HoopsCoach
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Posts posted by HoopsCoach
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1 hour ago, oldtimeqb said:
I agree.
I like what @HoopsCoach sketched out, but I just don't see IHSAA members passing a rule that requires a school to do anything football related. In basketball maybe, but we aren't there yet in football.
I also like the Saturday playoff game feel. Yes, it's a different routine than Friday school then a game, but if you have advanced to the final 4 or 8 it should feel a little different. Plus a 1 pm and 4:30 pm start should hopefully have a little better weather in November.
I honestly don’t think the requirement to be willing to host is necessary - just an idea and I agree that it would be unlikely to have support from the IHSAA board. If the IHSAA would simply give schools more of an incentive to host, I think a lot more would be willing. Covering the cost of hosting and letting the host keep concession revenue just doesn’t make it worth the effort for an AD to want their school to host. Spreading more of the wealth from tourney revenues to host schools, and giving more schools a chance to pull in some of those revenues by letting them host (instead of the same schools that have admin on the IHSAA executive committee always hosting when others are willing) would help incentivize hosting and maybe eliminate any need to mandate hosting.
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It’s definitely possible. I think Ohio has a rule that requires a school to be willing to host any round of the tournament to be eligible to host any games. I doubt that the executive committee would push for that here.
I prefer the 2 games at 1 site on Saturday format like we have for basketball. I’ll just use this past season as an example. Here’s what it could have looked like.
@Elkhart
New Prairie/Northridge
Andrean/Eastside
@Warsaw
Brebeuf/Marian
North Judson/Adams Central
@Lafayette Jeff
Merrillville/Westfield
Michigan City/Zionsville
@Franklin Central
Center Grove/Ben Davis
Indy Lutheran/Tri
@Bloomington South
Mount Vernon/Evansville Memorial
Scecina/Mater Dei
@Bloomington North
Cathedral/New Albany
Tri-West/Gibson Southern
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Not trying to pat myself on the back, but I did this enrollment thing a hell of a lot better than the IHSAA did. All they need to do is ask and I can take care of it for them. They have my number.
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2 hours ago, Indiana Fan said:
Mid-State West- Plainfield, Decatur Central, Mooresville, Martinsville, Bloomington North, Bloomington South
Mid-State East- Southport, Perry Meridian, Greenwood, Whiteland, Franklin, Columbus North
1 Nonconference, 5 Inter division games, 2 games from other division, Championship week 9 (1vs1, 2vs2, 3vs3, 4vs4, 5vs5, 6vs6).
There are some different sizes of schools in the Mid-State, but I do not think the difference in sizes is too much for a sport like football. All these schools would benefit from many factors, especially the proposed new schools from CI. I am not sure if Mid-State members are open to expansion, but I do think this would be one heck of a new conference and push to being one of the best in the state. There would be so many great matchups and rivalries with great crowds and exposure.
There is already a growing enrollment disparity between the 4 largest and 4 smallest of the 8 current Mid-State members. The addition of Southport and Columbus North would only escalate it. I would expect Greenwood and possibly Martinsville to consider leaving if this became a reality. Greenwood is a landlocked school district that relies on out-of-district transfers for any growth. Martinsville continues to lose enrollment to families leaving for Center Grove. Greenwood’s application to the Hoosier Heritage Conference would probably be submitted immediately after the approval of what you are suggesting. If new membership requires unanimous approval from current members, I would expect Greenwood and Martinsville to block these additions.
Southport 2379
Perry Meridian 2373
Columbus North 2219
Whiteland 2012
Decatur Central 2001
Plainfield 1810
Bloomington South 1655
Bloomington North 1592
Franklin Community 1571
Mooresville 1391
Martinsville 1284
Greenwood 1186
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19 hours ago, BTF said:
I thought of it. Didn't we conclude that Delta was the instigators and that they had issues with other programs as well? Wayne's only crime was that they didn't turn the other cheek.
(my perspective from the outside looking in)
It wasn’t Delta. It was Mississinewa.
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2 hours ago, Indiana Fan said:
Curious, is there any word on if they are freezing it for one more year? Or reclassifying? Needs to be reclassified now!
Haven’t seen anything official, but it wouldn’t surprise me if the IHSAA delays reclassification for one more year.
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2 hours ago, NLCTigerFan07 said:
You're joking right? There's no reason why the IHSAA would put Ben Dvais in Sectional 8 and move Center Grove to Sectoinal 6 unless I'm completely missing something here. Sorry if I am.
IHSAA just rubber stamps the recommendations of the alignment committees. The committees are usually made up of AD’s or administrators from schools in that class, so all it would take is one person on the alignment committee that doesn’t want Ben Davis in their path. If, for example, a Warren Central admin is on the 6A committee and decides they don’t want to play both BD and CG in the tournament, putting them in the same sectional solves that problem. And don’t think it hasn’t happened. It does in almost every alignment cycle.
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17 hours ago, HoopsCoach said:
One correction to make - I didn’t have Christel House Manual in my first post. I also added enrollment rank.
305 Indianapolis Manual 225
I still messed this up. Added Christel House and didn’t take out Indy Manual. There should be 316 schools. 32 in 5A and 6A. Probably 63 in each class for 1A-4A.
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1 hour ago, NLCTigerFan07 said:
The issue in 6A North with Cathedral in 6A is at least two teams between Zionsville, Westfield, Noblesville, Fishers, HSE and Carmel will HAVE to go to sectionals 1-3 somewhere. There are only 10 schools north of those schools, so 2 will have to go that way for their sectionals. My best guess is the "northern" most of that grouping is Noblesville and Westfield. Noblesville has been in a sectional with Fort Wayne schools in the past, so that makes sense for them to definitely be 1 of the schools heading WAY north. Westfield having to go a long way up Highway 31 to be included in Sectional 3 seems crazy, but the only other logical option would be to send Zionsville up Highway 65 with Laf Jeff and 2 region schools.
2 options as I see it:
Sectional 1: Crown Point, Lafayette Jeff, Lake Central, Portage
Sectional 2: Elkhart, Penn, Warsaw, Westfield
Sectional 3: Carroll (FW), Homestead, Noblesville, Northrop
Sectional 4: Carmel, Fishers, Hamilton SE, ZionsvilleSectional 1: Crown Point, Lafayette Jeff, Lake Central, Zionvsille
Sectional 2: Elkhart, Penn, Portage, Warsaw
Sectional 3: Carroll (FW), Homestead, Noblesville, Northrop
Sectional 4: Carmel, Fishers, Hamilton SE, WestfieldAnything different than either of these two options would come from breaking up schools that normally the IHSAA has not done in the past. Something crazy like this could work, but doesn't seem likely
Sectional 1: Crown Point, Lake Central, Penn, Portage
Sectional 2: Elkhart, Lafayette Jeff, Northrop, Warsaw
Sectional 3: Carroll (FW), Fishers, Hamilton SE, Homestead
Sectional 4: Carmel, Noblesville, Westfield, ZionsvilleSee what I mean? That's just really messy. I think they obviously keep these "pods" together when it comes to the North
Lake Central and Crown Point (2)
Penn and Elkhart (2)
Carroll, Homestead and Northrop (3)
Fishers and HSE (2)That's 9 of 16 6A North schools that I feel like the IHSAA always trieds to keep together. Another random options could be:
Sectional 1: Crown Point, Lake Central, Penn, Portage
Sectional 2: Elkhart, Carroll (FW), Homestead, Northrop
Sectional 3: Lafayette Jeff, Noblesville, Warsaw, Westfield
Sectional 4: Carmel, Fishers, Hamilton SE, ZionsvilleI think Cathedral is in 6A if the IHSAA realigns this spring for the 22-23 and 23-24 cycle. Wouldn’t be surprised if they take the cowardly stance of saying let’s go 1 more year with frozen enrollments.
Here’s what I see for 6A:
Sectional 1: Lake Central, Crown Point, Portage, Lafayette Jeff
Sectional 2: Penn, Elkhart, Warsaw, Homestead
Sectional 3: Carroll, FW Northrop, Hamilton Southeastern, Fishers
Sectional 4: Noblesville, Carmel, Westfield, Zionsville
Sectional 5: Cathedral, Lawrence Central, Lawrence North, North Central
Sectional 6: Avon, Ben Davis, Brownsburg, Pike
Sectional 7: Perry Meridian, Southport, Arsenal Tech, Warren CentralSectional 8: Center Grove, Columbus North, Franklin Central, Jeffersonville
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14 minutes ago, MarshallCounty said:
Where these the numbers reported last year? I don't believe the IHSAA has released the fall numbers, and spring count isn't until February. When the IHSAA figures class enrollments don't they take the average from the 2 counts to determine school placements?
These are from the Department of Education, not the IHSAA, and they are from the fall count day this year (21-22). I post them as a preview of what we could see for classification, not a guarantee. I don’t know if the IHSAA will consider spring enrollment counts.
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11 hours ago, Old Man High Pants said:
While I think East Central would be better suited as an independent I don't think they ever will be. I've always gotten the feeling that East Central likes their position and won't do too much to compromise that.
East Central would fit in the Southwest Ohio Conference with their rival and neighbor Harrison. It’s currently a 6 school conference - Harrison, Ross, Talawanda, Edgewood, Northwest, and Mount Healthy. All have around 850-1200 students, and their longest trip would be 50 minutes to Edgewood. As a 7 team conference, they would still have 3 open weeks for non-conference games with Lawrenceburg, Roncalli, and Moeller.
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40 minutes ago, HHF said:
Random comments :
Purdue Poly is on the east side of downtown Indy on Washington Street. They probably have quite a few students from the former Indianapolis Howe that didn’t want to go to Arsenal Tech after Howe closed. If the Howe campus is available it would make a lot of sense to move this school there.
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47 minutes ago, oldtimeqb said:
By my count, that puts FW Northrop as #31, assuming Cathedral is SF to 6A as #32, making WL Harrison the team that benefits and its the largest of 5A.
Bill Peebles helping his brother Terry have one more cycle in 5A.
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One correction to make - I didn’t have Christel House Manual in my first post. I also added enrollment rank.
1 Carmel 5327
2 Ben Davis 4557
3 Warren Central 3845
4 North Central (Indpls.) 3709
5 Fishers 3611
6 Hamilton Southeastern 3430
7 Pike 3387
8 Penn 3345
9 Elkhart 3294
10 Avon 3248
11 Noblesville 3220
12 Lake Central 3211
13 Franklin Central 3206
14 Brownsburg 2983
15 Crown Point 2923
16 Lawrence North 2833
17 Center Grove 2754
18 Westfield 2611
19 Homestead 2502
20 Carroll (F.W.) 2472
21 Southport 2379
22 Perry Meridian 2373
23 Portage 2269
24 Lawrence Central 2245
25 Zionsville 2233
26 Columbus North 2219
27 Lafayette Jefferson 2153
28 Indianapolis Arsenal Tech 2111
29 Jeffersonville 2099
30 Warsaw 2087
31 Fort Wayne Northrop 2080
32 Harrison (West Lafayette) 2079
33 Valparaiso 2063
34 Whiteland 2012
35 Merrillville 2003
36 Decatur Central 2001
37 Chesterton 1995
38 Goshen 1980
39 Castle 1933
40 South Bend Adams 1917
41 Hammond Central 1904
42 Fort Wayne Snider 1872
43 Floyd Central 1854
44 Anderson 1837
45 Plainfield 1810
46 McCutcheon 1807
47 New Albany 1787
48 LaPorte 1756
49 Hammond Morton 1729
50 Concord 1689
51 Evansville North 1687
52 Bloomington South 1655
53 Terre Haute South 1650
54 Seymour 1604
55 Bloomington North 1592
56 Mishawaka 1584
57 Terre Haute North 1575
58 Franklin Community 1571
59 Munster 1568
60 Columbus East 1534
61 Michigan City 1526
62 Fort Wayne North Side 1513
63 Kokomo 1488
64 Greenfield-Central 1474
65 Huntington North 1442
66 Muncie Central 1437
67 Northridge 1410
68 Pendleton Heights 1409
69 Bedford-North Lawrence 1391
70 Mooresville 1391
71 Fort Wayne South Side 1385
72 Fort Wayne Wayne 1379
73 Mt Vernon (Fortville) 1375
74 Richmond 1315
75 Martinsville 1284
76 East Central 1264
77 Evansville Reitz 1264
78 Hobart 1264
79 Logansport 1252
80 Gary West Side 1226
81 Greenwood 1186
82 Jennings County 1180
83 New Palestine 1162
84 Indianapolis Crispus Attucks 1135
85 Shelbyville 1133
86 Evansville Harrison 1124
87 Columbia City 1108
88 East Chicago Central 1107
89 Indianapolis Roncalli 1081
90 DeKalb 1080
91 Plymouth 1079
92 Indianapolis Cathedral 1073
93 Lowell 1068
94 Kankakee Valley 1055
95 Evansville Central 1051
96 New Haven 1047
97 East Noble 1042
98 Jasper 1038
99 Marion 1036
100 South Bend Riley 1030
101 Highland 1021
102 Indianapolis Shortridge 1015
103 Lebanon 1001
104 New Prairie 985
105 Connersville 981
106 Beech Grove 968
107 Leo 963
108 Northview 955
109 Wawasee 945
110 Fort Wayne Bishop Dwenger 928
111 Silver Creek 911
112 Indianapolis Washington 906
113 Frankfort 893
114 Boonville 879
115 Northwood 879
116 New Castle 875
117 Jay County 871
118 Brebeuf Jesuit 841
119 Western 838
120 Culver Academies 832*
121 Mississinewa 808
122 South Bend Saint Joseph 806
123 South Bend Washington 801
124 Edgewood 800
125 Angola 793
126 Norwell 790
127 Delta 781
128 South Bend Clay 778
129 Evansvill Bosse 776
130 Hanover Central 763
131 Yorktown 763
132 Danville 759
133 Franklin County 756
134 West Lafayette 752
135 Guerin Catholic 740
136 Washington 738
137 Madison 736
138 Hamilton Heights 731
139 Corydon Central 730
140 Vincennes Lincoln 722
141 Charlestown 717
142 Greensburg 716
143 Lawrenceburg 715
144 Scottsburg 715
145 Batesville 707
146 Gibson Southern 703
147 West Noble 698
148 Crawfordsville 695
149 Mishawaka Marian 690
150 South Dearborn 689
151 North Harrison 687
152 Indianapolis Bishop Chatard 667
153 Rushville 656
154 Twin Lakes 655
155 Owen Valley 650
156 Peru 650
157 Mt Vernon (Posey) 643
158 Bellmont 641
159 John Glenn 636
160 Tri-West 624
161 Calumet 622
162 Heritage 615
163 Heritage Hills 615
164 Fort Wayne Concordia 610
165 Griffith 609
166 Northwestern 605
167 Maconaquah 604
168 Garrett 602
169 Princeton 596
170 Indian Creek 591
171 Jimtown 582
172 Lakeland 578
173 Purdue Polytechnic (23-24) 563
174 Tippecanoe Valley 561
175 Evansville Memorial 556
176 Knox 551
177 North Montgomery 549
178 Fairfield 543
179 Speedway 543
180 Woodlan 538
181 Monrovia 531
182 Salem 531
183 Oak Hill 526
184 West Vigo 525
185 Centerville 517
186 Rensselaer Central 517
187 Boone Grove 516
188 Southridge 515
189 Pike Central 512
190 River Forest 511
191 Western Boone 511
192 South Vermillion 509
193 Benton Central 508
194 Frankton 507
195 Bremen 502
196 Indianapolis Cardinal Ritter 502
197 Brown County 501
198 Christel House Manual 501
199 Evansville Mater Dei 496
200 Heritage Christian 496
201 Cascade 495
202 Hammond Bishop Noll 493
203 Alexandria 492
204 Rochester 492
205 Blackford 489
206 Eastbrook 489
207 Southmont 487
208 Brownstown Central 483
209 Whiting 482
210 Fort Wayne Bishop Luers 481
211 Manchester 479
212 Lapel 477
213 Greencastle 475
214 Sullivan 472
215 Bluffton 471
216 Wabash 471
217 Triton Central 461
218 Eastern (Greentown) 455
219 Tipton 454
220 Mitchell 451
221 North Posey 445
222 North Putnam 444
223 Tell City 440
224 Indianapolis Scecina 439
225 Wheeler 436
226 Prairie Heights 432
227 Switzerland County 428
228 Northeastern 425
229 Eastern (Pekin) 419
230 Delphi 418
231 Central Noble 417
232 Whitko 417
233 Crawford County 415
234 Shenandoah 415
235 Lewis Cass 411
236 Elwood 410
237 Andrean 408
238 Winchester 405
239 Paoli 401
240 Churubusco 397
241 Clarksville 395
242 Union County 393
243 Perry Central 392
244 Lake Station Edison 388
245 LaVille 388
246 North Knox 388
247 Eastside 387
248 Seeger 387
249 Winamac 387
250 Linton-Stockton 386
251 Forest Park 383
252 Eastern Hancock 379
253 Park Tudor 378*
254 South Spencer 375
255 Parke Heritage 368
256 Adams Central 366
257 South Putnam 359
258 North Newton 358
259 Clinton Prairie 353
260 Covenant Christian (Indpls.) 352
261 Madison-Grant 352
262 Taylor 352
263 Carroll (Flora) 337
264 South Adams 334
265 Hagerstown 332
266 Sheridan 329
267 Knightstown 328
268 Providence 327
269 North Judson 323
270 Eastern Greene 321
271 Monroe Central 320
272 Milan 318
273 Pioneer 313
274 South Central (Union Mills) 313
275 Cloverdale 312
276 Riverton Parke 311
277 North Decatur 301
278 Lafayette Central Catholic 296
279 Covington 294
280 Fremont 291
281 North Daviess 286
282 Wes-Del 286
283 Bowman Academy 285
284 North Miami 285
285 Tecumseh 283
286 Fountain Central 275
287 Northfield 273
288 Cambridge City Lincoln 272
289 North White 272
290 West Washington 268
291 Springs Valley 264
292 South Decatur 260
293 Triton 258
294 North Central (Farmersburg) 257
295 Culver 255
296 Clinton Central 252
297 Southern Wells 252
298 Union City 246
299 Anderson Prep Academy 241
300 Southwood 240
301 Caston 234
302 Tri 234
303 Tri Central 233
304 Edinburgh 227
305 Indianapolis Manual 225
306 South Newton 225
307 Indianapolis Lutheran 224
308 Indianapolis Tindley 219
309 Tri-County 218
310 North Vermillion 213
311 Frontier 196
312 West Central 196
313 Dugger Union 193
314 Rock Creek Academy 176
315 Attica 170
316 Traders Point Christian 124
317 Indiana Deaf 94* -
Finally released by the DOE. Schools with an * do not report enrollments to the DOE, so their numbers are just what the IHSAA has in their directory and may not be current. Enrollments only include students in grades 9-12. Probably not perfect, but it should give an idea what the next alignment would be based off of.
Dugger Union will become tourney eligible in 22-23, and Purdue Polytechnic will become tourney eligible in 23-24, so they are both included.
Carmel 5327
Ben Davis 4557
Warren Central 3845
North Central (Indpls.) 3709
Fishers 3611
Hamilton Southeastern 3430
Pike 3387
Penn 3345
Elkhart 3294
Avon 3248
Noblesville 3220
Lake Central 3211
Franklin Central 3206
Brownsburg 2983
Crown Point 2923
Lawrence North 2833
Center Grove 2754
Westfield 2611
Homestead 2502
Carroll (F.W.) 2472
Southport 2379
Perry Meridian 2373
Portage 2269
Lawrence Central 2245
Zionsville 2233
Columbus North 2219
Lafayette Jefferson 2153
Indianapolis Arsenal Tech 2111
Jeffersonville 2099
Warsaw 2087
Fort Wayne Northrop 2080
Harrison (West Lafayette) 2079
Valparaiso 2063
Whiteland 2012
Merrillville 2003
Decatur Central 2001
Chesterton 1995
Goshen 1980
Castle 1933
South Bend Adams 1917
Hammond Central 1904
Fort Wayne Snider 1872
Floyd Central 1854
Anderson 1837
Plainfield 1810
McCutcheon 1807
New Albany 1787
LaPorte 1756
Hammond Morton 1729
Concord 1689
Evansville North 1687
Bloomington South 1655
Terre Haute South 1650
Seymour 1604
Bloomington North 1592
Mishawaka 1584
Terre Haute North 1575
Franklin Community 1571
Munster 1568
Columbus East 1534
Michigan City 1526
Fort Wayne North Side 1513
Kokomo 1488
Greenfield-Central 1474
Huntington North 1442
Muncie Central 1437
Northridge 1410
Pendleton Heights 1409
Bedford-North Lawrence 1391
Mooresville 1391
Fort Wayne South Side 1385
Fort Wayne Wayne 1379
Mt Vernon (Fortville) 1375
Richmond 1315
Martinsville 1284
East Central 1264
Evansville Reitz 1264
Hobart 1264
Logansport 1252
Gary West Side 1226
Greenwood 1186
Jennings County 1180
New Palestine 1162
Indianapolis Crispus Attucks 1135
Shelbyville 1133
Evansville Harrison 1124
Columbia City 1108
East Chicago Central 1107
Indianapolis Roncalli 1081
DeKalb 1080
Plymouth 1079
Indianapolis Cathedral 1073
Lowell 1068
Kankakee Valley 1055
Evansville Central 1051
New Haven 1047
East Noble 1042
Jasper 1038
Marion 1036
South Bend Riley 1030
Highland 1021
Indianapolis Shortridge 1015
Lebanon 1001
New Prairie 985
Connersville 981
Beech Grove 968
Leo 963
Northview 955
Wawasee 945
Fort Wayne Bishop Dwenger 928
Silver Creek 911
Indianapolis Washington 906
Frankfort 893
Boonville 879
Northwood 879
New Castle 875
Jay County 871
Brebeuf Jesuit 841
Western 838
Culver Academies 832*
Mississinewa 808
South Bend Saint Joseph 806
South Bend Washington 801
Edgewood 800
Angola 793
Norwell 790
Delta 781
South Bend Clay 778
Evansvill Bosse 776
Hanover Central 763
Yorktown 763
Danville 759
Franklin County 756
West Lafayette 752
Guerin Catholic 740
Washington 738
Madison 736
Hamilton Heights 731
Corydon Central 730
Vincennes Lincoln 722
Charlestown 717
Greensburg 716
Lawrenceburg 715
Scottsburg 715
Batesville 707
Gibson Southern 703
West Noble 698
Crawfordsville 695
Mishawaka Marian 690
South Dearborn 689
North Harrison 687
Indianapolis Bishop Chatard 667
Rushville 656
Twin Lakes 655
Owen Valley 650
Peru 650
Mt Vernon (Posey) 643
Bellmont 641
John Glenn 636
Tri-West 624
Calumet 622
Heritage 615
Heritage Hills 615
Fort Wayne Concordia 610
Griffith 609
Northwestern 605
Maconaquah 604
Garrett 602
Princeton 596
Indian Creek 591
Jimtown 582
Lakeland 578
Purdue Polytechnic (23-24) 563
Tippecanoe Valley 561
Evansville Memorial 556
Knox 551
North Montgomery 549
Fairfield 543
Speedway 543
Woodlan 538
Monrovia 531
Salem 531
Oak Hill 526
West Vigo 525
Centerville 517
Rensselaer Central 517
Boone Grove 516
Southridge 515
Pike Central 512
River Forest 511
Western Boone 511
South Vermillion 509
Benton Central 508
Frankton 507
Bremen 502
Indianapolis Cardinal Ritter 502
Brown County 501
Evansville Mater Dei 496
Heritage Christian 496
Cascade 495
Hammond Bishop Noll 493
Alexandria 492
Rochester 492
Blackford 489
Eastbrook 489
Southmont 487
Brownstown Central 483
Whiting 482
Fort Wayne Bishop Luers 481
Manchester 479
Lapel 477
Greencastle 475
Sullivan 472
Bluffton 471
Wabash 471
Triton Central 461
Eastern (Greentown) 455
Tipton 454
Mitchell 451
North Posey 445
North Putnam 444
Tell City 440
Indianapolis Scecina 439
Wheeler 436
Prairie Heights 432
Switzerland County 428
Northeastern 425
Eastern (Pekin) 419
Delphi 418
Central Noble 417
Whitko 417
Crawford County 415
Shenandoah 415
Lewis Cass 411
Elwood 410
Andrean 408
Winchester 405
Paoli 401
Churubusco 397
Clarksville 395
Union County 393
Perry Central 392
Lake Station Edison 388
LaVille 388
North Knox 388
Eastside 387
Seeger 387
Winamac 387
Linton-Stockton 386
Forest Park 383
Eastern Hancock 379
Park Tudor 378*
South Spencer 375
Parke Heritage 368
Adams Central 366
South Putnam 359
North Newton 358
Clinton Prairie 353
Covenant Christian (Indpls.) 352
Madison-Grant 352
Taylor 352
Carroll (Flora) 337
South Adams 334
Hagerstown 332
Sheridan 329
Knightstown 328
Providence 327
North Judson 323
Eastern Greene 321
Monroe Central 320
Milan 318
Pioneer 313
South Central (Union Mills) 313
Cloverdale 312
Riverton Parke 311
North Decatur 301
Lafayette Central Catholic 296
Covington 294
Fremont 291
North Daviess 286
Wes-Del 286
Bowman Academy 285
North Miami 285
Tecumseh 283
Fountain Central 275
Northfield 273
Cambridge City Lincoln 272
North White 272
West Washington 268
Springs Valley 264
South Decatur 260
Triton 258
North Central (Farmersburg) 257
Culver 255
Clinton Central 252
Southern Wells 252
Union City 246
Anderson Prep Academy 241
Southwood 240
Caston 234
Tri 234
Tri Central 233
Edinburgh 227
Indianapolis Manual 225
South Newton 225
Indianapolis Lutheran 224
Indianapolis Tindley 219
Tri-County 218
North Vermillion 213
Frontier 196
West Central 196
Dugger Union 193
Rock Creek Academy 176
Attica 170
Traders Point Christian 124
Indiana Deaf 94*
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18 hours ago, Muda69 said:
Carmel's proposed 2022 6A tour schedule:
@ Penn
Lafayette Jeff
@ Columbus North
Merrilville
@ Carroll (Fort Wayne)
Southport
@ Franklin Central
Chesterton
@ Warsaw
Some of those matchups are possible, but many of those schools have conference games from weeks 3-9. That will make it tough for Carmel and Center Grove to fill their schedule with some of them. I think CG, Carmel, and the MIC schools may have to continue to play in the regular season out of necessity.
Here is a potential schedule for both schools based upon non-conference availability for the opponents. I don’t know the political stance of each MIC school towards Carmel and CG, so the schools who are willing to play them are just a guess. Maybe Ben Davis would be willing to play, but I get the impression they led the movement to vote the suburban schools out.
CG
1 Warren Central
2 Merrillville
3 Cincinnati St. Xavier
4 Columbus North
5 Lawrence North
6 Carmel
7 Bloomington South
8 East Central
9 Cathedral
Carmel
1 Homestead
2 Westfield
3 Cincinnati Elder
4 Cathedral
5 North Central
6 Center Grove
7 Chatard
8 Warren Central
9 Louisville Trinity
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If Warren Central drops Center Grove with their removal from the MIC, the Warriors would have a week 1 opening to fill potentially with Snider. Warren Central may want to continue the series with Center Grove but they could move it to a week later in their season with both schools potentially having more openings.
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12 minutes ago, jakone said:
The last time the SAC had out of conference games Luers played Toledo Whitmer and Columbus Bishop Hartley.
I think the main obstacle would be getting games with either of those schools in week 1 or week 2 (the problem with any of the opponents I included as “wish list”. When Luers played Hartley it was in week 8, and the one year they played Whitmer it was in week 4. They replaced Whitmer with Leo for the next two years before the SAC went back to 10 teams.
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1 hour ago, jakone said:
Why play teams you might meet in the playoffs. Being a Luers fan I would like them to play teams they haven't played before.
Who would you want to see them play?
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The biggest challenge will be finding their desired opponents in week 1 or week 2 only. If they had the option of playing out of conference during other weeks, more options could be considered. Here are a few ideas. “Wish List” opponents are those that probably couldn’t be worked out based upon current schedules and games the opponent would not want to drop to pick up an SAC school.
Homestead - Wish list: Elkhart. Realistic: Week 1 Carmel, Week 2 Valparaiso.
Carroll - Wish List: Elkhart. Realistic: Week 1 Chesterton, Week 2 Harrison (WL).
Snider - Wish list: Merrillville. Realistic: Week 1 Lafayette Jeff, Week 2 Penn.
Dwenger - Wish list: Cathedral, Roncalli, Brebeuf. Realistic: Week 1 South Bend St. Joseph, Week 2 Chatard (after they drop Arsenal Tech, see South Side below).
Luers - Wish List: Andrean, Mishawaka Marian. Realistic: Week 1 Indianapolis Scecina, Week 2 Leo.
Northrop - Wish List: South Bend Washington/Clay/Riley. Realistic: Week 1 Anderson, Week 2 South Bend Adams
Concordia - Wish List: Indianapolis Lutheran. Realistic: Week 1 Culver Academies, Week 2 Norwell
North Side - Wish list: South Bend Washington/Clay/Riley. Realistic: Week 1 Huntington North, Week 2 Hammond Central
South Side - Wish list: South Bend Washington/Clay/Riley. Realistic: Week 1 Marion, Week 2 Arsenal Tech (renewed series).
Wayne - Wish list: South Bend Washington/Clay/Riley. Realistic: Week 1 New Haven, Week 2 Indianapolis Attucks
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18 hours ago, HHF said:
http://www.ossaa.com/Football.aspx
Oklahoma has a similar problem as does Indiana. It has a small number of schools (Jenks/Union) in Tulsa that dominate the biggest class, same as we do in Indianapolis with our Big 4 (WC/BD/CA/CG) Indiana has approx twice the population of Oklahoma, so the Class structures make sense.
Oklahoma has 16 schools in the biggest class, and they break it up into 2 Divisions of 8 schools each, by enrollment, with a 3 week tournament
We can and should do the same thing in Indiana, leaving 6A with 32 schools and breaking them into 2 16 school subgroups, with a 4 week tournament This will create another class tournament and another state champion, and give some very deserving schools an opportunity to win a title.
Had we used the 6A1 and 6A2 class setup this year, our tournaments would have looked like this :
Class 6A1
1112 Carmel High School 1,359 1,338 1,267 1,322 5286 AAAAAA 1 2221 Ben Davis High School 1263 1075 1100 1061 4499 AAAAAA 2 3433 Warren Central High School 961 962 960 938 3821 AAAAAA 3 4344 North Central (Indpls.) High School 973 939 872 943 3727 AAAAAA 4 5 7 9 14 Fishers High School 950 887 862 810 3509 AAAAAA 5 6555 Penn High School 840 856 782 860 3338 AAAAAA 6 7866 Lake Central High School 827 850 795 844 3316 AAAAAA 7 8677 Pike High School 909 825 792 769 3295 AAAAAA 8 9988 Hamilton Southeastern HS 827 803 840 803 3273 AAAAAA 9 10 10 10 12 Avon High School 838 770 724 763 3095 AAAAAA 10 11 11 11 10 Noblesville High School 805 744 750 702 3001 AAAAAA 11 12 12 12 11 Crown Point High School 735 704 697 719 2855 AAAAAA 12 13 14 16 18 Brownsburg High School 726 676 693 715 2810 AAAAAA 13 14 13 13 13 Franklin Central High School 759 719 700 626 2804 AAAAAA 14 15 33 44 16 Indpls. Arsenal Technical High Schoo 614 716 696 582 2608 AAAAAA 15 16 17 19 20 Lawrence North High School 702 607 632 655 2596 AAAAAA
Class 6A2
17 16 15 17 Center Grove High School 648 640 630 603 2521 AAAAAA 17 18 18 20 23 Perry Meridian High School 626 619 605 595 2445 AAAAAA 18 19 15 14 9 Portage High School 620 586 621 609 2436 AAAAAA 19 20 19 18 21 Homestead Senior High School 678 580 586 580 2424 AAAAAA 20 21 21 24 28 Carroll (F.W.) High School 597 652 598 565 2412 AAAAAA 21 22 25 34 40 Westfield High School 668 573 563 530 2334 AAAAAA 22 23 20 17 15 Lawrence Central High School 539 565 616 570 2290 AAAAAA 23 24 23 26 26 Southport High School 588 589 559 518 2254 AAAAAA 24 25 22 21 19 Merrillville High Sch 564 527 557 539 2187 AAAAAA 25 26 24 25 25 Warsaw Community HS 548 511 518 526 2103 AAAAAA 26 27 30 33 32 Lafayette Jefferson High School 587 492 546 438 2063 AAAAAA 27 28 31 28 29 Columbus North High School 568 535 470 490 2063 AAAAAA 28 29 28 29 30 Chesterton Senior High School 561 512 509 481 2063 AAAAAA 29 30 36 43 44 Zionsville Community High Sch 553 504 492 506 2055 AAAAAA 30 31 27 27 24 Valparaiso High School 511 477 529 537 2054 AAAAAA 31 62 61 63 68 Elkhart High School
Schools will move up and down between the classes based on enrollment changes and the Success Factor. CG, with 2 straight state titles, would likely be bumped up into 6A1. CGs next enrollment number will probably put them in the Top 16 anyway. Tech will certainly drop out, and LN could as well.
We would add a 10th regular season game for these schools as they have the depth and resources to take on an additional game. The 10th game would occur in week 10, week 11 would be a bye week, and the the two 6A tournaments would run weeks 12-15.
The 10th game would be a 32 team open draw where the IHSAA would match 6A1 schools vs 6A2 schools o avoid any potential overlap of tournament games.
We could see some great matchups like Ben Davis vs Merrillville, Fishers vs Homestead, Noblesville vs Warsaw, etc.
What are your thoughts.
Oklahoma knows a little about football. Wouldn't hurt Indiana to follow The Sooner State's lead on this one.
Did you copy and paste your topic from 2 years ago?
https://gridirondigest.net/topic/2012-time-to-fix-the-broken-6a-tournament/
The enrollment differential from largest to smallest within classes 2A to 6A I/6A II in Oklahoma are very similar to the differentials in classes 1A to 6A in Indiana. Oklahoma has fewer schools in most of the classes and some very small schools in Classes A, B, and C. Other than that, the size of schools is very similar in Oklahoma 2A and Indiana 1A, Oklahoma 6A II and Indiana 5A, Oklahoma 6A I and Indiana 6A, etc.
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18 minutes ago, HHF said:
Didnt they say that about New Castle?
Kokomo appears to be all in on football and unless they have a lifetime contract to remain in the NCC, all options are on the board, especially now given that the CG/CA MIC departures are likely to force moves in other conferences.
True that many New Castle faithful said for many years that they would never leave the NCC. It may just be my perception from being at Kokomo, but I felt like any administrator or AD to suggest leaving the conference would be immediately escorted out by the arms.
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3 hours ago, HHF said:
I dont see the Duneland reaching out and saving the 3 Lafayette nomads. A better option is for Lafayette to create its own city based conference with its core 5 schools and invite 3 more to join. Those 3 would be Kokomo, Logansport and Lebanon.
Harrison
Jeff
McCutcheon
LCC
WL
Kokomo
Lebanon
Logansport
This is a huge jump in overall football competition for all schools and a massive reduction in travel.
For those who might feel that this is too much for LCC, 2A Luers competes in The SAC with 6A schools. 2A Mater Dei competes in the SIAC with 5A schools, and 3A Marian and St Joe compete in the NIC with mega 3000 plus enrollment 6A schools.
I like the idea, I just don’t think there is any way it will happen (just like my suggestion that the 3 Tippecanoe County schools would fit nicely in the Duneland). Kokomo will never leave the NCC. Logansport is only slightly more likely than Kokomo to ever leave the NCC. Lebanon’s growth has not happened the way some thought it would and they have stayed in the range of 1000 students for quite a few years (940 in 2000, 1017 in 2020). Frankfort and Lebanon are both unlikely to consider leaving the Sagamore and would improve the level of competition for the Tippecanoe County schools compared to the NCC. I think LCC would be reluctant to take their lumps from the bigger schools all season because it could jeopardize their post-season runs. Keeping the status quo is the easiest choice for these schools (and AD’s).
I like the schedule flexibility of 6 or 7 team conferences. AD’s don’t like it because it forces them to fill dates in schedules that aren’t guaranteed with conference games (especially in football). 8 team conferences have been the goal for many, and I can understand why. Getting back to the main topic of the MIC, if I were those 6 schools I wouldn’t be in a rush to fill the void left by Carmel and Center Grove.
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1 hour ago, foxbat said:
Jeff / Harrison are likely to move together due to the fact that both will be 6A. McCutcheon is currently, and likely to stay 5A. It's highly likely that, wherever Harrison goes McCutcheon would likely follow, but I also don't know that that is a given.
McCutcheon would be fine for sports, although the female sports have thrived more than the male sports recently. Their women's volleyball just won state this year and are in the set of favorites to do it again next year. Women's soccer has also done well in the NCC. Boys' basketball has taken conference a couple of times recently.
Nothing against McCutcheon, but a big part of the focus with Harrison moving up to 6A, since they just passed Jeff in numbers, is playing more than two competitive 6A schools a season. Right now the NCC only provides Jeff as their 6A foil along with non-conference Westfield. Occasionally, Kokomo, in 5A, squeezes into that mix, but that set of three provides a problem should Harrison move up to 6A and decide that they would like to strive deeper in the post-season. If not, then staying in the NCC is fine for them. I suspect that the former is where the program is likely headed.
Harrison and McCutcheon are a package deal, and Jeff likely stays with them in any conference moves. I don’t think the size of schools they play in football matters as much as the quality of the competition. The bigger concern for the 3 Tippecanoe County schools is the lack of competition in sports other than boys basketball. Their best fit in terms of competitive balance and similar enrollments would be the Duneland Conference. The Lafayette area schools have played Duneland schools in many sports, and the drive times wouldn’t be that different from their current trips in the NCC. The Duneland schools would be reluctant to expand south when their conference currently has 8 members that are all relatively close together. The time zone change would be a problem also. I would not be surprised if Harrison and Jeff end up in a 6A sectional with 2 Duneland Conference schools.
The regular season series between Harrison and Westfield is ending. Harrison will play West Lafayette and Plainfield as non-conference opponents. Lafayette Jeff has switched from West Lafayette and Lawrence Central to Cathedral and Michigan City for their 2 non-conference games. McCutcheon plays Guerin Catholic and West Lafayette.
8-Man Football
in The Indiana High School Football Forum
Posted
The NCC plays varsity Friday night, followed by JV and/or Freshman games on Saturday. Usually late morning and early afternoon for the JV/Freshman games. Occasionally a Monday evening game will be played, but they are normally on Saturdays.