BTF

3 minutes ago, gonzoron said:

It was already being talked about long before I got here way back on page 1. Don't want others to participate, I'd suggest starting your own private club.

Lol, noted. 

Just now, Footballking16 said:

It’s an opinion obviously. But I’d be hard pressed to know another team in the state that has the collection of wealth and talent in the skill position department as Cathedral? You have anything to offer?

Cathedral is probably a good place to start. But I haven't researched all 317 teams to say that they are "far" superior. 

Just now, Bobref said:

Then take it back by making a post that you consider on the correct track … instead of whining about it.

Lol, and there you are. 

1 minute ago, Footballking16 said:

How many other teams in the state have a D1 QB, WR, and TE on their roster? Tibbs (Purdue) and O’Neil (several high major offers) are both P5 players and Wooten has recently committed to Western Michigan.

Cathedral probably has the best skill guys in the state, you lost me at "far superior."

2 hours ago, Komets2727 said:

But, but, but, Bobref has NEVER seen a suspension overturned. Blasphemy I say!!!!

Stating their opinions over in the "Officials" thread apparently wasn't enough, Bob and Gonzo had to hijack this thread. Get used to it, it's what they do. 

1 hour ago, Footballking16 said:

Cathedral’s skill position players are far superior to anyone else in the state. 

How do you know this?

Hijacked. 

2 hours ago, gonzoron said:

If there is a burning car on the field during a high school football game, Fort Wayne has a lot more problems than we thought.

Who is "we" and what kind of problems do you think Fort Wayne has?

7 minutes ago, gonzoron said:

Rules are rules. There should be no reversals.

Not sure you're in a position to make that determination. 

56 minutes ago, jakone said:

I'm Hearing Snider appealed the suspension and will likely get it reversed.

I hope that is the case. I don't feel that he did anything to warrant sitting out an entire game. 

1 hour ago, GOLDRUSH1985 said:

Yes , its a coaches job to have the players ready for big games . Your right in one regard as Penn did not have the talent to beat Warren in 2003 regardless of the coach . But betting beat by 50 or 20 is much different . Brian Kelly was a good coach at Notre Dame , but he couldn't win the big game . And 2003 is not the only year I'm talking about . Look at 2004 Semistate, the Carmel state beating . 

Much respect for Penn, but they weren't beating Snider that year even with Geesman. Good to have Penn guys back on the forum, you've been pretty quiet the past few years. 

Making a case for Homestead and Carroll:

Their benchmark is Snider, a school with an enrollment of 1800 students. Schools similar to their size, like Center Grove, Brownsburg, and Westfield have the luxury of playing opponents similar in size or even larger in enrollment. Homestead and Carroll, moving forward, get to schedule whoever they want the first two weeks of the season. That will help those programs tremendously. 

Carroll has Hamilton Southeastern and Warren Central next year. HSE and Center grove in 2024.

Homestead has Carmel and Noblesville.

They both improved immensely when joining the SAC, they'll improve even more by playing Indy programs in the future. Stay tuned.

Don't say it Temp. 

1 minute ago, GOLDRUSH1985 said:

Why bring up Penn , When not one Penn Person ever said a word about enrollment ? 

He has a point there King. 

7 minutes ago, temptation said:

Enrollment isn't everything...feel like we've been here before.

With the number of schools over 3000 growing, the advantages once held by the BD's, Warren's and Carmel's of the world are shrinking.  It is all about the realistic number of student-athletes that you can recruit for football.

HSE/Fishers' 3000+ are much different than NC/Warren's...hence the reason the gap has closed and may be completely closed sooner rather than later.

I feel like teams of the 80's and 90's were at the mercy of the number of pure natural athletes who graced their hallways. Over the last two decades, more sophisticated training is at the disposal for those who can afford it. Hence the reason a suburban school sporting 2500 students can compete with a city school with 4000. 

3 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

The hierarchy of football in central Indiana has drastically changed, even in the last 5 years. WC and BD aren’t shells of their former selfs, and while you can attribute some of that to the pandemic, I’m not sure you’ll ever see either of those programs line up and dominate they way they used too, mega-enrollment or not.

Center Grove is undoubtedly the pinnacle program of central Indiana (as well as the state) and Coach Moore has laid such a tremendous amount of ground work, I’m not sure that is ever going to be reversed. Carmel will always be Carmel, but they were human these last two years after going to the south half of the bracket. They will always be a contender, going north.

Cathedral will be a 6A school for the foreseeable future. They will be a major player in 6A for years to come. 

Agree, agree, and agree.

10 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

Carmel, BD, and Warren are still the 3 largest schools in the state and all 3 are currently 0-1 losing to 3 opponents all with vastly inferior enrollments. Carmel and Warren failed to win their sectional last year  and BD hasn’t played in LOS since 2017. 

They have their down years just like any other program. They're not expected to be the best every year, just expected to have the most championships over the course of time (which they do). And kudos to those programs for having good coaching staffs, that's a key element to this. 

15 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

Way to bring up Cathedral in an argument that has nothing to do with Cathedral. Penn has 500 less students than Warren Central, it’s a tiring argument about enrollment. When you have 3,000+ kids in your school, the argument about not being able to put a competitive football team on the field is ridiculous.

Citing Penn’s enrollment to a lack of competitiveness against the Indy hegemony is absolute hog wash.

I agree. Penn just hasn't been the same since Geesman retired. Yoeman is good, but Geesman ranks somewhere in the Top 10 of all time. 

The north only has one program, Penn, that ranks in the Top 10 in enrollments. The three largest schools, Carmel, Ben Davis, and Warren Central also have the most state championships with nine each. Coincidence?

I'm not sure if the forementioned teams are the three largest currently, but they were when they won their 27 state titles. 

You'll also never here me feeling sorry for ANY program with 3000+ students. At least we are on the same page on that one. 

1 hour ago, GOLDRUSH1985 said:

And at least I list my school that I went to and played for . My guess is the only Football you ever played was in a video game , but you talk smack about Northern schools . I have a blue ring that I earned in football , how many do you have ?

Much respect to the Kingsman, one of Indiana's Top 5 programs of all time. But I've got to side with Temp here. I think he gives an unbiased opinion regardless of the fact that he lives in Indy. It took me a few years to figure that out though, lol. 

37 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

Tired of this excuse.

Penn has had 3000+ students for two decades. Homestead and Carroll are both bigger than Center Grove. Westfield and its 2600 students came out of the North last year (with no mega enrollment school in the way) and gave CG all they could handle last year.

 

Lol...........bla bla bla. The Rocks had one great season (more to come hopefully) and it still wasn't enough to come out on top of 6a. The rest of their good teams were 5a state caliber good. You guys have one really good example down there, Center Grove. Good for them. Coach Moore has done a fabulous job in building arguably the best program in Indiana. 

10 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

I know where Westfield is located.

I’m tired of hearing about the enrollment “excuse” when it comes to a lack of competitiveness in state title games between Indy area schools and true northern schools. Westfield, at 2600 kids, was more than competitive in their state title game last year. A school like Penn can’t use their enrollment as an excuse as to why they aren’t competitive when they make it to the state finals.

I get it, we all get it. You just want to pump your chest saying "we're the greatest." Hell, you can't even admit that your Irish have advantages. Luers fans go home every year disappointed after getting thumped by Snider. Is it because Snider has a better program? Hardly. They have an enrollment advantage and Luers doesn't have a metro of 2 million to recruit from, like a certain program in Indy does. When you have an advantage, it's okay to admit it. 

1 hour ago, Grover said:

True.  But thankfully Center Grove overcame it in 2015.

Special program. Kudos to Coach Moore. 

And if we're going back to year 2000, it's only fair to include the Snider 2004 team. I maintain, they were the best team in the state during the regular season when they had their D1 running back. Warren was given a gift with him sitting on the bench with a broken ankle. Few and far between, whatever, I get it. 

2 hours ago, temptation said:

2015 was an anomaly.  It’s been way longer than that.  Taking the Indy/Indy matchups out of the equation, true “north schools” have been blown out more often than not.

Lawrence Central beat Snider by 25 in 2012.

Carmel beat Penn by 54 in 2011.

Warren Central beat Penn by 50 in 2003.

Ben Davis beat Snider by 24 in 2002.

Ben Davis beat Valpo by 19 in 2001.

 

The enrollment disparity is hard to overcome. It's like I said in another post. A northern team may catch 4 of the 5 mega schools on an average year, but at least one of those schools is going to have an up year and take care of their smaller northern counterpart.

4 hours ago, scarab527 said:

Penn in 2015. But that seems like a LONG time ago...

The north might have had 2 of the top 3 in 2015. The problem here is we have to go back seven years. The gap between Indy and everyone else has been sizable from 2016-present. 

1 hour ago, Boilernation said:

What did he do to get ejected? On the replay it possibly looked like he was taunting. The Summit City crew calling the game couldn't really tell as well. Also, what is the first name of the Snider RB who took over? I believe his last name was Veazy. It sounded like they were calling him "Al Capone". 

De'alcapon Veasy, he's a sophomore. 

Senior Langston Leavell was called for spiking the ball. It was a quick celebration spike, hardly obscene. But they got him anyway. The second was for gesturing a first down signal and possible words with another player. I've seen far worse celebrations not get called, but the refs were throwing the flags Friday night. He's out this Friday against Carroll. 

1 hour ago, temptation said:

I can’t be the only one.

You might be the only one out of the Indy area. Most fans are selfishly biased toward their area of the state and prefer total domination. You seem to be a fan of high school football in general and appreciate a good game regardless of geography. I can assure you fans of Northeastern Indiana would like to see a 6a team in our area compete. We were spoiled for a long time with Snider, but declining enrollment and socioeconomic factors have knocked them from 6a to 5a. Homestead and Carroll are 2500 and growing, they are the future of 6a football in Fort Wayne. 

3 minutes ago, BDGiant93 said:

When Merrillville wins 9 State Championships, come talk to Ben Davis about whiffing.

I don't think he was taking a jab at the Giants, just making a point. Comparing Merrillville to Ben Davis isn't fair since the Giants are double the Pirates in enrollment. Give Merrillville 3000+ kids and they probably have multiple championships to their credit. Maybe not nine, but more than likely multiple.