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DT

MIC should give Lawrence schools the boot

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3 minutes ago, Temptation said:

Lawrence North's girls are also making their second consecutive state finals appearance this weekend in basketball...

That plays well in The HCC

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21 hours ago, DT said:

I would not be at all surprised if the Lawrence Township High School athletic apparatus is reconsidering their long term attachment to the MIC

On paper, just a poor fit for both schools.  

If the HCC would accept FC, I have no doubt they would also accept LC and LN.   

The MIC might be better served to go forward with 6 schools, giving its members more scheduling flexibility in football.  With Cox retired, the 300 mile travel rule might be back in play.  

If the MIC were to prefer remaining at 8, Cathedral and Tech would be my top two candidates.   I would not consider any HCC schools for membership.  

"If the horse is dead...get off the horse."

--Bob Knight

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On 2/26/2020 at 12:06 PM, DT said:

That plays well in The HCC

Funny how your tune has changed from CG and Carmel because of attendance.  Now LC and LN, who don’t travel well (LN had less than 150 fans at the GBB semi state last week compared to Bedfords 1500) should join the HCC.

 

 My IQ goes down every time I read one of your posts.

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10 hours ago, HoosierFB_JG said:

Funny how your tune has changed from CG and Carmel because of attendance.  Now LC and LN, who don’t travel well (LN had less than 150 fans at the GBB semi state last week compared to Bedfords 1500) should join the HCC.

 

 My IQ goes down every time I read one of your posts.

You make good points...

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10 hours ago, HoosierFB_JG said:

Funny how your tune has changed from CG and Carmel because of attendance.  Now LC and LN, who don’t travel well (LN had less than 150 fans at the GBB semi state last week compared to Bedfords 1500) should join the HCC.

 

 My IQ goes down every time I read one of your posts.

The MIC was conceived as a collection of "super schools" who had outgrown their competition in both enrollmentment and competitiveness in football

Lawrence North as a charter conference member was neither a super enrollment school nor a local football power.   It was added as a means to an end to get to 8 member schools

Neither LN nor LC are viewed today as super enrollment or super competitive football schools

Hence, they are basically "filler" material for the mega schools

Is that really in the best interests of their student athletes?

 

 

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1 hour ago, DT said:

The MIC was conceived as a collection of "super schools" who had outgrown their competition in both enrollmentment and competitiveness in football

Lawrence North as a charter conference member was neither a super enrollment school nor a local football power.   It was added as a means to an end to get to 8 member schools

Neither LN nor LC are viewed today as super enrollment or super competitive football schools

Hence, they are basically "filler" material for the mega schools

Is that really in the best interests of their student athletes?

 

 

One of the recent seasons, LN won a sectional title in 11 of their 17 sports. They are almost always in the middle or upper in the conference in other sports. Outside of the main sports of football and basketball, schools like BD, WC, and Pike are generally the bottom of the conference. This includes tennis, swimming, cross country. softball, etc. If you frame of reference is only football and basketball you are not seeing the entire picture.

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30 minutes ago, JustRules said:

One of the recent seasons, LN won a sectional title in 11 of their 17 sports. They are almost always in the middle or upper in the conference in other sports. Outside of the main sports of football and basketball, schools like BD, WC, and Pike are generally the bottom of the conference. This includes tennis, swimming, cross country. softball, etc. If you frame of reference is only football and basketball you are not seeing the entire picture.

My point exactly!!!  Conference affiliations are much more than football...

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But it's the money making sports like Basketball and Football keeping the minor sports alive.

 

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3 hours ago, Muda69 said:

But it's the money making sports like Basketball and Football keeping the minor sports alive.

 

LN and LC have excellent basketball......

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LN girls won state this weekend. The boys swim team finished in the top 20 in state swimming. Only Carmel and Center Grove in the MIC finished ahead of them. Warren Central and North Central were the other only MIC schools that scored points. 48 of the 240 schools in the state scored at the meet.

Looking at the MIC vs. HCC in swimming, the HCC is stronger. Here is how their teams finished in sectional and state:
Fishers - 2nd in Sectional 8, 4th in State
Zionsville - 1st in Sectional 12, 5th in State
HSE - 1st in Sectional 8, 6th in State
Avon - 3rd in Sectional 11, 13th in State
Brownsburg - 1st in Sectional 13, 17 in State
Franklin Central - 3rd in Sectional 13, 22nd in State
Westfield - 2nd in Sectional 9, no points at State
Noblesville  - 3rd in Sectional 9, no swimmers at State

3 teams in the top 10 and 6 in the top 25 is very impressive. Westfield and Noblesville also have very good swim programs, but this shows how hard it is to score at state.

Meanwhile in the MIC:
Carmel - 1st in Sectional 9, 1st in State
Center Grove - 2nd in Sectional 16, 9th in State
Lawrence North - 2nd in Sectional 14, 19th in State
Warren Central - 4th in Sectional 14, 24th in State
North Central - 1st in Sectional 14, 39th in State
LC - 6th in Sectional 14, no points at State
Ben Davis - 4th in Sectional 13, no swimmers at State
Pike - 6th in Sectional 13, no swimmers at State

This just shows that sports vary from conference to conference. Munster, Chesterton and Penn are 3 of the other top 76 teams. Carroll and Franklin round out the top 10. None of those teams are top 25 teams in football. If you are only focusing on football as the only sport to determine where a school should be you are not looking at it from the perspective of an athletic administrator.

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42 minutes ago, JustRules said:

LN girls won state this weekend. The boys swim team finished in the top 20 in state swimming. Only Carmel and Center Grove in the MIC finished ahead of them. Warren Central and North Central were the other only MIC schools that scored points. 48 of the 240 schools in the state scored at the meet.

Looking at the MIC vs. HCC in swimming, the HCC is stronger. Here is how their teams finished in sectional and state:
Fishers - 2nd in Sectional 8, 4th in State
Zionsville - 1st in Sectional 12, 5th in State
HSE - 1st in Sectional 8, 6th in State
Avon - 3rd in Sectional 11, 13th in State
Brownsburg - 1st in Sectional 13, 17 in State
Franklin Central - 3rd in Sectional 13, 22nd in State
Westfield - 2nd in Sectional 9, no points at State
Noblesville  - 3rd in Sectional 9, no swimmers at State

3 teams in the top 10 and 6 in the top 25 is very impressive. Westfield and Noblesville also have very good swim programs, but this shows how hard it is to score at state.

Meanwhile in the MIC:
Carmel - 1st in Sectional 9, 1st in State
Center Grove - 2nd in Sectional 16, 9th in State
Lawrence North - 2nd in Sectional 14, 19th in State
Warren Central - 4th in Sectional 14, 24th in State
North Central - 1st in Sectional 14, 39th in State
LC - 6th in Sectional 14, no points at State
Ben Davis - 4th in Sectional 13, no swimmers at State
Pike - 6th in Sectional 13, no swimmers at State

This just shows that sports vary from conference to conference. Munster, Chesterton and Penn are 3 of the other top 76 teams. Carroll and Franklin round out the top 10. None of those teams are top 25 teams in football. If you are only focusing on football as the only sport to determine where a school should be you are not looking at it from the perspective of an athletic administrator.

The MIC is a different animal.   It was founded solely on the premise that it bring together central Indiana's top programs to form the best high school football conference in the Midwest

It is barely the top conference in the state at this time due to traditional bottom laggards LC, LN and PK. NC has risen mightily in the past few years 

 

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13 minutes ago, DT said:

The MIC is a different animal.   It was founded solely on the premise that it bring together central Indiana's top programs to form the best high school football conference in the Midwest

It is barely the top conference in the state at this time due to traditional bottom laggards LC, LN and PK. NC has risen mightily in the past few years 

 

Follow Tom Lemming on Twitter.  He tweeted during the NFL combine while here in Indy about 2 LN players that are high on radar screens.  (McCulley & Cooper)  LN has some talent DT....and a heck of a coach.

He also gave Caden Curry and Austin Booker love from CG.

image.png.fb0525d87c144e9872726f26372e575e.png

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1 hour ago, TrojanDad said:

Follow Tom Lemming on Twitter.  He tweeted during the NFL combine while here in Indy about 2 LN players that are high on radar screens.  (McCulley & Cooper)  LN has some talent DT....and a heck of a coach.

He also gave Caden Curry and Austin Booker love from CG.

image.png.fb0525d87c144e9872726f26372e575e.png

No one is contesting the fact that LN on occasion will produce some high end talent

So do HSE, ZV, BlackBerry, AV, WF Fishers and others 

There is no disputing the fact however that Carmel has 5000 students  while LN has 2300.  BD 4600.  WC and NC 3700.  Those enrollment discrepancies do not support competitive balance in a sport that requires depth 

 

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Another reason why this idea is next-level stupid:

 

Travel time.  The distances from the Larry’s is a lot less to the city schools as opposed to the remote outposts (😉) of Avon, Westfield, etc.  it is also on the student-athlete’s best interest to study which can really hampered by a bus ride on I-465 on a Tuesday night.

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22 hours ago, DT said:

The MIC is a different animal.   It was founded solely on the premise that it bring together central Indiana's top programs to form the best high school football conference in the Midwest

It is barely the top conference in the state at this time due to traditional bottom laggards LC, LN and PK. NC has risen mightily in the past few years 

 

Just stop. One year the HCC was comparable and it was STILL an all MIC final. The MIC is still by far the king. I have no affiliation to these conferences, but to diminish how good this conference is at all is silly. 

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3 hours ago, Gipper said:

Another reason why this idea is next-level stupid:

 

Travel time.  The distances from the Larry’s is a lot less to the city schools as opposed to the remote outposts (😉) of Avon, Westfield, etc.  it is also on the student-athlete’s best interest to study which can really hampered by a bus ride on I-465 on a Tuesday night.

The move to add Franklin Central showed that the HCC is open to any and all expansion options.  It also opens up a pathway to the south for the conference.  

 

Fishers, HSE, Noblesville, FC are all easy commutes for the Larrys

Avon is just a bit further out than Ben Davis

 

 

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1 hour ago, btownqbcoach said:

Just stop. One year the HCC was comparable and it was STILL an all MIC final. The MIC is still by far the king. I have no affiliation to these conferences, but to diminish how good this conference is at all is silly. 

Great observation.  City kids should play city kids.  This is not sone fantasy football league.

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On 2/28/2020 at 1:17 PM, Muda69 said:

But it's the money making sports like Basketball and Football keeping the minor sports alive.

 

Pardon me, but I might be a bit ignorant. @Muda69 makes a great point. Speaking purely from a former AD perspective, basketball and football keep other sports alive at many schools. Hence the reason many schools don’t want to cut football even if they aren’t Conference or Sectional contenders. Swimming, wrestling, tennis, golf, track, etc are not paying the bills, or coaches salaries. Football and basketball do that.

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4 minutes ago, Coach_K said:

Pardon me, but I might be a bit ignorant. @Muda69 makes a great point. Speaking purely from a former AD perspective, basketball and football keep other sports alive at many schools. Hence the reason many schools don’t want to cut football even if they aren’t Conference or Sectional contenders. Swimming, wrestling, tennis, golf, track, etc are not paying the bills, or coaches salaries. Football and basketball do that.

Not ignorant at all.

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On 3/3/2020 at 11:13 AM, DT said:

The move to add Franklin Central showed that the HCC is open to any and all expansion options.  It also opens up a pathway to the south for the conference.  

 

Fishers, HSE, Noblesville, FC are all easy commutes for the Larrys

Avon is just a bit further out than Ben Davis

 

 

FC filled the 8th opening from when the Lafayette area schools left.  The HCC is now closed for expansion.  I repeat, the HCC is closed!

Thank you for your interest.

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10 hours ago, Staxawax said:

FC filled the 8th opening from when the Lafayette area schools left.  The HCC is now closed for expansion.  I repeat, the HCC is closed!

Thank you for your interest.

Eight is a good number of members.  Probably the best as it allows a round-robin league schedule in addition to two out of conference games.

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