USA Today Network media poll Week 2

[BTF]

3 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

Fluke to be in semi-state? They played nobody for 3 months, as typically is the case for whoever comes out of sectional 1/2. 

Ok, so they played nobody then beat Westfield. Not a good look for Westfield that they lost to a team that was prepared by "nobody."

[Footballking16]

1 minute ago, BTF said:

Ok, so they played nobody then beat Westfield. Not a good look for Westfield that they lost to a team that was prepared by "nobody."

Or the randomness of a single elimination tournament…

[temptation]

1 minute ago, BTF said:

Ok, so they played nobody then beat Westfield. Not a good look for Westfield that they lost to a team that was prepared by "nobody."

Sigh, I like you man…but you’re crazy sometimes.

[Footballking16]

7 minutes ago, temptation said:

Who in the hell has Jeff beaten?  A rebuilding Avon program or we talking those big conference wins over Tech?

You’re being generous. Avon has been largely terrible the last 4-5 seasons. And that’s saying something given Avon would be one of the better teams in the DAC.

[Boilernation]

5 minutes ago, temptation said:

 

I long for parity in 6A and am hopeful that 2024 delivers.  We’ve seen glimpses but I want chaos.

Agreed. Which is why I will continue to hold out hope somebody can figure out how to turn Lake Central around. There's zero reason they're not knocking on the 6A non-Indy North door with Crown Point and Carroll. Penn and Snider should be up there as well.  

[BTF]

1 minute ago, Footballking16 said:

Or the randomness of a single elimination tournament…

You guys are exhausting. Fun, but exhausting. 

1 minute ago, temptation said:

Sigh, I like you man…but you’re crazy sometimes.

Didn't FootballKing say they played "nobody" for three months? What was incorrect about my statement. 

[temptation]

2 minutes ago, BTF said:

You guys are exhausting. Fun, but exhausting. 

Didn't FootballKing say they played "nobody" for three months? What was incorrect about my statement. 

He did.  That can also be an advantage ya know…it’s a two way street.

Westfield (who I’m not making any specific excuses for) played the 4th toughest schedule in Indiana last year.

[Footballking16]

1 minute ago, Boilernation said:

Agreed. Which is why I will continue to hold out hope somebody can figure out how to turn Lake Central around. There's zero reason they're not knocking on the 6A non-Indy North door with Crown Point and Carroll. Penn and Snider should be up there as well.  

Those guys all need to form their own conference. I get it would be a logistical nightmare, but for football’s sake it needs to happen. Makes too much sense from a competitive standpoint.

-Snider

-Carroll 

-Homestead

-Elkhart

-Penn

-Lake Central

-Crown Point

-Valpo

[BTF]

15 minutes ago, temptation said:

Who in the hell has Jeff beaten?  A rebuilding Avon program or we talking those big conference wins over Tech?

So a win over Avon isn't a good win? Let's not pretend that Avon is some kind of chump. 

[BTF]

3 minutes ago, temptation said:

He did.  That can also be an advantage ya know…it’s a two way street.

Westfield (who I’m not making any specific excuses for) played the 4th toughest schedule in Indiana last year.

I thought this forum came to the conclusion that playing a tough schedule is the key ingredient to deep runs in 6A? Damn, we've been debating this for years now. Now an Indy team loses and it's because the northern team was well rested.......lol. Now I've heard it all. 

[Footballking16]

3 minutes ago, BTF said:

So a win over Avon isn't a good win? Let's not pretend that Avon is some kind of chump. 

They’ve won 5 games in 3 years…

[BTF]

6 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

Those guys all need to form their own conference. I get it would be a logistical nightmare, but for football’s sake it needs to happen. Makes too much sense from a competitive standpoint.

-Snider

-Carroll 

-Homestead

-Elkhart

-Penn

-Lake Central

-Crown Point

-Valpo

Nope, then they'll be too tired and worn down and lose at semi state.

3 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

They’ve won 5 games in 3 years…

And lost to some pretty good teams by less than a touchdown.

[Footballking16]

1 minute ago, BTF said:

I thought this forum came to the conclusion that playing a tough schedule is the key ingredient to deep runs in 6A? Damn, we've been debating this for years now. Now an Indy team loses and it's because the northern team was well rested.......lol. Now I've heard it all. 

Being battle tested always helps but isn’t a pre-requisite formula for winning.
 

Question: How many times in the last 15-20 years have you seen an undefeated (or close to it) team from the northern part of the state get blitzed and fold against a team from Indy because it’s their first real competition they’ve seen all year?

Answer: a lot more times than a team like Carroll or Crown Point beating a team from central Indiana.

4 minutes ago, BTF said:

Nope, then they'll be too tired and worn down and lose at semi state.

Well which is it? Your last post literally contradicts this?

[BTF]

6 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

Being battle tested always helps but isn’t a pre-requisite formula for winning.
 

Question: How many times in the last 15-20 years have you seen an undefeated (or close to it) team from the northern part of the state get blitzed and fold against a team from Indy because it’s their first real competition they’ve seen all year?

Answer: a lot more times than a team like Carroll or Crown Point beating a team from central Indiana.

Probably not a fair statement about Snider. But you do you. You guys are stretching tonight for every excuse you can find to justify why the HCC is zero for the last two years vs True North. 

Edited August 28, 2024 by BTF

[scarab527]

41 minutes ago, temptation said:

No one is “upset”, lol.  You can’t get upset when folks dismiss these types of games as “one offs” when looking in an unbiased manner at the last 25 years of large school football in our state.

Carroll and Crown Point were cute stories and then they got “ trucked” (appropriate here) a week later by Indy powers.

I long for parity in 6A and am hopeful that 2024 delivers.  We’ve seen glimpses but I want chaos.

Not gonna disagree with the general point here, but do you really think the results in those state games would’ve been that much different had HSE and Westfield played in them instead? Cause I’m pretty sure CG and BD would’ve taken them to the woodshed as well. 
 

I do think it’s fair to say though that the “one off” characterization becomes less justifiable when it happens two years in a row. Once can be a fluke, twice in a row and you have to start reevaluating, imo. 

Edited August 28, 2024 by scarab527

[Footballking16]

7 minutes ago, scarab527 said:

Not gonna disagree with the general point here, but do you really think the results in those state games would’ve been that much different had HSE and Westfield played in them instead? Cause I’m pretty sure CG and BD would’ve taken them to the woodshed as well.

Westfield and Center Grove played to an absolute classic in the 2021 title game in one of the better 6A title games in history. I would expect HSE, Westfield, insert 6A Hamilton County to be more competitive in a title game against BD, Warren, CG, etc at least in theory, because all those Hamilton County schools play top end competition night in and night out. Not saying it would always play out that way and it certainly hasn’t based on some previous results but just an opinion I have.

[scarab527]

1 minute ago, Footballking16 said:

Westfield and Center Grove played to an absolute classic in the 2021 title game in one of the better 6A title games in history. I would expect HSE, Westfield, insert 6A Hamilton County to be more competitive in a title game against BD, Warren, CG, etc at least in theory, because all those Hamilton County schools play top end competition night in and night out. Not saying it would always play out that way and it certainly hasn’t based on some previous results but just an opinion I have.

Yeah and the year before CG manhandled Westfield.

 

From what I saw those years, the results would’ve been about the same. 

Edited August 28, 2024 by scarab527

[Footballking16]

23 minutes ago, BTF said:

Probably not a fair statement about Snider. But you do you. You guys are stretching tonight for every excuse you can find to justify why the HCC is zero for the last two years vs True North. 

I mean Snider is 6-12 by my count against Indy-area schools in the last 20 years. 

[Footballking16]

1 minute ago, scarab527 said:

Yeah and the year before CG manhandled Westfield.

 

From what I saw those years, the results would’ve been about the same. 

Like I said, it doesn’t always play out that way. But if you were to ask me who would be more competitive against a CG, BD, WC type team in a championship game: Crown Point/Carroll or Hamilton County HCC school, I’m picking the Hamilton County school 10/10 times.

[BTF]

4 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

I mean Snider is 6-12 by my count against Indy-area schools in the last 20 years. 

Good work. I'm seeing 7-12 and four of those games were decided by less than a touchdown, three by less than a field goal. However they are 6-6 going back 12 years. Almost every Indy school is on Snider's list of victims historically, so I'm not sure where you're going with this. 

[scarab527]

3 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

Like I said, it doesn’t always play out that way. But if you were to ask me who would be more competitive against a CG, BD, WC type team in a championship game: Crown Point/Carroll or Hamilton County HCC school, I’m picking the Hamilton County school 10/10 times.

Yeah, if the HCC team is Brownsburg. 
 

Sticking by my original statement that HSE or Westfield would not have given that much better games in 2022 or 2023. 

[Footballking16]

7 minutes ago, scarab527 said:

Yeah, if the HCC team is Brownsburg. 
 

Sticking by my original statement that HSE or Westfield would not have given that much better games in 2022 or 2023. 

Based on what? HSE went undefeated in the best conference in the state including a win over….Brownsburg.

[psaboy]

19 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

I mean Snider is 6-12 by my count against Indy-area schools in the last 20 years. 

I'll check your math tomorrow,  but think you are close. 

[scarab527]

6 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

Based on what? HSE went undefeated in the best conference in the state including a win over….Brownsburg.

Because recent history says Brownsburg has been the HCC that has faired best against the teams you’re mentioning. And because just by watching these teams, it’s pretty easy to see Brownsburg generally has the athletes on the outside to matchup with those teams you mentioned, whereas the other HCC generally don’t. 
 

By that logic, you’d have to say Carroll would fair better than HSE would’ve seeing as they beat HSE…

Edited August 28, 2024 by scarab527

[Footballking16]

5 minutes ago, scarab527 said:

By that logic, you’d have to say Carroll would fair better than HSE would’ve seeing as they beat HSE…

Well no because I watched HSE go 12-0 playing one of the hardest schedules in the state that year. Had Carroll played a schedule that remotely resembled HSE’s with the same outcome then yeah, I’d be inclined to agree with you. Transitive property isn’t really a predictor in football.