US31

Reminded me of the Marc Buoniconi hit....glad he was ok. When I was in college, there was a video (Dick Vermeil narrated it) about neck injuries that included game film from "head down" tackles that led to paralysis or death (Chucky Mullins may have been one?). Had to watch it each year before contact practices. Not sure if it was an NCAA thing, or something we did. Was one of the most miserable things I've ever had to watch.

https://www.click2houston.com/news/local/2020/12/04/texas-football-player-escorted-out-of-game-by-police-after-assaulting-referee/ Apparently this was a "play-in" game for Texas Playoffs. The blue team won, but today the school district has decided to pull the team from the playoffs. Ugly all the way around. It does sound like the official (27 year veteran) is going to be ok. Further, the kid who attacked the official had a very bright athletic future, in football & wrestling. But he has apparently had issues like this in the past. Terrible waste.

@Bobref In regards to "generate revenue"....how would less tournament games achieve this? I would piggy back this on top of the dismissal of "because we can". I'm not disagreeing with much of your proposal, there is a lot to agree with from a football perspective. But if "we can" do an all in tournament, in order to "generate more revenue"....isn't that the responsible thing for the IHSAA to do? I would definitely agree with anything that would get us "better games" (via seeding, neutral sites, rolling success factor, etc), but not necessarily "less games" for reasons above.

I think there is more happening off screen that we can't see....something more than just the one player charging the official.

Very well said. Every kid at Cathedral is a recruit, otherwise they would have no student body....even the kid that just wants to take AP classes and play the violin has been recruited at least by reputation, advertisement, or other (I personally know someone who sent their kid there for this specific reason...I have no personal knowledge of why Cathedral is a great place to play violin, but I'm told it is 😀). The imbalance comes from the kids PPs don't have to count. Being able to quantify the amount of kids that might participate in "something/anything" seems to be a logical and way to count enrollment for extracurricular (i.e. football) classification.

What I'm suggesting is a "clearinghouse" form that every kid who WANTS to participate in ANY extracurricular would have to fill out at beginning of year. Most schools have something like this already that serves as code of conduct/drug testing/etc form. You aren't counting specific kids in each extracurricular, you are having them declare their intended interest. Some of these kids may not even go out for sports, band, the play, student council, etc. But they are a potential "participant" and would be counted as such for IHSAA classification. I imagine DOE would find some purpose for this data as well. Somewhere back in the depths of old PP debate archives there is a longer (and likely better) version of this proposal...but now I'm old with less brain cells🤪

Agree with Grover.... I have always been an advocate of a "clearninghouse" system. That counted the number of kids that participate in ANY extracurricular (sports, music, etc). That is your "participant" enrollment. For PP's and affluent public schools this number will be near or over 90% of their total enrollment. For schools with struggling "demographics" (however you want to determine that)....it may be 50% of total enrollment or lower. The issue isn't the kids that publics/PPs count....the issue it the kids that PP's don't "have to count".

The best 6% of football players from a BIG pool of players will be VASTLY superior to the best 6% of football players from a SMALL pool of players.

So....... Hickory High: Total Enrollment = 400 students, Male enrollment = 200. Football Team = 35. 35/200 = 17.5% SuperSuburb High: Total Enrollment = 5000, Male enrollment = 2500. Football Team = 150 150/2500 = 6% Metro High: Total Enrollment = 2500, Male Enrollment = 1250, Football Team = 50 50/1250 = 4% Who does the following school get classified with? Pope John's High: Total Enrollment = 700, Male enrollment = 350, Football Team = 90 (or more) 90/350 = 26%

IMO the effect of success factor on PPs is this.... Periodically Cathedral will bump up to 6A, Roncalli to 5A, Chatard to 4A, etc limiting their tournament "success" (Although this years teams are a beast, and would be successful in those classes) and/or Periodically some combination of Cathedral, Roncalli, Dwenger, Chatard, etc get moved around so that formerly "separate" PP powers now can knock each other out. This year you have something "unusual" in the success factor era. Several PP powers have dropped back "down" along with many of the geographically close schools being spread out in the classes. I think this year is the SF anomaly...not a return to normal, as SF could potentially kick some of them up to where they will see other PP powers in their new class; or be in a class that is more competitive for that particular PP (e.g. Cathedral in 6A, Roncalli in 5A, etc)

If that play was 4th and Goal to take the lead in a close game, would you feel the same way....honest question.

I disagree with this as well....frame by frame he's driving forward off his left foot a few frames before the ball moves. Its close, we disagree, thats why we have all the fun on Fridays!😇

Da Bears have ownership/management issues that preclude any success from personnel and coaching changes. Having personal friends that have played in the organization as well as others in the NFL...none of them felt Da Bears were a well run organization. In fact quite to the contrary, they constantly talked about how poorly things were run from the top down compared to others. Until ownership allows/hires the correct people at the top....don't expect more from anyone who takes the helm. Probably also a reason quality people avoid this job like the plague. ETA (don't read further unless you want to hear a rant on ND.)😇 As an aside....the same problem exists at ND. Until the Holy fathers allow ND to recruit the same kids that Clemson and Alabama recruit, don't say you are "all in" on being the top program in the country you aren't....you're just the best of the Northwesterns and Stanfords (which is a commendable thing to be!). But if ND is more worried about weather or not a freshman can take calculus....than weather or not they can help ND beat Clemson/Alabama/etc...they aren't really dedicated to that goal (and again...that ok! But don't claim to be....and don't blame the coaches that have all had success everywhere else). Kelly has done an AMAZING job in SPITE of ND's standards.

Was this supposed to be in purple??🤪 Elkhart & St Joe counties are becoming "more affluent"? Compare to the 80's/90's????? Obviously this is why Indy Metro Teams from Hamilton, Boone, Hendricks, Johnson, & Hancock counties were terrible....the affluence guaranteed their terrible performance.

Cant' they just give them a virtual timeout for a week or two like other forums do...instead of closing otherwise ok topics and discussion?

You are welcome too🤪

FB attacks forward presnap....thats what I see.

The fact they motioned the big dude directly behind QB to do this with intent at the snap isn't enough??????🤪

The proposed problem is Marion County though....correct? Not LOS specifically. CG would be an option....some HCC schools.

So reward unsuccessful programs for (possibly) tanking??🤔

I thought a version of this was the way to go back when it got introduced..... Take out the 6A (top 32, 16, whatever). Average the rest out in 5 classes. Combine that with a 3 year "rolling" success factor. I just don't see the IHSAA ever going back to only 5 state championship games when they could sell tickets for 6. I personally think 6 is a good number. You can comfortably play 3 games in a day and it makes Fri/Sat after Thanksgiving a solid weekend of Indiana Football. Not saying it would be bad....just an observation. Chatard would be the hot girl at the party🤪

Difference between 1 & 16 in 6A = 2690 (Carmel and LN) Difference between 16 & 32 in 6A = 561 (LN and Jeffersonville) The 6A problem is really Carmel & BD....or possibly the top 5. But once you get down to 3500 there is a pretty steady decline through the rest of the class. As far a success factor, I would be open to a "rolling" 3 year success factor...but that would require a readjustment of classification every year. A lot of 4-5A schools would be fighting to schedule 2-3A PP's in their non-conference schedule.

The fact that IHSAA website still has the "normal" state finals info on its website tells me that all of this is currently under consideration.... Apart from questionable weather, would hosting the games at "neutral" metro schools be "easier" from a social distancing/sanitation perspective? I'm bored and just thinking out loud. I also have almost zero experience in game administration. But its an open forum....so🤷‍♂️

Nothing on IHSAA website other than what has been there for recent seasons.... Somewhat off topic, but remember that IHSAA is going away from the 1A/3A/5A day and a 2A/4A/6A day. This year they are setting the finals to be more "geographically friendly"... https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/high-school/2020/07/02/ihsaa-changes-football-state-finals-schedule-voting-eight-man-football-proposal/5368098002/ FTA "This year, as voted by the IHSAA executive committee, the state finals matchups, dates and times will not necessarily be played in its usual format. If matchups allow, schools from a similar geographical area may be grouped into consecutive games or at least on the same day. The schedule will now be announced following the semistate games."

Abundance means a "large amount of something".....by referring to their level of caution as an OVERabundance I think you are subconsciously arguing that logic #Freud 😇