2 or 3 Wayne players.  To top it off Wayne fans came onto the field and a Wayne player chased one of the Mississinewa coach's around the field.  I saw the video and it was wild.  I sat in the parking lot for a little bit of the game and watched Mississinewa score their final touchdown.  After the RB had crossed the goal line, officials gave the TD signal, and RB had dropped the ball a Wayne player came in and shoved the RB for no reason.  The Wayne player was a good 5 yards away from the RB.