PDB26

I hadn't yet looked into how this was going to affect the other programs. It looks like the basketball and volleyball programs benefit from the arrangement with the opportunity to schedule more out of conference games, while all the other programs get locked into full round robin schedules with reduced out of conference opportunities. I'm glad we can count on Dikos to be the one Penn coach to complain publicly about the arrangement, and I hope there are at least some private complaints from the others. “I’m not a big fan of this at all,” said Penn Baseball Head Coach Greg Dikos, who has guided Penn to back-to-back State Championships the last two seasons. “The double round-robin does not benefit us as a program. This is forcing us to take off some non-conference teams that we have built a very, very good relationship with over the past couple of years. “For example, the high schools that are in the mix of being removed are Lakeshore, Fort Wayne Carroll and Mishawaka,” Dikos continued. “Those are the teams that come to mind but nothing is set to stone yet. “We have to trim the schedule up. As an organization, we do not want this to take place, we don’t want to play conference teams twice, we want to be able to see what our team is capable of with teams like Lakeshore and others. We aren’t benefiting from this.”

I can appreciate the sentiment about not wanting to be dinged up for the tournament, but I'd rather be better prepared than just healthy. I know garbage time is better than nothing for underclassmen, but I've never been convinced that it's all that valuable--at least against NIC teams. Of course, the jv and freshman games are worse. I couldn't agree more with your point about Morton and Portage.

You're right, but they can't be the second best team--possibly by a lot--on your schedule if you're in 6A.

I'm not sure there's even that much value in more than one "Marian" type of game on the schedule for a 6A team since the implementation of the running clock--unless you challenge yourself to keep it a four score game throughout.

There is no way to make sense of this schedule or rationalize any value in playing it. I've always defended Cory, but this schedule is so bad for the program.

It's exactly the inward looking thought that 86ed the move to the DAC in the early 2000s. Don't expect it to change any time soon, and it certainly does not help with making any noise in the tournament.

I'm sure everything will be alright at the corner of Jefferson and Bittersweet as long as Dr. Thacker can get into a sectional championship picture every year. I'm probably about as big a homer for Cory as you can be, but, damn, this will be the worst schedule Penn has played in at least 20 years--possibly the worst since 1995. It's like, sure it's fun to beat on Mishawaka, and I guess it's useful to face their offense with Warsaw, possibly, lurking in the sectional, but what in the hell are we even doing out here? This has to be the worst schedule any 6A team will play this year and moving forward. At least Elkhart has Penn on their schedule.

Looks like the Carmel series has been cancelled. https://pennant.phmschools.org/news/nic-changes-impact-penn-sports-schedules/

Unless the determinative characteristic is Catholic faith, the ridiculously homogenous standard probably applies to most school districts, don't you think?

No dog in this fight. I think members on both sides of this debate make some good points but, I'm curious, do you have/know the percentage of schools in each class that are p/p?

Maybe somebody else already tossed it into the river.

It's an awful look, superseded in its awfulness only by the white over black away uniform. At least get white pants for the road if we can't have gold ones. ALSO, I'd be in favor of tossing that inflatable helmet into the mighty St. Joe while we're suggesting changes.

Perfectly reasonable. I considered that BD played in the state finals in '87, '88, '90, '91, '92, '96, '99, '01, and '02 with 7 championships. Penn and Ben Davis traded shots ('96 and '99) during Penn's run, while Ben Davis took us out in '91. Of course, '91 and '99 were not particularly close games. Also, it was hard for me considering the unevenness of the regular season series during the '95-'02 stretch. '98 and '02 seem like missed opportunities where Penn could have picked up one or two more appearances in the finals, which might have been persuasive for me. As it stands, I think I still have us at #4, even if it's closer to a toss up.

I'm in the same boat as you @BTF. Maybe Center Grove's run feels a little bit like Ben Davis from '87-'02, but against a stronger field. If I'm ranking dynasties [which to me isn't limited to consecutive championships] it goes: #1 Warren Central 2003-2006 #2 Center Grove 2011-present #3 Ben Davis 1987-2002

I suppose this type of thing would be fine in Indiana, but it seems sort of strange. I think @temptation said it, this almost certainly a smaller 6A tournament. I'm trying to clarify whether participation in this tournament would be compulsory or elective. Can see problems with both. What if East Central had never won a state championship before and they were mandatorily entered into this field? OR, what kind of pressure would that put on them if they had the option? Those aren't reasons to not organize a system like AZ's, just the inherent problem that comes to mind especially considering it seems AZ instituted the system to specifically address a competitive issue with one program in one class. Wouldn't a tournament that had: 1) 5 classes, 2) Understandable and reasonably applied success factor system and 3) Seeded regional groups--if not the full field--pretty much address most concerns, outside of those from the neutral sites crew, while capturing almost all of the teams that would be likely to participate in an open tournament? Also, single class ball was fun, and the environment inside Northside gym for a sectional often felt like a state championship kind of weekend. That's what was lost with class basketball.

@Bobref isn't the only one. I've always been proud of that team, but the offense carried us. There was probably enough crow to go around until the next Thanksgiving. Elder's coach was right. We knew they were excellent; we knew they were fast; but their physicality was something else entirely. The got on you quick and when they were on you, that was it. They were easily the most physical team we played in my time at Penn. Hard to believe they lost twice. You certainly could say the same for Crown Point. Penn missed an extra point, had one blocked, and had a last second field goal attempt blocked. CP led by 14 twice in that game, too. Then you have the 17-0 lead against Westfield. I think you're right; this is probably a three score game.

Just to be clear, I'll eat a shoe if Crown Point manages to win by more than 7, and I'll eat a pair of shoes if Ben Davis gets shut out.The 2000 reference was a little tongue in cheek. I don't accept the premise that a team's first time in the state championship is all too determinative so long as they've played championship caliber opponents. Presently, neither of these teams have played in a state championship as they are currently constituted, but Ben Davis has played better opponents throughout the season. Ben Davis's passing game is going to be a problem for Crown Point. It's a real strength on weakness scenario, and Crown Point's inability to defend the pass is likely their fatal flaw. They've had some pretty dicey moments with the lead in their last two outings and Penn had nearly 400 yards passing against the Bulldogs--which, to me, is saying something about how they play the pass. I doubt Crown Point is game planning to score 42, but they're going to have to score a lot to win this one. I'm thinking they have to get to 28 or 31 in order to keep some pressure on the Giants. Maybe then they're able to force Ben Davis into a mistake or two, but that's going to mean they control the ball and have very few empty possessions. It's a bit too much of a high-wire act to me. In the end, nothing against the Bulldogs--they've had a hell of a run. If they defended the pass better I would be inclined to give them more than a puncher's chance. They'll have to play a perfect game and make some breaks for themselves along the way to stay close enough to win.

Hey, if you're going to go back to '96 then maybe there's an infinitesimally small chance of a 2000 repeat. If Crown Point played the pass better I'd entertain the concept of them leaning on their line and mucking it up, but Ben Davis has to be too prolific moving the ball through the air, right? Maybe it's not 63-14, but I think Ben Davis's number is 42. So, can Crown Point keep up enough to make it interesting and force a mistake or two out of the Giants?

I'm inclined to guess never. That has to be the record.

Plus, it's not like it's some new development for the team coming out of the Region to have a giant, effective offensive line either. Similarly, because I haven't seen a down of Crown Point, I'd expect this to come down to whether or not Penn's defense can limit CP enough to keep the offense in the game--since historically, the offense has rarely run away with games in the later rounds.

I know. Just waiting for the IHSAA to do the right thing and success-factor Center Grove to Ohio.

The system is kind of bogus anyway and borderline punitive. Though, I guess that would be made more obvious if the system bumped schools up by two classes.

I agree that it likely makes less sense for the DAC, especially now that it seems like Elkhart would be a bottom-feeder in the conference. Anything is an improvement for Penn. Elkhart probably needs the NLC if the NIC collapses.

I'm pretty sure the Penn freshman have been playing Elkhart twice a year for maybe four or more years now. I wouldn't be surprised if they're getting multiple games against Mishawaka. I'd actually be in favor of scheduling multiples with a few competent programs. Alternatively, I've long thought the freshman and jv programs would benefit from intra squads more than they do from the majority of their schedules.

I know. It's insane, it's an old problem that has just gotten worse. There were NIC schools that would often have to ask if they could have a few sophomores play in freshman games 15 years ago just to fill out a position group.