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Crown Point could become the Northern version of Center Grove


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Lots of similarities between the two communities.

Both very affluent.

Community life centered around both high schools.

Top notch facilities.

Hyper intense local support

Total admin buy in.

Growing enrollment

Transfer magnet

What is the biggest difference between the two?

Coaching and Program Leadership.

Crown Point has everything in place to become the northern version of Center Grove.  Great numbers.  Solid athletes.  Growing diversity.  Established pee wee,bantam and junuior high feeders.  

Now all CP neads is an Eric Moore type visionary leader to turn all this potential into reality.,

Locally, several head coaches might consider making the jump to grab this opportunity:

Phil Mason - Michigan City

Chris Skinner - Andrean

Craig Osika - Hobart

Keith Kilmer - Lowell

Brad Siess - Merrillville

 

Out of Area Candidates :

Pat Shanley - Lafayette Jeff

Shane Fry - West Lafayette

Adam Berry - Pioneer

Mike Davidson - Mishawaka Marian

Bart Curtis - Warsaw

Tom Wogomon - Northridge

Nate Andrews - Northwood

Chad Zolman - Homestead

Dave Sharpe - Noblesville

Terry Peebles - Lafayette Harrison

Luke Amstutz - East Noble

 

 

 

 

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Lots of similarities between the two communities. Both very affluent. Community life centered around both high schools. Top notch facilities. Hyper intense local support Total

I'd argue that Marion County schools ARE staying the same if not declining (I know that some of the folks on this board will rush to their defense and pretend they are outraged by this statement).  I'

VHS Boys basketball would like to discuss your assumption. By all means, keep going Mr. P.

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CP is definitely a sleeping giant and the new Superintendent has deep football roots.  All the chatter on the other thread has me very intrigued about who the new coach will be.  I have some guesses, but I'm going to keep them to myself out of respect for all involved. I'm a Lowell guy so I hope they screw it up. Competitively, football is all we have!! 

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8 hours ago, DT said:

Lots of similarities between the two communities.

Both very affluent.

Community life centered around both high schools.

Top notch facilities.

Hyper intense local support

Total admin buy in.

Growing enrollment

Transfer magnet

What is the biggest difference between the two?

Coaching and Program Leadership.

Crown Point has everything in place to become the northern version of Center Grove.  Great numbers.  Solid athletes.  Growing diversity.  Established pee wee,bantam and junuior high feeders.  

Now all CP neads is an Eric Moore type visionary leader to turn all this potential into reality.,

Locally, several head coaches might consider making the jump to grab this opportunity:

Phil Mason - Michigan City

Chris Skinner - Andrean

Craig Osika - Hobart

Keith Kilmer - Lowell

Brad Siess - Merrillville

 

Out of Area Candidates :

Pat Shanley - Lafayette Jeff

Shane Fry - West Lafayette

Adam Berry - Pioneer

Mike Davidson - Mishawaka Marian

Bart Curtis - Warsaw

Tom Wogomon - Northridge

Nate Andrews - Northwood

Chad Zolman - Homestead

Dave Sharpe - Noblesville

Terry Peebles - Lafayette Harrison

Luke Amstutz - East Noble

 

 

 

 

You forgot that they boast the same school colors...cannot overlook that.

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If I were them, I'd work on scheduling some MIC schools in the non-Duneland part of the schedule if they can if that's truly their aim to become a big time player in the north. The north is ripe for the emergence of a power if they keep sending Carmel south.

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When I coached at Crown Point under Chip Pettit and Kevin Enright, we would travel to CG on a Friday in July.  We would have a team day.  Long trip down and back but it sure was worth it at the time.  Those non air conditioned bus rides were brutal.  I do not miss that part of coaching one bit.

We would compete our tails off.  The one thing that really jumped out at me comparing our 2011 and 2012 teams at CP to the CG teams of those 2 years, were the massive size difference CG had.  At that time, our speed and physicality were even.

 

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ATE OPPONENT CENTRAL TIME OA 0.0, DA 0.0
Aug. 20 at Lowell 4A 7:00 pm    
Aug. 27   Andrean 2A 7:00 pm    
Sep. 3   Merrillville 6A © 7:00 pm    
Sep. 10 at Lake Central 6A © 7:00 pm    
Sep. 17 at Portage 6A © 7:00 pm    
Sep. 24   Valparaiso 5A © 7:00 pm    
Oct. 1   LaPorte 5A © 7:00 pm    
Oct. 8 at Chesterton 6A © 7:00 pm    
Oct. 15   Michigan City 5A © 7:00 pm

 

Who do you replace ?

no way LOWELL,  that is a huge rival, going back to early 1900s     

Andrean looks new to the schedule which looks like replacing Highland and before that Mishawaka 

I would reckon that leaving Andrean off could open up but I truly understand the significance for this game to be played,  especialy if Andrean finishes their capitial project to have their new school in crown point about 4 miles away from the CPHS

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11 hours ago, DT said:

Lots of similarities between the two communities.

Both very affluent.

Community life centered around both high schools.

Top notch facilities.

Hyper intense local support

Total admin buy in.

Growing enrollment

Transfer magnet

What is the biggest difference between the two?

Coaching and Program Leadership.

Crown Point has everything in place to become the northern version of Center Grove.  Great numbers.  Solid athletes.  Growing diversity.  Established pee wee,bantam and junuior high feeders.  

Now all CP neads is an Eric Moore type visionary leader to turn all this potential into reality.,

Locally, several head coaches might consider making the jump to grab this opportunity:

Phil Mason - Michigan City

Chris Skinner - Andrean

Craig Osika - Hobart

Keith Kilmer - Lowell

Brad Siess - Merrillville

 

Out of Area Candidates :

Pat Shanley - Lafayette Jeff

Shane Fry - West Lafayette

Adam Berry - Pioneer

Mike Davidson - Mishawaka Marian

Bart Curtis - Warsaw

Tom Wogomon - Northridge

Nate Andrews - Northwood

Chad Zolman - Homestead

Dave Sharpe - Noblesville

Terry Peebles - Lafayette Harrison

Luke Amstutz - East Noble

 

 

 

 

Something else to take into consideration in the CP/CG comparison is the enrollment that Crown Point possesses compared to its region counterparts.  Only Lake Central boasts a larger student body and they have a clear advantage in that aspect over everyone else.  Center Grove does not.

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12 minutes ago, temptation said:

Something else to take into consideration in the CP/CG comparison is the enrollment that Crown Point possesses compared to its region counterparts.  Only Lake Central boasts a larger student body and they have a clear advantage in that aspect over everyone else.  Center Grove does not.

CP clrearly has not leveraged its resource advantage in The Region.  That is why Coach Enright was asked to resign.

A big hire is coming.  CP will be sending a huge message to Merrillville and Valparaiso that it is intent on taking aim at DAC football leadership.  Looking forward to watching this develop over the next 3 to 5 years.

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1 hour ago, BDGiant93 said:

If I were them, I'd work on scheduling some MIC schools in the non-Duneland part of the schedule if they can if that's truly their aim to become a big time player in the north. The north is ripe for the emergence of a power if they keep sending Carmel south.

Agree

Any of the Big 4 would be a great test for the Bulldogs.  Not quite yet.  2024   Another interesting matchup would be Crown Point - Cathedral

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56 minutes ago, DE said:

When I coached at Crown Point under Chip Pettit and Kevin Enright, we would travel to CG on a Friday in July.  We would have a team day.  Long trip down and back but it sure was worth it at the time.  Those non air conditioned bus rides were brutal.  I do not miss that part of coaching one bit.

We would compete our tails off.  The one thing that really jumped out at me comparing our 2011 and 2012 teams at CP to the CG teams of those 2 years, were the massive size difference CG had.  At that time, our speed and physicality were even.

 

CP needs to get its kids into the weight room.  

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55 minutes ago, Coach Nowlin said:
ATE OPPONENT CENTRAL TIME OA 0.0, DA 0.0
Aug. 20 at Lowell 4A 7:00 pm    
Aug. 27   Andrean 2A 7:00 pm    
Sep. 3   Merrillville 6A © 7:00 pm    
Sep. 10 at Lake Central 6A © 7:00 pm    
Sep. 17 at Portage 6A © 7:00 pm    
Sep. 24   Valparaiso 5A © 7:00 pm    
Oct. 1   LaPorte 5A © 7:00 pm    
Oct. 8 at Chesterton 6A © 7:00 pm    
Oct. 15   Michigan City 5A © 7:00 pm

 

Who do you replace ?

no way LOWELL,  that is a huge rival, going back to early 1900s     

Andrean looks new to the schedule which looks like replacing Highland and before that Mishawaka 

I would reckon that leaving Andrean off could open up but I truly understand the significance for this game to be played,  especialy if Andrean finishes their capitial project to have their new school in crown point about 4 miles away from the CPHS

Regardless of long time rivalry ties, it just does not make sense for a highly aspirational 6A program to play down to 4A and 2A in non con play.  Cant convince me of that.  CP will soon be over 3000 students.  Lowell has 1100.  This is a lose lose proposition for CP.  Win and it was expected.  Lose and you are a bum for losing to a much smaller school.  

2 minutes ago, Coach Nowlin said:

From the Region coaches I have talked to tell me that Crown point has strong kids, so one would say that they do a nice job in the weight room.   

They fail the eye test when compared to central Indiana schools.  I can see it throughout The DAC when I look at game photos in The Times.  

Edited by DT
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4 minutes ago, Coach Nowlin said:

From the Region coaches I have talked to tell me that Crown point has strong kids, so one would say that they do a nice job in the weight room.   

Not from the area, but doesn't Crown Point have a damn fine wrestling program or am I mistaken?  Where is the disconnect between wrestling and football?

Edited by temptation
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1 minute ago, temptation said:

Not from the area, but doesn't Crown Point have a damn fine wrestling program or am I mistaken?

Sure   Lots of 140-160 pound guys with big biceps and bulging thighs.  But they cant help on 4th and 1 against the Carmel defensive front.

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12 minutes ago, DT said:

CP needs to get its kids into the weight room.  

When I was there, they all were.  I have NO REASON to believe anything has changed.

The weight room does not add 10 inches in height to a player.

Our 6 foot safety running down the field trying to cover their 6-10 TE, Nate Wazniak is a vivid memory.

Appreciate the response Mr. P.

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20 minutes ago, Coach Nowlin said:

From the Region coaches I have talked to tell me that Crown point has strong kids, so one would say that they do a nice job in the weight room.   

BINGO!

The school is supportive of their kids taking APC (or whatever it is called at CP).  Our kids were expected to take it.  If they didn't or couldn't b/c of their schedule, they would join us beginning in January for 530 am workouts in the weight room and conditioning.  Many learned REAL quick to find a way to schedule APC during the day.  Of course, some absolutely could not and they were the ones at the school by 5 am waiting on us coaches to get there.  They then went on their day taking numerous AP/dual credit courses, heavily involved in all aspects of school and community.

We worked HARD at CP, but man did we have a good time.

23 minutes ago, DT said:

Regardless of long time rivalry ties, it just does not make sense for a highly aspirational 6A program to play down to 4A and 2A in non con play.  Cant convince me of that.  CP will soon be over 3000 students.  Lowell has 1100.  This is a lose lose proposition for CP.  Win and it was expected.  Lose and you are a bum for losing to a much smaller school.  

They fail the eye test when compared to central Indiana schools.  I can see it throughout The DAC when I look at game photos in The Times.  

Lowell football would like to have a word w you Mr. P.

I think the ENTIRE state would agree of the football reputation Lowell has.

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23 minutes ago, temptation said:

Not from the area, but doesn't Crown Point have a damn fine wrestling program or am I mistaken?  Where is the disconnect between wrestling and football?

All I can attest is, there wasn't one when I was there.  Many did both sports.

21 minutes ago, DT said:

Sure   Lots of 140-160 pound guys with big biceps and bulging thighs.  But they cant help on 4th and 1 against the Carmel defensive front.

Marcus Shrewsbury would like to have a word with you Mr. P.

https://nusports.com/sports/wrestling/roster/marcus-shrewsbury/2033

 

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2 minutes ago, DE said:

BINGO!

The school is supportive of their kids taking APC (or whatever it is called at CP).  Our kids were expected to take it.  If they didn't or couldn't b/c of their schedule, they would join us beginning in January for 530 am workouts in the weight room and conditioning.  Many learned REAL quick to find a way to schedule APC during the day.  Of course, some absolutely could not and they were the ones at the school by 5 am waiting on us coaches to get there.  They then went on their day taking numerous AP/dual credit courses, heavily involved in all aspects of school and community.

We worked HARD at CP, but man did we have a good time.

Bottom line, CP needs to get bigger and stronger.  If you look at the past 5 years, typically you are looking at 6-3, 275LB average across the offensive line when you get deep into the 6A tournament.  Lots 0f 6-5 , 300 LB plus guys all over the state.  Dont see much of that in the DAC, outside of Valpo.  

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28 minutes ago, DT said:

Regardless of long time rivalry ties, it just does not make sense for a highly aspirational 6A program to play down to 4A and 2A in non con play.  Cant convince me of that.  CP will soon be over 3000 students.  Lowell has 1100.  This is a lose lose proposition for CP.  Win and it was expected.  Lose and you are a bum for losing to a much smaller school.  

Beyond the fact it's one of Indiana's oldest rivalries (some say the oldest), you are overlooking a very important fact as to why the CP-Lowell rivalry will remain:   Economics! Lowell fans travel better than any other team in the Region.

Plus, the kids are just getting back to school, it's week one of the HS season, the CP kids love to dress up as farmers to tweak the Lowell kids, etc. The stands are PACKED.  You need to lighten up old man and realize competition isn't everything!  If you weren't such a curmudgeon I'd invite you to the game at the Inferno next year as a side trip to visit your family.  It's a top 10 Indiana HS Friday night atmosphere IMO. 

 

Edited by vito
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1 minute ago, DT said:

Bottom line, CP needs to get bigger and stronger.  If you look at the past 5 years, typically you are looking at 6-3, 275LB average across the offensive line when you get deep into the 6A tournament.  Lots 0f 6-5 , 300 LB plus guys all over the state.  Dont see much of that in the DAC, outside of Valpo.  

I don't think ANYONE, including the great people at CP, would argue.

Again, how do you control how tall you are?

Unless you try the Arnold Jackson approach....which we all know, didn't work.

2 minutes ago, vito said:

Beyond the fact it's one of Indiana's oldest rivalries (some say the oldest), you are overlooking a very important fact as to why the CP-Lowell rivalry will remain:   Economics!

Lowell fans travel better than any other team in the Region. Plus, the kids are just getting back to school, it's week one of the HS season, the CP kids love to dress up as farmers to tweak the Lowell kids, etc. The stands are PACKED.  You need to lighten up old man and realize competition isn't everything!  If you weren't such a curmudgeon I'd invite you to the game at the Inferno next year as a side trip to visit your family.  It's a top 10 Indiana HS Friday night atmosphere IMO. 

 

RDP football is LEGIT!

Hobart travels well too.

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3 minutes ago, DE said:

I don't think ANYONE, including the great people at CP, would argue.

Again, how do you control how tall you are?

Unless you try the Arnold Jackson approach....which we all know, didn't work.

Have a conversation with the Head Basketball Coach, and encourage him to push his players to play multiple sports instead of specializing.  Lots of TEs, receivers and defensive backs could be found on the hardwood.

6 minutes ago, vito said:

Beyond the fact it's one of Indiana's oldest rivalries (some say the oldest), you are overlooking a very important fact as to why the CP-Lowell rivalry will remain:   Economics!

Lowell fans travel better than any other team in the Region. Plus, the kids are just getting back to school, it's week one of the HS season, the CP kids love to dress up as farmers to tweak the Lowell kids, etc. The stands are PACKED.  You need to lighten up old man and realize competition isn't everything!  If you weren't such a curmudgeon I'd invite you to the game at the Inferno next year as a side trip to visit your family.  It's a top 10 Indiana HS Friday night atmosphere IMO. 

 

Roger That!

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5 minutes ago, DT said:

Have a conversation with the Head Basketball Coach, and encourage him to push his players to play multiple sports instead of specializing.  Lots of TEs, receivers and defensive backs could be found on the hardwood.

Roger That!

Makes sense.  I get your thought process....

Though the big OL that you are speaking of at Valpo (besides Jones) do not play hoops.

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13 minutes ago, DE said:

Makes sense.  I get your thought process....

Though the big OL that you are speaking of at Valpo (besides Jones) do not play hoops.

Why does Valpo have two 6-6, 300lb D1 linemen on the same roster and CP has never had one bigger than Kurt Wermers (6-3/275)???????

https://247sports.com/player/kurt-wermers-24382/

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1 hour ago, Coach Nowlin said:
ATE OPPONENT CENTRAL TIME OA 0.0, DA 0.0
Aug. 20 at Lowell 4A 7:00 pm    
Aug. 27   Andrean 2A 7:00 pm    
Sep. 3   Merrillville 6A © 7:00 pm    
Sep. 10 at Lake Central 6A © 7:00 pm    
Sep. 17 at Portage 6A © 7:00 pm    
Sep. 24   Valparaiso 5A © 7:00 pm    
Oct. 1   LaPorte 5A © 7:00 pm    
Oct. 8 at Chesterton 6A © 7:00 pm    
Oct. 15   Michigan City 5A © 7:00 pm

 

Who do you replace ?

no way LOWELL,  that is a huge rival, going back to early 1900s     

Andrean looks new to the schedule which looks like replacing Highland and before that Mishawaka 

I would reckon that leaving Andrean off could open up but I truly understand the significance for this game to be played,  especialy if Andrean finishes their capitial project to have their new school in crown point about 4 miles away from the CPHS

Tough question. I think you have to look at changing up the front end of your schedule if you want to compete for a 6A state title. Nothing against Lowell or Andrean...both fine programs. It's a different gear when you're playing any of the MIC teams, HCC teams, or Cathedral.

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