Footballking16

Give it a rest my man.

31 minutes ago, slice60 said:

I think my Dad has a good idea. The IHSAA should hand out 6 championship trophies in football-- 1A Champion, 2A Champion, 3A Champion, 4A Champion, 5A Champion and THE STATE CHAMPION. In the 4-class sports, the IHSAA will award a 1A Champion, 2A Champion, 3A Champion and THE STATE CHAMPION. Don't call it 4A (or 6A football) anymore-- maybe you call it Open Class because any school in any sport can choose to compete for THE STATE CHAMPIONSHIP during the next 2 year cycle.

Granted, the smaller schools & privates would surely feel insulted by this change. But maybe it would entice some big-time programs (Andrean baseball, Cathedral football) to always compete in the Open Class for the biggest trophy of all instead of only being up in the top class after Success Factor bump-ups.

Serious question, do you really think a school like Andrean or Cathedral or Chatard really gives a sh*t when public school zealots try and diminish a state title because it was won in a lower enrollment class? Will assure you nobody from Andrean is losing sleep over what some blowhards on a message board think. 

Just now, BTF said:

Again, that's a hard claim to make considering you've never spent a day in the life of a football player at Dwenger, Pioneer, or Adams Central.............to name a few. 

Didn’t ask you to agree with me.

3 minutes ago, BTF said:

So one of the three hardest working teams in the state. Not sure how you can prove that. Not sure how any program could claim that. Let's just say they are Top 25. Somewhere between 1 and 25, but who really knows. 

I would take Cathedral’s daily/weekly preparation and commitment to being the best football program as humanly possible over any other teams in the state. I’m sure someone from CG, New Pal, etc will argue otherwise but you aren’t going to find many, if any schools who take football more seriously than Cathedral and are dead set on being a championship contender every single year. If you think Cathedral just goes through the motions M-Th and just shows up on Friday you would be severely mistaken.

18 minutes ago, BTF said:

Mebuck took offense to the idea that his Bishop Dwenger Saints is one of those schools that has no boundaries. I've never known Dwenger to actively recruit kids outside of their feeder system. They pretty much do it all from within. So like I say, kudos to them. 

Tell me you don’t know the difference between a parochial school and an independently run private school without telling me you don’t know the difference between a parochial school and an independently run private school.

21 minutes ago, BTF said:

Not many? Would you say Cathedral is in the top five percentile?

Top 1 percentile.

3 minutes ago, temptation said:

It’ll also prove that Peebles’ and Cathedral simply “work harder” than the rest of the state.

Not many teams going to outwork Cathedral, I’ll put a penny on that.

Its as real and as serous as it gets over there.

1 minute ago, Whiting89 said:

Exactly so be a leader quit and start the public school association. I’m a big golf fan and there is a serious shake up going on with liv golf and the pga tour. The status quo isn’t working anymore 

Fire up the cannons!!!

Just now, Whiting89 said:

It’s a joke I really wish we’d get some leadership from the public schools and force the private schools out.

No one is forcing any public school to play in the IHSAA sanctioned tournaments….

4 minutes ago, temptation said:

It’ll definitely be a David vs Goliath level accomplishment considering Cathedral’s small enrollment…🙄

It’ll be entertaining and well deserved irregardless. 

16 hours ago, BTF said:

No one is equating Dwenger to Cathedral. We know that Dwenger is built from the ground up...........kudos to them.

What the hell does this even mean?

Can’t wait till Cathedral wins 6A. Ensuing days ought to be fun.

11 minutes ago, DT said:

Covenant will always be in the go forward conversation due to their ability to recruit and custom build a roster designed to win state championships.  Lutheran just happens to have more and better athletes today.  Both are 1A football magnets, built in the image and likeness of the LCC machine from 10 years ago.  

 

Yes, Park Tudor is rising rapidly.  

Park Tudor hasn’t won a sectional since 2005. They had a good year last year for program standards. Improving? Yes. Rising rapidly? Chill.

6 hours ago, DT said:

None of that matters.

What does matter is that PPs have won 9 of the past 13 1A state titles, and the coaches are fed up with it.  Lutheran and Covenant will be pre season favorites to win it again.  Park Tudor also in the mix.  

These are the facts that drive change.

 

Park Tudor?? The same Park Tudor team that has one winning season since 2005?

Lutheran and Covenant play in the same sectional so one of those teams will be eliminated in the first 3 weeks of the playoffs. Lutheran is deservedly one of the favorites to win 1A next year but Covenant isn’t.

1 hour ago, BDGiant93 said:

Covenant Christian doesn't even have its own football field.

Wait till he finds out that not every kid who attends private school has parents who drive a Bentley or own a Fortune 500 company.

13 minutes ago, BTF said:

Did I imply differently?

Who do you think the is driving force behind CG’s youth league???

7 minutes ago, temptation said:

It’s “passion” man.  Come on.

Yeah. Thinking Coach Moore just showed up one day and started out scheming teams is an odd flex.

1 hour ago, BTF said:

Coach Moore. A diamond in the rough. Coaching is the third ingredient to a successful program, no one is denying that. But to ask every coach in the state to duplicate Moore's passion would be irresponsible................on a high school coach's pay scale. 

 

How instrumental was Coach Moore in not only establishing but ramping up CG’s bantam program? I don’t know the answer but I’ll guarantee you Coach Moore’s contributions to the CG football program and community go exponentially further than just X’s and O’s. Don’t kid yourself.

5 minutes ago, temptation said:

I wouldn’t get too comfortable.  In today’s educational society buzzwords like equity, inclusion and representation are being utilized more and more.

Hell, soon not only will every team get in, we may start giving teams points on the scoreboard before kickoff or even letting teams play with 12-13 guys in the name of fairness.

Muda will be awarding points to teams who punt on 3rd down up big in the 2nd half.  

3 hours ago, Bobref said:

Correct. A lot of people think the travel limitations only apply when the Indiana school travels out of state. That’s incorrect. The travel rule, which is Rule 10-1, reads as follows:

“The address of an out-of-state school participating in a Contest with a member School, as well as the site of such Contests, must be within six hundred (600) miles round trip travel from the Indiana state line and shall be sponsored or co-sponsored by a member School.”

I’m on record as saying the travel rule constitutes an unwarranted intrusion on the rights of local school corporations to decide, on a case by case basis, what sort of experiences they want to offer students, including student athletes. A blanket rule like 10-1 is a blatant overreach by the IHSAA.

Really, really silly rule that holds Indiana back (among other things) yet in the event it was overturned there still wouldn't be a team in this state dumb enough to schedule IMG. 

IMG plays non-prep schools for two reasons; 1) to beat you by 50 points and 2) try and poach your states best players. 

Just now, Bobref said:

That the cluster system, or it’s various permutations, was actually a “cluster ****” is not a reason to reject a “top 1/2” qualification format. In fact, the IHSAA had the right idea, but the implementation was poor. Not enough teams in the playoffs. In a “top half” system, that problem goes away.

In a nutshell, if you can’t rate in the top 50% of your class, you don’t deserve to play for a state title.

Agreed

5 minutes ago, Bash Riprock said:

Perhaps they would based on criteria established today....I haven't seen it.  But they sure wouldn't have made based upon the criteria back during my Indiana HS days....that I'm sure.

Right and the IHSAA took the easy out and went from a bad situation with the cluster format to nearly a worse with the all-in. Cluster and all-in are on complete ends of the spectrum, there is a middle ground somewhere in-between. I think all but two states have figured it out. 

3 minutes ago, Bash Riprock said:

Don't go overboard and I sure didn't mean to light this one up again.....

I was exaggarating a bit.  Of course teams want to win every game, and conference championships do matter.  But no one wants to be playing their best football at the beginning of the season...no one.  Keeping this conversation in context, I was responding to a given year that was quoted as a down year....thanks to the current system that recognizes improvement with a team, that team that faced a gauntlet earlier in the season and took their lumps, developed and went all the way to the 6A state championship game, almost pulling off a championship.  

If anything, that example smacks your theory right in the face.....and I would contend CG demonstrating improvement and playing in the state final, makes Indiana football far better than if they had been eliminated from the playoffs and we sitting at home.

Using that particular year for Center Grove, they would have made every single postseason format that effectively cuts the field in half using some kind of combination of record, SOS, and opponent SOS. CG was a top 10-15 Sagarin team the entire year despite the slow start. 

Just now, NLCTigerFan07 said:

You're hopeless. There is no sense going round and round with you here. You win? lol

Applaud you for being gracious in defeat. 

9 minutes ago, NLCTigerFan07 said:

You must be extremely dense. You literally said it yourself. They are the two PRIMARY factors, not ONLY factors. Those two factors, enrollment and SES, are the foundation of potential success for a football program at the high school level in Indiana. It does not guarantee success if a school finds itself in a good spot with both, nor does it guarantee failure if a school finds itself in a bad spot with both.

IF****

IF high enrollment and low ses WERE the two primary factors for having a successful program you wouldn't see so many 6A schools with 3000+ kids and low SES numbers having programs as bad as they are. Clearly they aren't the two primary factors.

Re-read what I said and that get back to me on who is being dense. 

1 minute ago, NLCTigerFan07 said:

@Footballking16 Geezus Chryst who peed in your Cheerios this morning? All I did was provide some context and stats around this discussion that has been had time and time again on this thread. You need to lighten up Francis.

But since you asked, my point would be that both enrollment and SES or F/R lunch statistics are the two biggest indicators of whether or not a school can field a successful program. Obviously they are not THE ONLY things in play (as @temptation has stated also), but you are doing everything you can to try and dismiss them entirely it seems.

My opinion is that being in the top half of enrollment a school's class is the first major indicator of whether or not that school can have a successful football program. It is an automatic advantage if this is the case. The next indicator is SES of the school. Do you have a small or large portion of F/R lunch? If your SES indicators are on the lower end, that is the next step in the right direction for being set up to have a successful football program. Then there are many other factors after those two that make an impact that can also help overcome shortfalls in either of those two indicators initially.

I’ve acknowledged all this years ago and yet nobody can answer why schools like Noblesville, Lake Central, etc have such poor football programs? If enrollment and SES were the two primary factors those two schools would be head over heels better than they are and Carmel would win the state title every single year. 
 

Too many people like yourself and Temp want to dismiss culture/coaching/community support as non-factors. I can tell you that a school like North Central could be as good as any team in the state if they wanted too, they just don’t try. Their youth program is a joke. There’s so many kids from Washington Twp who end up playing CYO ball at an early age because there’s no structure or support in the youth system and those kids ultimately end up at Cathedral, Chatard, or Brebeuf.

Center Grove’s bantam league is a huge reason why they keep kids from going to a school like Roncalli. Center Grove wouldn’t be where they are today without its youth program.