temptation

2 hours ago, BDGiant93 said:

No need to be nasty.

It’d be like Illinois and Rutgers boasting about Ohio State making the college football playoff...

You don’t get to puff your chest out and claim conference superiority when over half of your conference’s D1 players are on one team.

10 hours ago, Bobref said:

Unfortunately, I’m sure the resolution on your screen is not good enough for you to see that right now I am playing the world’s tiniest violin 🎻.

ND is one fanbase I WON’T take crap from...

1 hour ago, Lemmy said:

Don Brown has got to go for sure.  Michigan is one of the most talented defenses in the conference and ranks near the bottom.  As much as I love what IU is doing this year, there really isn't any excuse for IU and NW to have a significantly better defense than Michigan.  Maybe Don Brown is a defensive genius, but there is no reason for them to give up so many big plays.  From afar it looks like his guys aren't dialed in to what he wants to do and therefore they make a bunch of mistakes. 

Now this we can agree on.  Michigan was slated to be the youngest of the 130 FBS schools in 2020 BEFORE Covid.  Throw in your starting QB requesting a transfer three weeks before the season starts as well as your best offensive and defensive player opting out and you have the perfect storm.

2 starting offensive linemen and two defensive linemen then get hurt in week 2 along with a starting line backer.

The secondary has gotten ripped apart but it starts with the lack of a pass rush.

Maybe shuffling the coaching deck and taking your lumps in 2020 is the best plan.  I don't know.

14 hours ago, DE said:

Coach Rodriguez and baggage?  

What is the significant back story?  Never heard. 

Harbaugh is shell of his former self because of some things going on in his personal life.  No excuse as he has a job to do and gets paid handsomely to do it.  He doesn't want anyone to feel sorry for him and only a handful of insiders in Ann Arbor know the story and one (John U. Bacon) has shared it. 

40 minutes ago, BDGiant93 said:

The MIC did tread water as the top conference in Indiana and one of the best in the Midwest. I'm sure they'll take it. 

 

2 hours ago, Ballhawk said:

The most successful MIC schools as far as the tourney goes would be Ben Davis, Warren Central, Carmel & Center Grove.  To me, the one thing these schools do is grind it out on the ground, throw just a little and play tough defense.  

I see the other MIC teams and the HCC teams and I see spread with very little defense.  Not a good recipe come November.  When Avon or Brownsburg have an off night throwing, they are pretty much screwed.

Carmel and Ben Davis simply have an enormous numbers advantage over everyone else.  (You could throw Warren in there too.). Taking nothing away from their programs or coaching staffs but facts are facts.

Warren and CG have identifies.  Warren’s has shifted by necessity but they’ve gone from a dominant offense that tries to outscore you every week in the 2000’s, to a defense that is going to challenge you for every yard.

CG’s has been discussed multiple times on here.  They have a culture and identity in place from the ground level (youth leagues) up.  They are fundamentally sound annually and will run their system to a T but also adapt it to fit their personnel.

I agree that the spread is often a recipe for failure come tournament time and that could be the case but you are still asking schools in the 2500-3000 range to compete with those in the 4000-5000 range which is a tall order.

Center Grove has figured out a way to navigate that mountain and perhaps Westfield is next.

48 minutes ago, BDGiant93 said:

You're going to make me go to the dictionary this early.😁

What’s next?

”We are taking it one game at a time?”

You have a book of these things?

2 minutes ago, temptation said:

I disagree.  The HCC has started to win its fair share of head to head battles (all be it in the regular season) with MIC schools and the Indy suburbs are beginning to develop next level players at a higher rate than the Marion County schools (the MIC should thank the lord for CG)..

I know that’s a sketchy comparison as Carmel and CG are MIC schools by name only.  Their socioeconomics/geography align (DT will tee off on this) with HCC schools more so than their MIC brethren.

They just can’t get over the hump in November for some reason.  I don’t get it.

The depth of the MIC is their biggest advantage.  In 2020 alone, I don’t  think it’s far fetched to say that the MIC boasted 7 of the top 15 teams in the state.  Hell, 0-10 LC played Lafayette Jeff fairly close.

The bottom of the HCC needs some work.

I think Noblesville at least has optimism for a bright future...FC is in no man’s land.

15 hours ago, scarab527 said:

Fair. Still, those 2 titles were at the very beginning of the decade. In the years that have followed, in my opinion, the gap between the MIC and everyone else has grown. This isn’t a knock on those other teams, the HCC has proven to be a great conference too. But the MIC has proven itself to be on a whole ‘nother level.  

I disagree.  The HCC has started to win its fair share of head to head battles (all be it in the regular season) with MIC schools and the Indy suburbs are beginning to develop next level players at a higher rate than the Marion County schools (the MIC should thank the lord for CG)..

I know that’s a sketchy comparison as Carmel and CG are MIC schools by name only.  Their socioeconomics/geography align (DT will tee off on this) with HCC schools more so than their MIC brethren.

They just can’t get over the hump in November for some reason.  I don’t get it.

9 hours ago, Footballking16 said:

Crazy to think how far Westfield has come since week 1. Granted, Cathedral has turned out far better than anyone could have imagined, but was very unimpressed with Westfield. 

Yes.  Cathedral and CG have made some pretty solid outfits look foolish this fall.

14 minutes ago, WestfieldRocks said:

That someone could be Westfield. This year, playing the same schedule as the varsity, and yes, that includes Cathedral, Westfield's JV and freshmen teams both went undefeated. Their eight grade team (not sure of their schedule) also went undefeated. 

Westfield is also experiencing faster growth than any corporation in the metro area.

They'll be 3000+ before you know it.

36 minutes ago, Muda69 said:

Maybe Jim Tressel could get coaxed out of the YSU president's office.

 

Baggage.

5 hours ago, JustRules said:

All 3. The numbers though will show by school, and I don't believe any of the districts only use neighborhood schools. For example, if there was a school in the Geist area that only took kids from the neighborhood around Geist, the F&R number would be very low. It appears Amy Beverland Elementary is close to the Geist area, and it has a 28% F&R number. Brook Park is one of the elementary schools closer to the south edge of the district, and it has a an 85% R&R number. Both schools will pull students from around the district beyond their local neighborhoods and they area already have a nearly 60 percentage point gap. If both schools only pulled from their neighborhoods I imagine the gap would be closer to that 79 percentage points. You could do similar analysis in Pike and Washington Townships. You have less affluence in the other township districts, but it's still possible to have wide disparities the closer you get to the edges of each district.

Good points and while no district boundaries are perfect (as you mentioned), a quick analysis yielded the following results.

Lawrence Township:  56 percent difference between the highest (Brook Park) and the lowest (Crestview/Amy Beverland).

Washington Township:  39 percent difference between the highest (Willow Lake/Greenbriar/Nora) and the lowest Allisonville.

Pike Township:  20 percent difference between the highest (Deer Run) and the lowest Eagle Creek.

79 percent is immense.

9 minutes ago, scarab527 said:

? 6A has been won every year by the MIC since it was first introduced. 

5A was Indiana's largest class prior so I went from 2010-2019 which included both Fishers and Lawrence Central (pre-MIC) winning titles.

19 minutes ago, scarab527 said:

Trust me, I’d love to see it happen. Maybe it will. But I doubt it. 

By 2030?  Easily.

Hell, as dominant as the MIC has been it "only" got 8 out of 10 in the last decade.

16 hours ago, scarab527 said:

The dominance of the MIC isn’t going away anytime soon. I doubt that changing scheduling is going to help. To be honest, I’d be shocked if a team that’s not in the MIC wins 6A once in this entire decade. 

I'll gladly take that bet.  DT was correct in stating that the HCC was a bit disappointing this season and took a step back but simple socioeconomics and the upgraded commitment that HCC schools are putting into football is astounding.  Common sense suggests that someone outside of the MIC will get one soon.  Maybe later rather than sooner, but if you are giving me until 2030, I will take that bet.

On 11/16/2020 at 9:54 AM, DL6 said:

This year has been pointed to by those within the Roncalli community for awhile now.

Coach Rodenberg is doing a fantastic job, but you could see this success coming without a coaching change. Strong sophomore and junior classes complimented by several seniors with lots of experience.

Roncalli was fantastic under Coach Marsh in his first year, ranked #1 in 5A for a majority of the year and losing in a close game to Cathedral in the sectional.

After that year, they were really hurt by missing out on some big-time talent from their traditional feeder programs for a variety of reasons. Eddie Schott (St. Jude) went to Southport where his dad works and is now at Ball State. Ryan Lezon (St. Barnabas) same scenario. Nate McCahill, who is having a fantastic season at Cathedral, also attended a south side catholic school. These are just the big examples as there have been several others.

People point to “recruiting” with Roncalli (which is bogus). The real recipe for success for all Indianapolis parochial schools (Chatard, Scecina, Ritter, Roncalli) is if they can keep all of the talent from their feeder schools. Roncalli has done that in the past several classes and it is now showing.

It showed in 2016 as well, as that team was driven by strong junior and senior classes in which most or all of their feeder school talent went to Roncalli.

Recruiting is no longer (if it ever was) a logical complaint that can be used as open borders basically allow every school to "recruit."  The public schools just justify it in the current era by saying, "Privates have done it for years and we are just trying to keep up."

Basketball "recruiting" is as rampant as its ever been, especially in central Indiana right now.  It has become about stockpiling as much talent as you can based on summer leagues and friendships formed in the offseason between players and coaches as well as players and other players.

The "real" recipe (folks are going to get tired of me saying this in every thread) is the fact that families that send their kids to parochial schools are most often affluent, two parent households, with college educated parents who place a high priority on education.  THAT is the difference more so than "keeping all of their talent from their feeder schools."

Privates will always have an advantage and its not due to recruiting as much as it is due to SES.

1 hour ago, BDGiant93 said:

Please look and see where I made a prediction (other than it might be closer than many think).

Never said you made a specific prediction kind sir, but outside of "defense wins championships" your justification defaulted to two idioms with no substance.

2 hours ago, Grover said:

I have a different memory about 2008.  I remember CG scoring pretty much at will right out of the gate but I could be wrong.

The 2014 game will make me will think of Max Norris's hamstring every time I see him.

I assume you are referring to BD.  How has their SES changed in 20 years?

Free and reduced lunch rates have jumped an average of about 2 percent annually in Wayne Township in the last two decades.

The earliest data provided on the DOE website is 2006 and at that time 54 percent of Wayne Township students were on free and reduced lunch.

Fast forward to 2020 and that number is now just over 70 percent (though the district has gone to universal free breakfast and lunch as of last year).

BD will continue to remain competitive at the state level simply because of the fact that they have the second largest talent pool in the state (4500 students) to choose from.

19 minutes ago, Coach Nowlin said:

@temptation 

Let's hear why you support retaining Coach Harbaugh 

I have never come out and stated that I support retaining him, but I am having trouble coming up with a realistic candidate who has an overall body of work/resume that compares to Jim's.

One thing is for sure, the UM athletic department WILL NOT cut corners that other programs are willing to cut.  That is not an excuse but eliminates anyone with baggage (Hugh Freeze comes to mind).

There is a pretty significant backstory as to why Harbaugh is not the same guy that he used to be and its actually pretty sad/depressing.

I think if he somehow gets to 3-5/4-4 this season, he gets a Covid pass but the D coordinator falls on the knife.

Did ND fire Brian Kelly after their 4-8 season?  How has that turned out?  There are many parallels to both the ND/UM program on and off the field.

5 minutes ago, crimsonace1 said:

I graduated from Pike in the early 1990s and that was definitely the case. We had a broad range from very upper-middle-class/upper-class areas, to solidly working-class neighborhoods with older housing stock and very low SES populations. The further south you went from 96th Street to 38th Street (and the further east - especially inside I-465), generally, the more the socioeconomics changed.

A LOT has changed since the early 1990's.

20 minutes ago, JustRules said:

All 3. The numbers though will show by school, and I don't believe any of the districts only use neighborhood schools. For example, if there was a school in the Geist area that only took kids from the neighborhood around Geist, the F&R number would be very low. It appears Amy Beverland Elementary is close to the Geist area, and it has a 28% F&R number. Brook Park is one of the elementary schools closer to the south edge of the district, and it has a an 85% R&R number. Both schools will pull students from around the district beyond their local neighborhoods and they area already have a nearly 60 percentage point gap. If both schools only pulled from their neighborhoods I imagine the gap would be closer to that 79 percentage points. You could do similar analysis in Pike and Washington Townships. You have less affluence in the other township districts, but it's still possible to have wide disparities the closer you get to the edges of each district.

Good call/research.  Still mind blowing.

16 minutes ago, vicvinegar said:

Because they would have won otherwise, right? 🤣

I mean, you could easily make the case, sure.  We will never know.  

4 minutes ago, JustRules said:

I live in one of those districts and I can tell you it's very possible. If there was a school that was based in the neighborhood of the most affluent areas of the district, the F&R numbers would be extremely low. If there was a school that based in the neighborhoods closer to 38th Street (all 3 reach down that far) the F&R numbers would be 80%+. I believe all 3 districts though distribute all students through all schools so the demographics are closer to the make-up of the district with some home school preference.

The numbers are easy to access.  What townships are you referring to?  Lawrence, Washington and Pike I assume?

24 minutes ago, SAC_Coach said:

 

Add to that they now hold the tie breaker over Valpo and will host Semi-State at home as well. So Zionsville did not play a sectional championship and will host both Regional and Semi-State. 

Dwenger should be livid...

1 hour ago, BDGiant93 said:

Ben Davis is a completely different team than they were before. That said, Center Grove is what BD 2017 and Warren 2018 were...one of the best teams in history. They are loaded. BD has to play some mistake-free football, but I think they can keep it closer than most believe. They are playing with no pressure right now and are playing motivated football.

Warren was also "playing with no pressure" and was "playing motivated football"...