BTF

Your argument doesn't hold water. Since 6A's inception 11 years ago, the three largest schools own seven titles versus Center Grove's four. I'm not buying the "Carmel continues to slide" argument. They have two of the last eight titles. Four titles in the last seventeen years but none the seventeen years before that. Wondering why Hamilton Southeastern, Fishers, Noblesville, Avon, Brownsburg, and Westfield have yet to win a 6A title. Their programs aren't as good? Coaching is subpar?

C'mon. The three largest schools have 28 combined titles since 1978. The rest of the field combined has 18. I'm not asking for much here, just a small amount of acknowledgment. Maybe something like this: "Carmel, Ben Davis, and Warren Central are all great programs, but they have had an enrollment advantage over their competition over the years." I don't think it's that hard to say.

Enrollment is just part of the equation. I've been saying that since the beginning. I just find it comical that most posters from Indy refuse to acknowledge it. No one is asking for "enrollment is the REASON for our success," only "enrollment is partially what makes us successful in 6A." I don't think that's asking much. C'mon, just say it. Repeat after me. You too Bash. "Enrollment makes a difference at the 6A level." That's all I'm asking. In your mind, it could just be 5% of the equation, who cares. Just repeat the words.

Why Penn isn't producing D1 players at the rate Fort Wayne & Indy do is perplexing to me. Do you have any data, or lack there of, to show that Penn isn't producing? I tried looking it up, but all I get is Penn State information.

Better than California, Oklahoma, and Pennsylvania? Not too shabby.

It's about the same as Indy. One leads the other by a fraction of a percent.

Researching Penn is a pain in the a$$. Penn State keeps popping up, lol. I'll pass and leave your question to the Penn experts. Let me ask you this: If Ben Davis produces five D1 guys and Penn produces ten D2/D3 guys, does that make Ben Davis more talented?

Why are you calling Penn out as a victim? They have 5 titles.

The Big 3 of course. Carmel, Ben Davis, and Warren Central. Word on the street is that it's the Giants and Warriors this year.

Don't get all giddy about kids being bigger and stronger in Indy. The food and water is no different there than it is anywhere else. But if you want to go down that road, we can talk about which area of the state sends most kids to the NFL per capita. I honestly don't want to go down that road. Let's just look forward to the season and enjoy how it plays out.

Since I can't get anyone to comprehend that the chances of finding a D1 caliber football player out of a pool of 4000 is better than a pool of 2500, I'll just end with this. Good luck to all programs. And for the 45th year in a row, the state title will go through an Indy Mega School.

Sounds similar to Snider/Luers.

Better athletes? Are kids bigger and faster in Indy than kids throughout the rest of the state? None of this adds up. The only difference between Ben Davis and Merrillville is enrollment. That's it. Carmel and Valpo........enrollment. Warren Central and Snider......enrollment. There are no other differences in those programs. If those northern programs had the same amount of kids that the three Indy schools do, would they have the same amount of state championships? That's an easy "yes." You Indy fans are getting your feelings hurt because someone is willing to point out the obvious. No one is saying your programs aren't good down there. We're just stating that their is an obvious advantage over your competition. Jeffersonville, Harrison, and Portage will never be afforded the opportunity to stare at a trophy case with nine titles in it. The cards are stacked heavily against them. But that's OK, northern teams enjoy the challenge of breaking through and getting that "one". Looking forward to the day when schools ranked 6 through 10 in enrollment win nine straight titles. But we can all agree that it will never happen.

So enrollment isn't a factor. Just say it. Programs from the MIC are just better because they do things "different." I concede.

Good post. I have a ton of respect for all said programs. I just don't think it hurts to say, "yeah, we have a somewhat of an advantage with our enrollment numbers." And I'm not even saying we need to dilute 6A down to 16 teams. I'm just saying, "be humble." No more, no less.

Look up "by and large."

Snider's Brandon Logan - Offer from Notre Dame

Which makes them about the 134th best program in the state?

We'll talk when Hamilton Southeastern, Westfield, Avon, and Noblesville are the four preseason teams to beat.

Let's take a look at what transpired in the biggest division prior to 2015. Center Grove has been the outlier since then, and let's be honest, this most recent stretch hasn't been some of BD, WC, and Carmel's best years. So lets shoot for 1978-2014. That's 36 years. We should be able to draw some kind of conclusion from that. Eight schools outside of the Top 5 enrollment schools won the state title. The top 5 enrollment schools took 78% of the titles. I mean, that's practically 8/10. Coincidence I guess. From 1999-2007, all nine titles came from within the Top 5 enrollments schools, four of the five being represented (Carmel, BD, WC, and Penn). I think it's hard for anyone to conclude that that's just coincidence. This is probably my last post on this topic. I'll just chalk it up as a loss on my end. I can't keep saying the same thing over and over again and try to make the numbers make sense for those who don't understand it. Good luck to all programs.

Can someone other than Temp, Rodney, or myself on this forum.........especially someone with MIC ties............just please say that "having a higher enrollment number is an advantage." Geeeesh.

You're beating a dead horse. If the three largest schools owning 90% of the state titles can't help someone figure it out, then nothing can.

I'd have to do some research on that one. But I think looking at who Snider or New Pal have played in past years might be a good place to start. I think Carmel holds roughly a 9-4 advantage (off the top of my head) over Snider. I'd have to dig deeper to make a claim that some of their victories came at the hands of "average" coaches. I'm more of a numbers guy than anything else. I like to look at charts and things like that. My comment in my previous post was more common sense based than it was actual fact. But in this case, I would say my comment was 98% fact. Give me 4000 kids and chances are I'm going to come up with a bigger more talented offensive line than you will at a school of 2000.

While I agree for the most part, to be fair, North did have a team highly capable of beating Warsaw two seasons ago with the same coach they have now.

Nothing can be said as absolute fact, I get that. But, by and large, would you lean toward true or false?