Muda69 Posted April 27 Share Posted April 27 https://reason.com/2023/04/26/stadium-subsidy-stupidity-hits-new-record/ Quote The Metropolitan Council of Nashville and Davidson County voted in the wee hours on Wednesday morning to spend $1.26 billion in taxpayer money on a new government-owned stadium. That figure not only puts locals on the hook for more than half of the stadium's estimated $2.1 billion cost, but it also sets a new record for the largest stadium subsidy in U.S. history. Supporters of the new domed stadium say tourists will pay that money back, not locals. The Tennessean reports that Council Member Zulfat Suara "voted in favor because she prefers tourists to bear the tax burden of stadium construction and upkeep (through sales, ticket and hotel taxes) instead of Davidson County taxpayers." On top of a 1 percent hotel tax increase, sales taxes paid in and around the stadium (as well as ticket taxes and fees) will be used to repay $500 million in bonds from the state government and $760 million in bonds from Nashville's Sports Authority. That logic sounds good until you consider fans of the NFL's Tennessee Titans presumably live in Tennessee, if not mostly in Nashville and Davidson County. The fees and taxes also drive up costs for business travelers and visitors who aren't attending stadium events. Meanwhile, several special events are exempt from the new 3-percent ticket fee: Country Music Association events, Academy of Country Music events, the Grammy Awards, and World Wrestling Entertainment events. The problem with the new stadium, like the current Nissan Stadium, is not just who pays for it, but who owns it, and that's the The Metropolitan Council of Nashville and Davidson County. It's unclear if the Metropolitan Council ever considered getting out of the stadium business and simply asking the billionaire owner of the Titans to pay for the team's own upgrade. This is not an impossible task: SoFi Stadium outside Los Angeles is the most expensive stadium ever built and reportedly had no direct government subsidies. It's probably the finest stadium in the world and routinely hosts special events. Supporters say that with Nashville on the hook for the upkeep of the current stadium, it's cheaper to start fresh instead of upgrading Nissan Stadium. But the government never really looked into how much an upgrade that fulfilled Nashville's obligations would cost, only relying on one estimate provided by the Tennessee Titans owner of how much it would cost to build her dream stadium. It used to be that NFL team owners would threaten to move their teams and local governments would instead open their wallets for a shiny new stadium—now governments are tripping over themselves to give over $1 billion in subsidies to NFL owners who aren't even threatening to move. Fans won't even get a bigger stadium: The new one will seat 60,000 people, which is about 9,000 seats fewer than the current stadium and will be the smallest capacity in the NFL. The city is building a smaller stadium rather than renovating one the state owes money on through 2029. Nashville's $1.26 billion football stadium subsidy surpasses the $1 billion taxpayer subsidy for a new Buffalo Bills stadium approved last year. The stadium subsidy arms race never ends. The taxpayers of Nashville just got fleeced. Again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bash Riprock Posted May 3 Share Posted May 3 On 4/27/2023 at 9:47 AM, Muda69 said: https://reason.com/2023/04/26/stadium-subsidy-stupidity-hits-new-record/ The taxpayers of Nashville just got fleeced. Again. or....the voters of the city got exactly what they voted for. If not, then they will vote out the people in political power....or leave the area if that issue is a big enough deal to them as voting citizens. But I am sure they appreciate your concern. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muda69 Posted May 4 Author Share Posted May 4 20 hours ago, Bash Riprock said: or....the voters of the city got exactly what they voted for. If not, then they will vote out the people in political power....or leave the area if that issue is a big enough deal to them as voting citizens. But I am sure they appreciate your concern. Only the stupid voters of the city got what they voted for. And that seems to still be the majority of voters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bash Riprock Posted May 5 Share Posted May 5 (edited) On 5/4/2023 at 10:24 AM, Muda69 said: Only the stupid voters of the city got what they voted for. And that seems to still be the majority of voters. Careful with labels..the group you are insulting may indeed label you as the same...perhaps with the term of "shortsighted" as well..... Edited May 5 by Bash Riprock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muda69 Posted May 8 Author Share Posted May 8 On 5/5/2023 at 1:29 PM, Bash Riprock said: Careful with labels..the group you are insulting may indeed label you as the same...perhaps with the term of "shortsighted" as well..... How is my viewpoint shortsighted, Bash? Study after study has shown the complete money pit that publicly funded football stadiums have become, along with projected ancillary incomes that never materialized. And still frankly stupid individuals continue to support throwing their money away when it should be the billionaire owner putting up their own financing for such a project. What is shortsighted about that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bash Riprock Posted May 8 Share Posted May 8 (edited) 2 hours ago, Muda69 said: How is my viewpoint shortsighted, Bash? Study after study has shown the complete money pit that publicly funded football stadiums have become, along with projected ancillary incomes that never materialized. And still frankly stupid individuals continue to support throwing their money away when it should be the billionaire owner putting up their own financing for such a project. What is shortsighted about that? While other studies do show a return on investment. My point is that regardless which camp one lands in, just remember that when you are labeling a large group of people as stupid, those people may indeed be labeling you as the same. It their home...not yours. I don't know if the Titans need a new stadium or how the facility will be used to support the community outside of football. All stadium investments are not the same. But I do know this...I could care less how Nashville invests their money. Those citizens have that responsibility. Edited May 8 by Bash Riprock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muda69 Posted May 8 Author Share Posted May 8 1 hour ago, Bash Riprock said: While other studies do show a return on investment. Links. please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bash Riprock Posted May 8 Share Posted May 8 1 hour ago, Muda69 said: Links. please. I don't want to go down this rabbit hole with you. Try your favorite search engine....they are out there if you really want to find them with an open mind. But there are absolutely articles as to the pros and cons. I do agree that its more difficult to show a benefit when replacing an existing facility (that still has life) vs. building a first time stadium for a city. Bottom line, its the voting citizens of Nashville's business...not yours or mine. Calling voters of another city "stupid" because they have an outlook different than yours is unfortunate to say the best. They determine the "value" for them. Stay home Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gipper Posted May 8 Share Posted May 8 Maybe the home of the Music City Bowl needs a better stadium! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muda69 Posted May 9 Author Share Posted May 9 18 hours ago, Bash Riprock said: I don't want to go down this rabbit hole with you. Try your favorite search engine....they are out there if you really want to find them with an open mind. But there are absolutely articles as to the pros and cons. I do agree that its more difficult to show a benefit when replacing an existing facility (that still has life) vs. building a first time stadium for a city. Bottom line, its the voting citizens of Nashville's business...not yours or mine. Calling voters of another city "stupid" because they have an outlook different than yours is unfortunate to say the best. They determine the "value" for them. Stay home I hate seeing taxpayers money wasted. Pity that you don't. BTW, here is a new stadium/arena boondoggle just announced here in Indiana: https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nba/pacers/2023/05/08/pacers-news-mad-ants-moving-from-fort-wayne-to-noblesville/70196524007/ Quote Pacers Sports & Entertainment and the city of Noblesville announced Monday that the Fort Wayne Mad Ants, the Pacers' G-League affiliate, will move to Noblesville, which will build a 3,400 seat, 85,000-square-foot arena on the city's east side for the team. The city hopes the arena will be built for the 2024-25 season, and the Pacers say the Mad Ants will play in Gainbridge Fieldhouse until construction is completed. According to a press release, Noblesville is "working through due diligence steps with local partners and plan to build the arena at Finch Creek Park near the Mojo Up Sports Complex." The franchise will maintain the Mad Ants name through the 2023-24 season, after which a new name will be chosen. The Mad Ants were named after the namesake of Fort Wayne, "Mad" Anthony Wayne, an American Revolutionary War general and U.S. Congressman. ... According to the release, a 10-year partnership agreement between Noblesville and Pacers Sports & Entertainment will be presented Monday at the Noblesville Common Council meeting. The agreement includes a $5 million investment from PS&E, which will lead an effort to secure another $5 million in naming rights and signage over those 10 years. The city will invest $36.5 million in building the arena. .... What the Indianapolis Star really means is that Noblesville taxpayers will be on the hook for at least $36.5 million. For a minor league developmental team. Crazy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gonzoron Posted May 9 Share Posted May 9 44 minutes ago, Muda69 said: I hate seeing taxpayers money wasted. Pity that you don't. BTW, here is a new stadium/arena boondoggle just announced here in Indiana: https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nba/pacers/2023/05/08/pacers-news-mad-ants-moving-from-fort-wayne-to-noblesville/70196524007/ .... What the Indianapolis Star really means is that Noblesville taxpayers will be on the hook for at least $36.5 million. For a minor league developmental team. Crazy. You let this one slip by you? https://fox59.com/indiana-news/fishers-indy-fuel-prepare-to-break-ground-on-new-arena-event-center/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muda69 Posted May 9 Author Share Posted May 9 1 hour ago, gonzoron said: You let this one slip by you? https://fox59.com/indiana-news/fishers-indy-fuel-prepare-to-break-ground-on-new-arena-event-center/ Thanks. Article doesn't state exactly how much the taxpayers in Fishers are on the hook for this boondoggle, so one can assume most if not all of the $550,000,000 stated in the beginning or the article. Robbery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bash Riprock Posted May 9 Share Posted May 9 3 hours ago, Muda69 said: I hate seeing taxpayers money wasted. Pity that you don't. I think the fine people of Nashville will be just fine without my concern about a new stadium being built. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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