BTF

1 minute ago, temptation said:

Oh I know all about being Catholic and hating ND.  Really easy for me.

Well there ya go. Something you and Footballking have in common. 

3 hours ago, temptation said:

From the looks of it, “the chosen one” needs to hit the stair stepper in the weight room before being handed the keys to being QB1.

Drew Pyne doesn't get the credit he deserves. But he will. Buchner is injury prone, so it's just a matter of time before Pyne comes in and takes them the rest of the way. Buchner can't even walk down a flight of stairs without hurting himself. 

To your earlier question. Notre Dame has the offensive line, quarterback, tight end, and defense to make the game interesting against Ohio State. If Oregon can do it, I'm sure Notre Dame can. Obviously I wouldn't take ND even up in Columbus, but I think they can cover the spread. Ohio State just seems hit or miss to me, probably because you have an average coach with outstanding athletes. 

Footballkings 35-7 at half comment is way off base and is ND bashing plain and simple. Still not sure how a Catholic with ties to Cathedral can hate ND so much. "If Brian Kelly was still there, then Ohio State would be up 35-7 at halftime." Braindead comment. 

5 hours ago, Robert said:

And Luers and Dwenger will have wins and losses against other teams that were in and off of that list in many of those years, but someone will point out 2A and 3A titles.  Yes, but they may have beaten Snider in 5A that year or insert school of choice here.  Everything after the but is BS.

Robert. I think we are finding that Luers has a large amount of respect statewide, regardless of the size of their school. 

Great work Gatorguy, I'm sure that took some time. 

1 hour ago, temptation said:

Caesars has released some early season betting lines…

OSU -13.5 vs ND

I'll take ND.

36 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

Winning 9 state titles and 7 runner-ups spanning 5 different decades is the definition of sustained success. They have the most sectional titles of any program in the history of the sport. They are the walking definition of a blue-blood. 

I have them down for four decades. The 70's, 80's, 2000's, and 2010's. They disappeared in the 90's.

Only the following schools have been successful every decade from the 80's until now: Ben Davis, Dwenger, Luers, Cathedral, Chatard, Roncalli,Snider, Zionsville and Penn. Those nine pass the test for Blue Bloods. Carmel and Warren Central get a pass for the vast amount of success that they achieved every decade but the 90's. Twenty nine other programs can make a case by tweaking the criteria here and there. 

It's been a fun discussion. 

13 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

Both Warren and Carmel have had sustained success the last 50 years despite not winning a title in the 90's. There isn't a more successful big class school in the history of the sport than Carmel. They are most certainly an Indiana blue-blood and arguably at the top of the list in my opinion.

You said "sustained success." They never even made it to the final game in the 90's. That's not sustained success. 

37 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

I think there's several schools who fit the blue-blood criteria for a sustained period of success going back 40-50 years.

 

But not Warren Central and Carmel.

That being said, I think you could make a case for both programs as their success in every other decade was enough to make up for their lack of success in the 90's.

You could also make an exception for Snider. They were successful every decade. Five state titles are hard to come by when you have to play several programs twice your enrollment to hoist up the trophy. 

2 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

You forgot Carmel who has titles in the 70's, 80, 2000's, and 2010's. But yes that's a pretty solid list. My personal Mt Rushmore for Indiana High School Football is:

Carmel

Cathedral

Luers

Chatard

Carmel is out............no success in the 90's. 

11 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

I think to be considered a true blue-blood you need a minimum of 5 state titles and titles must be won in at least 3 different decades. 

These programs have been to the state finals every decade since the 80's. (We're not counting the 2020's): Ben Davis, Dwenger, Luers, Snider, Cathedral, Chatard, Ritter, Roncalli, Northwood, Penn, Tri-West, and Zionsville. 

One state finals appearance per decade eliminates Warren Central and Carmel. Neither of them has representation in the 90's.

Regionals - Northwood eliminated. Only one regional title in the 2010's.

Sectionals - Ritter eliminated. Only three sectional titles in the 90's and 2010's. Tri-West eliminated. The 80's was the only decade they recorded four sectional titles.

So here are the Blue Bloods with regard to THAT criteria: Ben Davis, Dwenger, Luers, Snider, Cathedral, Chatard, Roncalli, Penn, and Zionsville. 

17 minutes ago, BTF said:

Good point.

That being said. What is the criteria? Are we going back to the 80's or just the 90's? 

One state championship

One state championship appearance per decade (80's forward)

Two regional championships per decade (90's forward)

Four sectional titles per decade (90's forward)

16 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

Because being considered a blue-blood is an ultra-exclusive title. If we recognized every program who has shown a decade worth of sustained success, you'd have 30 something blue-blood programs. It would diminish the title.

Good point.

6 minutes ago, Footballking16 said:

Where do you put a school like Evansville Reitz when it comes to blue-blood status? Evansville Reitz been playing football forever and has a ton of mythical (and legit) state titles pre-IHSAA era and at one point (not sure still this case) had the 2nd most wins in Indiana History. Won a few state titles this century as well. 

According to Gatorguy's spreadsheet, Reitz comes in at 36. I had Reitz in my original 33 (no particular order). I think there are about 40 schools out there who would stake their claim to being a Blue Blood. That tells me that recent success needs to be taken into account to get that number down to 20. 

3 minutes ago, NLCTigerFan07 said:

I mean... I don't know how you can't lol

"Lol" was my reaction as well. It just kind of left me speechless. 

Giving credit where credit is due, his list included some really good programs. I just don't know how you can include the likes of Bloomington South and Center Grove, but not Luers, Dwenger, and Snider. At the end of the day, I think there are approximately 25 programs that could make a case for Blue Blood status. The best post I've seen so far is the spreadsheet that was derived from a point system. 

1. Chatard

2. Cathedral

3. Luers

4. Carmel

5. Ben Davis

6. Roncalli

7. Dwenger

8. Penn

9. Sheridan

10. Hobart

11. Warren Central

12. Ritter

13. Snider

14. LLC

15. Center Grove

16. Jimtown

17. Andrean

18. Mater Dei

19. Tri-West Hendricks

20. Northwood

21. Evansville Memorial

22. Adams Central

23. West Layfayette

24. Franklin Central

25. Columbus East

That's a pretty good Top 25 if you ask me. Some will ask where Bloomington South, Pioneer, and New Pal reside. All three would be included in a Top 30. Zionsville comes in at 32, Lowell at 35, and Heritage Hills at 36. I guess we can all look at the ranking and come up with our own conclusion as to who is a Blue Blood and who isn't. 

21 hours ago, Indiana Fan said:

Jimtown would’ve been next on my list. Just haven’t heard much of them lately, but then again I could be wrong. NorthWood has always been a good program as well

I'm still curious as to why Luers doesn't come to mind. 

Luers: 25 sectional titles, 20 Regional titles, 16 semi-state titles, and 11 state championships. 

12 hours ago, temptation said:

Cool, now we are comparing concessions.

Well, yeah. Concessions is part of the whole fan experience. Maybe that's why Parkview Field was rated higher than Lucas Oil in a recent study of the top sporting venues in the United States? They typically look at the whole package. 

2 hours ago, temptation said:

25-17-1

Even your cute little stadium is a mini replica of The Big House.

Lol. At least at Notre Dame you can go get concessions without having to wait in line to get back in. 

Five 10-win seasons in a row. Michigan has two during that time period. Not bad, not bad. They're trying. 

2 minutes ago, temptation said:

We going down this rabbit hole, huh?

I’ll play.

5 of the last 8…

6 of the last 10…

https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/27379180/the-50-best-college-football-programs-150-years

Michigan comes in at a respectable #6. 

Just now, temptation said:

And Notre Dame can’t do a thing about it for a decade.

Notre Dame won two of the last three..........Michigan will have to live with that for a decade. 

18 minutes ago, temptation said:

In the big scheme of things, that score is meaningless to both programs at this point as they have bigger goals in mind.

However, in this particular event (a discussion where both fan bases are riling one another up) the scoreboard is the checkmate.  It’s good natured ribbing.

Lol. I'll give you that. 

7 minutes ago, DE said:

I’m sure the pope would’ve intervened at some point. Too much money in college football to be had. 😊 

My thought is that if they were motivated enough to have Michigan stop by to teach them the game, then eventually they would have had somebody teach them had the Wolverines refused. 

I said it once and I'll say it again. Most Irish fans that I know have completely forgotten about that game. Notre Dame's football program is focused on winning the national championship. If someone asked Freeman or anyone on his staff what the score of that game was, 50% of them wouldn't even know. 

I agree that Michigan fans think more about that game than Notre Dame fans do. But at the end of the day, both programs can hold their heads high knowing that they are the two winningest programs in college football history. 

17 minutes ago, temptation said:

Without Michigan, Notre Dame’s program ceases to exist.  Know your history.

So if Michigan's football team didn't stop in South Bend in 1894 to teach the Notre Dame students the game of football on their way to Chicago, then Notre Dame wouldn't have a football team today?

1 hour ago, temptation said:

It’s definitely been a sight to see both programs benefitting from one another and the growth on a state wide level.

Still no clue why other schools have failed to follow this blueprint.

If they haven't by now, then they never will. This concept has been around since the 90's. 

On 4/15/2022 at 12:44 PM, Footballking16 said:

Believe Mishawaka did right when the IHSAA implemented its 6th class. It was before teams like Cathedral, Dwenger, etc were regularly cycled up to 5A and were still in 4A. Mishawaka avoided northern powers like Lowell and Dwenger. 4A was stronger at the time than the new look 5A featuring 32 teams, especially in the North half of the bracket. 

Mishawaka avoided Lowell and Dwenger to play Snider? I find that fascinating since Snider beat Dwenger 43-0 in 2012. Are we sure we know the REAL reason why Mishawaka bumped up?