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I noticed an advocate that beliefs or once believed Sandy Hook didn't happen is letting us all know his opinion on this matter. Does anyone know if the IHSAA has plans to use this facility? I would think since it's labeled multisport we might not only see boys and girls soccer games but maybe even football and lacrosse.

If the field is cut in half does a Cinderella exist? Based on what you're saying here it doesn't appear to be the case?

Could you please separate the record? I'd like to see the record of the games like Columbia City over Sagarin 32 seed Ft. Wayne Wayne. Or Brebeuf over 21 seed Northview. I think it'll be interesting to see how the bottom half of the qualifiers hold up to the top half.

I'm wondering if you could also track win-loss records of those top half of the qualifiers against each other? I'm interested to see if it's just as lopsided. Meaning the top half still dominates and the bottom half of the schools deemed worthy to qualify for a playoff system you are proposing. Obviously you'll run into issues like New Pal v Mt. Vernon. But for example, Brebeuf over Northview is an example I would like to see. Is that 58-2 number including Brebeuf's win already? Or do you not include it?

OK I've punched some numbers with the schools (14 total) that are currently 5A or recently 5A that I would imagine Castle and Evansville North will be jockeying with for a playoff qualifier and seeding. I compiled the last three years. The 2020 season has all kinds of issues (Cancellations etc. etc.) with it being that was the season of COVID. I was thinking of possibly throwing that year out but I was halfway through the process and decided to just include it. Some of these calculations might be off due to the rush and I by no means claim that the accuracy of these digits are legit. But I believe this will provide a nice picture of the system that OHSAA uses being applied to schools like Castle and Evansville North. Should a qualifier apply any school ranked 8 or below would be considered the bottom half. Bloomington South for some reason has an 8 game schedule. I didn't take exception to the formula with them. I applied the formula as if they played a 9 game schedule. This means they missed out on points. You'll see how this jeopardizes possible seeding for them below. Schools bolded won a sectional. Schools in italic won the regional. Current Season Breakdown [8-1] Whiteland 24.777 [7-1] Bloomington South 19.611 [7-2] Franklin 19.611 [6-3] Terre Haute South 15.444 [6-3] Seymour 14.444 [5-4] Bedford North Lawrence 11.444 [5-4] Bloomington North 11 [5-4] Evansville North 10.277 [5-4] Castle 9.833 [4-5] Columbus East 9.388 [4-5] Floyd Central 8.611 [2-4] Terre Haute North 3.555 [2-7] New Albany 3.388 [1-7] Jeffersonville 2.5 If all of these schools were in 5A and a qualifier that cuts half the field was implemented, the SIAC might not have representation in the tournament this year. Bloomington North and BNL might also not make the cut because I didn't include other 5A schools considered in the south bracket. This is assuming there would be a 'South' and 'North' bracket of course. 2021 Season [6-2] Bloomington South 16.055 [7-2] Castle 15.555 [6-3] New Albany 14.333 [5-3] Whiteland 13.611 [6-3] Bloomington North 13.5 [4-5] Columbus East 8.722 [5-4] Evansville North 7.944 [4-5] Bedford North Lawrence 7.722 [3-6] Franklin 7.722 [3-5] Jeffersonville 6.611 [3-6] Floyd Central 6.388 [3-5] Seymour 6 [3-6] Terre Haute North 5.388 [1-9] Terre Haute South 0.666 Whiteland beat Columbus East twice, once in the regular season and again in the first round of the sectional. An 8 total game schedule Bloomington South beat Castle in the first of the sectional. 2020 Season [8-1] Whiteland 22.777 [7-2] Columbus East 21.666 [7-2] Floyd Central 15.833 [5-3] Castle 12.833 [6-2] New Albany 10.777 [5-4] Evansville North 10.666 [4-3] Bloomington South 9.833 [4-5] Bloomington North 7.944 [4-5] Terre Haute North 6.388 [3-5] Jeffersonville 5.166 [3-7] Seymour 5.055 [2-7] Terre Haute South 4.722 [3-5] Franklin 3.611 [2-7] Bedford North Lawrence 3.333 This year is a tough one to evaluate in a substantial way due to COVID. Jeffersonville won its Sectional this year. They most likely would have been cut from the field according to the points accumulated. But again, 2020 was an anomaly. Overall, I think it's safe to say the 5A SIAC schools probably wouldn't face any major issues with getting any sort of shaft with this type of system. Getting a 1 seed might be a challenge for them. And I would consider a 5-4 school be on the bubble anyway. But I think they'd be just fine with the current schedule they play. Which is actually a good thing for fans of the SIAC. Tango already mentioned Rivalry Week down here. He's 100% correct about the enthusiasm. The folks on the west side would probably blow a gasket if the West Side Nut Club Championship was no longer a thing because of something like this. They would absolutely lose their poop. It wouldn't be pretty. No seriously. For real.

I haven't punched the numbers yet but Evansville North and Castle probably get screwed with OHSAA's system. When I get the time I plan on breaking down the area to see just how much these two 5A schools miss out on points as opposed to the 5A schools north of I-64.

I might be mistaken but isn't a bubble team also considered a Cinderella? I'd be interested to see not only the bottom half stats but also the stats bubble teams that would or wouldn't qualify. I'm willing to throw down some cash that you'll see running clocks with a field cut in half as well. I could be mistaken but I like my chances. So if we do indeed see the same type of stats of what you deem Cinderella teams with bubble teams should the field be cut again? Personally, I just enjoy watching football. And I'm interested to see how 812 football does during the tournament. Just like any tournament on the planet the good teams weed out the bad teams week after week. Some teams are better than others. That's sports.

Well, it goes without question 42 is the answer, to everything. I was under the assumption based on the conversation we've been having only one programed CRS (a computer) vs an application written to play chess is the discussion. I'm now at the understanding you have a desire to take averages of three separate programs (computers)? If that's the case, that somewhat balances out the most obvious defect that all CRS have in the state of Indiana. It still isn't effective and solved by "a computer" or computers. It's taking the subjective human element into solving the math objective by intervening with separate algorithms, that are not as effective due to unit-containment. This also points out the inefficiencies in taking multiple programs written to get the outcome, unlike an application being written for a game of chess and the stark differences between the two math objectives.

Yeah, these are all good ideas to address the unit-containment issue. 3-6 Evansville Harrison might end up above the cut off threshold to get punched in if they'd play a game outside of the SIAC. But proposing a game to fix the unit-containment won't address Sagarin's second out of state opponent defect. Which you have pointed out regarding Gibson Southern. And all SIAC schools would absolutely have to avoid scheduling any out of state schools, which might be an issue down here in 812 SIAC land.

OK, that makes sense. I was wondering why you were using Sagarin as an example. I appreciate your response here. Frankly, I think all systems have their defects here in the state of Indiana. I'll cover that below. I personally could be sold on a 'take an average' of the three systems approach. However, if I'm being completely honest, I could really be sold to a 'committee of coaches' (CoC) approach. I say this because I tend to think coaches have a better pulse on the IHSAA football landscape then some dudes in the Bay Area, CA or Jefferson City, TN. But more importantly the CoC will cover the computer ranking system (CRS) defect. The major issue with using a CRS in the state of Indiana is there are two metro areas/conferences (SIAC and SAC) that have self-contained units. This is basically the statistical math kiss of death for any statistician on the planet. They can't solve this problem effectively. However this can be effectively solved by subjective pollsters or a CoC. Sidenote: Man, using Sagarin, Gibson Southern would get the shaft at an overall 7 seed when they're ranked 3 in both Calpreps and Massey. Instead of hosting a regional game they're most likely on the road.

Is Norwell the overall #1 seed for the entire tournament?

I cosine this hypotenuse.

Boss, which one of these programs effectively solved the problem? 3A class rank of Norwell - Sagarin: 1 Calpreps: 6 Massey: 4

Yes really. Creating algorithms for a game of chess has a completely different math objective than the subjective logic of creating a ranking system for sport teams. Excuse the pun but these are two separate objectives to solve mathematically. How is that criteria agreed-upon? A computer ranking system?

Sure you're gonna get complaints. Which makes sense. But are they somewhat fair seedings?