BTF

2015 all over again.

Actually, I think the gap was bigger. Luers won the SAC title that year with victories over Carroll, Homestead, and Dwenger. No one saw that Eastside debacle coming. I only have Lutheran as a slight favorite this year. There's a team from Adams County that might have something to say.

Not sure if you answered my last question, time is a valuable commodity these days and I don't have time to scroll back. You can't beat 5A up based upon seven state champions in the last ten years being from 4A. Four of those were Cathedral, who you and everyone with somewhat of a decent high school football IQ, knows that the Irish are not a true 4A school. It's okay for them to beat up on 6A's best, but when they win 5A, it makes 5A weak? That doesn't make any sense to me. Same with New Pal, almost but not quite. They are a true 4A school. But they also beat up on 6A's best. Ask Center Grove. But when they win the 5A championship, that makes 5A weak? I'm just not understanding your logic. The only way to compare these two classes are by using averages from rankings that have flaws such as Sagarin and Cal Preps. Unfortunately, that's the only way to do it since most of these teams will never go at it head to head. I think we all know there's flaws in a system that has Snider ranked 21st in the state and Carroll 24th. Liked.........."But to be clear, I’m generally just here to make snide observations and defend the American Way….and to recognize immutable facts."

Not sure why you're so angry over this. I think a good healthy debate is okay. At the end of the day both sides make a good argument. Who cares. One thing we can all agree on, and I implore that the IHSAA takes it into consideration, is to make 1A the other 32 team class. But would that water down 4A? Are the teams that are dominating 4A the larger enrollment schools? Without doing any research, I'd love to see New Pal, Roncalli, Reitz, and East Central competing with Snider, Valpo, Merrillville, and Whiteland. What I'd love more is for Snider to win state this year so that they get bumped up to 6A, that'll really give people something to bitch about regarding 5A North. Snider gets to resume competition against the likes of Carmel, Fishers, HSE, and Penn............if of course they survive Carroll and Homestead (wow, it's a new era for sure). East Central bumps up, Cathedral bumps down, creating a force in 5A South. Is 5A still weak at that point? Or does one team make a difference? I think I'll just go back to "who cares."

I've got Luers at #4 in the SAC currently. They could move up a spot if they beat Homestead, which I hope they do. I don't believe in co-champions. I think Snider and Carroll have moved on to bigger things. Their focus is on winning 6A and 5A. Not sure what happens if Homestead beats Luers. You end up with three teams with one loss. Do you look at how those teams performed head to head? Snider is 1-0, Carroll is 0-1, and Luers is 0-0. One would think Snider wins the title outright.

I think 5A north could be Snider, Valpo, or Merrillville. Mishawaka will have something to say. Any game involving those four will be fun to watch.

1. Agree 2. Agree On your last point: More than agree. That would make for one hell of a class. Old, fat, hairy guys who wear their t-shirts too small?

So what proponents of 4A really need to be saying is, "the top half of 4A is better than 5A", not "4A is better than 5A." I can respect that even though we are seeing flaws with Sagarin. But let's leave 3A out of the equation (speaking to all posters). They'd get squashed by every class above it.

Without being a homer, I'd have to agree with that. They were able to beat a VERY good Carroll team. There is merit in that. Not to mention the two blowouts of WC and EN. Yeah, they laid an egg against Homestead a week after the big game, but then again, so did Carroll against Wayne.

I have a busy day today, so I don't have time to look up past posts. But there were several posts (to my recollection) stating that this could be Warren's year. Even the pre-game show on IHSAA had every Snider fan worried with what those guys were saying about Warren.

This is 5A vs 4A, not Top 10 vs Top 10. I'd be more interested in seeing how the Top 32 in each class match up against one another. Also, to be fair, we know Sagarin isn't the 'be all end all.' They have Snider at 21 and Carroll at 24. I think 99% of educated posters would disagree with those rankings.

Good work. Especially since it's the 4A proponents who are touting Sagarin. I would also agree, despite having a weak schedule, East Central's win over Moeller solidifies their placement as a Top 10 team, maybe even Top 5. I'm just not buying that they would "crush" 5A's best. Especially since Snider crushed both East Noble (Sagarin #4 in 4A) and Warren Central (who were HIGHLY touted in the pre-season). I have nothing against 4A or Chatard in 3A. But I will come to the defense of 5A when needed.

Good stuff. Dick the Bruiser is a legend. Had no idea he went to Lafayette Jeff and played football there. Thanks for the history lesson.

Lol

That's a valid opinion, but the games would be competitive at the very least. I think calling Valpo and Whiteland "bad" is a stretch.

To your credit, you did say "capable." I can live with that. No team in 4A would have named their score against Snider last year, probably not even Valpo. C'mon Rodney.

So weather is the great equalizer only sometimes. You're right, blowing snow has no affect on a team that throws the football. I put as much stock into a warm bucket of hamster vomit as I do CalPreps. That being said, I wouldn't bet against EC. I'm just saying it wouldn't be the blowout everyone claims it would be. I would have EC as a 58% favorite. Some posters just talk out their ass, someone needs to level the playing field. Self imposed warning point: 1

Dwenger should have the mercy rule in place by the third quarter. It's been a long time since I've seen Concordia this non competitive and the Saints seem to a little better each week. Dwenger by 42 I think Luers will put up a fight, but in the end, 6A takes this game. Homestead is capable, as seen in the Snider and Carmel games, but we've also seen them lay an egg. Lay an egg tomorrow Spartans, I don't believe in co-championships. Homestead by 10 North Side has no chance in this game if Carroll half way shows up. The Legends are a mess in more ways than one. This one screams mercy rule. Chargers by 42 Northrop/South Side is one of three good contests on the table Friday night. I really like this South Side team and the direction they are headed. The Bruins just seem to have a curse on them. Archers by 14. Wayne will give Snider fits. Where the Generals continue to get better every week, Snider may have peaked in Weeks 1 & 2. This one is closer then most think and won't be won until the fourth quarter. Panthers by 10

I don't agree with that, not even a little bit. Snider's season ended last year in a brutal snow storm, they never got their chance to showcase who they were at the state level. I would also argue that EC wouldn't be a lock to win 5A this year. I'm not sure I'd bet against them, but I know that if they hit Snider, Snider would hit back. Everyone thought New Pal was untouchable in 2015, then they quickly found themselves down 42-14 at state.

Much respect for the Irish. Easily one of the top programs in the state regardless of what class they are playing in. I just find it ironic that no claims of 5A being weak were made when Cathedral was there. One team doesn't make an entire class strong or weak. I just don't see a huge difference in a class that lost Cathedral, Westfield, and Zionsville, but gained Snider, Valpo, and Merrillville. A difference? Sure. A significant one? Not really.

Cathedral and Dwenger drift in and out of 5A. Snider, whom the forum seems to respect as the only legitimate 5A program, hangs around this class until they are bumped to 6A. But I'd argue that Valparaiso and Merrillville are legitimate programs that could compete with half of 6A and would be favored against 95% of 4A. Mishawaka is stout as well. I've got Mishawaka handling 90% of 4A. It does get a little sketch after that, I'll have to admit. But I think the three forementioned teams deserve a little more credit than they are getting. Harrison also deserves some respect. They also would take out 90% of 4A. I can't speak for the South, so I'm not going to give a pretend assessment of that region. Someone else will have to stand in for Bloomington North/South, Decatur Central, Whiteland, Plainfield, and Floyd Central. Let's not involve 3A in this debate. It doesn't hold any water at all with the exception of one team. And if one more person makes a claim that Indy Lutheran could win 5A I may have to check out of this forum for good as I just can't trust the credibility of the discussions anymore.

Doubtful. Speculation.

I don't think this speaks for an entire class. Six of those seven were won by either Cathedral or New Pal. Most on here will agree that Cathedral isn't really a 4A school. They have advantages that place them as a true 6A program. New Pal is an anomaly. They have a very good coach with a philosophy that allows his teams to compete with programs twice their size. He plays his best athletes on both sides of the ball. Kudos to him, that approach seems to work. New Pal has bullied 6A programs in the same manor they've bullied 5A. Since their loss to Snider in 2015, they've beaten Westfield, Cathedral, and Center Grove twice.

Mismatch. Could be ugly.

I'll take the under.