vicvinegar

58 minutes ago, TrojanDad said:

With the exception of Pike, the only MIC teams eliminated have been by other MIC teams.  Can the HCC say that?

Early regular season, and post season are not equal.  

In elimination games, the MIC is currently 3-1 against the HCC, correct?

Correct! The top MIC team beat two HCC team that were around .500.

9 minutes ago, HoosierFB_JG said:

Champions aren’t crowned in the regular season...

I don't remember saying they were. I'm not even saying the HCC is the better conference. I just find it hilarious that people want to forget the fact that in 2019, the HCC is 6-5 against the MIC. If you want to pretend the other games didn't happen, go for it. 

2 hours ago, TrojanDad said:

The MIC is eliminating each other. That will continue. 

But the HCC didn't? 🤔 So is your argument that since Carmel beat HSE and Westfield, while CG beat FC that proves that the MIC is dominant over the HCC? We just completely ignore regular season matchups? That's convenient! 

I don't know how a person could stand in front of those players and tell them they are no longer allowed to play football because they aren't good enough. That them not playing will make high school football in Indiana more competitive. Then tell the other sports programs that their funding will be cut because the football program is being shutdown. Then tell the cheerleaders, band members and fans (which I was actually surprised that there were so many) to find something else to do on Friday nights. Just a few more schools to tell this to and then maybe we can get down to that magic number to make Indiana high school football competitive!

2 hours ago, Staxawax said:

We must have different definitions of “upset”.

I agree. A team that beats an opponent that they lost 3-7 to the first time, isn't much of an upset. #2 losing at #4 isn't much of an upset either. 

1 minute ago, Warren05 said:

I was able to watch 11 different games on the IHSAA app on my 55 in tv through my ROKU device 

For free?!?!

Zionsville- 36

Pike- 0

Final

Zionsville-19

Pike- 0

Halftime

54 minutes ago, itiswhatitis said:

Looking at the offensive stats from last game, I have to ask:  Can the Patriots pass the ball?  I see they only threw 2 passes in that game and both were incomplete.  I get that some teams run the ball almost exclusively, but at some point if that isn't working, are you capable of passing?  I think the score will be closer than during the season.  According to the Sags they are about 10 points apart.  Give GS the 1.45 points for being at home and it comes down to about an 8 to 9 point game.  Of course, that's all things being equal.  Looks like there will be some issues with the weather Friday night.  Even if it isn't raining/snowing during the game, the field will probably be wet from the previous 2 days of forecasted rain.  Seen games like that where there were zero turnovers.  Also seen games like that when there were 11 turnovers.  Should be a really good game.  I'll say the Patriots win out and move on.

I haven't watched a game, but if I'm not mistaken, HH runs a flexbone offense (perhaps a double wing). Those type of offenses are never going to throw the ball much. As you pointed out, as we get deeper into the playoffs and the weather gets worse, it only helps them. 

2 hours ago, hhpatriot04 said:

If you are interested in traveling abroad to teach any subject (fully English), I can give you some recommendations for semester or year gigs. Just message me. Compensation includes transportation, housing, food at school. Instruction in English. Extra salary if you hold a Master's or have any certificates. That's K-12. Some interesting options if you hold a Master's as a college guest lecturer. 

Thanks for looking out! However I doubt the girlfriend would be on board with me going abroad. lol I do have an Aide position, just trying to find that full-time teaching position. So if anyone needs a good assistant coach and P.E. teacher, P.M. me! lol

12 hours ago, psaboy said:

Luers went 4-5 in 2009 and then won the 2A. That was start of their 4 year run. Think that was the beginning of the Jaylon Smith era as well. They also had a 4 year title run starting in 1999. Maybe be first team to have (2) 4 year straight runs??

16 minutes ago, GOLDRUSH1985 said:

And the reason I like the all in Playoff format . Northwood had injuries plague them in the regular season , only to get the players back for the playoffs . 

You beat me to it! lol I was about to say that some one not have these two teams in the playoffs. Both are amazing playoff runs.

Wish I could have given more. Unfortunately unemployed teachers are on a tight budget. 😂

12 minutes ago, DT said:

The IHSAA is all about competitive balance.  Without it, there would be total chaos.

 

Here's the thing, this isn't the NFL. In high school sports, the worst team doesn't get the top draft pick the following year. The team that wins state is usually going to continue to have that same pipeline of players coming up, the same football culture, and likely the same head coach. With the exception of perhaps the HC, the same can be said about the 0'fers. Does that mean teams can't change? Of course not! You can shut down as many football programs as you would like, as long as we keep score, there will always be winners, and there will always be losers. It doesn't matter how even you try to make it. 

2 hours ago, itiswhatitis said:

Since this is a football site, I was only talking about their football futility.  Their closest conference game this year was with Tell City (48 - 14).  Their 2 non conference games were against 1A Tecumseh (39 - 3) and 3A Brown County (41 - 19).  Against the three 3A schools (Gibson Southern, Soutridge, and Heritage Hills) in their conference they were massacred 69 - 6, 74 - 0, and 70 - 3.  Against the four 2A schools in their conference they didn't fare too much better and lost 48 - 14, 69 - 12, 61 - 7, and 42 - 0.  That was just this year, but you can check on Harrell's and find that is pretty much typical of most years going back to 1994.  I'm wondering what their attendance is like at their games?  Maybe a few parents and that's it?  That's just a guess but I don't see much support for a program like that.  It's just hard for me to wrap my mind around a program that has been bad for so long and still dresses a team every week.  I get that teams have down years, but this one has been down for decades.  I still say they don't belong in the PAC (in football at least).  I applaud the young men still suiting up and playing, but it shouldn't have to be that way year after year.  Maybe a young coach with a lot of fire and motivation?  Don't misunderstand me here.  I am not posting this to belittle a program.  I would love to see them be able to see them have some winning seasons.  I just have a hard time understanding programs who seem to accept their fate instead of things getting changed/improved.  Good grief!  25 years?

I still question the support Admin gives the program (I don't truly know... maybe they are very supportive). However, I wonder if it has become such of a unattractive job that decent coaches don't want to touch it. I'm sure there has been some decent coaches over 25 years, but just go to Hudl and watch the Indianapolis Lighthouse game. They have two high safeties that are usually 17-20 yards deep. They are not gap sound. The first steps of the linebackers are backwards. I do not like to bash coaches, but that is just poor coaching. Indianapolis Lighthouse (whoever that is) is playing pitch and catch. I did like Coach Mattingly. I wished he would have stuck around, but maybe after being there a year he figured he could not win for one reason or another. Maybe he just found a better opportunity. I do agree though... I applaud the young men for dressing up every Friday night. I just hope that either the current Admin or new Admin will supply the right coach with what they need to make the program competitive. 

4 hours ago, itiswhatitis said:

I know some people have been talking about Shelbyville and how bad they are, but what about Pike Central?  I checked and I believe in the past 25 years they have only won 31 games!  They need to get out of the Pocket Conference, go independent and schedule some easier teams and learn how to win.  That's a LONG time to deal with losing.  Their best record was 4 - 8 in that 25 year span.  Wow.

I've always been interested in Pike Central. I get that the socioeconomics might be an obstacle, but it's hard for me to accept that causes 25+ straight years of losing. There are certainly other areas of the state that struggle socioeconomically, that haven't struggled as much as PC has. I'm not sure if administration is supportive. What type of funding is supplied to the football program. Surely there has been a good coach or two there in 25 years, but I'm sure it's also difficult to build a staff in a rural small town if admin isn't willing to get assistants in the building. I don't think PC needs to get out of the PAC. Especially being in the smaller division. With the exception of Southridge, the other teams may have decent years here and there, but it's not like any of the other schools in the smaller division are true powerhouses. I would really like to see a coach and Admin get in there that could get that program competitive. 

15 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

I'm glad that not everybody shares your opinion.  You seem to cherish Indiana high school football teams with 20+ long losing streaks.  How does that make the overall sport better?

 

I'm just glad not everyone shares your opinion. An opinion that if a program finishes with 9 wins,  7 wins, 7 wins, 1 win, and likely zero wins over the past five years, then you shut down their program. I think you do a great job of playing devil's advocate on the forum, but you're really reaching here. 

3 minutes ago, dmizers3 said:

Actually yes, a 16 team tournament with 16 good teams would be much more fun.  You certainly wouldn't have to deal with 60+ point sectional championships(New Pal v Anderson last year). But I guess you'd prefer just a few more regular season games and no tournament.  I mean why would we want the season shortened and have games "taken away from kids" just because they lost.  And to address your other point, qualifications would not be based solely on W-L records.   Strength of schedule matters.

You'll have to forgive me, I don't remember saying that. 

3 minutes ago, JustRules said:

If you had a qualifying tournament you would reduce the tournament by 1 week and could add a week to the regular season. Everyone would still be guaranteed at least 10 weeks.

There are many ways you could determine qualifying and I would guess under all of them CG would make the tournament as it stands today. Just using Sagarin as an example (not the one I would propose but it's measureable). They are currently #7 in Sagarin so are well within the 16 if you used it.

I do not know the rules for Illinois, but I've been told that you generally have to win 5 or 6 games. So assuming that is true, UNDER ALL of them, that is not true. 

1 hour ago, Footballking16 said:

 

I fully support the IHSAA seeding the sectionals because it’s the first step to a qualification format which I fully endorse. The number of blowouts in round 1 if the sectionals were seeded properly would only further the case for a qualification system. In fact I believe that is the ONLY reason why the sectionals aren’t seeded, because the IHSAA would then have to justify the current all-in format.

I could careless if the sectionals were seeded, but because of what footballtalking said is why I don't support it. Why do you want to take another week of football away from kids? Especially in 5A and 6A? So that way only 16 teams make it per class? That sounds real fun! 

1 hour ago, oldtimeqb said:

Count me in the group with Bob.  If you do a full seeding, then week 1 becomes a bloodbath.  Look at your PAC brother Pike Central.  In a traditional sectional 32, no matter who is the #1 HH, GS, or Southridge, no one wants to see a 69-6, 74-0, or 70-3 repeat.  Only the IHSAA screwy geography prevents that this year by moving PC to 30.

In my opinion, seeding and qualification (and I'm in favor of a low standard - like 2 or 3 wins or certain Sagarin rank) go hand in hand. 

So since you want to use a sectional 32 team, I'll do the same. In 2010 Bosse only won 2 games during the regular season. Because they were a terrible team? No, because they play in a conference with 4A, 5A and private schools. Yet, they won their sectional, beating Memorial who had been to the State Championship the two previous seasons. 

So let's say we do a qualification system. If you're a team in a tougher conference or a smaller school in a conference with larger schools, are you leaving now? Why the world would you schedule a tough opponent in non-conference? No need for Brownsburg to schedule Ben Davis. What about a team with injuries? Especially one that may get that player back? So if you use a system similar to Illinois, I don't believe Center Grove is getting in this year. Tough luck I guess! In the end though, it boils down to why should you take a game away from kids, Mr. Scrooge? 

North by a TD

MD by 2 scores

Castle It gets ugly

It should be a good one.... I guess I go with Memorial. 

2 hours ago, FastpacedO said:

There are likely very gifted athletes in the halls of Avon that don't play football, they may not play football because they have no interest to play football and prefer focusing on another sport: Baseball, Basketball, Soccer, etc. Honestly who knows.

I think this is closer to on track as to why more kids don't play at some of these larger schools. Especially larger schools that may have some kids from poorer areas. Kids may choose to focus on one sport. With that many kids at one school, they may feel like they have to. Some kids may have to work after school to help support their family. While coaching at a inner-city school, I've had multiple students tell me that they had to watch their younger siblings after school. Some simply don't have the grades. Perhaps the program has been down and they do not want to come out and be a "loser".  I don't doubt that their are some students that don't play because they do not want to ride the bench. I do doubt that there are a lot of GREAT athletes not coming out for that reason. Bottom line, there are a LOT of different reasons why kids do not come out for football. 

Since I haven't seen his name on here, I'll say it. Mike Goebel! He has success year after year. He coaches a 2A team in a conference comprised of mainly 4A & 5A schools. In 21 years he has had one losing season. He has a state championship, multiple semi-state, regional and sectional championships.  As much success as he has had as a football coach, his career record as a wrestling coach is even more impressive! I copied and pasted those stats below.

As a wrestling coach, Goebel has set a precedent unlike any coach in the state of Indiana, and his teams head to head match record of 533-14-2 is the national record for winning percentage. Goebel has an elusive 29 City Championships, 29 Sectional Titles, 29 Regional Titles, 22 Semi-State Titles, and 12 State Titles with 1 runner-up. Coach Goebel’s run of 29 straight regionals is a state record, and his 12 state titles is the state record.

The man just knows how to coach!

Well thanks! It's just for some strange reason always bugged me on how a program could struggle so much. Other than coaching there a time or two, I don't know these areas that great. Washington has had it's own struggles over that same period, but they have at least had a few winning seasons. I just never understood why Pike Central couldn't at least be similar. Thanks for the feedback! 

On 9/5/2019 at 3:36 PM, Patriot 74 said:

Couldn't have said it better, where as if Pike were to happen to shock the conference I am sure they would be very happy as a community!!  Ala 1986!!!!!

For all of you guys that have been involved/ following the PAC for years, I'm curious to see why you think Pike Central has struggled so badly? Talent? Culture? Coach Roach was able to have success on the hardwood, so I find it hard to believe it is just because of talent. Over the last 25 years they have only had one season where they won 4 games. I'm curious to hear the thoughts of people that have been around the conference. 

North 35-14

Reitz 21-13

Mater Dei 24-21

Castle 42-7