Whiteshoes Preseason Top 100

[whiteshoes]

High school football kicks off this weekend as Hawaii, Alaska and Utah begin play.   Here is my preseason Top 100.

1.    Santa Ana (CA) Mater Dei

2.    Las Vegas (NV) Bishop Gorman

3.    Bellflower (CA) St. John Bosco

4.    Bradenton (FL) IMG Academy

5.    Miami (FL) Central

6.    Baltimore (MD) St. Francis Academy

7.    Fort Lauderdale (FL) St. Thomas Aquinas

8.    Buford (GA)

9.    Hollywood (FL) Chaminade-Madonna

10.  Duncanville (TX)

11.  Philadelphia (PA) St. Joseph Prep

12.  Norman Park (GA) Colquitt County

13.  Corona (CA) Centennial

14.  Oradell (NJ) Bergen Catholic

15.  Lakewood (OH) St. Edward

16.  Galena Park (TX) North Shore

17.  Chandler (AZ) Basha

18.  Fairbanks (GA) Langston Hughes

19.  DeSoto (TX)

20.  Alabaster (AL) Thompson

21.  Olney (MD) Our Lady of Good Counsel

22.  Miami (FL) Columbus

23.  Carrollton (GA)

24.  Irmo (SC) Dutch Fork

25.  Washington (DC) St. Johns

26.  Nashville (TN) Lipscomb Academy

27.  Planation (FL) American Heritage

28.  Belleville (MI)

29.  Hochston (GA) Mill Creek

30.  Draper (UT) Corner Canyon

31.  Austin (TX) Westlake

32.  Mission Viejo (CA)

33.  Southlake (TX) Carroll

34.  Gainesville (GA)

35.  San Mateo (CA) Serra

36.  Scottsdale (AZ) Saguaro

37.  Katy (TX)

38.  Chandler (AZ)

39.  Chatsworth (CA) Sierra Canyon

40.  Loganville (GA) Grayson

41.  Cincinnati (OH) Archbishop Moeller

42.  Denton (TX) Guyer

43.  Greenwood (IN) Center Grove

44.  Los Alamitos (CA)

45.  Peoria (AZ) Liberty

46.  West Chester (OH) Lakota West

47.  East St. Louis (IL)

48.  Milton (GA)

49.  Longview (TX)

50.  Lakeland (FL)

51.  Orange (CA) Lutheran

52.  Akron (OH) Archbishop Hoban

53.  Chandler (AZ) Hamilton

54.  Fort Lauderdale (FL) Cardinal Gibbons

55.  Hyattsville (MD) DeMatha

56.  Highland Springs (VA)

57.  Murfreesboro (TN) Oakland

58.  Carlsbad (CA)

59.  Homestead (FL)

60.  Yelm (WA)

61.  Dallas (TX) South Oak Cliff

62.  Lehi (UT) Skybridge

63.  Kahuku (HI)

64.  Toledo (OH) Central Catholic

65.   River Ridge (LA) John Curtis

66.  Phenix City (AL) Central

67.  Orlando (FL) Edgewater

68.  Austin (TX) Vandegrift

69.  Concord (CA) De La Salle

70.  Woodbridge (VA) Freedom

71.  Indianapolis (IN) Cathedral

72.  Ramsay (NJ) Don Bosco Prep

73.  St. Louis (MO) Christian Brothers

74.  Springfield (OH)

75.  Greenwood Village (CO) Cherry Creek

76.  Bryant (AR)

77.  Baton Rouge (LA) Catholic

78.  Humble (TX) Atascocita

79.  Charlotte (NC) Providence Day

80.  Houston (TX) Westfield

81.  Bixby (OK)

82.  Saraland (AL)

83.  New Orleans (LA) Edna Karr

84.  Severn (MD) Archbishop Spalding

85.  Atlanta (GA) Westlake

86.  Folsom (CA)

87.  Starkville (MS)

88.  Miami (FL) Booker T. Washington

89.  New Bern (NC)

90.  Chattanooga (TN) Baylor

91.  Lehi (UT)

92.  Florence (SC) South Florence

93.  Rancho Santa Margarita (CA) Santa Margarita

94.  Hoover (AL)

95.  Sammamish (WA) Eastside Catholic

96.  Long Beach (CA) Poly

97.  Harrisburg (PA) Bishop McDevitt

98.  Chicago (IL) Mt. Carmel

99.  West Linn (OR)

100. San Juan Capistrano (CA) J Serra Catholic

[AW0352]

Who can logically come up with a top 100 for high school in the country?   How do you even compare teams? 

[Footballking16]

22 minutes ago, AW0352 said:

Who can logically come up with a top 100 for high school in the country?   How do you even compare teams? 

Whiteshoes has been providing this content nationally for years and I trust that he knows and studies his stuff.

Like any preseason rankings, I'm sure it's largely comprised of prior year results combined with returning production. I'm sure there's some combination of historical tradition that factors in as well. 

[whiteshoes]

18 hours ago, AW0352 said:

Who can logically come up with a top 100 for high school in the country?   How do you even compare teams? 

Wow, where to start.   Roughly twenty years ago I was asked by Rivals to get with some other posters on their forum to compile a Top 100 for that site after Dallas Jackson was removed from their staff.    That started my interest in compiling the poll for discussion and debate among others with similar interests in the national aspect of the game.   Dallas Jackson soon established his own site and requested that I post exclusively on his site, which I did.   In the following years, I have added other sites, including this one, to my "customer" base.   My methodology is simple.   I read, watch, and analyze this game on a daily basis from May to January.   I am not smart enough to develop nor do I believe in algorithms.   I am constantly viewing MaxPreps, rivals and other forums to gather all the information I can on teams throughout the country.   I attend as many games as possible throughout the season and watch games both on TV and streaming services.   For instance, next weekend I am going to Massillon, Ohio to watch four of the Cleveland area's best teams play four state champions, including Center Grove from Indiana.    This does not only give me a chance to gauge those teams, but also a gauge on each state's strength.   The following weekend, I will not only attend a game (most likely Warren Central at Carroll) but also watch the national games being broadcast on ESPN as part of their kickoff weekend.  With all that of background, plus empirical data from prior seasons, I compile team rankings for every state, yes that includes states like Wyoming, Rhode Island, and other non-power states.   From there I compile a Top 100 by looking at game results, player evaluations and the state's strength to compile the list.   Hope this helps.

[temptation]

35 minutes ago, whiteshoes said:

Wow, where to start.   Roughly twenty years ago I was asked by Rivals to get with some other posters on their forum to compile a Top 100 for that site after Dallas Jackson was removed from their staff.    That started my interest in compiling the poll for discussion and debate among others with similar interests in the national aspect of the game.   Dallas Jackson soon established his own site and requested that I post exclusively on his site, which I did.   In the following years, I have added other sites, including this one, to my "customer" base.   My methodology is simple.   I read, watch, and analyze this game on a daily basis from May to January.   I am not smart enough to develop nor do I believe in algorithms.   I am constantly viewing MaxPreps, rivals and other forums to gather all the information I can on teams throughout the country.   I attend as many games as possible throughout the season and watch games both on TV and streaming services.   For instance, next weekend I am going to Massillon, Ohio to watch four of the Cleveland area's best teams play four state champions, including Center Grove from Indiana.    This does not only give me a chance to gauge those teams, but also a gauge on each state's strength.   The following weekend, I will not only attend a game (most likely Warren Central at Carroll) but also watch the national games being broadcast on ESPN as part of their kickoff weekend.  With all that of background, plus empirical data from prior seasons, I compile team rankings for every state, yes that includes states like Wyoming, Rhode Island, and other non-power states.   From there I compile a Top 100 by looking at game results, player evaluations and the state's strength to compile the list.   Hope this helps.

Love it.  Thanks for the transparency.  Not an easy task I am sure.

[AW0352]

On 8/10/2023 at 6:27 AM, whiteshoes said:

Wow, where to start.   Roughly twenty years ago I was asked by Rivals to get with some other posters on their forum to compile a Top 100 for that site after Dallas Jackson was removed from their staff.    That started my interest in compiling the poll for discussion and debate among others with similar interests in the national aspect of the game.   Dallas Jackson soon established his own site and requested that I post exclusively on his site, which I did.   In the following years, I have added other sites, including this one, to my "customer" base.   My methodology is simple.   I read, watch, and analyze this game on a daily basis from May to January.   I am not smart enough to develop nor do I believe in algorithms.   I am constantly viewing MaxPreps, rivals and other forums to gather all the information I can on teams throughout the country.   I attend as many games as possible throughout the season and watch games both on TV and streaming services.   For instance, next weekend I am going to Massillon, Ohio to watch four of the Cleveland area's best teams play four state champions, including Center Grove from Indiana.    This does not only give me a chance to gauge those teams, but also a gauge on each state's strength.   The following weekend, I will not only attend a game (most likely Warren Central at Carroll) but also watch the national games being broadcast on ESPN as part of their kickoff weekend.  With all that of background, plus empirical data from prior seasons, I compile team rankings for every state, yes that includes states like Wyoming, Rhode Island, and other non-power states.   From there I compile a Top 100 by looking at game results, player evaluations and the state's strength to compile the list.   Hope this helps.

Well.   I need to start by saying thank you to this community for all the time and effort you put into this.   I realize my comment definitely came across wrong and I greatly apologize for that.    In my simple mind it is just hard to compare a team from Oregon to a team from Florida, but it is still really cool to see this list and all the effort that goes in to it.   Thanks again! 

[whiteshoes]

On 8/13/2023 at 9:15 AM, AW0352 said:

Well.   I need to start by saying thank you to this community for all the time and effort you put into this.   I realize my comment definitely came across wrong and I greatly apologize for that.    In my simple mind it is just hard to compare a team from Oregon to a team from Florida, but it is still really cool to see this list and all the effort that goes in to it.   Thanks again! 

No problem.   I just started posting my national stuff on here last season and there are probably many others who wonder where this know-it-all came from.   Seriously, being retired with a lot of time on my hands this "hobby" helps pass the days and hopefully helps keen my mind sharp.   Don't remember a team from Oregon playing a team from Florida, but we are starting to see more and more out-of-state contest each year.  Hope you enjoy both the polls and weekly viewer guides.

[Whiting89]

Out of curiosity is Miami central a legit public school  with neighborhood boundaries?

any consideration of doing public and private ranking?

[Footballking16]

11 hours ago, Whiting89 said:

Out of curiosity is Miami central a legit public school  with neighborhood boundaries?

any consideration of doing public and private ranking?

Yes it is a legit public school part of the Miami-Dade County Public School System. 1600 enrollment with nearly an 80% f/r lunch program which trumps a lot of narratives here. Miam-Dade County Public School System is one one of the biggest school systems in the country.

[temptation]

6 hours ago, Footballking16 said:

Yes it is a legit public school part of the Miami-Dade County Public School System. 1600 enrollment with nearly an 80% f/r lunch program which trumps a lot of narratives here. Miam-Dade County Public School System is one one of the biggest school systems in the country.

80% huh?  Not according to my research.

Can you point me in the right direction?

[Footballking16]

5 minutes ago, temptation said:

80% huh?  Not according to my research.

Can you point me in the right direction?

My bad. 86% (not 80%) qualify for F/R Lunch. Not sure how up to date that is, but given Central's location and demographics it's probably +/- incrementally from the time it was reported.

https://high-schools.com/directory/fl/cities/miami/miami-central-senior-high-school/120039000596/

 

FWIW the Florida Dept of Health lists Central at 100% F/R lunch for the 23-24 school year although I'm not quite buying that (page 25)

https://www.floridahealth.gov/programs-and-services/childrens-health/child-care-food-program/_documents/school-list.pdf

 

Real reason for Central's success just like every other successful program is talent and coaching. Central has been a national power the last 4 or 5 years and they are attracting not only more local, but national talent. Believe they have P5 recruits from Texas and California who have transferred in this year and have a few local kids out of district within Dade/Broward who have all transferred in.

 

[temptation]

18 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

My bad. 86% (not 80%) qualify for F/R Lunch. Not sure how up to date that is, but given Central's location and demographics it's probably +/- incrementally from the time it was reported.

https://high-schools.com/directory/fl/cities/miami/miami-central-senior-high-school/120039000596/

 

FWIW the Florida Dept of Health lists Central at 100% F/R lunch for the 23-24 school year although I'm not quite buying that (page 25)

https://www.floridahealth.gov/programs-and-services/childrens-health/child-care-food-program/_documents/school-list.pdf

 

Real reason for Central's success just like every other successful program is talent and coaching. Central has been a national power the last 4 or 5 years and they are attracting not only more local, but national talent. Believe they have P5 recruits from Texas and California who have transferred in this year and have a few local kids out of district within Dade/Broward who have all transferred in.

 

Hmm…

https://www.usnews.com/education/k12/florida/districts/miami-dade-110364#:~:text=At schools in Miami-Dade,students are English language learners.

[temptation]

5 minutes ago, temptation said:

Hmm…

https://www.usnews.com/education/k12/florida/districts/miami-dade-110364#:~:text=At schools in Miami-Dade,students are English language learners.

Just realized, that’s the district data.

My bad.

[Footballking16]

3 minutes ago, temptation said:

Hmm…

https://www.usnews.com/education/k12/florida/districts/miami-dade-110364#:~:text=At schools in Miami-Dade,students are English language learners.

That link is for the entire Miami-Dade County Public School system. The data is compiled for 500+ schools and 300,000+ students. Here is Miami Central's profile on the same website.

https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/florida/districts/miami-dade-county-public-schools/miami-central-senior-high-school-4839#:~:text=Miami Central Senior High School 2022 Rankings,rank the Best High Schools.

[temptation]

1 hour ago, Footballking16 said:

My bad. 86% (not 80%) qualify for F/R Lunch. Not sure how up to date that is, but given Central's location and demographics it's probably +/- incrementally from the time it was reported.

https://high-schools.com/directory/fl/cities/miami/miami-central-senior-high-school/120039000596/

 

FWIW the Florida Dept of Health lists Central at 100% F/R lunch for the 23-24 school year although I'm not quite buying that (page 25)

https://www.floridahealth.gov/programs-and-services/childrens-health/child-care-food-program/_documents/school-list.pdf

 

Real reason for Central's success just like every other successful program is talent and coaching. Central has been a national power the last 4 or 5 years and they are attracting not only more local, but national talent. Believe they have P5 recruits from Texas and California who have transferred in this year and have a few local kids out of district within Dade/Broward who have all transferred in.

 

So it’s still a bit naive and shortsighted to claim that the makeup of their school matches the make up of their football team, right?

Tech would be a good comparison with the enrollment/SES data you provided.  If they started getting P5 kids to transfer in, they’d be great also…just look at what their basketball team attempted to do.  

According to 247, they have a half dozen four star recruits…out of 800 boys in the entire school.  How many of those are home grown from the impoverished area to which you refer?

Florida breeds football players the way Indiana used to in basketball.  That also helps.

Good talk though.

[Footballking16]

15 hours ago, temptation said:

So it’s still a bit naive and shortsighted to claim that the makeup of their school matches the make up of their football team, right?

90% F/R lunch. No I don't think Central is shipping in rich kids from the South Florida suburbs to play on their football team, there's too many affluent schools in the South Florida area who are all just as good as Central. There are 4 other Miami-County Dade schools with similar enrollments, demographics and all with 85-90% F/R lunch rate in MaxPreps top 100 rankings to start the year. 

 

15 hours ago, temptation said:

Tech would be a good comparison with the enrollment/SES data you provided.  If they started getting P5 kids to transfer in, they’d be great also…just look at what their basketball team attempted to do.

Tech is a good comparison. I don't think Tech has anywhere close to the same amount of school and community support as a school like Miami Central which has always been one of my major talking points. Not only establishing, but maintaining a winning culture is the one common denominator you see in all these successful programs regardless of socioeconomic factors or demographics.

 

15 hours ago, temptation said:

According to 247, they have a half dozen four star recruits…out of 800 boys in the entire school.  How many of those are home grown from the impoverished area to which you refer?

No clue but answered some of it above. I think Central has a firm grip on the inner-city Miami talent pool. They're pulling top kids from the inner-city districts similar to what Tech tried to do back in the day.

 

15 hours ago, temptation said:

Florida breeds football players the way Indiana used to in basketball.  That also helps.

Right but it's all relative to the state. I still maintain there's more than enough talent at Tech high school to be way more competitive than it has been. Not sure they are committed to doing so. That's my point. 

[temptation]

3 hours ago, Footballking16 said:

90% F/R lunch. No I don't think Central is shipping in rich kids from the South Florida suburbs to play on their football team, there's too many affluent schools in the South Florida area who are all just as good as Central. There are 4 other Miami-County Dade schools with similar enrollments, demographics and all with 85-90% F/R lunch rate in MaxPreps top 100 rankings to start the year. 

 

Tech is a good comparison. I don't think Tech has anywhere close to the same amount of school and community support as a school like Miami Central which has always been one of my major talking points. Not only establishing, but maintaining a winning culture is the one common denominator you see in all these successful programs regardless of socioeconomic factors or demographics.

 

No clue but answered some of it above. I think Central has a firm grip on the inner-city Miami talent pool. They're pulling top kids from the inner-city districts similar to what Tech tried to do back in the day.

 

Right but it's all relative to the state. I still maintain there's more than enough talent at Tech high school to be way more competitive than it has been. Not sure they are committed to doing so. That's my point. 

I'll concede on a couple of your points simply to avoid going do the traditional/annual rabbit hole on this topic.  We can agree to disagree.  I still maintain that it plays a HUGE factor when it comes to athletics and think we disagree on HOW much of a factor it is.  There are exceptions to every rule.  

[Slobberknocker]

Came across this article from the Daily Journal. In it mention that Center Grove had a Week 7 game lined up against Catholic Memorial from Boston before Pike, the Trojans’ regular Week 7 foe, decided in May to opt back in.  That would have made six out of state teams that CG would have faced.  In the article Moore didn't sound so happy with IHSAA for the situation that they are in. Is playing all these national teams good for Indiana football?

Center Grove football: Season preview - Daily Journal

[Footballking16]

1 hour ago, Slobberknocker said:

Came across this article from the Daily Journal. In it mention that Center Grove had a Week 7 game lined up against Catholic Memorial from Boston before Pike, the Trojans’ regular Week 7 foe, decided in May to opt back in.  That would have made six out of state teams that CG would have faced.  In the article Moore didn't sound so happy with IHSAA for the situation that they are in. Is playing all these national teams good for Indiana football?

Center Grove football: Season preview - Daily Journal

As a casual fan I think it's great. There's only so many good football teams in Indiana and Center Grove either already has a contract with them or will play them in the tournament when it matters. They're the 3x defending state champions and have only lost to one Indiana opponent in the last 3 seasons. Hell they've only played a handful of competitive games against in-state competition during that stretch. With the exception of maybe Cathedral, they're on an other worldly level than anyone else in the state. And frankly I don't think it's close.