Footballking16

12 minutes ago, gonzoron said:

Not true at all. Now you're just making things up.

How does a new school or new program have an existing team? Unless the word new has been redefined in the last 20 or so minutes?

@gonzoronI mean seriously, the title of the thread is "New Schools/Programs". 

Understanding that, not a single new school or new program is going to have an existing football program. 

1 minute ago, gonzoron said:

Because this is a football forum. We talk high school football here.

If they're nearly the same size as LCC, there is no reason they can't field a football team.

There are smaller schools than LCC with football teams. 

Lol.

The literal idea of this thread is about potential new schools and/or new programs. Why wouldn't a school with a rapidly growing enrollment have the potential to start a football program??

Eat a Snickers man, geez.

5 minutes ago, gonzoron said:

Then they don't belong in this discussion.

Why?

Is it a foregone conclusion that Faith Christian will never field a football team? I would say the biggest precursor to starting a football program is a growing enrollment. It took Covenant Christian almost 20 years to field their first varsity team. And it coincided with an enrollment spike. 

2 hours ago, crimsonace1 said:

It's highly unlikely - the modus operandi in the suburbs seems to be to grow schools to huge sizes (a la Carmel) rather than split (like HSE, Southport & Perry Meridian did). Meanwhile, the cities are losing population and seeing schools close (Elkhart, Muncie, Michigan City, Anderson, et al, have all consolidated back into one school in the last 30ish years). I doubt we'll see many school splits. Possibly a few new private schools here and there. 

Whitestown was mentioned in the thread - that community is mostly in the Lebanon school district. I highly doubt Lebanon splits into two, especially given they're already significantly smaller than Zionsville even with the rapid growth of Whitestown. 

I've heard "talks" for a few years about a potential third Fishers high school but nothing substantiated.

I reckon we're still a ways out but I wouldn't be surprised to see Lawrence go to a 1 township high school here in the distant future. Consolidate LN and LC at around 3500-4000 students. Sooner or later Mount Vernon is going to get a fair amount of those kids as Hancock county continues to grow. 

Agree on Whitestown. Zionsville will take as many kids until they can't anymore and then it will likely force Lebanon to build a bigger high school. 

38 minutes ago, Bash Riprock said:

No disagreements and I agree Penn State has much more talent.  But for a game 1, that game was there for the taking by Purdue and they blew it.  As FB16 stated, they were gifted a pick 6 and still lost it at the end.  

I am an IU guy, but let's be honest....Purdue has played a much stronger schedule so far.  IU was outplayed and came back late against Illinois.  IU was down 10-0 at half by a mediocre FCS team Idaho, and were outplayed and more than lucky to beat mid-major WKU in OT via a 51 yd FG.    The most unimpressive 3-0 I can remember.  Will be interesting to see what happens this weekend at Cincy.

IU is also breaking in a brand new OC and system, with a brand new QB, a bunch of new/inexperienced wideouts, a brand new RB room, and have two starters out on an offensive line that is already bad to begin with. Offense has been out of sync at times but they've already shown an infinite higher ceiling than last year. Bazelak has missed some throws and I attribute that some to lack of repetition in an unfamiliar system. But he can drive the ball downfield and IU has 3-4 receivers plus a big body TE that have shown the ability to get separation from defenders. That was almost non-existent last year and it made matters worse when Penix went out as neither Tuttle or McCulley could accurately drive home the ball downfield. 

My biggest concern is the defense. We all knew McFadden would be a big loss but other than he, IU has a bunch of experienced 3-4 year starters back and added a couple impact transfers from legit P5 programs. Defense isn't getting it done consistently right now. Tom Allen isn't calling an aggressive scheme like he did 2-3 years ago and IU just isn't good enough in the secondary to contain with a 4 man pass rush. 

I will agree that the 3-0 start is pretty pedestrian but at the same time 3-0 is 3-0. With the way last year ended, dropping 1 or 2 of these early winnable games could have been catastrophic for the rest of season outlook. I think this game at Cincinnati in a pretty hostile environment will set the tone for the rest of the season. I'm beyond moral victories with Tom Allen at this juncture but this is a game that I don't see Indiana winning. If they play with their hair on fire in this game and make it interesting my outlook changes some for the rest of the year. Get blown out and there may not be many, if any, wins left on the schedule. 

10 minutes ago, temptation said:

I swear Purdue invents new ways to lose games.

Brohm is Kevin Wilson but playing in an easier division. 

Kevin Wilson was a wizard at going 5-7 and blowing 2-3 games a year on simple coaching malpractice. 

2 hours ago, temptation said:

Small sample size for me anyway as I did not keep tabs on him prior, but DeBoer strikes me as a potential future NFL guy.  Seems like an offensive mastermind.

He has a great gig in Washington after absolutely moving his way up the NAIA ranks at his alma mater in South Dakota. Think he can absolutely be a winner with Washington's pedigree, but ultimately conference alignment may dictate things. Not sure if Washington survives if they aren't eventually invited to the B10. He's moved each of the last 4 seasons so from Fresno St to Indiana back to Fresno State and then this last year to Washington so he may be ready to give it a rest for awhile, but Nebraska would be nuts not take a look at him. 

2 minutes ago, DumfriesYMCA said:

They barely could get by Purdue and Purdue has serious issues with closing out games

And that's kind of my point. Led a flawless game winning drive at the end but should have never been in that situation in the first place. PSU had a double-digit half time lead and then all of the sudden Clifford starts missing throws high and wide and then eventually throws just a terrible pick 6 and PSU then has to hang on for dear life. PSU with even a semi-competent QB performance in the second half wins that game by 2-3 TDs.

Just now, DumfriesYMCA said:

This.

 

clifford is also imo at his ceiling

 

He’s a great college QB.  Nothing wrong with that…..except that he plays for a program that is looking for that Elite QB to put them over the top and into the playoffs.  
 

Unfortunately for him…Allar just happens to be the #1 QB from the 2022 class and the last year or so Allar has been on a rocket ship to the top and improving his game tremendously.  
 

i think I recall him absolutely lighting up the Elite 11 competitions and he went from a high 4star to a consensus top 3 QB in just a matter of a few months 

Clifford is a game manager that has just enough left in the tank to make a play when you need it, but he's not going to go out there and beat OSU or UM without some serious help. 

44 minutes ago, temptation said:

How has their run blocking improved so much but they are still atrocious in pass protection?

Clifford has terrible pocket awareness and doesn't throw it will enough to begin with when his feet are set so they are always moving the pocket and getting him downhill which leads to a lot of unnecessary hits. They run a ton of RPO and zone read as well which opens him up to even more contact. 

On 9/19/2022 at 4:22 PM, BTF said:

All three of those teams have a better defense than North Carolina. I think Pyne will feel less pressure playing away from home. Whatever, I'm normally wrong anyway. 

If ND's front 7 can get to Maye and keep this from becoming a shootout I like ND's chances. But ND will be in trouble if this game is played in the high 30's/low 40's. 

2 hours ago, MonkeyButt said:

I would also say that Cathedral is not a lock in their sectional. LC could give them more than people expect. They have been know to surprise teams in section play.

Next month of football will tell a lot about Lawrence Central. Played admirably against both HSE and Westfield to start the year and had the big win over Warren, but their schedule is brutal to close out the regular season; 3/4 last games are all on the road against Center Grove, Ben Davis, and Carmel. Getting through that meatgrinder relatively healthy may be priority #1. 

Just now, BTF said:

Just sayin. Notre Dame wasn't the only high profile program to take a chance on a successful coordinator. Sink or swim. Sometimes the risk is worth the reward, sometimes not. 

Obviously.

But Ohio State can withstand hiring a coach every 3 years need be, Notre Dame necessarily can't. 

2 minutes ago, BTF said:

I hope you're wrong just for the sake of him coming across as a good guy. Ryan Day made it, why not Freeman?

Same reason why a ton of high end coordinators never made it. 

8 minutes ago, BTF said:

Wait, hold the fort here. You were wrong about something?

Well technically not yet, but not feeling good.

Haven't been wrong about ND and Marcus Freeman though. Nice to get the first win off his back but he just looked uncomfortable on the sideline the entire afternoon. I don't see him making it more than 3 years. 

2 minutes ago, temptation said:

Winning in that environment is impressive, I’ll give Penn State that.

Playing the atmosphere is sometimes tougher than the actual opponent in my opinion.

That’s why Iowa still makes me nervous.

I think Iowa fans are already over this season and are at crossroads with Ferentz and his son. If Iowa somehow manages to keep it close with Rutgers next week it might get ugly. 

Just now, temptation said:

Drinking that Penn State Kool Aid after their win over the 14th best team in the SEC huh?

If Jeff Brohm had a brain they would have lost in West Lafayette and couldn’t run the ball against PURDUE.

Plus they are still coached by James Franklin…the second most overpaid coach in college football behind Mel Tucker.

Penn State looked impressive against Auburn Saturday until you realized this is the worst fielded Auburn team in the last 50 years and their coach is a dead man walking. 

Give Penn State two years and they may be the best team in the B10 in spite of James Franklin. Two freshman RB's are going to be really good as they continue to develop and I think Allar is a potential top 5 pick down the road. But they will still have to overcome Franklin's in-game incompetence. 

Just now, temptation said:

@ Iowa still makes me nervous.  Crazy nonsense always seems to happen  there…must be the pink locker rooms.

Thankfully it was announced as a noon game today.  Want no part of the hornet’s nest that is Kinnick at night.

That was my third loss for Michigan when I had originally made the bet with you. Iowa would have to play 8 quarters to score enough points to beat Michigan. 

I still think the Wolverines get rolled by Ohio State in a revenge game from last year but I just don't see them losing any more than two games, if two at all. 

2 minutes ago, DumfriesYMCA said:

For the annoyance, yeah I would put Minnesota over MU.  3 years ago they were 11-2 and last year 9-4.  It’s not like they are Rutgers. 

ultimately though.  I see this Michigan team as a 9-3 team and probably finishes #20-25 in the nation 

hasaan haskins had to have some crazy games last year with 20+ TDs to get them where they were and they had Aiden Hutchinson who was by far and away the best college defender.  

There is no eye test for this team right now…it’s just riding the success of last year while getting confirmation bias against truly one of the worst schedules so far. They haven’t been tested at all and it’s going to only take 1 close game with a conference opponent for people to move them closer to #10 immediately.  1 loss and they probably drop to 15 because nobody will pick them over OSU at that point. 
 

And that’s the problem.  The actual best programs can take a loss and still be ranked in the top 10 because they still have something to point at and say “we are still great”.  If Michigan loses they have last year. 

Where do you see 3 losses on this Michigan schedule? I made a bet with @temptationin the offseason that Michigan wouldn't win 10+ games and am already regretting it. The B10 is awful this year and Michigan's schedule is extremely favorable. Their 3 hardest remaining games are home games against Penn State and Michigan State and an away game at Ohio State to end the year. I think at worst Michigan goes 10-2 but they will be a TD+ favorite in every game until the rivalry game with Ohio State. 

1 minute ago, DumfriesYMCA said:

I think people are too hung up on last year and how much of an impact haskins/Aiden had for that team.  

i just don’t think they have proven anything yet…I sure as hell don’t think they should be ranked 4th in the country.

i know Penn state has taken some losses out of conference but at least they schedule those games. 

there are 7 teams currently 3-0 in the B1G and 4 who are 2-1. 

the teams Michigan has played are right now a combined 0-9 against FBS opponents this year and have 2 wins against FCS schools

the fcs schools are Duquesne University who is 1-3 and lost to Hawaii by just 10 points.  Their 1 win was against an NAIA school that is typically a .500 team 

and Central Connecticut State who is  0-3 and lost 28-3 against Connecticut….a game that was 7-3 at the half and 14-3 entering the 4th

Michigan loaded with 4 and 5 star talent is playing teams that can barely win against bad FCS schools. 

im just not going to give them any credit until they do something worth noting.  

All the teams that are 3-0 right now

Penn State with #37 SoS

Ohio State with #69

Indiana with #102

Maryland with #105

Rutgers with #116

Minnesota with #130

Michigan with #131

it’s that bad 

So you would rank Minnesota ahead of Michigan (as you previously stated above) because Minnesota's SOS is one spot higher than Michigan? That's legit the worst rationale I've ever heard. 

Penn State is the only team in the B10 who comes close to making an argument that they should be ranked ahead of Michigan. Penn State is good, they aren't Michigan good. 

1 minute ago, DumfriesYMCA said:

The eye test means nothing for Michigan  playing who they have played.  
 

My problem is we have seen this too many times with Michigan. Until they can beat out of conference ranked opponents I won’t say they deserve to be ranked just under OSU.  
 

Michigan under Harbaugh has consistently been able to pull in 5star guys and plenty of 4 star guys…..and they end up underperforming with them.  I bet 70% of the B1G would outperform Michigan if they had the exact same recruiting classes as Harbaugh has had. 

They were in the CFB playoff last year. Penn State has routinely taken dumps outside the conference and Wisconsin hasn't beaten anybody to date AND has already lost at home to Washington State. 3-0 Minnesota hasn't played a soul either and there's no way they look better than Michigan right now. 

I hate to defend Michigan and Harbaugh, but outside Georgia, they look about as good as anybody in the country and I don't care who they've played. Penn State is the only team that you can even attempt to make an argument should be ahead of Michigan right now.

4 minutes ago, Irishman said:

The crazy part was, watching the Nebraska NU game, it was a great game. Both teams played well. I did not get the impression that either team was bad; much less THAT FREAKIN bad.....wow. 

Nebraska is (was) horribly coached and their defense is just atrocious. No doubt it was an exciting game but when Northwestern does that to your defense it should have been foreshadowing. They've given up 31 to NW, 17 to an FCS team that was a game through 3 quarters, 45 to GA Southern, and 49 to Oklahoma who called off the dogs early. 

On 9/18/2022 at 12:41 PM, temptation said:

Feel like we can accurately assess most conference teams after three weeks.

Here goes.

1.  Ohio State

2.  Michigan 

3.  Penn State

4.  Minnesota

5.  Wisconsin

6.  Michigan State

7.  Purdue

8.  Maryland

9.  Iowa

10.  Rutgers

11. Indiana

12. Illinois

13.  Northwestern 

14.  Nebraska

 

What say you?

1. OSU

2. UM

3. Penn St

4. Minnesota

5. Mich State

6. Maryland

7. Wisconsin

8. Purdue

9. Iowa

10. Indiana

11. Rutgers

12. Illinois

13. Northwestern

14. Nebraska

7 minutes ago, DumfriesYMCA said:

Michigan should be lower

 

if Purdue was 3-0 right now they wouldn’t be ranked that high and Purdue has played better teams than Michigan by far.  
 

i think Michigan is 4th right now. Behind OSU Penn state and Mn.  Arguably Wisconsin too but that’s just my bias showing 

Well Purdue isn't 3-0, they're 1-2. And a 3-0 Purdue team would be ranked right behind Michigan and Ohio State had that been the case. 

There is still a level of an eye test that goes into this and despite playing 3 high school teams, Michigan looks the part.

Wisconsin doesn't belong anywhere near this list. The lost at home to Washington State.