HoopsCoach

The DOE released enrollment numbers for this fall (Sept ‘22) and AC would be in 2A by enrollment. Just barely, but they would be. It won’t matter because they will get back to the state finals next year and bump up by success factor. I think the AG’s post about shaking up the sectionals was referencing Blackhawk being in a 1A sectional starting in 2023 since they are already an eligible member school. I think Blackhawk would join sectional 44, then Madison-Grant could move to sectional 45.

Completely agree. This has been rumored for a few months among ACAC member schools. With the right coach, I think Blackhawk will be able to pull some athletes from Snider, Leo, Northrop, Carroll, etc. that feel like they can play a bigger role at a small school that plays 1A football. Just look at their basketball program to see what will happen. They used to be a doormat prior to class basketball when they had to compete with the larger Fort Wayne schools. If they have a coach who can recruit some kids from the larger schools in addition to building their own feeder program, it will be just a few years before football is just like their basketball program. Don’t expect the ACAC schools to blindly take Blackhawk just to get to 8 members. They will need to consider the advantages Blackhawk has as a private school in a city with nearly half a million people compared to their own schools that have to accept any and all students in their small town, rural communities of only a few thousand residents. The geographic proximity would be attractive to Heritage and Woodlan, but I could see their reluctance to admit Blackhawk if they have lost any students to them. I could also see the 5 schools in Adams, Jay, and Wells Counties saying no. If they really want an 8th member, maybe they reach out to Bellmont to see if the Braves would consider a move to the ACAC. Then Angola could move into the Northeast 8 and Blackhawk can, as Bobby Knight once said, play with themselves.

I think neutral site semi-states would need to happen before this could work. In 2A under this plan, Andrean/Mater Dei could potentially be a semi-state game and either of those teams being able to host should be taken away as a possibility since it involves a 5 hour (one way) bus trip. This was poorly done by the alignment committee for 2A, then rubber stamped by the IHSAA leadership. To be fair, I think you would be able to make the same criticism with some of the semi-state matchups that would happen in your alternative plan. People would wonder why Valpo plays Castle and Whiteland plays Snider.

On the subject of Blackhawk, they started football this year as an 8 man program. There has been discussion of transitioning to 11 man already. If they do, I think they will be able to pull some athletes from Snider, Leo, Northrop, Carroll, etc. that feel like they can play a bigger role at a small school that plays 1A football. Just look at their basketball program to see what will happen.

These are the IHSAA member schools that are private/parochial/choice. This does not include charter schools. They are listed in order by enrollment. I included schools that do not play football. Indianapolis Roncalli Indianapolis Cathedral Fort Wayne Bishop Dwenger Brebeuf Jesuit Culver Academies South Bend Saint Joseph Guerin Catholic Mishawaka Marian Indianapolis Bishop Chatard Fort Wayne Concordia Evansville Memorial Indianapolis Cardinal Ritter Heritage Christian Evansville Mater Dei Hammond Bishop Noll Fort Wayne Bishop Luers Illiana Christian Indianapolis Scecina Muncie Burris Andrean Park Tudor Covenant Christian (Indianapolis) University Providence Lafayette Central Catholic Fort Wayne Canterbury Fort Wayne Blackhawk Christian Christian Academy of Indiana Faith Christian Marquette Catholic Indianapolis Lutheran Providence Cristo Rey Oldenburg Academy Evansville Christian Lakewood Park Christian Greenwood Christian Elkhart Christian Trinity Lutheran Indianapolis International Shawe Memorial Liberty Christian Traders Point Christian Bethany Christian Trinity School at Greenlawn Lakeland Christian Bethesda Christian DeMotte Christian (Covenant) Seton Catholic MTI School of Knowledge Bloomington Lighthouse Christian Academy Washington Catholic Vincennes Rivet Central Christian Academy Evansville Day

You’re right. I’m not sure why I didn’t flip them.

I tried to keep teams from the same area or conference together if it made sense based upon their opponents. It worked out (hypothetically) for Castle/Mater Dei, Snider/Luers, and East Central/Lawrenceburg.

Here are my hypothetical neutral site semi-states for this year. This time I am presenting two options. The first is single games played on Friday night. The second features two games played at each of six sites on Saturday afternoon/evening. All games in both options would be at locations with turf fields. Which format do you prefer? Friday Night - Single Games 6A Carroll/Hamilton Southeastern @ Marion Cathedral/Center Grove @ Ben Davis 5A Valparaiso/Snider @ Warsaw Whiteland/Castle @ Bloomington South 4A New Prairie/Kokomo @ Plymouth Roncalli/East Central @ Columbus North 3A West Lafayette/Chatard @ Lebanon Monrovia/Lawrenceburg @ Columbus East 2A Andrean/Luers @ Goshen Linton/Mater Dei @ Jasper 1A North Judson/Adams Central @ Maconaquah North Decatur/Lutheran @ Greenfield Central Saturday Afternoon/Evening - 2 Games @Plymouth Andrean/Luers Valparaiso/Snider @Warsaw North Judson/Adams Central New Prairie/Kokomo @Kokomo (or Marion) West Lafayette/Chatard Carroll/Hamilton Southeastern @Franklin Central North Decatur/Lutheran Cathedral/Center Grove @ Columbus North Monrovia/Lawrenceburg Roncalli/East Central @ Jasper Whiteland/Castle Linton/Mater Dei

I considered suggesting Huntington North. They have a brand new facility and I’m sure they would be eager to host a tournament game to showcase their investment. However, I went with Norwell because it is less time and miles for BOTH Luers and Bluffton to go to Norwell compared to HN. Luers to Huntington North - 33 minutes, 26 miles Bluffton to Huntington North - 39 minutes, 25 miles Luers to Norwell - 24 minutes, 17 miles Bluffton to Norwell - 16 minutes, 9 miles

Who pays it for state tournament events in every other sport? Bellmont does not have turf. Travel twice as far? It’s 25 minutes to go from Luers to Norwell. It’s 18 minutes from Bluffton to Norwell. I could see an argument if it was 2 hours for one school and only an hour for their opponent. Not a difference of 7 minutes.

All good. You’re not wrong about those in Wells County that carry some deep hatred, even within the same family.

I’m from Wells County. Norwell and Bluffton (and Southern Wells) aren’t as hateful towards each other as some may think. Maybe some in their communities hold some animosity, but their school leaders seem to work together just fine. This is obviously hypothetical and will not happen any time soon. Just posting this for fun/discussion.

Here are my hypothetical neutral site regionals for this year. Single games played on Friday night, all at locations with turf fields. 6A Lafayette Jeff/Carroll (FW) @ Marion Hamilton Southeastern/Westfield @ Carmel Brownsburg/Cathedral @ Ben Davis Warren Central/Center Grove @ Southport 5A Merrillville/Valparaiso @ Hobart Mishawaka/Snider @ Warsaw Plainfield/Whiteland @ Perry Meridian Bloomington South/Castle @ Jasper 4A New Prairie/Northridge @ SB St. Joe Columbia City/Kokomo @ Mississinewa Roncalli/New Palestine @ Franklin Central East Central/Evansville Memorial @ Bloomington North 3A West Lafayette/Knox @ Logansport Yorktown/Chatard @ Pendleton Heights Monrovia/Owen Valley @ Martinsville Lawrenceburg/Southridge @ Charlestown 2A Andrean/Central Catholic @ Crown Point Luers/Bluffton @ Norwell Linton/Lapel @ Greencastle Triton Central/Mater Dei @ Mitchell 1A North Judson/Park Tudor @ Harrison (WL) Carroll (Flora)/Adams Central @ Oak Hill Sheridan/North Decatur @ Mount Vernon (Fortville) Lutheran/Providence @ Seymour

The same thing it would take to remove AC from the conference. No need to change the districts with open enrollment. SW already gets a few students from Pennville and the NW corner of Jay County. They also get some from Warren. They get a bunch from Montpelier, especially now that Montpelier Elementary has closed. Many families in Montpelier have chosen to send to SW instead of staying in district and going to Blackford. The enrollment at SW from within their district has declined as you would expect with some families moving to cities to be closer to jobs. The only way the school has maintained their enrollment is by accepting from outside the district. Montpelier, Warren, and Pennville are not towns with a substantial number of strong athletes, so SW athletic programs aren’t really benefiting. They are just helping with funding enough to keep the school going.

True that WL is not your average 3A school. They have the advantage of being a relatively small district located in an urban area that attracts an affluent population which values higher education. They are more like a private school than a small town/community school, which is what the rest of the conference is other than Central Catholic. They have similar demographics to what you see in their Catholic rivals across the river, and they are in a college town with easier access to more training and higher level competition in youth sports. Every school in the Hoosier Conference other than West Side and Central Catholic has rural areas of their district and relatively small population centers. West Side and Central Catholic are able to pull from a population center with over 100,000 people. Most of the smaller rural communities that make up the rest of the conference don’t have that luxury. Western pulls a lot from Kokomo and Hamilton Heights may get some families that don’t want to go to the 6A schools in Hamilton County. West Side is probably more like Mishawaka Marian, Andrean, Chatard, and Brebeuf than Twin Lakes, Benton Central, Rensselaer, and Cass. West Lafayette would fit in well as a member of the North Central Conference.

I don’t think either school would leave their current conference. West Lafayette would be slightly more likely to consider it than Lebanon in my opinion, but neither would go for it. My suggestion is very unrealistic.

I’ve posted this on another forum, and I know it’s more unrealistic fantasy booking, but here it is anyway. I’d like to see the NCC expand with several more schools and split into 2 divisions that function as their own separate conferences. Keep the NCC name and “Conference of Champions” moniker since that is really the only thing that keeps the conference alive. With the cost of transportation, a conference with the geographic footprint of the NCC is more of a burden than a benefit. So bring in some slightly smaller schools that can compete with the current NCC members that are located within or close to the current footprint of the NCC. Something like this: NCC East Marion Mississinewa Jay County Delta Muncie Central Yorktown Anderson Richmond NCC West Kokomo Western Logansport Lebanon McCutcheon Lafayette Jeff West Lafayette Harrison

Muncie Central, Delta, and Yorktown - possibly. Centerville - very unlikely. I think Oak Hill is even less likely to join that group than Centerville. They are a very good fit in the CIC and they would be foolish to choose to leave for a conference that would double their travel. It would be interesting to see several of those schools form a new conference of large 3A, 4A, and small 5A members centered around Muncie. Throw out NCC history (the biggest obstacle to this) and go with Delta, Jay County, Muncie Central, Yorktown, Mississinewa, Marion, Anderson, and Richmond. New Castle would be a great fit instead of Anderson, but I think there are still some hard feelings over New Castle leaving the NCC. If Jay County doesn’t think they can compete, then give the Trojans an invite. Anderson might be interested in taking their place in the Hoosier Heritage, and the HHC might consider the Indians if they lose Delta, Yorktown, and New Castle. As much as I like fantasy booking, none of this will actually happen.

There was a stretch of about 10-15 years around the late 90’s up to 2010 or so when the south side of Lafayette experienced a housing boom and became the trendy part of Tippecanoe County to move to. They were pulling athletes from Jeff, and Harrison wasn’t seeing the growth in their district yet. That trend on the south side stopped with the housing market taking a dump about 12-15 years ago. The families that moved in during their growth period had kids that made up the really strong classes they had up to around 2019. As the housing market recovered, most of the new construction in Tippecanoe County in the past 10 years has been in the Harrison district (note their enrollment growth to over 2000). Many of the young families that have moved to those homes in Harrison’s district now have children that are getting to high school, and their talent pool has improved to the point that they have the best athletic program in the NCC. Jeff has turned things around a bit with keeping their athletes from leaving (as well as poaching a few from the TSC district). McCutcheon doesn’t have a lot of talent in the pipeline compared to Jeff and Harrison, but they will still be very competitive in certain sports (see Volleyball and their connections to club volleyball programs). West Side will always have an abundance of talent with a small but affluent district that resembles the demographics of Central Catholic.

Yes, the DOE lists the BD 9th grade center as a separate school in their data and on their INview site (which sucks), so they only list the BD enrollment for grades 10-12.

You are mistaking. Carmel and BD have been #1 and #2 for around 15 years. Both have had over 4000 students since 2007. Warren Central has been close to 4000, but never over. Carmel 5327 Ben Davis 4557 Warren Central 3868

Yes. I know this is a football forum, but my view of conference changes is based upon the entirety of the school programs. Football and boys basketball tend to be the “bread winners” of the athletic family and often drive the discussion of conference moves, but conference changes need to be made with all programs in mind unless it is a sport specific conference. It’s not always easy for AD’s and administrators to get coaches to understand that. Their views are naturally going to be focused on the impact of any moves on their program, and sometimes AD’s and admin allow them to have too much of a voice. If they are a good coach, AD’s often listen because they don’t want to risk losing them.

I get that, which is why I said “None of these will work out this way.” There are lots of things that would stand in the way of some of these conferences changing and looking like what I listed. There are more realistic changes I could see happening, and changes I would prefer to see instead of what I posted. Here are a couple examples: Metropolitan Interscholastic Conference Avon Ben Davis Franklin Central Lawrence Central Lawrence North North Central Pike Warren Central Hoosier Crossroads Conference Brownsburg Carmel Center Grove Fishers Hamilton Southeastern Noblesville Westfield Zionsville

Fantasy booking some Central Indiana conferences a few years down the road. None of these will work out this way. Just some ideas. For football, Center Grove could still play Warren Central week 1, Carmel week 2, and Cathedral week 9 if they are in a 7 team conference as listed below. Metropolitan Interscholastic Conference Ben Davis Indianapolis Arsenal Tech Lawrence Central Lawrence North North Central Pike Warren Central Hoosier Crossroads Conference Avon Brownsburg Fishers Hamilton Southeastern Noblesville Westfield Zionsville Conference Indiana Center Grove Franklin Central Columbus North Southport Decatur Central Plainfield Whiteland Mid-Indiana Conference Mooresville Martinsville Terre Haute North Terre Haute South Bloomington South Bloomington North Franklin Community Perry Meridian Hoosier Heritage Conference Shelbyville Greenwood Mount Vernon Pendleton Heights Greenfield-Central New Palestine New Castle Beech Grove Indiana Crossroads Conference Speedway Monrovia Ritter Lutheran Triton Central Indian Creek Covenant Christian Scecina North Central Conference - West Lafayette Jeff McCutcheon Harrison (WL) West Lafayette Logansport Kokomo Western Lebanon North Central Conference - East Marion Mississinewa Delta Yorktown Jay County Muncie Central Anderson Richmond Independent Carmel Indianapolis Cathedral

Don’t forget that Luers, the smallest SAC school (*private school), just shared the conference championship with Carroll last season.