HCC/MIC Week #14

[Bash Riprock]

8 hours ago, BTF said:

I personally don't think New Pal or Chatard beats Carroll having seen all teams play. Crown Point manhandled Carroll. Center Grove and HSE beat the Chargers, CP manhandled them. As Sir Charles once said, "I may be wrong, but I doubt it."

Let me apply your logic.....

Indiana manhandled Nebraska 56-7.  Ohio State barely beat Nebraska at the Shoe.  Therefore, Indiana is WAY BETTER than Ohio State.......

I don't know, but it would seem you put way too much faith in how teams play each other throughout the season.  

[BTF]

5 hours ago, Bash Riprock said:

Mmmmmm...be careful.

Center Grove was a 6A runner up losing to Carmel 20-17 in 2019.  During the regular season, New Pal beat the Trojans 28-9.

In 2018, Center Grove made it to the 6A semi-state losing to undefeated state champion Warren Central 27-20.  Earlier in the regular season, New Pal beat Center Grove 31-9.

CP would not running clock New Pal.

 

Does anyone REALLY think this year's New Pal team measures up to 2018 & 2019? C'mon. 

[BTF]

3 hours ago, WestfieldRocks said:

So HSE winning at Carroll 45-21 was not manhandling them, but CP winning at home over Carroll by 38-21 is manhandling them? 

Carroll had a pulse against HSE. Against Crown Point they were just flat out embarrassed. Let's not pretend the final score wasn't deceiving. 

[FastpacedO]

15 minutes ago, BTF said:

Carroll had a pulse against HSE. Against Crown Point they were just flat out embarrassed. Let's not pretend the final score wasn't deceiving. 

HSE was up 28-7 at the half and 35-14 after 3 quarters.

[BTF]

2 hours ago, FastpacedO said:

I don't know that you can really even make comparisons. HSE beat Carroll 45-21, but the Center Grove vs Carroll game was called at halftime 28-14 due to a storm that actually flipped bleachers over into the goalpost. Not to mention Carroll played HSE in week 1, CG in week 2, and Crown Point in week 13 game 12 can be a lot of differences be it good or bad.

I would say HSE definitely did a good job of dominating Carroll

 

If memory serves me correctly, at one point it was 28-14 in favor of HSE. To me that equates to 'Carroll hanging in there.' There was none of that against Crown Point. That was a man handling plain and simple. But yes, looking at the stat sheet, it's hard to conclude that they weren't dominated against HSE. At the end of the day, Carroll always overrates themselves by their performances against Snider. Dinan was an assistant coach there for 10 years, so he knows the inner workings of their program. Carroll, like Homestead, just can't seem to get it together against anyone outside of Allen County. And if you want 100% honesty? Carroll was outgained by HSE in 2022 by a 2-1 margin. They benefited by playing in a snowstorm. HSE suffered the same fate that night that Snider did. Any team playing in Fort Wayne that night who's sideline was facing the west was basically screwed. 

[temptation]

16 minutes ago, BTF said:

Carroll had a pulse against HSE. Against Crown Point they were just flat out embarrassed. Let's not pretend the final score wasn't deceiving. 

Twice as many plays, twice as many first downs and I am assuming dominating total yardage…

Might need a pacemaker.

[BTF]

1 hour ago, Bash Riprock said:

Let me apply your logic.....

Indiana manhandled Nebraska 56-7.  Ohio State barely beat Nebraska at the Shoe.  Therefore, Indiana is WAY BETTER than Ohio State.......

I don't know, but it would seem you put way too much faith in how teams play each other throughout the season.  

It's the Indy guys who keep bringing up "transitive property." I just like to throw it back at em when warrented. I think it's a little overrated if I'm being honest. 

[BTF]

3 minutes ago, temptation said:

Might need a pacemaker.

Help me out with the correlation. 

[temptation]

37 minutes ago, BTF said:

Help me out with the correlation. 

You said they had a pulse, I disagreed.

 

[BTF]

1 minute ago, temptation said:

You said they had a pulse, I disagreed.

 

Lol, gotcha.

Seriously looking forward to Saturday morning. 

[LC_Bears_04]

Westfield by 7 over Crown Point

Brownsburg by 3 over Center Grove

[FastpacedO]

11 hours ago, temptation said:

Twice as many plays, twice as many first downs and I am assuming dominating total yardage…

Might need a pacemaker.

The yardage didn't match the plays and first downs, which is not uncommon when passing teams start tossing the ball a lot down multiple scores. Total yardage was about 420 to 360. Looking at the stats HSE seemed to be content just running the ball at will. Their top 3 rushers in the game averaged 4.5, 6.7, and 7.4 yards per carry. Even the 4th top ball carrier had 4.3 yards per carry. I think it is safe to say that Crown Point dominated Carroll and HSE dominated Carroll, neither game was in doubt.  The only difference right now is Crown Point was an undefeated team and HSE ended up being a 7-4 team in the HCC. HSE lost to Westfield 21-14 in OT and beat Brownsburg 30-23, HSE's achilles heel was their biggest rival Fishers whom they lost to 37-35 in regular season and 44-41 in Sectional Championship. It still amazes me that I remember when HSE was a 3A school in the 90's and that area has grown so much that they opened another school (Fishers) and both are 6A schools now.

When it comes to Center Grove vs Carroll I don't think you can even use that in a comparison. For starters the game was called at halftime 28-14 CG due to a storm that flipped bleachers over into a goal post. Carroll likes to throw the ball, and this year Center Grove really likes to throw the ball. The weather wasn't the greatest to suit either teams style of play this year, but they were both throwing the ball good enough. That being said CG seemed to be more content running the ball more than they have most games this year. CG's RB Hennessy had 10 carries 117 yards 11.7 yards per carry at the half.

At any rate I don't think you can draw much conclusion from these games to really compare how the Westfield vs Crown Point game will go. 

[BTF]

1 hour ago, FastpacedO said:

The yardage didn't match the plays and first downs, which is not uncommon when passing teams start tossing the ball a lot down multiple scores. Total yardage was about 420 to 360. Looking at the stats HSE seemed to be content just running the ball at will. Their top 3 rushers in the game averaged 4.5, 6.7, and 7.4 yards per carry. Even the 4th top ball carrier had 4.3 yards per carry. I think it is safe to say that Crown Point dominated Carroll and HSE dominated Carroll, neither game was in doubt.  The only difference right now is Crown Point was an undefeated team and HSE ended up being a 7-4 team in the HCC. HSE lost to Westfield 21-14 in OT and beat Brownsburg 30-23, HSE's achilles heel was their biggest rival Fishers whom they lost to 37-35 in regular season and 44-41 in Sectional Championship. It still amazes me that I remember when HSE was a 3A school in the 90's and that area has grown so much that they opened another school (Fishers) and both are 6A schools now.

When it comes to Center Grove vs Carroll I don't think you can even use that in a comparison. For starters the game was called at halftime 28-14 CG due to a storm that flipped bleachers over into a goal post. Carroll likes to throw the ball, and this year Center Grove really likes to throw the ball. The weather wasn't the greatest to suit either teams style of play this year, but they were both throwing the ball good enough. That being said CG seemed to be more content running the ball more than they have most games this year. CG's RB Hennessy had 10 carries 117 yards 11.7 yards per carry at the half.

At any rate I don't think you can draw much conclusion from these games to really compare how the Westfield vs Crown Point game will go. 

You're an encyclopedia of football facts, you almost take the fun out it. But I do admire your passion for the high school game. I still think you're from Indy though, most of your posts gravitate toward that area. 

[FastpacedO]

7 minutes ago, BTF said:

You're an encyclopedia of football facts, you almost take the fun out it. But I do admire your passion for the high school game. I still think you're from Indy though, most of your posts gravitate toward that area. 

In all honesty I'm not likely to drive 2  plus hours on a Friday from my home  in western Hendricks County to Crown Point for a football game. No more than you are likely to drive 2 and a half hours from Fort Wayne to Crown Point or 2 hours to Westfield. It would be much more likely for me to drive 50 minutes to Westfield or 48 minutes to Center Grove. It really has no bearing on my thoughts of teams from year to year.

I will however watch streams when I can of games if I am not at a game in person. I also will watch film of various different games when I have the time. I have given Crown Point plenty of compliments and haven't said anything negative. Saying I am staying reserved until I see them play stiffer competition is not a diss to Crown Point, I just want to gage how they play with teams that can match their talent, size , and speed. We are at that time now and the Westfield vs Crown Point will be a good gage.

As for encyclopedia I just have watched a lot of football over the years. 

[temptation]

1 hour ago, FastpacedO said:

The yardage didn't match the plays and first downs, which is not uncommon when passing teams start tossing the ball a lot down multiple scores. Total yardage was about 420 to 360. Looking at the stats HSE seemed to be content just running the ball at will. Their top 3 rushers in the game averaged 4.5, 6.7, and 7.4 yards per carry. Even the 4th top ball carrier had 4.3 yards per carry. I think it is safe to say that Crown Point dominated Carroll and HSE dominated Carroll, neither game was in doubt.  The only difference right now is Crown Point was an undefeated team and HSE ended up being a 7-4 team in the HCC. HSE lost to Westfield 21-14 in OT and beat Brownsburg 30-23, HSE's achilles heel was their biggest rival Fishers whom they lost to 37-35 in regular season and 44-41 in Sectional Championship. It still amazes me that I remember when HSE was a 3A school in the 90's and that area has grown so much that they opened another school (Fishers) and both are 6A schools now.

When it comes to Center Grove vs Carroll I don't think you can even use that in a comparison. For starters the game was called at halftime 28-14 CG due to a storm that flipped bleachers over into a goal post. Carroll likes to throw the ball, and this year Center Grove really likes to throw the ball. The weather wasn't the greatest to suit either teams style of play this year, but they were both throwing the ball good enough. That being said CG seemed to be more content running the ball more than they have most games this year. CG's RB Hennessy had 10 carries 117 yards 11.7 yards per carry at the half.

At any rate I don't think you can draw much conclusion from these games to really compare how the Westfield vs Crown Point game will go. 

GREAT analysis.  All signs point to these being two great games tomorrow night and a competitive final regardless of the outcome.

[BDGiant93]

17 hours ago, temptation said:

Can't fall behind CG like they did BD/LN in my opinion.

Yep. CG can actually chew clock and shorten games effectively. BD/LN were not built to do that as much.

[WestfieldRocks]

3 hours ago, FastpacedO said:

The yardage didn't match the plays and first downs, which is not uncommon when passing teams start tossing the ball a lot down multiple scores. Total yardage was about 420 to 360. Looking at the stats HSE seemed to be content just running the ball at will. Their top 3 rushers in the game averaged 4.5, 6.7, and 7.4 yards per carry. Even the 4th top ball carrier had 4.3 yards per carry. I think it is safe to say that Crown Point dominated Carroll and HSE dominated Carroll, neither game was in doubt.  The only difference right now is Crown Point was an undefeated team and HSE ended up being a 7-4 team in the HCC. HSE lost to Westfield 21-14 in OT and beat Brownsburg 30-23, HSE's achilles heel was their biggest rival Fishers whom they lost to 37-35 in regular season and 44-41 in Sectional Championship. It still amazes me that I remember when HSE was a 3A school in the 90's and that area has grown so much that they opened another school (Fishers) and both are 6A schools now.

When it comes to Center Grove vs Carroll I don't think you can even use that in a comparison. For starters the game was called at halftime 28-14 CG due to a storm that flipped bleachers over into a goal post. Carroll likes to throw the ball, and this year Center Grove really likes to throw the ball. The weather wasn't the greatest to suit either teams style of play this year, but they were both throwing the ball good enough. That being said CG seemed to be more content running the ball more than they have most games this year. CG's RB Hennessy had 10 carries 117 yards 11.7 yards per carry at the half.

At any rate I don't think you can draw much conclusion from these games to really compare how the Westfield vs Crown Point game will go. 

Not only are HSE and Fishers both 6A now, but both have over 3.000 students. They would be largest school in the state if they did like Carmel, and just keep adding on capacity instead of splitting into two high schools.  Fishers won Class 5A in just their 5th year of existence in 2010. HSE actually won the 1A title in 1981. They have been runnerup in 1A, 4A, and 5A.

[RocksFan23]

3 minutes ago, WestfieldRocks said:

Not only are HSE and Fishers both 6A now, but both have over 3.000 students. They would be largest school in the state if they did like Carmel, and just keep adding on capacity instead of splitting into two high schools.  Fishers won Class 5A in just their 5th year of existence in 2010. HSE actually won the 1A title in 1981. They have been runnerup in 1A, 4A, and 5A.

I’ve heard it thrown around some, maybe on here, can’t remember, but outside shot of a third HS for HSE district that’d land somewhere near the Madison County line? 
 

think Westfield ever gets to a second school? Superintendent don’t seem against it, remember reading him saying “takes a lot of land etc” but at least in people’s mind around Westfield. Second middle school I know is on the way and yet another elementary.

[WestfieldRocks]

12 hours ago, LC_Bears_04 said:

Westfield by 7 over Crown Point

Brownsburg by 3 over Center Grove

This would be my ideal 6A title game. A rematch of Westfield's only loss, 17-13, where they twice had the ball iinside the Brownsburg 5 yard line and did not score. The second of those was late 3rd quarter, when the QB Carsen Melvin was knocked out of the game and did not return. It would assure that the HCC finally gets their first 6A title, although they have had quite a few in the lower classes, with Zionsville, HSE, Franklin Central, and Brownsburg all winning titles before the HCC existed, and Westfield and Fishers both winning 5A titles while HCC members.

[WestfieldRocks]

4 minutes ago, RocksFan23 said:

I’ve heard it thrown around some, maybe on here, can’t remember, but outside shot of a third HS for HSE district that’d land somewhere near the Madison County line? 
 

think Westfield ever gets to a second school? Superintendent don’t seem against it, remember reading him saying “takes a lot of land etc” but at least in people’s mind around Westfield. Second middle school I know is on the way and yet another elementary.

I've heard the same about both the HSE school corporation and Westfield. I'd say most here don't want a second high school. There were stories about how it divided the Fishers community after Fishers HS opened. That second middle school is overdue, except their sports domination in Hamilton County will probably come to a close :)

[RocksFan23]

16 minutes ago, WestfieldRocks said:

I've heard the same about both the HSE school corporation and Westfield. I'd say most here don't want a second high school. There were stories about how it divided the Fishers community after Fishers HS opened. That second middle school is overdue, except their sports domination in Hamilton County will probably come to a close 🙂

Interesting, hadn't heard that about Fishers when they opened up. Growing up in Westfield never imagined even a second middle school happening. Can see how a second HS would break things up talent wise, just always thought crosstown games were great to watch in other places as a neutral.