Bonecrusher

3 hours ago, Muda69 said:

Sounds like a consolidation of Southern Wells and Blackford County schools would be a smart move.

 

That consolidation would put them in the top 3rd of 3A enrollment.  I know about SW's recent football woes, and doesn't look like Blackford's been having much success, either.  Wonder if combining two lackluster programs would net much of a gain.  Larger pool of athletes, yes, but what is the quality of those athletes?  Speaking strictly about football and not trying to knock the kids.  Maybe there would be gains in other sports.

What I don't know is how those two communities would feel about consolidating.  But doesn't look likely, so it's all speculation at this time.

On 1/8/2023 at 9:26 AM, HoopsCoach said:

Southern Wells is not closing and really isn’t in jeopardy of potential closure any time soon.  That was a rumor that got started several years ago by some people in the district who wanted to make sure the tax referendum would pass.  Fear is a common motivator used to drum up votes and when some of the tight wad farmers in the district raised opposition to the referendum, the rumor got started that the school would close if it didn’t pass.  The tax referendum passed then, and it was just renewed in the November election, which will continue to help with funding.  The enrollment at the elementary level has gone up this year with the closure of Montpelier Elementary and there seems to be some optimism that things will get better down the road.

Back to the main topic, SW‘s program has been struggling because they haven’t been able to develop any significant investment from their athletes.  Many choose not to play football, and several who play have little interest in working to get better.  Some certainly do, but not enough to turn the cultural around and get the support they had in the LeFebvre era.  The ACAC does not have anywhere near the depth of the MAC in football, so the opportunity to win games and get athletes to buy in is much more likely at SW.  It’s tough to build belief in the program if the wins don’t come, and Parkway faces a greater challenge to get those wins than SW.

If Parkway was the 8th member of the ACAC, I would be more optimistic that they could win more games than SW.  A move to the ACAC would probably benefit Parkway, and if they aren’t winning enough games in the MAC to get into the tournament in Ohio anyway, what would they have to lose?  At least they could win some games and build some optimism for the future.  That being said, I don’t think a move to an Indiana conference is a realistic possibility.  I know schools from Illinois have played in an Indiana conference, but I’m not familiar with any from Ohio.  Indiana schools could easily do it since we have an all-in tournament.  SW doesn’t have to worry about qualifying for the tournament, so that is one less obstacle to turning their fortunes around.

I'm a tad late to the party on this.  Ran the whole SW closing thing up the flagpole with a few members of the wife's side of the fam, who live in the district and know what's going on, but didn't hear back right away.  Got basically the same response as this one.  I'm glad to hear that.  Recent football success (or lack thereof) issues aside, it's a nice school in a nice community.  I was skeptical when I first heard about it, but sometimes you never know what's really going on.

1 hour ago, Basementbias said:

This comparison will probably limit most since one school is in Ohio. The comparison is Southern Wells and Parkway (Rockford) OH. Both have been at or near the bottom of their conferences. Each are close to me, and looking for a new coach. 

Southern Wells has a history of success. 2001 1A state champs and probably could have won in 2000 if they didn't blow it to my Jets that became state champs that year. During my HS days they were battling for 1st/2nd/3rd with Heritage & AC as well as Garrett. They ended my career and made it semi state losing to the juggernaut that was/is Sheridan. However in recent times they've struggled to field a varsity team and haven't won much at all. Plus there are rumblings that the school could close.

Parkway is in the mighty MAC that is the best small school football conference in Ohio and one of the best in the country. Parkway won the first conference crown and a couple more after. However that was in the early to mid 70s. It's been downhill ever since. They are the only school in the conference for football without a state title after New Bremen won in 2020 (NB won this year as well). Their schedule is brutal for the conference slate and they've had a tough time making the playoffs. Also seems like they do not have the athletes or enough of them like their conference foes.

So if you were a potential coach, what is the better job? Which is the tougher rebuild?

This is interesting news.  I have family on my wife's side that would be in the know about this; I'll ask around, or have her ask, and see what comes back.

Coaching-wise, I would probably pick SW due to the fact that their success has been more recent.  Maybe parents/community would be more apt to buy-in if the new guy made some progress? Another factor could be that, besides AC & SA, the ACAC might not be quite as tough of a conference as what Parkway has to deal with?

12 hours ago, Basementbias said:

Yep our Jets will be 2A next cycle either by enrollment or success factor. Our enrollment keeps growing as families are leaving Bellmont due to the Chicago natives moving into Decatur. Also some AC alums in other surrounding school districts not finding the rare available house in AC district as well.

Curious as to what's attracting the Chicagoans to Decatur?  Relocated manufacturing or something like that?

3 hours ago, Robert said:

New Haven? Concordia? Woodlan?  Dwenger?  Interesting on where they could rent. 

Any of those four would be logical choices.  Woodlan would probably have the best "small school" feel, but beggars can't be choosers.

Another, albeit not quite as attractive, option is Harding.  No action Friday nights anymore at that school, so they wouldn't have to worry about working around the "real" home team's schedule.  Little farther drive, but with Maplecrest going straight through to 930 it wouldn't be unreasonable.  My father still lives on the outer edge of the SE side and he can make it to Georgetown Square, via Maplecrest, in what seems like no time at all.

I did pick one winner correctly, though.  Texas 4A-DI China Spring beat Boerne 24-21.  CS went into halftime down 21-0, came out and scored 24 unanswered points.  Game winner was a 20-something yard FG kicked with I think 3 seconds left on the clock.  They are next to the school district my kids went to, so always pulling for them to do well.  They won state last year, so a nice repeat win.

2 hours ago, foxbat said:

I knew about the Refugio pronunciation.  There are lots of places in Texas that have off-sounds on the city/town names.  I always like Waxahachie, Seguin, Mexia, Nacogdoches, and of course, Luckenbach.

Like you said, with 15-18 year old kids, it's not smart to bet the farm.  Depends on what side of the bed they get up on ... even if there bed is up against a wall. 🙂

When were looking at houses just prior to our move to TX, I got caught mis-pronouncing Mexia when I saw it on a highway sign.  The realtor corrected me immediately.

4 minutes ago, Basementbias said:

Dean Pantazzi just tweeted it out. Have to believe that they will join the ACAC.https://twitter.com/DeanPWPTA21/status/1604915874208645120?t=B9pD9F032Ws8XM0hKERjwQ&s=19

I know folk that attend Blackhawk's church.  Did they only do 1 season of 8-man?  Gonna be a big jump.  Might get a few wins in the ACAC.  First season could be a hefty learning curve.  Does anyone know what their attendance numbers are?  What class would they be in?  Assume 1A or 2A.

On 12/18/2022 at 10:42 AM, foxbat said:

Looks like Hawley and Albany have slain the giants, while Aledo is the stuff of myth and legend.

St. Aug's loss to DeSoto earlier in the season looks pretty respectable in light of DeSoto's thrashing of fellow-6A Vandegrift.

Hats off to SOC too for its back-to-back wins this season and last.  Since the age of suburban dominance, it's the only DISD school to win a state championship in almost three-quarters of a century.

Very true.  Both were big time underdogs and punched the favorites in the mouth.

The previous week (semi's), Hawley beat a local (to me) team, Crawford.  My kid's school plays Crawford every year and they are always tough.  They seemed to always have our number.  Hawley's semi-state win vs. Crawford was by 14 pts; their state win vs. Refugio was by 26 points, nearly double.  The game vs. Crawford was very close throughout and only in the 4th did Hawley pull away when Crawford had to sub due to injuries.  Hawley was in control vs. Refugio from the start and the guys I talked to that either went to the game or watched on TV said Hawley's lead was never in doubt.  Many here feel like the de facto state championship was the previous week vs. Crawford.  Fun fact: Refugio is not pronounced like it's spelled.  It's pronounced "Refurio".  The story behind it is kinda funny if you're ever looking for something to Google.

Albany vs. Mart, yeah that did not go according to plan AT ALL.  Mart is the Texas 2A, Div. II version of Center Grove (IN) or Aledo (TX).  Nobody, I mean nobody, saw that one coming.  Not even the Albany people were predicting a woodshedding like what took place.  The score does not accurately show how lopsided the game really was, according to those who were there.

15-18 year old kids, go figure.

23 hours ago, Bonecrusher said:

Rep'ing the smaller schools here...

Class 2A, Div. 2 (smallest class/div in 11-man) Mart (15-0) vs. Albany (13-2) tonight.  This will be Mart's 13th time playing for a championship with 8 wins.  Three-peated in 2017, 18,19; runner up in 2020; knocked out in the semi's in 2021 by 4 pts.

Class 2A, Div. 1 Refugio (14-1) vs. Hawley (15-0) Thursday. This will be Refugio's 10th time playing for a championship with 5 wins.  2019 was both the last appearance at the ship and the last title.  Their coach has been jokingly referred to as one of the most hated high school football coach in Texas.

Class 4A, Div. 1 China Spring (14-1) vs. Boerne (15-0) Friday.  China been to 4 championships, with 2 titles.  One of those wins was last year, so looking to repeat.

When my kids played (youngest graduated in 2018) we played Mart, they were a bigger school then and in our district, that was 100% a guaranteed "L" for us.  There's something in the water in that community, and also Refugio.

I'll bet @foxbat knows about Mart, maybe Refugio.

Somewhat familiar with Aledo's program, from reading about them in news and on football forums.  I think their coach wasn't real well liked either, for the same reason as Refugio's.

Been a good week for west Texas teams so far.  Both 6-man (1A) classes won by west Texas teams.  The Mart vs. Albany game won by west Texas team (Albany).  The current game Refugio vs. Hawley, Hawley another west Tx team leads 34-13 at HT.  In one of the 6-man games and both 2A games, the central or south Texas teams were heavily favored over west Texas.

3A and larger are all central/south/east TX teams.  A few of these are from the DFW/Houston/San Antonio areas.  Impressive run for the big country teams, though.

Rep'ing the smaller schools here...

Class 2A, Div. 2 (smallest class/div in 11-man) Mart (15-0) vs. Albany (13-2) tonight.  This will be Mart's 13th time playing for a championship with 8 wins.  Three-peated in 2017, 18,19; runner up in 2020; knocked out in the semi's in 2021 by 4 pts.

Class 2A, Div. 1 Refugio (14-1) vs. Hawley (15-0) Thursday. This will be Refugio's 10th time playing for a championship with 5 wins.  2019 was both the last appearance at the ship and the last title.  Their coach has been jokingly referred to as one of the most hated high school football coach in Texas.

Class 4A, Div. 1 China Spring (14-1) vs. Boerne (15-0) Friday.  China been to 4 championships, with 2 titles.  One of those wins was last year, so looking to repeat.

When my kids played (youngest graduated in 2018) we played Mart, they were a bigger school then and in our district, that was 100% a guaranteed "L" for us.  There's something in the water in that community, and also Refugio.

I'll bet @foxbat knows about Mart, maybe Refugio.

Somewhat familiar with Aledo's program, from reading about them in news and on football forums.  I think their coach wasn't real well liked either, for the same reason as Refugio's.

Few more Texas games to add to the list that should really be good, and also a nod to a couple smaller schools....

Class 2A, Div. I

Crawford (13-0) vs Tolar (13-0)  Crawford rank 7 and Tolar 5 in TX coaches poll per Maxpreps.

Class 2A, Div. II

Mart (13-0) vs. Lovelady (12-0)  Mart rank 2 and Lovelady 7 in TX coaches poll per Maxpreps.

The school my kids went to played both Crawford and Mart over the years.  Mart is the textbook definition of a perennial football powerhouse.  Crawford not too far behind.  Like CG, they don't rebuild - they reload.  Mart spread but can run, balanced offense, insane speed and athleticism year after year.  Crawford will punch you in the mouth repeatedly and when you finally commit to defend the run immediately burn you with the long ball.  A couple years my kid's teams might have reached the finals if not for one of these two.

Class 4A, Div. I

China Spring (12-1) vs. Anna (13-0)  CS rank 1 and Anna 2 in TX coaches poll per Maxpreps.

My youngest played youth football in the China Spring youth system, they got some ballers.

Keeping my underdog/FW area homer picks going for this game, too.

Give me Adams Central by a TD.

From a fellow ACAC team member, GATA!

3 hours ago, Komets2727 said:

So Carroll beats the #1 team in the state, HSE, in a game they controlled throughout, yet Center Grove is going to manhandle Carroll? Not following the logic here. CG may very well win this game, as almost every person predicted that HSE would beat Carroll, but give some respect to Carroll. They aren’t scrubs and beat a 6A powerhouse in convincing fashion.

Well said sir.

Going with the underdog/FW homer pick.  Carroll 28-24.

On 11/15/2022 at 12:35 PM, BTF said:

I always felt that Snider played poorly when they traveled long distances to the Region or Indy. I actually researched this last week, but couldn't find any data to back it up. When it comes to data, I have to side with Temp on this one. 

My common sense tells me that a two hour bus ride has to have some sort of negative affect. Maybe there is a difference between riding in a bus 20-30 years ago vs riding in a bus today. Do teams still travel in the run of the mill yellow school buses? If so, that kind of sucks for two hours. The buses Snider took to Mishawaka looked like luxury busses to me. That could be the difference right there. 

Goldrush could argue that it took Snider an entire half to find their footing against Mishawaka and MAYBE had something to do with going down 21 points. Personally, I just think the game came down to adjustments for the Panthers.

Being a Penn guy, I can see where Goldrush may have a point. The Kingsman seem to play MUCH better at home than they do when they travel. It didn't do them any favors this year against Carroll. But it seems like they play they Indy teams better when they don't travel. 

Tenaha is a 2A, Div.II school in east Texas, the smallest classification that plays 11- man.

On 11/15/2022 at 9:58 AM, temptation said:

Don't put words in my mouth.  I stated that in this specific case, it won't make much of a difference.  Its actually not really provable so anyone can throw out theories.  You can't point to a fumble, a missed tackle, an interception or a kick that misses wide left as being due to travel.

Its an overstated built in excuse/idiom that has grown legs over time.  Sports are filled with them.

"Its tough to beat a team three times."

"Two quarterbacks mean you really don't have one."

I could go on all day.

These are high school kids.  Two hours is round trip to the grocery store in some rural places.  Don't overthink it.

Side note, check the other thread.  I have Whiteland "overcoming" a long bus ride to Newburgh and rolling Castle.

Correct.  I have done the same and am over twice the age of anyone playing Friday night.

How do they ever do it in Texas, Florida and California?

We have had drives of 1:45 to 2:00 for regular season games down here.  2:30 is not unusual for playoff games.  I think it's all your frame of mind.  For central/west TX that is the norm, you get used to it.

So far, the general opinion seems to be going against 3 of the 4 FW area teams getting a "W" this round.  Snider by 14.

I'll be the "homer" for this one.  I'll take the Knights by a TD.  Here's hoping they beat the odds 2 weeks in a row.

AC wins in single digits.  Game not decided until late Q4.

Snider & Carroll

I like this thread.  Ya'll are startin' ta think like Texans.

1. Football   2. 2-a-days   3. Stick ball   4. Huntin'/Fishin'   5. Brisket smokin'   6. 4 wheelin'   7. Round ball

3 hours ago, coachkj said:

 Correct me if I'm wrong, didn't the New Pal softball team lifted on the day of one of their state championships.  There are STILL baseball coaches who believe (even in the off season) that pitchers shouldn't lift like every other athlete. Really unbelivable.

Really?  On THE day of a SC game?  Someone please tell me what rationale I am missing out on here, and why this should make sense.

20 hours ago, Basementbias said:

Should do Huntington North for Luers vs Bluffton as a neutral site.

That's a good suggestion - I wish I'd thought of it.  We used to live about 1/4 mile away from that stadium when we first got married.  That makes me feel even dumber for not considering HN lol! 

Do they have turf now?  I thought I read they do.

On 11/5/2022 at 7:33 PM, Coach Nowlin said:

in this scenario (I am a proponent I think of neutral sites at this level) are sites pre determined, if they are what happens when host site school is still playing, a lot of your school personnel who would need to be there for the 2 visiting teams would also need to be at their own school's game, if not pre determined, and based on after Sectionals, does it give Host Schools and visitors 6 days enough time to pull it off with all the people and linguistics?   

 

That's a fair question.

I won't even pretend to know the logistics of it, but down here they make it work.  I would think there would be at least a base level of pre-planning required, since all playoff games are neutral sites, and venues aren't decided until that night's games are over.  Obviously adults with kids playing wouldn't be expected to stay home and work concessions, or something like that.  You would have to have some level of commitment from other staff/faculty/volunteers.  I don't even know if those people are paid.  The host school does get a percent of the gate, but it's probably not very high after the UIL (IHSAA for ya'll) takes their cut.  Probably the longer you do it, you come up with a system.  Pros & cons to everything.

On 11/5/2022 at 1:20 PM, jakone said:

Luers would have to travel twice as far as Bluffton if the game is at Norwell. Bellmont is about the same distance for both schools.

On 11/5/2022 at 12:38 PM, Yuccaguy said:

Nice selection of Neutral Sites...

BUT, There is NO WAY Norwell hosts that contest!  Wells County hatred runs generational deep!  Also, Bluffton has turf anyway.  It remains a "home game" for the Tigers. 

There's always Heritage.  Turf, 3A sized stands.  But the travel advantage flips to Luers in that scenario.

Someone's gonna get screwed a little bit re. travel time with neutral sites.  Deal with it.  Make it worth that extra time and win! (As told to a group of parents - and later the players - by my sons HC several years ago.  We won.)