temptation

8 hours ago, jets said:

Parochials/Private play UP a class. It’s really that simple. I’ve walked the halls of a public school- I’ve walked the halls of private/parochial-  They(P/P) just have a different clientele. It’s really that simple. 

The IHSAA are just cowards when it comes to the subject. 

It really IS that simple, yes.  

On 11/24/2020 at 6:52 AM, southend said:

God, another thread hi jacked by the DT haters. 
 

He owns so much space in some people’s heads...

Can anybody tell me what Harrell uses for his projections?  I’ve always wondered.

Its not Sagarin.

26 minutes ago, Jon said:

In 5a and 6a state championship games going back to 2010. 15 points wins 50% of games, 21 points wins 85% of games. Your 30 points would of won all but one game and that game was between Fort Wayne Snider and New Palestine 64-61, no defense in that game.

Good data.  I stand corrected.  I wonder what the data says at the college/pro level.

38 minutes ago, Knightmare said:

I think there is an argument for proximity to students, but it's more of a problem for 1A and 2A programs in extremely rural areas.  Luers, Mater Dei, and Lutheran all benefit from being able to get way more students than say Prairie Heights or North White because of their location in highly populated metro areas.

 

HOWEVER, this is about Danville and Chatard.  Of course the Tri-West guy is trying to deter the conversation because he doesn't want to see either of these teams in his sectional or regional next year because Danville or Chatard have eliminated the Bruins from the playoffs the last 5 years...

 

🔥

11 minutes ago, BDGiant93 said:

It's a coin flip.

A coin flip and then the winning coach gets to decide or a coin flip stating "heads you are this, tails you are this?"

15 minutes ago, Jon said:

Some Center Grove Stats from Digital Scout so don’t yell at me if they are wrong.

• Average Score.  CG: 42 – opponent: 7
• Only 3 games starters have played entire game (AKA running clock for the others).
• Average rushing yards per game.  Opponent: 38,   CG: 260
• Average passing yards per game.  Opponent : 119,  CG: 126
• Best team CG played.  Cathedral Stats: 54 rushing yards, 126 passing yards,  1 offensive TD
• Six games were opponents had 15 or less rushing yards.  2 teams had negative rushing yards.   Ben Davis: -3, North Central: -9 
• Most CG Yards per game.   Rushing: 322 against Carmel,  Passing: 265 in 1^st half against Columbus North
• CG Kicking.  30 touchbacks, 2 FG over 45 yards

I am going with CG. CG just has too many offensive weapons and like old saying says Defense Wins Championships.  

In my opinion, "defense wins championships" is the most outdated mantra at all levels of football, perhaps why you called it an "old saying."

In the modern era of football, you need to get to 30 points to win more often than not...

Now, CG turns defense into offense fairly consistently, but that's another story.

2 minutes ago, WolvesOnTheProwl said:

I really thought Jim Harbaugh would be home run hire for Michigan, but it just hasn't happened. I mean he's had success in college, NFL, and is a "Michigan" man that I thought would have great success. I thought I read somewhere that JH suffers from memory loss and shows signs of CTE and I wonder if that has effected his coaching ability. I don't know where they turn to from here, it's still Michigan and I'd think they'd have a lot of applicants to go through. Do they turn to an up and comer or someone who's had P5 or NFL success? Or do they stick it out one more year and give him a pass due to 2020 being 2020?

That CTE argument was pure speculation and irresponsible journalism, even if true.  He does have things outside of football going on that are definitely affecting his coaching ability.  Like I said above, no excuses when you are paid as handsomely as he is.

It is also important to remember his track record and that he did not just suddenly forget how to coach football.  Folks may say he is more suited for the NFL game but he did have impressive runs at San Diego and Stanford also.

1 minute ago, Gipper said:

We all walk a slippery slope...

 

I’m going to change my stripes and not be anti-IU today.  Allen’s had a good run at IU.  Not only do we take note, but deep pocketed ADs do as well.  Why be a (well paid) #2 at a basketball school, when you can be the man/head dog/big cheese/numero uno honcho somewhere else?

Side argument (sure to get folks fired up):  IU hasn't been a "basketball school" in over 25 years...

Football coaches tend to make more than those on the hardwood for obvious reasons but it is interesting that Archie and Allen make similar figures.

2 minutes ago, BTF said:

I thought IU had a recent class that was ranked in the Top 25.

 

Not even close.  Their 2019 class did crack the top 40.  Still not a recipe for long term success in the Big Ten East.

4 minutes ago, BTF said:

The one thing I always appreciated about Michigan was their above average standard for student athletes. Not on par with Notre Dame, Stanford, and Northwestern, but not far off either. 

Which is why I think Fitzgerald would be intriguing.  Don't see it happening but fun to talk about.

2 minutes ago, DE said:

What you said.  Big boy/heavy TE sets, etc.

@temptation

Happy Thanksgiving to you 2 gentlemen too.

I know 2020 is crazy, but those big boy/heavy TE sets sure as hell did knock out Oklahoma this year in the offensive minded Big 12...

Think Michigan would kill for one win over the top dog in its conference these days?  I sure as hell do.

2 minutes ago, BTF said:

I must be out of the loop. Tom Allen is already making 4 million. Can a program like Indiana afford anymore? Allen is Indiana though and through. I'm not sure he would take a higher paying position elsewhere. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.............lesson learned from the Rich Rod debacle. 

Good point.  I mean one thing the B10 does consistently do is pay its coaches competitively.  Allen is top 40 in America in salary, but that is only good for 9th in the Big Ten.  Having some roots in FL, maybe Allen goes after the Miami job if Diaz doesn't work out?  Would be a lateral step financially, but a massive upgrade in potential talent/ability to compete annually.

Side topic (maybe deserving of a separate thread), did Lincoln Riley miss his shot last year?  I know the Cowboys gig is a train wreck right now but has some of the shine worn off?

If so, Allen better look at all offers this offseason.  The Hoosiers have a young stud in Pennix but don't have the classes coming in behind him to make 2020 much more than an anamoly.

3 minutes ago, Gipper said:

Good analysis.  As much as it pains me, I see ND in the ACC on a permanent basis.

Thanks, I am just glad I behaved and did used the phrase "recruiting standards/admissions" as opposed to what I really wanted to type.

9 minutes ago, Gipper said:

Don’t forget about Venable at Clemson.  Dabo’s put together a fantastic run, but as soon as Saban leaves Tuscaloosa, he’ll be on the next flight west.

And then Venables slides into the driver's seat at Clemson.  No arguing from anyone here.  Clemson to Michigan is a definite step down in terms of talent, recruiting standards/admission, access to talent, etc..

Unless ND makes a permanent move to the ACC, its also a free pass to the playoff annually.

1 minute ago, DE said:

When I watch ISU I see a lot of similarities to UM.  I do not think it is bad.  But others do.

Great, respectful football banter.  Thanks @Gipperand @temptation

What specifically are you referring to?

Just now, DE said:

There is NO WAY that Ryan Day would leave OSU for Michigan.  None!  NFL?  Sure.

Fickell?  If he didn't take MSU, he is not taking UM.  I can see him staying at Cincy for awhile until OSU opens up when Day goes to the NFL or him going to the NFL, alas Mike Vrabel.

Mullen?????  Leave the SEC East which is a relative cakewalk to the conference championship vs. Bama, LSU or Auburn.  Yeah.  Just not seeing that either.

3/3

Just now, Gipper said:

How about some Brady Hoke?

Been there, done that.

Dude's absolute refusal to wear a headset and clap repeatedly for 4 hours every Saturday turned people off.

1 minute ago, Gipper said:

And what’s Skip Holtz up to?

Being too old.  If we are bailing on Harbaugh, I want a younger innovative guy.

1 minute ago, Gipper said:

Either.  Although this football season has been anything but normal, there has been some good coaching performances.

Michigan looked at Mullen twice before the Harbaugh/Hoke hires. 

If willing, I'd take a LONG look at Muschamp for D coordinator.  That job will DEFINITELY be open this winter.

8 minutes ago, DE said:

You know way more about UM than i do.....you keep saying never bring in someone with baggage.  Didn't they do that with Rich Rod?  Or is this a new "thing" since after Rich Rod.  Sorry if you already answered it.

Out of the 3 you listed Campbell, Cristobal and Heupel.  I have heard from some ISU fans, he is very happy there (whatever that means) and is more interested in the NFL.  Is his system too much like Harbaughs?  He does have STRONG ties to Ohio.

Can't see Cristobal.  Can see Heupel.

Joe Brady would be very interesting.  What are his recruiting ties?

I would think a guy like Chadwell will need to go to a notch or 2 above CC before he gets a gig like UM.  Maybe a UCF if Heupel got a bigger job.  That type of thing.

They did do that with Rich Rod and (though I could go on and on about outside influences that limited his success there) but they just won't do it again.  It was not a popular hire with the alumni and former players so he was given a short leash.

Michigan could double Campbell's salary as he currently makes $3.5 million.  I think he would at least take a look.

As far as "Harbaugh's system" what is it anyway?  He brought his Stanford "man ball" theory to UM in 2015.  Placed a large emphasis on the TE and methodical running game.  They then lost to OSU in dominating fashion and out thought themselves.  In modern football, you need an offense that can easily score 30 to have a shot.  

With each passing "disappointing" season, they began to change their recruiting philosophy to mirror other spread teams (cough, OSU) and decided to try the "speed in space" concept.  Problem is, they did not initially have the players to run it effectively. 

Now, they do have the personnel, but they are young.  Josh Gattis brought his playbook from Bama and it appears (though its a small sample size) they have their QB for this year.  (They do have a stud from IMG in JJ McCarthy coming in next year however.)

Brady really has no recruiting ties other than the fact that he gets credit for Joe Burrow.  I think he is a long shot, but is a young, enthusiastic guy with big ties to Florida/the southeast.  It is a necessity to recruit that part of the country in order to be successful.

I do think that Allen has done an amazing job at IU but lets pump the brakes a bit.  Teams WILL throw money at him this fall and he HAS to listen, but I think it is a bit premature.  Love his energy, passion and love for his players but I need to see more.

3 hours ago, southend said:

The obvious pick is Center Grove. Is there anyone that thinks Westfield will win? Oh I’ve read they have a punchers chance or the score might be closer than you think and so on. But that still says you are picking Grove to win. 
Anyone taking Westfield?

I'm taking the points.  Does that count?

32 minutes ago, Indiana Fan said:

Saw where the Trojans are wearing the Home Red jerseys. This is the first time they have worn these in Lucas Oil. They usually go with the all Whites.

Don't believe its a choice, no?

2 hours ago, DE said:

If Coach is not coaching at UM after this season, what about a guy like Sarkisian?

Kiffin?

Whether some like it or not, his name will be tossed out there.....

Hugh Freeze?  He had a comment just this weekend. He is doing very well at Liberty. 

Baggage on all three.  Sarkisian is a Carroll disciple and has had his run ins with the booze.  

Kiffin's lack of ethics has been widely publicized and Freeze is coming off of a scandal at Ole Miss.

Once again, Michigan will NEVER entertain bringing someone on board with prior convictions.  Whether I agree or not is moot, as it is not even worth entertaining, which lowers the applicant pool significantly, lol.

You can also eliminate anyone (Howard, Woodson, Hart) without head coaching experience or at least NFL experience as a coordinator.

I think a guy like Matt Campbell at Iowa State would be entertaining.  Mario Cristobal at Oregon (though I don't think he would leave) intrigues me a bit too.  Maybe Josh Heupel?  Pat Fitzgerald (though I also think he would not be interested)?

Guys like Chadwell and Allen are not Michigan material and I need to see more long term success before I'd make them a viable candidate for a blue blood job, especially in what's been a wild and crazy 2020.

A coordinator name that is generating some interest in Michigan circles is Joe Brady.

But once again, if Harbaugh gets to 4-4 this year (and maybe even 3-5), they will shuffle the deck chairs, fire Don Brown and make a run at it in 2021, which I firmly believe they should.

9 hours ago, PHJIrish said:

Yep!

And he has each and every one of you in the palm of his hand...daily.

5 minutes ago, DE said:

I was thinking Mike Hart.....

Next...

48 minutes ago, Gipper said:

Next man up?  Juwan Howard is having a certain degree of success on the hardwood.  Do you see a Desmond Howard or Charles Woodson stalking the sidelines at the Big House?

 

”I will have a Michigan man coaching a Michigan team.”

 

—Bocephus Schembechler

 

 

ZERO chance, and I wish the phrase “Michigan man” would just die already.

2 hours ago, TheStatGuy said:

Problem is. Michigan's fan base thinks it's at that level still. 

Can't completely disagree but the difference between Michigan and the programs mentioned is that Michigan is still a top 15-20 team annually.  Those others have fallen off the map.

There are really only 4-5 elite programs, then about 25 who compete for the remaining top 10 spots annually.  Michigan is in that second tier despite being the media's favorite punching bag at times.

Just now, BTF said:

IU struggled mightily with that from the time the fired Mallory until they settled on Allen. 

Correct.  But they knew their place in the football hierarchy, had realistic expectations for their program from both administration and alumni and it is now paying dividends.

Some programs (like the ones I mentioned above) are still living on past glory and cave to pressure.